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Gonna be starting my first season as a Groomer at Targhee, who else runs cats here? Gonna be running Prinoth Bisons, anything I should know about as a rookie?
Learn what every toggle and knob in the cab does. Plan your route fully in advance so you don't end up in a corner or with small hard to get to ungroomed patches. Push any extra snow you can find toward the park. Check your fluid levels before you head out. Don't leave any hard objects unsecured in the cab because they will go forward and crack the windshield.
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 10:14:25am
Also, make sure you always have a flat-ish spot in mind to turn around, and drop a generous blade of snow on your turning spot so it blends in instead of making a divot. Doesn't matter how many points your turn has to be, but don't go outside of a 1.5 groomer width radius to make it easy to cover your tracks. Don't spin the groomer by turning both tracks at once unless you end up in a really tight spot, because it's a great way to dig a big hole.
skiP.E.I.Don't spin the groomer by turning both tracks at once unless you end up in a really tight spot, because it's a great way to dig a big hole.
Its also really bad for the tracks if the snow is icy
This is my favourite style of turnaround, works great if your merginging onto another run thats already been tilled out and its a pretty flat area. Green is driving forward with tiller down red is reverse. If the snow is soft and your 3 point turn is digging a hole you can just back up further and grab some snow to fill it in. Good idea to replenish the area your taking from like once a week though
I'd also add don't feel like you have to slam the blade into the ground and hog a bunch of snow if your trying to build something, a lot of smaller, longer, skimming pushes will get the job done just as well and be easier on the machine
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 1:25:07pm
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 1:26:48pm
a_burgerIts also really bad for the tracks if the snow is icy
This is my favourite style of turnaround, works great if your merginging onto another run thats already been tilled out and its a pretty flat area. Green is driving forward with tiller down red is reverse. If the snow is soft and your 3 point turn is digging a hole you can just back up further and grab some snow to fill it in. Good idea to replenish the area your taking from like once a week though
I'd also add don't feel like you have to slam the blade into the ground and hog a bunch of snow if your trying to build something, a lot of smaller, longer, skimming pushes will get the job done just as well and be easier on the machine
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 1:25:07pm
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 1:26:48pm
also if you roll your blade forward so the end of the wings are just barely touching the snow thats like the perfect cutting angle, then you can just raise your blade up/down to control how much snow your taking
cat drivers, ive always wondered but never asked anyone who would know. say it's mid winter and you have a big 60 foot table set up and it's hard snow that's been there a while. is a cat somehow able to push it down? or is there a limit of hardness past which you can't?
SofaKingSickcat drivers, ive always wondered but never asked anyone who would know. say it's mid winter and you have a big 60 foot table set up and it's hard snow that's been there a while. is a cat somehow able to push it down? or is there a limit of hardness past which you can't?
Could be done but no ops manager who's paying attention would let you, would take days and put a lot of strain on the cat. When we rebuild our boardercross for our banked slalom we usually tow and excavator up and use it to rip out all the turns since they're so frozen. also keeps snow from sliding off into the woods.
I tried knocking down some 10ft jump landings that had been there since thanksgiving this spring when we were tearing down one of the parks, even at 50 degrees out I couldn't get the blade to dig into them beyond the first couple feet.
skiP.E.I.Learn what every toggle and knob in the cab does. Plan your route fully in advance so you don't end up in a corner or with small hard to get to ungroomed patches. Push any extra snow you can find toward the park. Check your fluid levels before you head out. Don't leave any hard objects unsecured in the cab because they will go forward and crack the windshield.
**This post was edited on Aug 26th 2022 at 10:14:25am
We had an unsecured operator get yeeted into the windshield a few years ago, didn’t crack the windshield, but gave him a nasty concussion.
SendyMcSendyfaceGonna be starting my first season as a Groomer at Targhee, who else runs cats here? Gonna be running Prinoth Bisons, anything I should know about as a rookie?
You have an incredible high standard to be held to because targhee has some fucking amazing hero courdory.
Like so pristine It feels bad to ski on it and ruin it
a_burgerCould be done but no ops manager who's paying attention would let you, would take days and put a lot of strain on the cat. When we rebuild our boardercross for our banked slalom we usually tow and excavator up and use it to rip out all the turns since they're so frozen. also keeps snow from sliding off into the woods.
I tried knocking down some 10ft jump landings that had been there since thanksgiving this spring when we were tearing down one of the parks, even at 50 degrees out I couldn't get the blade to dig into them beyond the first couple feet.
interesting. so say you have a huge booter and it's getting toward the end of the season, you have to wait til it's much meltier before you push that snow out to use it elsewhere?
Def take it slow. You need to get stuff done but you don't want to just brapp around as right at the beginning. New machine, pretty much a spaceship, also machine is big, machine will break shit very easily
Use your blade. Trail and park cats have a different ram setup for the blade so they're both a little different. But even in a trail cat don't be afraid to use some cut. You will blade dive at some point but you'll learn.
Worst thing you could do is be 3 years in driving with your blade in the air because you were too scared to use it.
Also play with your tiller settings. I've only demoed on of the new bisons briefly snd otherwise haven't been in one of the last tiers in a few years. They generally have a more aggressive tiller that will rip things smooth but still good to get your settings dialed so that you get into thw snow enough but also don't leave ridges.
Honestly a lot you just figure out. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Some people are dicks but generally, especially these days people are pretty good about it. It you feel dumb about something maybe ask one of the guys your friends with on the shift.
Be mindful of spacial awareness. Don't get too close to infrastructure. You'll figure out steering the tiller or floating it around corners but make sure you're doing it. If you turn especially tight with it locked it's putting a lot of stress on the frame.
If it's boney early/late season be weary of rocks and especially stumps. Somebody mentioned getting chucked into the windshield. We had 2 people break windshields with thier faces at Northstar. That's bad. Your 🧠 matters and windshields are about 4k these days.
Make sure you get at least some sleep. An hour of sleep roght before shift even is much better than going in with nothing. Be careful fueling and in the shop yard at end of shift when you're tired af getting used to the schedule. Don't rely on naps but if you feel like you're about to fall asleep and put it in the woods a half hour 40 min nap is better.
Idk it's not bad. It's a lot to get used to and the shifts are weird but you'll figure it out. What shift are you working?
If there's not enough cats or shit to do see if you can ride with a more experience operator. Once you're getting better never turn down an opportunity. Learning some park stuff, learning to winch etc. It's good to be well rounded and can make it more fun.
You will be under appreciated and probaly feel like a zombie from sleep deprivation but it's fun. You're making shit ski good the next day every day your out there.
Learning the machine, learning the trails and groomings patterns, the snow and how different types of snow groom, etc. But it's not bad just takes time.
Pay attention to what you're doing and don't be a know it all asshole once you get the basicals down and you'll be fine.
Go mow some lawns my friend!
Also heard Targhee built some new employee housing. Good for them. My mtn just tore down ours. Targhee is sick af. Stoked for ya.
Bappppppppp
Def take it slow. You need to get stuff done but you don't want to just brapp around as right at the beginning. New machine, pretty much a spaceship, also machine is big, machine will break shit very easily
Use your blade. Trail and park cats have a different ram setup for the blade so they're both a little different. But even in a trail cat don't be afraid to use some cut. You will blade dive at some point but you'll learn.
Worst thing you could do is be 3 years in driving with your blade in the air because you were too scared to use it.
Also play with your tiller settings. I've only demoed on of the new bisons briefly snd otherwise haven't been in one of the last tiers in a few years. They generally have a more aggressive tiller that will rip things smooth but still good to get your settings dialed so that you get into thw snow enough but also don't leave ridges.
Honestly a lot you just figure out. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Some people are dicks but generally, especially these days people are pretty good about it. It you feel dumb about something maybe ask one of the guys your friends with on the shift.
Be mindful of spacial awareness. Don't get too close to infrastructure. You'll figure out steering the tiller or floating it around corners but make sure you're doing it. If you turn especially tight with it locked it's putting a lot of stress on the frame.
If it's boney early/late season be weary of rocks and especially stumps. Somebody mentioned getting chucked into the windshield. We had 2 people break windshields with thier faces at Northstar. That's bad. Your 🧠 matters and windshields are about 4k these days.
Make sure you get at least some sleep. An hour of sleep roght before shift even is much better than going in with nothing. Be careful fueling and in the shop yard at end of shift when you're tired af getting used to the schedule. Don't rely on naps but if you feel like you're about to fall asleep and put it in the woods a half hour 40 min nap is better.
Idk it's not bad. It's a lot to get used to and the shifts are weird but you'll figure it out. What shift are you working?
If there's not enough cats or shit to do see if you can ride with a more experience operator. Once you're getting better never turn down an opportunity. Learning some park stuff, learning to winch etc. It's good to be well rounded and can make it more fun.
You will be under appreciated and probaly feel like a zombie from sleep deprivation but it's fun. You're making shit ski good the next day every day your out there.
Learning the machine, learning the trails and groomings patterns, the snow and how different types of snow groom, etc. But it's not bad just takes time.
Pay attention to what you're doing and don't be a know it all asshole once you get the basicals down and you'll be fine.
Go mow some lawns my friend!
Also heard Targhee built some new employee housing. Good for them. My mtn just tore down ours. Targhee is sick af. Stoked for ya.
Bappppppppp
Thanks for the big write-up homie! Not sure what sceddy I’ll be on, cause rookies don’t get much of a choice, but I’ve asked for evenings, cause that matches my normal sleep schedule pretty closely.
One thing that's good to learn while figuring out patterns. Imo.
If there's a trail that has wide and narrow spots it's okay to groom your edge pass several times in the narrow spot and flare out in the wide. Makes it so you can get all your cord straight the whole way across. It looks dumb when there's a 20 pass trail that looks the same wave as the first treeline pass. Groomthat edge pass or two and then start pulling straight lines. You'll cross cord in the narrow spots but 20 straight line passes look and ski way better. Got plenty of other shit to worry about but not a bad habit to learn early.
Also saying that, don't take each side and then groom to the middle. If it's a huge run especially. If your machine breaks or you/crew gets behind you can't leave islands like that and it will fuck you if things go wrong.
Idk if you're pack grooming or what. But radio shit out if you dive so next guy can dump some snow.
If you're doing your own trails let people if you're getting behind. Earlier the better. Than they can speed up and come help. Finding out there's an hour + of grooming left with less than a half hour happens and isn't ideal.
If you can't figure out your settings and the snow ask. If you're proud and keep trucking slong leaving shit passes it's not great. Cool you groomed 3 trails that need to be regroomed or will ski like shit.
Ski your work sometimes. Small ridges don't look like much but you fee them if you rip some hard turns side to side skiing. That seam between passes.
Trail grooming you need to make every pass count(well grooming in general) you don't really have time to double pass everything. So dialing in tiller and blading sooner is better.
You will fuck some shit up, you will blade dive, you will leave some wonky passes, you will probably get lost. Just call shit out and own up to anything. If you break something on the cat tell your sup. Try to talk to the mechanics regularly not just when you broke something. If you break something tell them directly. It can be stressful but it's food to get that relationship going. They might give you shit but it's way better than trying to hide broken shit.
REAL SHIT
You're only going to be able to remember so much. You're driving a spaceship overnight. Some stuff that the guys on your crew tell you might be hard to retain because there's so much going on. Also sometimes you just need a bit of experience for some things to even make sense.
3 people on the crew might tell you 3 ways to do something. There's generally a roght and wrong way but there's different ways to do stuff.if it works and you aren't fucking anything up and the product is good send it. If you're packed up woth a supervisor and they tell you something id prolly do that though.
SendyMcSendyfaceThanks for the big write-up homie! Not sure what sceddy I’ll be on, cause rookies don’t get much of a choice, but I’ve asked for evenings, cause that matches my normal sleep schedule pretty closely.
Yeah the way places groom varies but likely you'll end up on grave as a rookie but that depends. It ain't bad though.
I just woke up from a nap at the airport and saw this thread. Hopefully there's some coherent stuff in there.
I've been mostly working grave. In spring I've been switching to swing to brapp out the flow parks before they crust weird or jumping in a winch if were done/scaling back on parks but even grave isn't bad. I mean it's not great health wise but it's not bad. Helps if you live with/near hang out with some peeps from that shift.
Go ride together or grab breakfast after work once in a while.
It's a cool gig though.
I also recommend staying at said spot for at least a second year. Mtn is more stoked and looks better on your resume if you go elsewhere. Imean if you get a sick job somewhere whatever but just worth noting. Also grass isn't always greener. Every operation has issues. Some shops will suck worse than the one you have etc. If you don't like the spot there's always another hill but no place is perfect and most ate far from.
I’ve hired and trained probably over 50 rookie operators. Biggest word of advice, listen to your superiors, watch, learn, don’t be afraid to ask questions. And after a month of doing it, don’t think you already know it all and are the best. That shit used to drive me nuts.
a_burgerCould be done but no ops manager who's paying attention would let you, would take days and put a lot of strain on the cat. When we rebuild our boardercross for our banked slalom we usually tow and excavator up and use it to rip out all the turns since they're so frozen. also keeps snow from sliding off into the woods.
I tried knocking down some 10ft jump landings that had been there since thanksgiving this spring when we were tearing down one of the parks, even at 50 degrees out I couldn't get the blade to dig into them beyond the first couple feet.
Seen a cat take down/ relocate a 20-30 foot table in like 2 hours, been there December to March.
10 footer should be easy, unless ur in some roots tooth ass Lil cat
**This post was edited on Sep 3rd 2022 at 7:05:44am
ReformedBSeen a cat take down/ relocate a 20-30 foot table in like 2 hours, been there December to March.
10 footer should be easy, unless ur in some roots tooth ass Lil cat
**This post was edited on Sep 3rd 2022 at 7:05:44am
Depends where your at and what the snow is like. Dry west coast snow with no freeze thaw? Not a problem, but these jumps went through like 6 freeze/thaws and to start with were made out of very wet snow that was pushed while the guns were still running. This is a tube landing a bit further up the trail, the jump landing was basically this under 6-12in of actual rideable snow we had to replenish every night
Not really ideal. I probably could have cracked through the top layer eventually but it was also like 1hr till opening
a_burgerDepends where your at and what the snow is like. Dry west coast snow with no freeze thaw? Not a problem, but these jumps went through like 6 freeze/thaws and to start with were made out of very wet snow that was pushed while the guns were still running. This is a tube landing a bit further up the trail, the jump landing was basically this under 6-12in of actual rideable snow we had to replenish every night
Not really ideal. I probably could have cracked through the top layer eventually but it was also like 1hr till opening
icedif u hit a feature, tell the park manager, even if u dont see damage
If only people did this. I mean some do. Honestly os a decent policy. Both owning up to shit and also if nobody knows its broken that's sketch, and its moght get missed for a while/not be getting fixed.
Or just boot stomp snow around it and pretend you were never there
theabortionatorIf only people did this. I mean some do. Honestly os a decent policy. Both owning up to shit and also if nobody knows its broken that's sketch, and its moght get missed for a while/not be getting fixed.
Or just boot stomp snow around it and pretend you were never there
yup its definately better to own it that face a world of shit on the chance that park manager finds out
Jay has a park grooming position open that I am tempted to apply for. Zero cat experience, lots of heavy equipment experience so we will see what happens. My scheduled is freed up tremendously in the winter so I think it would be a good gig for me to get into.
LemuelJay has a park grooming position open that I am tempted to apply for. Zero cat experience, lots of heavy equipment experience so we will see what happens. My scheduled is freed up tremendously in the winter so I think it would be a good gig for me to get into.
Jay seems cool. It's easier to learn with s bit of trail grooming or mixed. Especially in a small program. It helps to get familiar with the machine before trying to build and maintain park stuff. But ywah if you wanna do it and have the time send it.
How are relationships between cat ops/park crews and patrol like in terms of risk assessment and management for yall at your respective resorts? We utilize our reports at work to see if there are ways we can improve features to make them safer.
theabortionatorJay seems cool. It's easier to learn with s bit of trail grooming or mixed. Especially in a small program. It helps to get familiar with the machine before trying to build and maintain park stuff. But ywah if you wanna do it and have the time send it.
Oh for sure. I was thinking that, I’d rather have some time under my belt just grooming trails. I’ll at least see if I can do some ride alongs to get my foot in the door for the future.
DeebieSkeebiesHow are relationships between cat ops/park crews and patrol like in terms of risk assessment and management for yall at your respective resorts? We utilize our reports at work to see if there are ways we can improve features to make them safer.
Ours is pretty good. I think most mtns I've worked at it had been, even ones where patrol and park crew butt heads a bit. I mean it should be because safety/liability all pretty important.
We just had a mgmt shift last year and our patrol director moved uo in management. Also my boss that runs parks and grooming and shit is a shredder. We have a pretty solid relationship between us and it's pretty easy to make plans. Even if we butt heads a bit it's generally all coming from the right reasons.
LemuelOh for sure. I was thinking that, I’d rather have some time under my belt just grooming trails. I’ll at least see if I can do some ride alongs to get my foot in the door for the future.
You know it! That's the move. The face that people know has a better chance of getting hired. Also doing those ride alongs shows interest. I tell people that shit all the time that wanna groom and a bunch are like "idk rhats kind late, i got this or that to do" like all good but maybe ain't the job for you.
We just hired a kid at Crystal for this season. He was showing up all the time riding with my roommate. Getting some tips, watching, getting some stick time. We already know he's gonna do well. He was a lock when he applied.
Some places are more lenient on stick time but i feel generally you show up a bit and somebody is gonna throw you in the seat. You also get s feel for hmthe machine, the grooming patterns and even just the vibe being out there.
Good luck buddy. It's a cool gig whether it's your thing or you do it for a season.
