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How about something in 95mm waist with not much if any rocker
Anyone else wish they could get a 95mm parky ski with little to no rocker? I miss my original 2012 Atomic Theory 185cm they killed it everywhere, a true one ski quiver.
That said the 4Frnt switch has almost none. Pretty long effective edge for a modern freestyle ski.
I know its probably useful if you're regularly skiing with a periscope in the white room of deep pow. But for the majority of the time it serves little to no useful purpose, for me, particularly if like the vast majority of people are on piste the vast majority of the time. Young guns do seem to love it mind, buttering about etc and apparently its useful on rails. But when I see ads for skis saying that it helps you not catch an edge, or make turns easier... etc it make me wonder why people don't invest in lessons if they need to learn to ski.... I know its part of the image the ski industry wants to present as well. So the idea that you'll all be off piste heroes now because the fat rockered skis will make you that without the time required to learn to ski... So its as much image I guess and the idea of skiing that has made the fad of rocker hook in so much. And yeah I have the Volkl Revolt 87cm park ski which is a nice stiff non rockered ski. Decent enough, but I'd prefer that in a 95mm under foot then I wouldn't need to have 2 pairs of skis, cause lets face it, a true twin tip is utter pony in deep pow owing to the long tails....
baz25216I know its probably useful if you're regularly skiing with a periscope in the white room of deep pow. But for the majority of the time it serves little to no useful purpose, for me, particularly if like the vast majority of people are on piste the vast majority of the time. Young guns do seem to love it mind, buttering about etc and apparently its useful on rails. But when I see ads for skis saying that it helps you not catch an edge, or make turns easier... etc it make me wonder why people don't invest in lessons if they need to learn to ski.... I know its part of the image the ski industry wants to present as well. So the idea that you'll all be off piste heroes now because the fat rockered skis will make you that without the time required to learn to ski... So its as much image I guess and the idea of skiing that has made the fad of rocker hook in so much. And yeah I have the Volkl Revolt 87cm park ski which is a nice stiff non rockered ski. Decent enough, but I'd prefer that in a 95mm under foot then I wouldn't need to have 2 pairs of skis, cause lets face it, a true twin tip is utter pony in deep pow owing to the long tails....
So you just want shit to be like the old days?
A small amount of tip and tail rocker make turn initiation and release easier, making skis more maneuverable and willing to make a variety of different size and shape turns.
Are the rockered skis you've ridden perhaps too small and your just noticing the lack of effective edge? Have you ever had a chance to get on a full rocker/reverse camber ski?
mystery3So you just want shit to be like the old days?
A small amount of tip and tail rocker make turn initiation and release easier, making skis more maneuverable and willing to make a variety of different size and shape turns.
Are the rockered skis you've ridden perhaps too small and your just noticing the lack of effective edge? Have you ever had a chance to get on a full rocker/reverse camber ski?
Yeah its the lack of effective edge. Also the feeling of looseness at the tails as they generally are softer and have a level of tapering around the tip shovels and tails these days which also reduces effective edge in addition to the rocker lines. You can sort of over-ride this to an extent by modifying your stance to more centred but its not my preference from my ex race training I guess. If you get what I'm saying. And I doubt the skis are too small as I alway opt for the longest versions. So I've got a pair of 187cm J-Skis Masterblaster as a mainstay and some Volkl Revolt 87cm though I would prefer a one ski quiver for simplicity. Both of these are good in their own ways, but for me the master blaster with no rocker and no tapering of the edge in the tails would be great.
And no, I don't want it to be just like the old days, when I was using old straight skis LOLs. Great for moguls, but not as good as carving skis, and nothing like as nice as my Atomic Theory, or Dynastar Big Trouble for that matter. :-)
mystery3So you just want shit to be like the old days?
A small amount of tip and tail rocker make turn initiation and release easier, making skis more maneuverable and willing to make a variety of different size and shape turns.
Are the rockered skis you've ridden perhaps too small and your just noticing the lack of effective edge? Have you ever had a chance to get on a full rocker/reverse camber ski?
Missed the last part.... no I've never tried full reverse cam skis. I doubt I'd ever "need" them. I do ski pow when its worth it. But its not as frequent as it was in years gone by in Europe now. So the majority of my time is in the park and piste. So an all rounder is a far better choice. Bought a set of ARV96 for next season, and they look likely to be a bit tasty. Hopefully they offer a longer effective edge and more edge hold as they have much more trad camber under foot as well than the MBs.
baz25216Missed the last part.... no I've never tried full reverse cam skis. I doubt I'd ever "need" them. I do ski pow when its worth it. But its not as frequent as it was in years gone by in Europe now. So the majority of my time is in the park and piste. So an all rounder is a far better choice. Bought a set of ARV96 for next season, and they look likely to be a bit tasty. Hopefully they offer a longer effective edge and more edge hold as they have much more trad camber under foot as well than the MBs.
Full rocker skis are a blast even in less than ideal conditions, they just turn differently.
Have you ever experimented with tuning? Putting a more aggressive edge and base bevel?
maaatttHead oblivion 94, just a touch of early rise in the top.
It's fun too, and also has the same base as the head rebel wc skis
I'll have to check them out, not looked at them yet. Was also checking the new Nordica Unleashed 98mm. They seem to be a replacement for next season for the Soul Riders. If they've got rid of some rocker they could also be a future contender.
SlowbroEdollos maybe? 98 underfoot, no tail rocker, and the nose rocker isn't that dramatic compared to a lot of modern skis.
I've bought a pair of Armada ARV 96 in a 184cm, they look pretty decent for effective edge and the trad camber is strong under foot so I'm hoping these characteristics have the effect of making the tails feel less likely to wash out. I mean I'm being a bit critical here I know. But I really loved the Atomic Theory skis, for me they were perfect 10 for design. Nice full length trad camber, stiff flex profile, sharp race angle edges and a good twin and near centred mounting, yet skied much better than you would expect in deep. Simplified kit when travelling with it, just one pair of skis required!!
Rocker makes swaps easier. It makes butters easier. It allows for quicker and surfier turns. Still performs super well if you lay it way down on edge and engage the whole ski. It straight up allows the ski to have maximum versatility imo
also no offense but how old are you this thread is giving me dad who just found NS vibes HEAVY
rojo.grandeRocker makes swaps easier. It makes butters easier. It allows for quicker and surfier turns. Still performs super well if you lay it way down on edge and engage the whole ski. It straight up allows the ski to have maximum versatility imo
also no offense but how old are you this thread is giving me dad who just found NS vibes HEAVY
Been skiing for longer than you've been out of your nappies I'd say young un :-)
Yeah I looked at the Revolt 95, but again its described as having the fabled rocker on it, and I think a bit on the softer side. One thing that would really help would be accurate specs being provided by manufacturers, including the amount in mm of rocker, where the rocker lines start from on the ski, effective edge length and so on. Not difficult to provide the specs, and would help a lot with buying over the internet which is everyone's main route now. Unfortunately most don't even provide a profile photo showing the skis together sidewalls to the camera, so you can see the camber profile and rockers (if any). Skiessentials and blister do a decent job of this though, but it is limiting to not get specs. J-Skis as I mentioned above provide all this info in the descriptions of their skis online. And at the other extreme we recently had the Rossi Black Ops, which when released provided literally nothing at all about the ski specs which certainly lost them a possible sale to me and I'm sure a fair few others, I bought the Masterblaster I think the same season the Black Ops came out, and may well have bought the Rossis instead if there were any specs to be found....
Rocker does not necessarily contribute to a lack of effective edge, I think you’re confused by how those two interact. Skis can have rocker and still have the entire sidecut engage when on edge so I’m confused as to what you want here. If you’re looking to spend all your time on piste and use your edges, there are plenty of skis that will engage 90% of the edge on a turn unless you’re sliding around bases flat.
anders_arevolt 95 pretty much a camber ski, and fairly stiff
Maybe they changed the specs again. I looked at it about 2017 when shopping for the replacement to the Atomic Theory skis I wish I could still get, and again in 2019 when I bought a pair of the Revolt 87cm as they are stiffer and only true camber. Its served me well enough.
More than happy to amuse you, young gun!! You should've seen the young guns in the park in Sunshine Village, Canada when I rocked up there in my old school Roosi 4M mogul straight skis from the 80s and started using the XL line for spins :-) Folks were seriously saying to me that I should get some carving park skis and see how much better I'd be skiing in them :-) Made them laugh looking at my saucer boy kit, but I think I had their respect for spinning a tail grab 3 in it on their XL line :-) To be fair once you're in the air it makes little difference what kit you have on you feet, other than in terms of weight. It is more to do with your confidence, balance, and poise on take off and through the air at that point :-)
You know they dropped the Soul Rider this season. Its being replaced with the Unleashed line up. I was interested to see a pair of the Unleashed 98mm. The initially seem to be less rockered than the Soul Rider with bigger shovels on the tip and tail to give float rather than rocketing. So I heard at any rate. Will be going to see em in a shop if possible. Could be a future kick option.
Not heard of Jet Skis. Your US brands aren't really getting over the Europe side as much these days cause the Dollar is kicking the shit out of the pound and euro....
baz25216Not heard of Jet Skis. Your US brands aren't really getting over the Europe side as much these days cause the Dollar is kicking the shit out of the pound and euro....
Nah, nothing to do with the forex...iykyk bro...even in europe.
baz25216Not heard of Jet Skis. Your US brands aren't really getting over the Europe side as much these days cause the Dollar is kicking the shit out of the pound and euro....
Jetskis are just Icelandic d’nollie’s brought back from the dead
animatorRocker does not necessarily contribute to a lack of effective edge, I think you’re confused by how those two interact. Skis can have rocker and still have the entire sidecut engage when on edge so I’m confused as to what you want here. If you’re looking to spend all your time on piste and use your edges, there are plenty of skis that will engage 90% of the edge on a turn unless you’re sliding around bases flat.
I hear what you're saying. The Atomic Theory was a good example of what you're describing. They stated the rocker line at tip end applied to 15% of ski length, and the tails 10%, meaning trad camber and it was a lot of it, ran through 75% of the ski. But the rocker was very shallow and almost unnoticeable in reality. Decambering the ski it looked pretty much like a trad camber all the way to the tip and tails.
And it's a combination of two factors of current ski design that result in effective edge. So the rocker, and the amount to which they taper the skis into the shovel of the tip and the tails which I'm told is done again for that fabled pow day. If they start tapering the edge away from the principal radius, it doesn't matter how hard you engage the edge by laying it over, the bit past the point of the natural radius of the ski will not be doing anything. In the case of the Atomics I'm banging on about, the ski didn't taper out of the 20m sidecut until the tip or tail shovel, so there was no loss of effective edge, meaning it had loads of hold. I get these things are subtle, and fo sure it makes no difference to Henrik Harlaut et al. It was just my preference, and made for a very versatile and strong skiing ski, parky on the park, racey on the piste, and solid in pow far as I'm concerned :-)
**This post was edited on May 4th 2022 at 1:12:00pm
Totes, on the Black Ops. I looked at them a bit in their first manufacturing run, cause I needed to replace my Atomic Theory setup after I pulled a screw loose on the toe piece and they were long in the tooth anyway. But for some reason Rossi did that stupid we're not saying anything about the design of the ski bit, and at the time there were no reviews on them. That meant I didn't want to buy em over the internet which was my only option from where I was at the time in France. So I ended up buying a pair of J-Skis masterblasters because they seemed to be a reasonable fit with what I wanted. They've been good for sure, just if they came without the rocker and tapering which to be fair lets them smear and butter etc more than they would otherwise, then the'd have been more up my street than they are. Opted for ARV96 cause I picked a new pair up half price this time around, and they look fairly similar to the Rossi ski you mention.
