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eheathIt's pretty unreal they won't just give patrollers like 2 more dollars an hour, they have no concern for the well-being of anyone, guests or employees.
DisvoNo lie fuck park city ski patrol not all of them but most they are fucking lazy I talk from experience one time my homie dropped his pole and we asked a ski patroller to go get it and he told us straight up he didn’t want to Like anit that the job dog
Way*MoThat is not the job G.
partyandBSthat is part of the job at every resort ive been to lol
Way*MoTo fetch lost gear? Patrol is there to respond to injuries and manage snow safety depending on terrain. Not to pick up lost poles for dipshits who dropped them.
partyandBSit takes patrol a lot less man power to send 1 patroller to go retrieve an item than it does to to respond to a guest injury for someone who cant navigate the terrain or worse if its an injury in closed terrain. patrol always assists with this from my experience as its seen as injury prevention.
DisvoNo lie fuck park city ski patrol not all of them but most they are fucking lazy I talk from experience one time my homie dropped his pole and we asked a ski patroller to go get it and he told us straight up he didn’t want to Like anit that the job dog
DisvoNo lie fuck park city ski patrol not all of them but most they are fucking lazy I talk from experience one time my homie dropped his pole and we asked a ski patroller to go get it and he told us straight up he didn’t want to Like anit that the job dog
SkiBum.Glad to hear. Hope Vail pays them. I also hope the on mountain experience every day they strike is horrible for the guests.
Every guest skiing or riding has to walk right past them every day they strike.
theabortionatorA good dump of powder would make things interesting
theabortionatorThey fought ski patrol on a dollar raise from 16 to 17 for almost a year. Then a few months later made it $20 company wide.
Fuck Vail
GayWolf420Have you not tried dropping poles like a 5 year old?
thatsGred jackets are only making $20/hr?
SkiBum.Glad to hear. Hope Vail pays them. I also hope the on mountain experience every day they strike is horrible for the guests.
Every guest skiing or riding has to walk right past them every day they strike.
theabortionatorVR is starting them at $21. The minimum for the company is $20 now. So first year lifty and newer ski patrol make basically the same.
Obviously would guess more experience people are making more but VR has really gone after patrol on pay.
I really hope this bites them in the ass.
partyandBSthat being said, the wages were posted in the job descriptions and in no way a secret so people know exactly what the fuck they are signing up for. if its a big deal, get a different job lol. if the pay is better to patrol elsewhere than go there and patrol. i get they are negotiating for more and they should but this is a mockery.
mismanagement + entitlement = shit show in PC
partyandBSyeah VR fucked up by doing $20 company wide. $20/hr at snow creek out side of kc missouri and you are livin like a king lol. they should have scaled it so that they could pay their big resorts that have a higher cost of living and have a bigger gap in skilled positions.
that being said, the wages were posted in the job descriptions and in no way a secret so people know exactly what the fuck they are signing up for. if its a big deal, get a different job lol. if the pay is better to patrol elsewhere than go there and patrol. i get they are negotiating for more and they should but this is a mockery.
mismanagement + entitlement = shit show in PC
GayWolf420Have you not tried dropping poles like a 5 year old?
CaseyHe probably just didn’t want to go get your stupid fucking pole. Maybe you should go get your own god damn pole they aren’t your fucking dad. Sack TF up and handle your own shit
50KalI feel this is the start of change in the industry.
Prior of the 2020 ski season the only ski patrol union I knew of was Aspen/snowmass ski patrol union.
Now with the start Vail Resorts and others having ski patrol unions start it’s resulted in a significant power change in the ski resort industry.
The concept of “just move for better job” is such a bullshit excuse in my opinion.
What if your entire family lives in the community and you don’t want to leave? What if you have a relative who’s disabled in the area and you still help them or even raise your family in the area?
I can go on and on about the multiple situations of why an individual may not want to uproot their entire life for the sake of a job.
But fighting for a good paying job (especially a first responder job) in a high cost of living area is never a bad thing in my opinion.
If we are gonna start talking entitlement, let’s start the Vail resorts CEO (Kirsten A. Lynch) who in 2023 made total of $6,195,302. $1.1million was her salary but the extra 5 million was bonus and additional stock options given too her. This what was reported to the government for working just VR. https://www.salary.com/tools/executive-compensation-calculator/kirsten-a-lynch-salary-bonus-stock-options-for-vail-resorts-inc?year=2023
Im not saying CEO can’t get paid but you get an extra 5 Million a year as stock and bonus you might be the entitled one.
DisvoI did try and they sent a snowmobile up to stop us from hiking up
partyandBSi know steamboats been union for quite some time. since 2003 i think and im pretty
sure they
uproot your whole life? homie theres a resort that literally touches pcmr lmao. and its rapidly growing. they got medical service right in pc as well. and slc is right down the road and could be commuted. some resorts its its astronomically more challenging. i hear snowshoe is pretty isolated.
and yeah kirsten makes hella and fuckin sucks at skiing. just a corporate overlord. guarantee that any patrol raises will not impact her salary though. in fact, i bet standing up to the union will be rewarded by other stakeholders. her bitch ass will make more each year even if VR performance isnt there. you know who will feel the pinch? every other employee at pcmr. they will be shafted any raises for the foreseeable future.
i do agree that advocating for more pay is always something we should all do. and i think a union can be a great way to do that if you’re not being heard by the powers that be. in general, im a big supporter of the unions that have formed across the industry and i have several friends in those inions. i just think this shitshow is not how its done. every other patrol managed to avoid shutting down during the most critical time of the year and i think there was a way to do that here but it fell short. sad really.
partyandBSi know steamboats been union for quite some time. since 2003 i think and im pretty
sure they
uproot your whole life? homie theres a resort that literally touches pcmr lmao. and its rapidly growing. they got medical service right in pc as well. and slc is right down the road and could be commuted. some resorts its its astronomically more challenging. i hear snowshoe is pretty isolated.
and yeah kirsten makes hella and fuckin sucks at skiing. just a corporate overlord. guarantee that any patrol raises will not impact her salary though. in fact, i bet standing up to the union will be rewarded by other stakeholders. her bitch ass will make more each year even if VR performance isnt there. you know who will feel the pinch? every other employee at pcmr. they will be shafted any raises for the foreseeable future.
i do agree that advocating for more pay is always something we should all do. and i think a union can be a great way to do that if you’re not being heard by the powers that be. in general, im a big supporter of the unions that have formed across the industry and i have several friends in those inions. i just think this shitshow is not how its done. every other patrol managed to avoid shutting down during the most critical time of the year and i think there was a way to do that here but it fell short. sad really.
-skian-"Have you tried not dropping your poles like a 5 year old?"
Fixed the grammar for you, ironic in trying to roast someone for acting 5.
partyandBSi know steamboats been union for quite some time. since 2003 i think and im pretty
sure they
uproot your whole life? homie theres a resort that literally touches pcmr lmao. and its rapidly growing. they got medical service right in pc as well. and slc is right down the road and could be commuted. some resorts its its astronomically more challenging. i hear snowshoe is pretty isolated.
and yeah kirsten makes hella and fuckin sucks at skiing. just a corporate overlord. guarantee that any patrol raises will not impact her salary though. in fact, i bet standing up to the union will be rewarded by other stakeholders. her bitch ass will make more each year even if VR performance isnt there. you know who will feel the pinch? every other employee at pcmr. they will be shafted any raises for the foreseeable future.
i do agree that advocating for more pay is always something we should all do. and i think a union can be a great way to do that if you’re not being heard by the powers that be. in general, im a big supporter of the unions that have formed across the industry and i have several friends in those inions. i just think this shitshow is not how its done. every other patrol managed to avoid shutting down during the most critical time of the year and i think there was a way to do that here but it fell short. sad really.
eheathApparently it's a massive shit show at the mountain today.
JmckRThey hold far too much power and don't give a fuck about the people whose lives are being affected by their actions.
K-Dot.This is equally true of the CEO and shareholders. They could end this tomorrow if they were just a tiny bit less greedy. When you blame the workers, the people creating the value, instead of the owners, the people taking the value that they didn’t create, you’re just doing work for the owners’ benefit for free.
If you really hate strikes so much you should hate the management that backed the workers so far into a corner that this was their only option. Again, the employer retains the power in the relationship, any inconvenience caused by striking is being caused by the ownership not managing the company properly. Blame the people with the power not the people just trying to keep up with rent and bills who also create the large majority of value at the company.
JmckRTough one this. On the one hand, I agree with absolutely everything they have to say here, having worked for ski resorts for years I completely understand the troubles they face. The pay rates are indeed a disgrace and makes living out there difficult.
On the other hand, having being directly affected by strike action from other industries in the past, I personally find it very difficult to sympathise with unions. They hold far too much power and don't give a fuck about the people who's lives are being affected by their actions.
I guess on this occasion, it's only rich people's ski seasons who will be affected, but the sheer principle of strikes still outrages me.
theabortionatorBro, where do you think workers rights came from. Industries didn't just decide to hook it up because they cared.
Unions aren't perfect but damn thats a hot take.
In the past VR fought them for a year trying to get a raise from 16 to 17. Within the 6 months later raised the wage company wide to 20. They've been trying to work out a deal for 9 months this time. 9 months. For a $2 raise to bring patrol base pay to $23. Only $3 above any other job including first year lifties, dishwashers, anything.
Sure this will impact mountain operations, thats the point. If you hit a point where they won't budge it makes sense. It puts the pressure on Vail to actually do something.
Idk just a weird take to complain about unions and strikes when that's how a lot of modern day workers rights were won in the past.
JmckRAgreed, but 9/10 times the main losers are the people affected by the strikes and that's not fair.
Since Covid I've been directly affected by a train driver strike in the UK, a junior doctor strike in the UK and the recent Canada Post strike.
These strikes affected me and my intermediate family much more than not being able to go skiing. I hold a severe amount of contempt for every single worker who went on strike, especially the train drivers who were striking for better pay despite being on $80k+ annual.
JmckRI just find it dumbfounding that because they're in a so-called "union" they have a right to not show up to work and demand more money. I wish I could refuse to work until i got paid more, but I think I'd just get fired so I can't risk it.
JmckRYeah, in the past, like when people were in the coal mines.
How, as a human race, have we not found a better way to negotiate workers rights in the last 100 years?
I just find it dumbfounding that because they're in a so-called "union" they have a right to not show up to work and demand more money. I wish I could refuse to work until i got paid more, but I think I'd just get fired so I can't risk it.
theabortionatorDo you think Vail mega corp is just going to gove them more money. They didn't when in the past after a year of negotiations. They didn't this time after 9 months of negotiations.
Idk, it's just weird to be anti union anti strike because you want more money, and you got inconvenienced by some strikes in the past.
Sure we're not in the coal mine days, we aren't in the child labor days, but still.
Look at Amazon. This is capitalism my guy. Many big corps don't give a fuck about the employees beyond extracting the labor they need for profits. They aren't going to cut into those profits unless something like this actually hurts their bottom line and forces them to do something.
K-Dot.This is not true. When employees strike and win higher wages, non unionized workers benefit tangentially because non unionized employers are forced to compete with the now higher wages at a competing company. Anyone that is a regular worker wins when labor win, it drives all of our wages up.
You’re still blaming the workers for something the management caused in your examples. Just take a look at how much of a killing nearly every company made during covid. Tons of free money from the government, record profits, and forcing the lowest wage people in our societies to continue to work by deeming them “essential” which was just a soft way of saying disposable while working them to sometimes literal death. Those train drivers deliver very significant value to society and should be compensated for their hard work. If it were a more equitable society they would get the full value of what their labor creates, including partial ownership, but they aren’t even asking for that. They’re just asking for a few more scraps while the owners still take the lions share of the excess value created while doing next to nothing to create it. Unless you believe that sending a few emails, going on retreats and the occasional zoom call is functionally more important than doing the actual physical labor that the whole business is there to do.
Again, you’re doing the work for these companies for free when you talk like this. All of history is the history of class struggle, the reason we enjoy any sort of comfortability in our workplaces currently is because people struggled and died for the right to something like a weekend. This has always happened in spite of private corporations, the quality of life we enjoy has always and will always be under threat by a ruling class looking to roll back any and all worker rights and protections through their influence in politics and ownership of the media. It’s worth understanding the history of why any of us got an education as a child instead of being put to work ten hours a day, seven days a week until we died like our ancestors had to.
JmckRTrue, but think we also have to look at supply vs demand here.
As we all well know ski resorts, not just Vail-owned, have gotten away with paying us next to nothing because they can, as if we quit someone else (probably from Australia) will replace us. Like it or not we're expendable as fuck.
As you referred to Amazon - it's the same principle, for each amazon driver position here in Canada, or in the UK, there is 1000 recent immigrants waiting for an opening.
Yes, arguably Patrol is different because it's a skilled job I will admit that. But it's just the way it is and always will be in ski resorts.
And I think accepting the job that so many people would absolutely love to take up, then to go on strike is pretty entitled.
JmckRThat's a heavy write up.
The union leader for the train drivers in the UK was Mike Lynch, he takes a salary home of £500k a year and has extended the strike several times for the last two years, for train drivers to make more money despite being well into the top 10% - whereas the little people trying to make ends meet can't get to work in the morning because their train gets cancelled. I'm not sure how this fits in with your pro-union, socialist agenda here?
Just to add as an edit:
My point above refers to my initial comment, 9/10 times the main losers are the people affected by the strikes and that's not fair.
**This post was edited on Dec 28th 2024 at 7:47:17pm
theabortionatorThis actually isn't the case these days. Mtns are understaffed even for lifties. Mtn ops jobs even places that pay well are understaffed or struggling to find good employees.
For ski patrol knowing the terrain is pretty importamt. That takes time. Rolling in blind to a new mtn even if you're experiemce it's going to take a while to learn the terrain and the setup.
So ywah, there's supply and demand but people aren't showing up to work at ski areas, even woth improved wages.
Even relying on J1s many of the VR mtns are short lifties.
The "We give you a pass so you're living the dream" thing is dead. You can't split cheap rent in ski towns. Everything's expensive.
I don't know about amazon was just mentioning the bullshit work conditions.
Idk man. You're calling them entitled for trying to make a more liveable wage to survive? They aren't quiting. They're trying to make it work. There aren't a surplus of skilled workers waiting to fill these roles.
Just seems like you're rocking the old ski area dream. They give you a season pass so you're living the dream and should accept anything else smiling. That's bullshit imo.
Good for Ski Patrol honestly. Hating on unions, strikes, and workers in general is pretty beat imo.
JmckRThat's a heavy write up.
The union leader for the train drivers in the UK was Mike Lynch, he takes a salary home of £500k a year and has extended the strike several times for the last two years, for train drivers to make more money despite being well into the top 10% - whereas the little people trying to make ends meet can't get to work in the morning because their train gets cancelled. I'm not sure how this fits in with your pro-union, socialist agenda here?
Just to add as an edit:
My point above refers to my initial comment, 9/10 times the main losers are the people affected by the strikes and that's not fair.
**This post was edited on Dec 28th 2024 at 7:47:17pm
K-Dot.I’m not going to pretend to know or really be terribly interested in all of the intricacies of the UK rail system but the basics are there. The RMT represents 85k rail workers in a variety of companies, some public, some private. For the public sector, even someone like the TFL commisioner is making 500k+, getting hung up only on the union bosses pay without any context is the point of the propaganda you’re regurgitating. You’re accepting the mainstream media framing that those 85k people are being greedy instead of the people who own the private companies many of them work for, for example someone like Richard Branson.
It’s hardly a controversial take to want thousands of workers to have a small pay bump instead of making billionaires even richer.
Still, unions have many flaws and are far from a perfect solution to the systemic contradictions. But the alternative scenario that preceded this one was unquestionably worse for the everyman. Unions are held to a standard that is of course never applied to business owners. One’s greed is good, the others is bad, at least if you listen to mainstream media which is owned by ruling class elites and is thus the representation of their interests.
Lastly, using socialist pejoratively as you’re trying to is so embarrassing. The red scare heavily revised western history but the historical facts are still easily accessible in this day and age. You have a socialist to thank for your weekend, your overtime pay, your benefits, retirement/pension, holiday pay, maternity leave, healthcare, the list goes on. That is a historical fact, please learn just a sliver about the vast history of what you’re talking about.
theabortionatorVR is starting them at $21. The minimum for the company is $20 now. So first year lifty and newer ski patrol make basically the same.
Obviously would guess more experience people are making more but VR has really gone after patrol on pay.
I really hope this bites them in the ass.
