I'm Russian. And I'm sorry!!!

Farmville420How many times do people have to explain that your “3/4” argument is invalid because not showing support for Putin can literally put your life at risk….

coronaAlso literally every recent opinion poll on Putin has shown his popularity surge (like 80%+) since the invasion.

I have no idea how accurate they are and we likely won't find out until studies are able to be conducted (like the one I posted).

coronaThe people of Russia are 100% complicit as they overwhelmingly have supported his leadership for the past 2 decades.

No leader, dictator or not, stays in power for over 2 decades if they don't have the support of the people.

coronaRead up my friend:

https://doi.org/10.1080/1060586X.2016.1144334

The people of Russia legitimately support him. That's not a one-off paper either. It's very well documented that he has the support of the people.

If the people of Russia go through this war unaffected, what will change? Nothing. Put pressure on the people and the cracks will form.

If, during the invasion of Iraq, your cost of living doubled and you fully realized that supporting the current government was the reason would you have been inclined to vote Bush again in 2004? I realize that isn't a great comparison due to the lack of democratic process in Russia, but sanctions do work. Apartheid is a good example of where sanctions worked (a lot more at play, but they were important in ending it).

Kevinb5Russia coming for Newschoolers next

LonelyAre Russians complicit? To a certain extent yes. I'm not saying this is similar to Germany in WWII, obviously, the crimes committed there are much more grave, but I would also argue that german citizens that didn't leave or push back were complicit as well. As complicit as the SS or brownshirts or the Nazi party? Absolutely not, but at the end of the day they are still complicit.

So- I think that fucking the economy and fucking over the Russian people is the best-case scenario, at least compared to dropping bombs on civilian populaces like everyone used to do and like how Russia is currently doing to the Ukrainian people.

It appears that Putin wants power, and disrupting the populace is the best way to reduce his power. The hope being that if enough of the populace is upset and angry about the current state of their country Putin will realize the risk of his power slipping due to sanctions is greater than the risk of having a democratic Ukraine and he will pull out.

Will that happen? That's yet to be seen.

Polling data shows that during his past invasions he has seen a rise in popularity. It's not difficult to believe that people love nationalism and even imperialism. Looking at his polling from statista, which tends to be pretty reputable he seems to gain popularity whenever there is an invasion. Watching interviews from 2014 and earlier, there are a lot of Russias, albeit older, that are still salty about the fall of the USSR and feel like the world has been fucking them over so they are justified in their pound of flesh.

As terrible as it is to say, and I understand the issues with me saying this from my comfy desk chair on my computer, but the only option is for the people to rise up in russia, which brings with it immense suffering. The only options that the west has right now is to either put the russian people in a spot where they have to do so...since they haven't in over two decades....or to start a nuclear war which needless to say would cause a great deal more suffering to both russians and the rest of the world

coronaAlso literally every recent opinion poll on Putin has shown his popularity surge (like 80%+) since the invasion.

I have no idea how accurate they are and we likely won't find out until studies are able to be conducted (like the one I posted).

coronaI wish this was correct, but it's not. The majority of the population genuinely support him. There have been countless opinion polls done over the years that show this.

https://doi.org/10.1080/1060586X.2016.1144334

Abomber22Keep up with the oligarchs as they travel
Twitter account started by a 19 year old.

spintricksGuys. I want to apologies for this terrible shit made by our president.

Trust me - ALL non-idiotic people, non-watching-TV people dont want that terrible conflict.
We all are hostages now here, nobody asked russian people do they understand what is going on and do they want a war conflict. Yes there were NAZI problems, nationalist problems, like in almost every coutry with lots of population and different opinions. I believe 90% of russian people didnt even try to make any history researches to find roots of the conflict.
It is wrong to a country to invade other smaller country, whether it was usa invading iraq or afganistan, or russia, or any other country.

Dont ignore russian skiers and snowboarders, we all only for love, peace and shred.

coronaAlso literally every recent opinion poll on Putin has shown his popularity surge (like 80%+) since the invasion.

I have no idea how accurate they are and we likely won't find out until studies are able to be conducted (like the one I posted).

r00kieI give that poll as much legitimacy as I give Putins ability to score 9 goals every time he plats hockey.

IHatePedophilesGo to hell

VTshredder69Ukraine deserves to get invaded for employing Hunter Biden.

That is all.

Coleg55Hope you’re safe man, can’t imagine your situation

BCbuddyRussian revolution v2

ReturnToMonkeyyou smooth brained insect

spintricksrussian soldiers, those young boys 19-21 year old are now victims and sacrifices -

qazwsxedc34Yes, lets send another Trotsky (Bronstein) from NY and Bolsheviks from Germany to takeover Russia and then kill 30+ million people. V1 was no revolution, is was a foreign takeover.

BCbuddySomeone’s got a useless degree

coronaNeither are at all comparable with the Ukraine. Ukraine, while corrupt, has been fairly democratic and forward thinking for getting on close to a decade now. They didn't attack Russia or support terrorism in Russia, their crime was becoming too 'western'. Not at all comparable to Afghanistan which supported a blatant attack on the west for which there had to be repercussion. Iraq is more comparable.

I think we have to make hypotheticals here for a better comparison: if the US outright invaded Mexico because they were getting too chummy with China, that would be a better comparison. And in that case, yes. I would fully support sanction on the US.

*TURBONERD*Afghanistan didn't fund the 9/11 attacks. It was largely Saudi-funded - Osama bin Laden was actually a member of a major Saudi oil family. Saddam Hussein had some anti-US rhetoric, but also didn't fund 9/11. Plus, Saddam originally came to power in a US-backed coup (and the Afghani Taliban's roots are in the mujahideen that were also originally funded by the US). Your response actually drives home the point I was trying to make - just like Americans, Russians are fed enough propaganda to support a war that's enacted under false pretenses. Knowing this, I ask again - would you have supported sanctions against the US in this context?

coronaAt this point it doesn't matter whether Russian support for Putin and his war is based on propaganda. Whether they're lied to or not, sanctions hurt Russians and internal pressure is about the only thing that can end this peacefully. It's also the only chance Putin will be disposed of.

Your comparison with Afghanistan and Iraq is not a good comparison simply by merit of both countries being run by oppressive regimes that were directly responsible in the deaths of thousands. Like Saddam literally killed hundreds of thousands of Kurds and Shia, used chemical warfare, made entire towns disappear of the face of the Earth, tortured countless people, etc etc. It's pretty alarming that you're trying to compare the situation in Ukraine to Iraq and Afghanistan as if to justify the war.

Let's look back to my Mexico example. Would you be supportive of sanctions against the US if the US outright invaded Mexico because of a growing relationship with China? In this scenario the majority of the US support the invasion. What recourse would the rest of the world have? 1- Do nothing and let Mexico burn. 2- All out war with the US resulting in catastrophe and likely the death of millions. 3- Sanctions that financially hurt US citizens and lower their quality of life so they put pressure on the government to end the invasion.

*TURBONERD*Honestly, no, because sanctions don’t always work and even when they do the economic devastation they cause can persist even through the replacement regime. Major US-led sanctions against Cuba (started in 1960 with a variety of permutations since), Venezuela (much more recent, started in 2018 but ongoing), and Hussein-era Iraq (started in 1990 and in place until he was deposed in 2003) haven’t worked, although Saddam is the only one of those three examples who you could really say wasn’t democratically elected.

The conclusions this takes me to are pretty shitty but I think at this point in history if nuclear power (except maybe Israel and the DPRK if their arsenals are strong enough) makes open aggressive moves like this on an international scale I think the bargaining table is the least bloody way of dealing with things.

You’re getting me wrong, though - I’m saying that Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is abhorrent in the same way that the US invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were. None of these military activities were even remotely justified; Saddam was undoubtedly brutal but the catastrophic destruction of infrastructure the invasion caused has just made the lives of Iraqis worse and more reliant of US aid. Afghanistan is even worse because we’re effectively right back where we started with the Taliban still in power, but with so many dead and with similar infrastructure damage. In the cases of both Iraq and Afghanistan, had the US simply never supported Hussein and the Taliban, the countries would likely be in a much better place.

A final note on the idea that the US invaded Iraq because Saddam Hussein used chemical weapons: they had no problem with him using them against Iran in the 80s, so that can’t be it.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/

*TURBONERD*Honestly, no, because sanctions don’t always work and even when they do the economic devastation they cause can persist even through the replacement regime. Major US-led sanctions against Cuba (started in 1960 with a variety of permutations since), Venezuela (much more recent, started in 2018 but ongoing), and Hussein-era Iraq (started in 1990 and in place until he was deposed in 2003) haven’t worked, although Saddam is the only one of those three examples who you could really say wasn’t democratically elected.

The conclusions this takes me to are pretty shitty but I think at this point in history if nuclear power (except maybe Israel and the DPRK if their arsenals are strong enough) makes open aggressive moves like this on an international scale I think the bargaining table is the least bloody way of dealing with things.

You’re getting me wrong, though - I’m saying that Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is abhorrent in the same way that the US invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were. None of these military activities were even remotely justified; Saddam was undoubtedly brutal but the catastrophic destruction of infrastructure the invasion caused has just made the lives of Iraqis worse and more reliant of US aid. Afghanistan is even worse because we’re effectively right back where we started with the Taliban still in power, but with so many dead and with similar infrastructure damage. In the cases of both Iraq and Afghanistan, had the US simply never supported Hussein and the Taliban, the countries would likely be in a much better place.

A final note on the idea that the US invaded Iraq because Saddam Hussein used chemical weapons: they had no problem with him using them against Iran in the 80s, so that can’t be it.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/08/26/exclusive-cia-files-prove-america-helped-saddam-as-he-gassed-iran/

spintricksGuys. I want to apologies for this terrible shit made by our president.

Trust me - ALL non-idiotic people, non-watching-TV people dont want that terrible conflict.
We all are hostages now here, nobody asked russian people do they understand what is going on and do they want a war conflict. Yes there were NAZI problems, nationalist problems, like in almost every coutry with lots of population and different opinions. I believe 90% of russian people didnt even try to make any history researches to find roots of the conflict.
It is wrong to a country to invade other smaller country, whether it was usa invading iraq or afganistan, or russia, or any other country.

Dont ignore russian skiers and snowboarders, we all only for love, peace and shred.

HypeBeastI might lose my reddit privileges for calling out Russian spammers and telling them where to stick it. I'm still shocked about how much focus we put on Facebook and YouTube yet reddit is literally as open as can be. The only thing they get upset about is name calling but by all means say anything else on reddit and you're fine.

TOAST.Im sure calling them mean names will get them to stop.

severniyOnce again - russian soldiers aren't victims. They are invaders. And in my humble opinion - deserve to die.

This is the story of my friend, whose family was lucky enough to survive the Holodomor, now facing another wave of genocide - https://www.facebook.com/kostiantyn.onopriienko/posts/5345547448811956

russians aren't actually sorry about their attitude towards Ukrainians. They just say sorry, because sanctions took away the goods they used to have. But it's nothing, compared to what Ukrainians are dealing right now. Take a look on a great report made by Vice news. They managed to show a war as is.


https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/1038098/Battle-for-the-South-of-Ukraine

spintricksNo, it is not true. U are talking idealistic, far from real unperfect world.

Those russian soldiers mostly are kids, 18-24 year, they dont know life, and they have no choice - to serve or to get no future in russia, maybe even put in jail. Believe me, it is mostly like when people were kept in german concentration camps during WW2, they all knew - germans soldiers will kill them, but each one person hoped somehow he'll make it through if he stays low. It is phycology.

People are affraid to act if they cant see real alternative perspective.

Not every soldier of cource, there are dogs of war on each side, they like death , destraction, "born to kill" ( remember full metal jacket and what did usa troops did to vietnam ? ) - those persons are totally deserve to be judged.