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Why not Look Pivots?

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yungskigga
Posts: 35 - Karma: 157
Basically what the title says... Can someone explain to me please, (other than the cost or if you wanna go touring) is there any reason someone might not want Look Pivots? Apparently they are a bit safer regarding knee injuries. Do they have any cons?
Apr 28 2022 2:14AM
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ASSholebomber22
Posts: 6598 - Karma: 69,845
They are operationally the same as any other binding besides the knee binding or tyrolia's new offering. Safer is a misnomer. The brakes suck. They can suck ass to put on in deep snow. There is very limited adjustability for different boot sizes, and forward pressure is a dark art to set. Great bindings otherwise but not perfect by any means.
Apr 28 2022 2:23AM
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lil.Boye
Posts: 2648 - Karma: 12,030
i have had bad luck with pivots, bought them as an investment for life but then they only last me a season and a half. they are annoying as shit to put on, they have little to no adjustment and they can be quite heavy. i also feel like my skis are more likely to get stolen with pivots.

the positive side is when they are done right with forward pressure and that shit, they are the most solid feeling bindings i have ever felt, they also look more sex than my attacks and griffons
Apr 28 2022 3:20AM
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isaacwrong
Posts: 2291 - Karma: 17,646
Some people don’t like to get penetrated
Apr 28 2022 5:54AM
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BearsOnKetamine
Posts: 674 - Karma: 1,234
lil.Boyei have had bad luck with pivots, bought them as an investment for life but then they only last me a season and a half. they are annoying as shit to put on, they have little to no adjustment and they can be quite heavy. i also feel like my skis are more likely to get stolen with pivots.

the positive side is when they are done right with forward pressure and that shit, they are the most solid feeling bindings i have ever felt, they also look more sex than my attacks and griffons


Tf is forward pressure and what does it do
Apr 28 2022 7:37AM
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Mr.Ice
Posts: 23 - Karma: 148
BearsOnKetamineTf is forward pressure and what does it do


it fights against backward pressure
Apr 28 2022 7:44AM
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Icant_kfed
Posts: 1274 - Karma: 11,538
They like to acquire snow and ice in the track, and sometimes shit stains, so be wary of used ones
Apr 28 2022 9:21AM
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lil.Boye
Posts: 2648 - Karma: 12,030
BearsOnKetamineTf is forward pressure and what does it do

It is basically how much pressure the heel have on your boot. Done wrong you will prerelease, or even worse, not release. Ot’s measured on the mounting plate where a white thingymajig have to line up with a line on the mounting piece. Really unscientific, and absolute ass to set. You have to fiddle with the arms to get it right.
Apr 28 2022 9:31AM
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BLandz
Posts: 1653 - Karma: 27,109
I rode pivots for 5 years in a row and I just got STH’s middle of last season. I like the STH’s better tbh. Don’t think I will ever go back.

The click in is better (especially in deep snow). The brakes don’t snap on the first switch eject. Way better adjustability. The only downside is they don’t look quite as cool imo but idc.

Only thing I will say if you buy the new STH’s and plan to mount them yourself keep in mind that they slightly changed the heel at some point so the templates online for the heel is incorrect
Apr 28 2022 10:07AM
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dkels
Posts: 137 - Karma: 648
Reposting my comment from another pivot post:


I rode pivots for years and eventually hopped off the pivot train because:
- the brakes are expensive if you break them or put them on different skis ($95 dollars compared to $25-$50 for other bindings)
- the heel piece rotates 50% of the time when you take your skis off which is pretty annoying
- if you ever try to sell skis with pivots on them, the odds that the person buying your skis won't have to remount the skis to fit their boots is low (pivots don't have nearly as much adjustability as other bindings)
- the price for pivots seemed to jump from $250 to $400 in only like 3 years
- I can get bindings for half the price with 95% of the features (Attacks and STH16s are my new personal favorites)
- Landing backseat on pivots sucks...

I think that when you click into a pair of pivots, you're clicked into one of the highest performing bindings on the planet (great retention/energy transfer/releaseability) but the cons listed above turned me off from these bindings...
Apr 28 2022 11:18AM
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zerospinskier
Posts: 4867 - Karma: 350
Their biggest benefit is also their biggest drawback. The high elasticity in the heel means sometimes you may have a nose heavy switch landing where the elastic heel lift will drop your brakes into the snow and catch before it releases your boot. Which means you snap the brakes more often. It can happen with any binding, but more so with pivots. Most other bindings release sooner before the brakes catch the snow. But pivots also prerelease the least when landing switch. So it’s a trade off.
Apr 28 2022 8:46PM
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IsaacNW82
Posts: 769 - Karma: 6,693
+1 for the knee safety is a misnomer thing. Ski bindings were designed to protect from tib/fib fractures, not ACL tears. For that you need lateral heel release, and if you look closely at a Pivot you will notice that not only is it not designed to release that way, the heel of your boot is completely physically blocked from doing so by the side-lugs:


Anyways, constantly bending brakes (which are expensive to replace), almost zero adjustability for new boot sizes, and a reputation for being more likely to delam skis (smaller bolt hole pattern on the heel) are reasons people like me aren't wild about them. I am also personally very curious about why they are the only turntable design left; marker used to make them too but everyone except look has since abandoned the design.
Apr 29 2022 3:09PM
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.nasty
Posts: 10581 - Karma: 11,157
I run STH's these days solely for dampening and power transfer. I don't mind the extra stack height as I'm more of a big mtn skier who wants to lay turns over more anyway. Pivot's are great and I may try some with risers under the toe piece on my next pair.


fuck I sound old....
Apr 30 2022 8:53AM
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isaacwrong
Posts: 2291 - Karma: 17,646
Switched to attacks this past year, no complaints. Easy snap in for hiking too. I don’t see how people spend retail price $300-$400 on bindings. A bn pair of v’s and pivots plus mount would be pushing 1k. I look around on sidelineswap, Facebook/Craigslist for racers unloading old “wc” setups. All of them I’ve bought for under $100
Apr 30 2022 10:20AM
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SchizoSkier
Posts: 2761 - Karma: 29,908
the brakes break easily
yungskiggaBasically what the title says... Can someone explain to me please, (other than the cost or if you wanna go touring) is there any reason someone might not want Look Pivots? Apparently they are a bit safer regarding knee injuries. Do they have any cons?
May 1 2022 10:36AM
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BearsOnKetamine
Posts: 674 - Karma: 1,234
I see a lot of broken ones and the fear of getting your finger stuck
May 2 2022 10:27PM
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Brother_trucker
Posts: 184 - Karma: 673
yungskiggaBasically what the title says... Can someone explain to me please, (other than the cost or if you wanna go touring) is there any reason someone might not want Look Pivots? Apparently they are a bit safer regarding knee injuries. Do they have any cons?


Only cons I would say they have is that the brakes don't tuck away. So sometimes for example when side stepping it is possible to catch the brakes in your trousers or on the other skis. They would be better IMO if they did what Salomon do by making them fold up and inwards so they don't stick out past the edge of the ski when you've got your skis on. I would not recommend getting pivot / Look bindings if you have a significant difference between the width of the ski at the mount point and the binding brake width. My pivot 18s have brake width of 95mm stated and are on a ski with a nominal 96mm waist, and the brakes still stick out as described, a little, but none the less still do. Salomon STH2 have brakes that fold up and out of the way and never catch as a result. You do see people with bent brakes on look bindings IMO as a result of what I'm describing here.
May 3 2022 10:06AM
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Brother_trucker
Posts: 184 - Karma: 673
Additional, I would also not recommend getting any binding with those annoying sliding spring loaded plates under the toe of you boot on the binding toe piece. I have had a pair of pivot 14 and SPX12 bindings get ruined because the crap mechanism of this sliding plate jammed or broke completely. Look basically told me to GTF when approached for a refund in both cases. In both cases the bindings were ruined within a season, so not even a few months old - utterly pony after sales from a big company. I currently use Pivot 18s and Salomon STH2 as a result of this stuff.
May 3 2022 10:11AM
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Michael.asquith_
Posts: 20 - Karma: 95
The breaks suck, for me that’s honestly the only valid reason. But for some people adjustability (or lack thereof) could be an issue and the turntable heel in pow. However when everyone says they are overpriced they really aren’t. Backcountry sells attack 17s for 360 WITHOUT breaks when pivot 18s retail for 400 with breaks so honestly the price difference is kinda negligible. Also I find pivots on sale all the time, got my 15s for like 250 which isn’t a bad deal at all.
May 3 2022 10:27AM
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.nasty
Posts: 10581 - Karma: 11,157
BearsOnKetamineI see a lot of broken ones and the fear of getting your finger stuck


Wanna know the leading cause of broken pivots? Using your ski to step out of the binding. Don't do that and you're golden.
May 3 2022 7:15PM
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BearsOnKetamine
Posts: 674 - Karma: 1,234
.nastyWanna know the leading cause of broken pivots? Using your ski to step out of the binding. Don't do that and you're golden.


I don't use poles...
May 3 2022 8:59PM
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apc.fr
Posts: 293 - Karma: 878
Tbh there's really only 3 pros:
- Elasticity
- Low stack height
- Tiny mounting area

These 3 combined are the reason I use them. They give you an awesome awesome feeling on the ski. Hard to explain, but you can really feel what the ski is doing. When it's close to coming off, when it's flexing, how's it's flexing, etc. I swear this isn't made up, hopefully blister does their binding comparative testing soon to prove it.

Cast is also a pro technically I guess...

Tons of cons:
- Fragile brakes, other components of the heel mount assembly
- Cost/sourcing of broken parts
- Cost of the binding generally
- Finicky forward pressure
- Terrible adjustment range
- Terrible heel mounting process

Still don't want to ever use anything else tbh.
May 3 2022 10:23PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37394 - Karma: 120,201
Half-moon plates still breaking all these years is the reason im done with these POS bindings and plus they have wack-as-fuck colorways. Like really, Rasta colors? Its not 2010 anymore. Fuck off. Plus that Pit Viper collab is so lame lol.
May 3 2022 11:07PM
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rojo.grande
Posts: 1497 - Karma: 12,180
BLandzI rode pivots for 5 years in a row and I just got STH’s middle of last season. I like the STH’s better tbh. Don’t think I will ever go back.

The click in is better (especially in deep snow). The brakes don’t snap on the first switch eject. Way better adjustability. The only downside is they don’t look quite as cool imo but idc.

Only thing I will say if you buy the new STH’s and plan to mount them yourself keep in mind that they slightly changed the heel at some point so the templates online for the heel is incorrect


I just snagged my first set coming from pivots and haven’t tried em yet. Fridge will get them first, I’m so fuckin stoked to see n feel the difference w these. The gen 1 attack 16 was my favorite binding of all time so I got a good feeling w the sth16s
May 4 2022 2:05AM
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Jems
Posts: 7507 - Karma: 97,131
.nastyI run STH's these days solely for dampening and power transfer. I don't mind the extra stack height as I'm more of a big mtn skier who wants to lay turns over more anyway. Pivot's are great and I may try some with risers under the toe piece on my next pair.


fuck I sound old....


you like to sit higher on the binding wtf?
May 6 2022 3:20PM
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BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6989 - Karma: 61,064
Some people do. It’s mostly a racer thing. More leverage over the ski to Lay deep angles
Jemsyou like to sit higher on the binding wtf?
May 7 2022 11:54AM
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lil.Boye
Posts: 2648 - Karma: 12,030
Jemsyou like to sit higher on the binding wtf?


it's kinda sex when you ride parkskis every day and get to try some carving skis with some stack height. stack makes a great deal tbh, my pettitors actually felt more lifeless when they got a lower binding, but more fun to send on
May 11 2022 4:58AM
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