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December, 2024

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Ski Patrol Deserves More

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HypeBeast
Posts: 9813 - Karma: 72,829
Holy fuck I just skimmed this article. They should be making $25/hr minimum. We're talking people who drops bombs. People rappelling and using beacons and digging to save your life. Like what in the actual fuck. I'm talking about ski patrol at any major resort that does advanced stuff. Holy cow.

https://unofficialnetworks.com/2021/11/30/patrollers-of-park-city-mountain-resort-enter-season-without-active-contract/?mc_cid=c43aee03c8&mc_eid=d7d6858a40
Dec 1 2021 12:38PM
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SuspiciousFish
Posts: 2781 - Karma: 16,814
I wonder with a skilled trade like this if they could make some kind of Ski Patrol Union? It looks like they have an Association but I dont know what kind of teeth that has.

Edit: It looks like they have a Union so that is good.

**This post was edited on Dec 1st 2021 at 12:47:32pm
Dec 1 2021 12:46PM
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aflightlessbird
Posts: 513 - Karma: 501
They are hoping to raise the starting minimum to $16.70?
That's depressing. For a job I would classify as skilled labor there should be way more starting incentive. And retainment incentives.

Fuck I just want some of these companies to give a damn about their employees in general. Seriously just reward and appreciate your employees that work hard and come back year after year. Not everything has to be GUESTS FIRST.
Dec 1 2021 12:50PM
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greensk1mask
Posts: 106 - Karma: 593
lets face it ski patrol has gotten on everyones nerves before but holy shit give them some credit they have a hard ass job and should be paid way more than that

**This post was edited on Dec 1st 2021 at 12:58:06pm
Dec 1 2021 12:57PM
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KilaTsunami
Posts: 3204 - Karma: 30,467
Facts. If they paid a livable wage, I would dedicate my body and soul to it tomorrow.
Dec 1 2021 1:11PM
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r00kie
Posts: 5238 - Karma: 59,582
Midwest patrol: you guys are getting paid?
Dec 1 2021 1:23PM
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bmick
Posts: 220 - Karma: 2,631
except the ones that act like mountain cops
Dec 1 2021 1:36PM
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ASSholebomber22
Posts: 6725 - Karma: 71,460
I remember a couple seasons ago riding a lift with a kid that was disappointed they couldn't do volunteer patrol at my local anymore. I agree patrol and most any emt's for that matter don't get paid nearly enough but they have to organize and make it happen because there's too many willing to work for free or peanuts.
Dec 1 2021 1:44PM
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faber-castell
Posts: 42 - Karma: 489
when i was 10 or 11 my goal in life was be ski patrol and then i rode the lift with one of them at abasin and those dreams disappeared immediately. They get paid jack shit with next to no benefits besides free season pass. pretty sad that the people that make the mtn safer get paid almost the same as someone working in the rental shop
Dec 1 2021 1:45PM
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Canis_lupus
Posts: 602 - Karma: 6,209
First responders in general get dicked on in terms of pay. This is coming from someone working towards an emt.
Dec 1 2021 3:27PM
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SuspiciousFish
Posts: 2781 - Karma: 16,814
ifrieslets face it ski patrol has gotten on everyones nerves before but holy shit give them some credit they have a hard ass job and should be paid way more than that

**This post was edited on Dec 1st 2021 at 12:58:06pm


I always show them respect due to the fact that they may have to literally sled your ass down the mountain if something goes wrong. Mountain Host on the other hand...
Dec 1 2021 4:18PM
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RH406
Posts: 109 - Karma: 1,024
Yeah I don’t get it. They should get hazard pay and higher hourly for sure. Many resorts out west have multiple runs named after patrollers who died while routinely opening the mountain for the day. I’m not sure on the stats, but I would assume with the small amount of patrollers and all the stories you here about fatal accidents that the death rate is much higher than average.
Dec 1 2021 4:31PM
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Chrischi69
Posts: 652 - Karma: 5,063
Depends on the spot but at anywhere bigger than hyland hills they fs do
Dec 1 2021 5:10PM
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HypeBeast
Posts: 9813 - Karma: 72,829
Canis_lupusFirst responders in general get dicked on in terms of pay. This is coming from someone working towards an emt.

Yeah that's fucked too. Ems does so much if you're the type that does scene runs
Dec 1 2021 5:19PM
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JLej
Posts: 114 - Karma: 474
Canis_lupusFirst responders in general get dicked on in terms of pay. This is coming from someone working towards an emt.


all the money that should go to paramedics and ambulance crews goes to police so they can play soldier all day
ya hate to see it
Dec 1 2021 6:23PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37638 - Karma: 123,025
JLejall the money that should go to paramedics and ambulance crews goes to police so they can play soldier all day
ya hate to see it

Cops don't get paid much either when you consider that they're the first ones actually being called in certain cases when it comes to 911 calls. You need a safe and secure scene before doing any kind of patient treatment. Also a lot of EMS in the US comes down to state and local legislation along with laws/guidelines and protocols, and yeah ultimately funding and money. Certain areas are able to do what others can't and its because of lawmakers being cheap.

But yeah Im on board. I grew up skiing PC and have been helped by them so many times, and still continue to work with them sometimes as a coach. Having a good rapport with them lets us have fun and stay safe too. Our PC patrollers love seeing people rip and are really really genuinely great people. Same people patrolling are also working ICU's, ER's, COVID Units down in the citys hospitals and patrolling truly is a labor of love for them.

**This post was edited on Dec 1st 2021 at 6:42:57pm
Dec 1 2021 6:41PM
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Chunderface
Posts: 2534 - Karma: 9,927
Literally Del Taco is hiring at $18/hr.
Dec 1 2021 7:04PM
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ndye
Posts: 3756 - Karma: 7,094
HypeBeastHoly fuck I just skimmed this article. They should be making $25/hr minimum. We're talking people who drops bombs. People rappelling and using beacons and digging to save your life. Like what in the actual fuck. I'm talking about ski patrol at any major resort that does advanced stuff. Holy cow.

https://unofficialnetworks.com/2021/11/30/patrollers-of-park-city-mountain-resort-enter-season-without-active-contract/?mc_cid=c43aee03c8&mc_eid=d7d6858a40


The minimum wage for ski patrol should be at least the price of 2 chicken tenders orders WITH FRIES at the cafeteria per hour.

Local midwest hill? 15 per hour.

Jackson Hole? 36.

You get the idea. Honestly I think all ski resort pay should be based on the going chicken tender rate.
Dec 1 2021 7:07PM
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Shower_Boy
Posts: 155 - Karma: 1,373
Canis_lupusFirst responders in general get dicked on in terms of pay. This is coming from someone working towards an emt.

So true. Currently working as an EMT in NYC and make barely above minimum wage and thats cuz I negotiated hard to make more. A lot of my partners make minimum
Dec 1 2021 7:07PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
Ski area pay is depressing. At least you know what your 17 dollar chicken sandwiches arent paying for. Well french fries, that costs extra but also a reasonable wage for employees...
Dec 1 2021 7:27PM
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BrightFrog
Posts: 593 - Karma: 1,676
lmao ski area SJWs are so cringe. You think you want higher wages, when in reality you want cheaper housing (that’s the problem).
Dec 1 2021 7:29PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
ndyeThe minimum wage for ski patrol should be at least the price of 2 chicken tenders orders WITH FRIES at the cafeteria per hour.

Local midwest hill? 15 per hour.

Jackson Hole? 36.

You get the idea. Honestly I think all ski resort pay should be based on the going chicken tender rate.


I like this. Some places 17 an hoir is great money. Some places you can barely buy groceries and pay rent.

There's a reason fast food is laying 16-18 in these places. Hell prolly 20 or so in some spots this last year.

Seeing some indeed posts the pay is so laugjable at some mtns i can't believe they list it. Min requirement 5 years+ building parks, heavy equipmemt skills, welding and carpentry skills, $15 an hour in a place where rent starts at 1000 if you can find a spot and groceries, gas etc are taxed.


I'm putting a friggin tip jar in my cat this year.
Dec 1 2021 7:31PM
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PimpChimpin
Posts: 1287 - Karma: 12,573
Yes, I saw all of them by cabriolet on opening day, shits sad to see. Wish they would really go on strike instead of “practicing”.
Dec 1 2021 7:41PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
BrightFroglmao ski area SJWs are so cringe. You think you want higher wages, when in reality you want cheaper housing (that’s the problem).


Because you couldn't pay for housing if the wages were legit or even on par or slightly above what fast food is paying?

Also changing the housing market in a small city seems easier than a resort paying employess better. Right...

We'll go with that...
Dec 1 2021 7:48PM
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PoonSauce
Posts: 2 - Karma: 198
As a 5th year pro patroller in MT (and an infrequent contributor but frequent viewer of NS), I can only speak to what I've experienced.

1st off, Unions (especially within ski patrol) really don't work the way people hope they will. Big Sky, along with Park City etc, unionize in an effort to bring professionalism and a 'career' element to ski patrolling. At the end of the day, whether it be Boyne, Vail Resorts or some other corp; the management drags their feet during negotiations so that a patroller who would be scheduled for a maybe $.50 raise now has to wait until negotiations are complete to see any type of monetary return from voting to unionize.

Most resorts that vote to unionize see 1-2 year wait time between the vote and action. During that time it is not uncommon for mtn ops and (occasionally) neighboring non-unionized patrols see increases to pay/benefits.

It's an amazing career where you always get first tracks and the opportunity to make things go boom. I'm not going to pretend that I deserve the same pay as an EOD specialist in the military but the great 'Wendy's Debate' is often discussed in a quiet corner of the patrol locker room.
Dec 1 2021 10:03PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
Jack in the box up the street is hiring at 19/hr I’m pretty sure frying food is a better contribution to society than first responding…
Dec 1 2021 10:11PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
PoonSauceAs a 5th year pro patroller in MT (and an infrequent contributor but frequent viewer of NS), I can only speak to what I've experienced.

1st off, Unions (especially within ski patrol) really don't work the way people hope they will. Big Sky, along with Park City etc, unionize in an effort to bring professionalism and a 'career' element to ski patrolling. At the end of the day, whether it be Boyne, Vail Resorts or some other corp; the management drags their feet during negotiations so that a patroller who would be scheduled for a maybe $.50 raise now has to wait until negotiations are complete to see any type of monetary return from voting to unionize.

Most resorts that vote to unionize see 1-2 year wait time between the vote and action. During that time it is not uncommon for mtn ops and (occasionally) neighboring non-unionized patrols see increases to pay/benefits.

It's an amazing career where you always get first tracks and the opportunity to make things go boom. I'm not going to pretend that I deserve the same pay as an EOD specialist in the military but the great 'Wendy's Debate' is often discussed in a quiet corner of the patrol locker room.


It's damned if you do damned if you don't. The resorts would be paying around the same on average either way. Higher in some spots lower in others.

Sucks that people literally do die doing avy control work and thats the compensation. The myth of the season pass and the lifestyle being fair needs to die. Housing prices say no to that.
Dec 1 2021 10:18PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
DesertStixJack in the box up the street is hiring at 19/hr I’m pretty sure frying food is a better contribution to society than first responding…


Yeah idk current prices but pre shortage tbell in kings beach CA was 14.50. This is 4 years ago. Sure its at least 17 now. Northstar(vail) was paging me 12.50 at the time.

"Why can't we find good workers when our shit wages have pushed everyone out of the industry? Guess people are just lazy?"

If housing was still 200 a month possible in theae towns splitting with friends i get it. But even then, the more skilled jobs start to push away with that.

I know several people that have left the ski industry to weld or do heavy equipment full time. Sure some things can be more loose in ski world but they're making significantly more. Like double or more.

Idk, the big companies need to eat shit on this honestly. They pushed a lot of people out over tiny amounts of money and now they cant find anyone, not even enough randos with no experience. Glad to see mtns struggling to hire right now. They deserve it.
Dec 1 2021 10:25PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
Yeah whoever downvoted me must not have picked up on my sarcasm lmao there is no way a legit mountain can justify paying less, or even close, to what burger flippers are getting in town. Why the hell would you do a job that’s exponentially more difficult for less or equal pay than punching in and out at the deep fryer.

And I’m not hating on fast food employees. I’ve served burgers before but I like to think I advanced a little in society and am worth more than a job I had as a teenager much like people in ski patrol deserve to be paid more than the homie serving tendies in the lodge.
theabortionatorYeah idk current prices but pre shortage tbell in kings beach CA was 14.50. This is 4 years ago. Sure its at least 17 now. Northstar(vail) was paging me 12.50 at the time.

"Why can't we find good workers when our shit wages have pushed everyone out of the industry? Guess people are just lazy?"

If housing was still 200 a month possible in theae towns splitting with friends i get it. But even then, the more skilled jobs start to push away with that.

I know several people that have left the ski industry to weld or do heavy equipment full time. Sure some things can be more loose in ski world but they're making significantly more. Like double or more.

Idk, the big companies need to eat shit on this honestly. They pushed a lot of people out over tiny amounts of money and now they cant find anyone, not even enough randos with no experience. Glad to see mtns struggling to hire right now. They deserve it.
Dec 1 2021 10:32PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
DesertStixYeah whoever downvoted me must not have picked up on my sarcasm lmao there is no way a legit mountain can justify paying less, or even close, to what burger flippers are getting in town. Why the hell would you do a job that’s exponentially more difficult for less or equal pay than punching in and out at the deep fryer.

And I’m not hating on fast food employees. I’ve served burgers before but I like to think I advanced a little in society and am worth more than a job I had as a teenager much like people in ski patrol deserve to be paid more than the homie serving tendies in the lodge.


I agree. People were hating when fast food was raising prices. I was about it. But it shows a hige fucking problem in the ski industry when Wendy's and tbell pay several dollars an hour more.

Fast food did things to get people working and its happening. There's a huge shortage the last year or so in the ski industry. I think it might and hope it will continue.

Ski areas that don't pay deserve to eat shit.

As mentioned in this thread pay and location matters a ton. 15 in tahoe you can barely buy groceries, 15 in rural NE or mid west and you're doing okay.

But the fast food wages show the trends. When people get all free market sorts itself out and market demands it's like, dude if taco bell pays $4 more it clearly is an issue.
Dec 1 2021 10:40PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
I don’t know the ins and outs because I don’t work there but our mountain is promoting like bonuses/raises across the board this season for employees. I feel like mountains have to do stuff like this or even the people who love working there not for the money will be forced to leave because they can’t pay bills. How fun is skiing when you don’t have a place to stay or food to eat?

I really don’t know the answer dude. It’s tough. I think it will take a mass exodus of employees who are fed up with being taken advantage of and if resorts want to operate, they will be forced to fill positions with higher wages or risk not spinning lifts or opening the lodge for food and drinks etc.
theabortionatorI agree. People were hating when fast food was raising prices. I was about it. But it shows a hige fucking problem in the ski industry when Wendy's and tbell pay several dollars an hour more.

Fast food did things to get people working and its happening. There's a huge shortage the last year or so in the ski industry. I think it might and hope it will continue.

Ski areas that don't pay deserve to eat shit.

As mentioned in this thread pay and location matters a ton. 15 in tahoe you can barely buy groceries, 15 in rural NE or mid west and you're doing okay.

But the fast food wages show the trends. When people get all free market sorts itself out and market demands it's like, dude if taco bell pays $4 more it clearly is an issue.
Dec 1 2021 10:46PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51834 - Karma: 164,672
DesertStixI don’t know the ins and outs because I don’t work there but our mountain is promoting like bonuses/raises across the board this season for employees. I feel like mountains have to do stuff like this or even the people who love working there not for the money will be forced to leave because they can’t pay bills. How fun is skiing when you don’t have a place to stay or food to eat?

I really don’t know the answer dude. It’s tough. I think it will take a mass exodus of employees who are fed up with being taken advantage of and if resorts want to operate, they will be forced to fill positions with higher wages or risk not spinning lifts or opening the lodge for food and drinks etc.


Yup. Nothing like letting 10 year + employees walk for $1 an hour and then having to beg green people and give bonuses just to get people in.

I remember one year northstar wasn't running lifts because they didn't have enough people. You could work a 6th day at your existing wage bevause they needed to keep the mtn open. My wage was shit and i told them to get fucked but some managers were cashing in for sure. Seems like a waste to pay shit wages and then pay somebody that earns way more overtime to do it to stay open.

Idk i forever hope the places that won't change eat shit and fold. If it was some mom and pop place with cheap tickets and rentals i get it. But the places charging hundreds for lessons, 20 for a cheesburger and fries. Yeah, i hope they close.

Sucks to say that but otherwise its forever same shit different season.
Dec 1 2021 10:54PM
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PeppermillReno
Posts: 4842 - Karma: -796
As long as people are willing to do it they will pay as little as possible. But there are well paid management jobs at all the resorts those are the people who should make less and lifties and patrol should make more.

I remember being pissed Vail wanted to pay me for the bootpack program since I was collecting UI at the time. It was something stupidly small and I would rather have volunteered. I got an email from the state congratulating me for finding a job and realized I couldn't clock in or let Vail actually pay me and lose the weekly income. The cunts shut off my pass in January.

Everyone wants to live in the mountains these days sooner you accept that the better. Even wildfires and a snowless winter won't stop the trend. A couple who works remotely in tech can force you out of your dwelling and still find the time to volunteer for patrol for free passes.
Dec 1 2021 11:00PM
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soup
Posts: 6345 - Karma: 4,443
PoonSauceAs a 5th year pro patroller in MT (and an infrequent contributor but frequent viewer of NS), I can only speak to what I've experienced.

1st off, Unions (especially within ski patrol) really don't work the way people hope they will. Big Sky, along with Park City etc, unionize in an effort to bring professionalism and a 'career' element to ski patrolling. At the end of the day, whether it be Boyne, Vail Resorts or some other corp; the management drags their feet during negotiations so that a patroller who would be scheduled for a maybe $.50 raise now has to wait until negotiations are complete to see any type of monetary return from voting to unionize.

Most resorts that vote to unionize see 1-2 year wait time between the vote and action. During that time it is not uncommon for mtn ops and (occasionally) neighboring non-unionized patrols see increases to pay/benefits.

It's an amazing career where you always get first tracks and the opportunity to make things go boom. I'm not going to pretend that I deserve the same pay as an EOD specialist in the military but the great 'Wendy's Debate' is often discussed in a quiet corner of the patrol locker room.

A huge factor as well is it's a seasonal job. It's not what the majority base their entire wage off so why fight. Every ski patroller can justify getting "paid to ski". Personally that's a lazy fucking cop out



Im a machine operator and the wage or groomers bothers me. Grooming, or good corduroy at a resort, is a product they are selling. And they market the shit out that. It's on all the billboards, the panflets. It's advertised in the rental shop. And the stoner dring the $480k groomer is getting paid $15 and hour (CDN). Infuriating. And disgusting.
Dec 1 2021 11:10PM
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gravel
Posts: 5522 - Karma: 42,344
PeppermillRenoEveryone wants to live in the mountains these days sooner you accept that the better. Even wildfires and a snowless winter won't stop the trend. A couple who works remotely in tech can force you out of your dwelling and still find the time to volunteer for patrol for free passes.


for sure, but the tech couple is hardly the main part of the problem, second home owners and corporate developers are way more damaging to the cost of living. at least an affluent couple can volunteer and participate in the community.
Dec 1 2021 11:42PM
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PeppermillReno
Posts: 4842 - Karma: -796
gravelfor sure, but the tech couple is hardly the main part of the problem, second home owners and corporate developers are way more damaging to the cost of living. at least an affluent couple can volunteer and participate in the community.


Not really.

The tech couples didn't exist until covid and compete for resources with ski bums. They are the new variable. They want rentals and affordable real estate and can afford it.

2nd/vacant home owners pay for the public service workers roads schools etc etc while not using them. Yes them and their homes are proverbial kicks in the nads as you ski by them and watch someone shovel snow from the lift at a house noone will be in more than 1-2 weeks a year.

Lots of these ski towns are VERY tax friendly though. The annual tax on a 10 million dollar Aspen house is something like 15k a year you can't park that kind of $$$ in real estate and pay that little tax anywhere and chances are it was purchased for 2-3 million making it a killer investment. Shit could change real fast if people started taxing these properties higher only problem would be they'd all hit the market and there would be no buyers even if they got discounted drastically by 70ish percent if the taxes were New York level.
Dec 1 2021 11:51PM
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RH406
Posts: 109 - Karma: 1,024
PoonSauceAs a 5th year pro patroller in MT (and an infrequent contributor but frequent viewer of NS), I can only speak to what I've experienced.

1st off, Unions (especially within ski patrol) really don't work the way people hope they will. Big Sky, along with Park City etc, unionize in an effort to bring professionalism and a 'career' element to ski patrolling. At the end of the day, whether it be Boyne, Vail Resorts or some other corp; the management drags their feet during negotiations so that a patroller who would be scheduled for a maybe $.50 raise now has to wait until negotiations are complete to see any type of monetary return from voting to unionize.

Most resorts that vote to unionize see 1-2 year wait time between the vote and action. During that time it is not uncommon for mtn ops and (occasionally) neighboring non-unionized patrols see increases to pay/benefits.

It's an amazing career where you always get first tracks and the opportunity to make things go boom. I'm not going to pretend that I deserve the same pay as an EOD specialist in the military but the great 'Wendy's Debate' is often discussed in a quiet corner of the patrol locker room.

What is starting pay at big sky for pro patrol? Been considering it for some time now.
Dec 1 2021 11:57PM
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skierman
Posts: 8384 - Karma: 7,774
"I CARE ABOUT SKI PATROL! I JUST DON'T CARE ENOUGH TO FULLY READ AN ARTICLE ABOUT HOW MUCH PEOPLE DON'T CARE ABOUT SKI PATROL!" - HypeBeast




LOL what a fucking hypocrite.
Dec 2 2021 6:02AM
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Icant_kfed
Posts: 1279 - Karma: 11,588
Ski patrol deserves more but not the nazi rangers
Dec 2 2021 8:04AM
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mattytru
Posts: 2788 - Karma: 5,618
gravelfor sure, but the tech couple is hardly the main part of the problem, second home owners and corporate developers are way more damaging to the cost of living. at least an affluent couple can volunteer and participate in the community.


all of these groups certainly have contributed to the rise of cost of living in mountain towns but the tech people have exploded that cost since covid. not only can they afford to pay the higher and higher rent prices, but they are not needing to rely on local wages to do it. this kinda causes a double whammy effect for anyone trying to pay those prices on a local wage.



at the end of the day it's kind of hard to blame individuals for any of this, as much as i'm slightly disdainful of some of these sorts of people. its more a systemic issue that people using their money this way negatively impacts other people who dont have as much.
Dec 2 2021 10:05AM
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PoonSauce
Posts: 2 - Karma: 198
RH406What is starting pay at big sky for pro patrol? Been considering it for some time now.


Honestly can't say for sure but I can tell you $14-$16 is average starting wage. $20/hour is often typical after a few seasons at a legitimate resort. Covid and the great Californian & Texan migration have definitely forced SW MT ski areas to bump pay but it's important to remember that besides a small gear stipend very few resorts offer health insurance or 401k opportunities.
Dec 2 2021 12:51PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
Damn you own the name “old stoke” for sure
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Dec 2 2021 12:57PM
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hdubs
Posts: 1131 - Karma: 11,671
It's honestly embarrassing that I make more working at target than patrolers make
Dec 2 2021 1:03PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
Ah I thought you meant that was you. Was gonna say you’re like my dads age and I’m one of the older dudes on here
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Dec 2 2021 1:11PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
Are you actually my dad?
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Dec 2 2021 3:10PM
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SkiBum.
Posts: 3604 - Karma: 3,971
Hope they strike around Xmas week and weekend.
Dec 2 2021 3:31PM
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DesertStix
Posts: 2540 - Karma: 14,985
No ski patrol for all the Texans and Californians in town who will no doubt need assistance. If they have a union, I seriously hope they’re discussing this.
SkiBum.Hope they strike around Xmas week and weekend.
Dec 2 2021 4:07PM
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