Member of the Month

KilaTsunami
October, 2024

Online

Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post. Register to become a member today!

Look Pivot 18 Help

profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
Hey everyone, I just had Look Pivot 18s mounted on my new Bent Chetler 120s. I bought them lightly used off a guy at a local shop. I just got home and stepped into them(as one normally does) and noticed that the toe piece immediately tilts forward. The front of my boot also seems to float just above the AFD, until I lean forward. The toe piece also articulates up and down a lot when I lean back, like I would in a butter. Is this normal for the Pivot 18s? I am coming from FKS 12s which have the solid toe piece. I know that the toe on the 18s is supposed to have the vertical release, but I didn't expect this much movement under such a light load.

I probably wouldn't have questioned it, except when I went to pick up my skis, the tech(who mounted them) brought out my skis with a boot that wasn't mine. When I said that wasn't my boot, he turned around and went into the back with the boot and my skis. He came back like 10 min later with my boot and was like oh yeah this is the right boot, you're all set.

Maybe I'm just overthinking it because this is my first pair of new skis in 8 years, but can anyone confirm that this is normal, or do I need to bring them back and have a chat with the manager/guy who I bought the bindings from in the first place?

Sorry for the rant, but I could really use the peace of mind. Thanks in advanced. I'm not sure if I can add my video to this post so here's a link to the video on youtube:


https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/1018520/Look-Pivot-18-Toe-Piece-Movement
POLL
Edit Poll
Votes:

Take care when editing a poll; Options should be similar to maintain vote integrity.

More options will be added automatically as you type. You must supply a question and at least two options. No HTML is allowed.

Nov 18 2021 8:48PM
3 1
profile picture
JLej
Posts: 114 - Karma: 474
yeah get those looked at. i have 2 pairs of new pivots and the toe piece doesnt move. Also jesters > pivots
Nov 18 2021 10:40PM
2 19
profile picture
Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4810 - Karma: 17,052
Forward pressure is jacked. See if they have any techs that are familiar with pivots. Possible they got adjusted to some other boot or some mix up but who knows. Did they give you a test sheet?
Nov 18 2021 10:59PM
8 0
profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
mystery3Forward pressure is jacked. See if they have any techs that are familiar with pivots. Possible they got adjusted to some other boot or some mix up but who knows. Did they give you a test sheet?


I didn't get a test sheet(not sure what that is?). I don't know a whole lot about the forward pressure but it looks like mine is opened up to the 3rd ring. My hunch is that the binding was installed for a smaller boot, and it was just corrected by loosening the forward pressure to let my boot click in. Will send updates.
Nov 19 2021 12:05AM
3 0
profile picture
KCoCM
Posts: 963 - Karma: 8,782
just take them back in and theyll tighten it up. I had a p14 toe piece moving around on me when i brought some home from the shop last year. Ive started clicking in on the carpet at the shop now to make sure nothing is loose after my body weight puts pressure on the bindings a bit
Nov 19 2021 12:21AM
4 0
profile picture
KCoCM
Posts: 963 - Karma: 8,782
edit: double post, but I just watched the video after posting and omg its moving so much lmao

**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 12:24:00am
Nov 19 2021 12:22AM
4 0
profile picture
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6982 - Karma: 61,008
I think you’re right, I think forward pressure is off because they teched it to a smaller boot. Also, was just reading today about forward pressure and how the heel should almost be vertical when forward pressure is correct. It said if the heel is at an angle, forward pressure is too high. Your heel angle doesn’t look vertical enough (aka too high of forward pressure). My heel is always vertical when I ski my pivots
Nov 19 2021 12:41AM
2 0
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
there is a white line and the back of the heel piece; click your boot in and see how far that white tab is pushed back.

If it is pushed back to where it lines up with the two black marks then the forward pressure is set correctly.

Post a picture of what I am talking about OP
Nov 19 2021 12:52AM
1 0
profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
ButteryStix69there is a white line and the back of the heel piece; click your boot in and see how far that white tab is pushed back.

If it is pushed back to where it lines up with the two black marks then the forward pressure is set correctly.

Post a picture of what I am talking about OP


This is a reply to you and BradFi. It looks like the white tab is lined up between the black nubs. I just clicked into my old pair of skis with fks 14s to compare, and I'm realizing the binding is for sure installed too short. The heel piece doesn't go nearly as steep(maybe 65-70deg), and the piece that sits on the boot heel cant seat properly. I am adding photos of my other ski to compare(heel at 80-85deg).
Nov 19 2021 1:25AM
4 0
profile picture
anders_a
Posts: 1680 - Karma: 5,603
how hard is it to rotate the dildo?

forward pressure tab doesnt mean much on pivots
Nov 19 2021 1:37AM
6 0
profile picture
Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4810 - Karma: 17,052
notJacobJohnsonI didn't get a test sheet(not sure what that is?). I don't know a whole lot about the forward pressure but it looks like mine is opened up to the 3rd ring. My hunch is that the binding was installed for a smaller boot, and it was just corrected by loosening the forward pressure to let my boot click in. Will send updates.


I'm not sure if there are different regulations state to state or otherwise but sometimes I've received a little printout from the binding testing machine showing the release values are within spec.

I can't imagine that mount would pass any testing.
Nov 19 2021 1:42AM
2 0
profile picture
charley
Posts: 12 - Karma: 52
Probably needs less forward pressure and a way higher din setting. I can see how far out the toe din is unscrewed causing the plastic insert to stick way out. That’s just the elasticity of the binding doing it’s job.
Nov 19 2021 10:26AM
4 0
profile picture
animator
Posts: 4552 - Karma: 26,250
BradFiAusNzCoCaI think you’re right, I think forward pressure is off because they teched it to a smaller boot. Also, was just reading today about forward pressure and how the heel should almost be vertical when forward pressure is correct. It said if the heel is at an angle, forward pressure is too high. Your heel angle doesn’t look vertical enough (aka too high of forward pressure). My heel is always vertical when I ski my pivots


Another kid posted this ab his CAST system last year, it’s definitely the forward pressure. The heel piece is pushing on the boot so hard that it’s forcing the toe piece up.
Nov 19 2021 11:11AM
4 0
profile picture
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6982 - Karma: 61,008
There’s your answer. Forward pressure too high!
notJacobJohnsonThis is a reply to you and BradFi. It looks like the white tab is lined up between the black nubs. I just clicked into my old pair of skis with fks 14s to compare, and I'm realizing the binding is for sure installed too short. The heel piece doesn't go nearly as steep(maybe 65-70deg), and the piece that sits on the boot heel cant seat properly. I am adding photos of my other ski to compare(heel at 80-85deg).
Nov 19 2021 11:12AM
2 0
profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
animatorAnother kid posted this ab his CAST system last year, it’s definitely the forward pressure. The heel piece is pushing on the boot so hard that it’s forcing the toe piece up.


That is my thought now. Do you know if the forward pressure has any more room to open up (it's on the 3rd ring)? Or do we think I'm looking at a possible remount?
Nov 19 2021 11:24AM
0 0
profile picture
animator
Posts: 4552 - Karma: 26,250
notJacobJohnsonThat is my thought now. Do you know if the forward pressure has any more room to open up (it's on the 3rd ring)? Or do we think I'm looking at a possible remount?


If you’re back at the third ring I’d say it’s most likely a remount but show us a picture
Nov 19 2021 11:36AM
0 0
profile picture
animator
Posts: 4552 - Karma: 26,250
notJacobJohnsonThat is my thought now. Do you know if the forward pressure has any more room to open up (it's on the 3rd ring)? Or do we think I'm looking at a possible remount?


Also after reading your OP I would assume the tech 100% fucked up and used the wrong boot. Take them back, I’m 90% sure they owe you a new ski.
Nov 19 2021 11:37AM
4 0
profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
On a side note, can anyone post/ send me a video of you clipping into your pivot 18s? I want to see what normal behavior of the toe piece looks like/if there's any movement.
Nov 19 2021 2:31PM
3 0
profile picture
shred14
Posts: 201 - Karma: 1,128
Since you all seem to know a bit about pivots, I just got a set of 15s and mounted them. I’ve never owned pivots so I’m not sure if this is normal. When popping out I’m able to push the heel piece down with my hand without any effort. Is that normal? Heel piece doesn’t move at all when leaning forward. In comparison to my past bindings (markers) there’s a bit of force that needs to be applied to push the heel piece down.
**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:14:31pm

**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:16:04pm
Nov 19 2021 6:12PM
2 0
profile picture
Chunderface
Posts: 2515 - Karma: 9,869
God I fucking hate shops.
Nov 19 2021 6:55PM
3 3
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
skeirmanGod I fucking hate shops.


what the fuck is your name
Nov 19 2021 6:56PM
0 0
profile picture
Notaskibum
Posts: 849 - Karma: 4,007
shred14Since you all seem to know a bit about pivots, I just got a set of 15s and mounted them. I’ve never owned pivots so I’m not sure if this is normal. When popping out I’m able to push the heel piece down with my hand without any effort. Is that normal? Heel piece doesn’t move at all when leaning forward. In comparison to my past bindings (markers) there’s a bit of force that needs to be applied to push the heel piece down.
**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:14:31pm

**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:16:04pm

Take them to get looked at, normally piviot are actuality harder to push down imo
Nov 20 2021 9:19AM
0 0
profile picture
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6982 - Karma: 61,008
Kinda sounds like the din is at bottom of the range. Pivots will seem weird at first overall. The action of the heel is relatively smooth so being able to push yourself out, like i said, just sounds like maybe you need the din increased. Markers are known for being tough to step in and out of. Have a shop check it out
shred14Since you all seem to know a bit about pivots, I just got a set of 15s and mounted them. I’ve never owned pivots so I’m not sure if this is normal. When popping out I’m able to push the heel piece down with my hand without any effort. Is that normal? Heel piece doesn’t move at all when leaning forward. In comparison to my past bindings (markers) there’s a bit of force that needs to be applied to push the heel piece down.
**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:14:31pm

**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:16:04pm
Nov 20 2021 10:10AM
0 0
profile picture
shred14
Posts: 201 - Karma: 1,128
BradFiAusNzCoCaKinda sounds like the din is at bottom of the range. Pivots will seem weird at first overall. The action of the heel is relatively smooth so being able to push yourself out, like i said, just sounds like maybe you need the din increased. Markers are known for being tough to step in and out of. Have a shop check it out


Good point, I haven’t adjusted the din yet.

here’s an example.https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/1018786/trim-3EE3F923-FE43-4485-9B51-C80F7A135E75-MOV
Nov 20 2021 10:31AM
0 0
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
shred14Since you all seem to know a bit about pivots, I just got a set of 15s and mounted them. I’ve never owned pivots so I’m not sure if this is normal. When popping out I’m able to push the heel piece down with my hand without any effort. Is that normal? Heel piece doesn’t move at all when leaning forward. In comparison to my past bindings (markers) there’s a bit of force that needs to be applied to push the heel piece down.
**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:14:31pm

**This post was edited on Nov 19th 2021 at 6:16:04pm


ya thats normal

whats ur din at
Nov 20 2021 10:40AM
0 0
profile picture
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6982 - Karma: 61,008
That’s part of the normal function of the bindings elasticity. It’s built that way so your heel can rise to absorb some impact but then it’ll bring you back to the ski. I thought you meant push yourself out entirely. That’s totally normal.
shred14Good point, I haven’t adjusted the din yet.

here’s an example.https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/1018786/trim-3EE3F923-FE43-4485-9B51-C80F7A135E75-MOV
Nov 20 2021 10:50AM
1 0
profile picture
shred14
Posts: 201 - Karma: 1,128
ButteryStix69ya thats normal

whats ur din at


Good to know, it’s at a 7.
Nov 20 2021 11:04AM
0 0
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
shred14Good to know, it’s at a 7.


i would say turn it up a bit if you re comfortable
Nov 20 2021 12:56PM
2 0
profile picture
mrk127
Posts: 1803 - Karma: 16,313
look pivot moment
Nov 20 2021 2:03PM
1 2
profile picture
notJacobJohnson
Posts: 105 - Karma: 344
shred14Good to know, it’s at a 7.


As a reference, I'm 5'10", 185lbs, and am pretty sendy. I set my fks 140s at a 10. Seems to be my sweet spot to release when needed and still holding me in through the rough stuff. Just run it on the low end and **have a professional** turn it up one number at a time until you don't have any unwanted releases.
Nov 20 2021 6:55PM
1 0
profile picture
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6982 - Karma: 61,008
The last thing you said. Turn it up as you go (IF NEEDED). I run mine at a 9 when I’m sending and I’m 5’8” 165lbish. Works great for me. Gonna start the season at an 8 and bring it back up to a 9 as I get back in shape and send harder.
notJacobJohnsonAs a reference, I'm 5'10", 185lbs, and am pretty sendy. I set my fks 140s at a 10. Seems to be my sweet spot to release when needed and still holding me in through the rough stuff. Just run it on the low end and **have a professional** turn it up one number at a time until you don't have any unwanted releases.
Nov 20 2021 7:43PM
0 0
profile picture
charley
Posts: 12 - Karma: 52
those won’t work very well set at 8. It’s a p18 and 8 is the lowest number on the window and the spring will not be compressed enough to function properly. Get the p15 if you need a metal toe otherwise stick with the lighter p12’s.
Nov 21 2021 9:39AM
2 4
profile picture
tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,385
How come it's sold as 8-18 DIN if it doesn't work properly on the scale it was sold at?
charleythose won’t work very well set at 8. It’s a p18 and 8 is the lowest number on the window and the spring will not be compressed enough to function properly. Get the p15 if you need a metal toe otherwise stick with the lighter p12’s.
Nov 21 2021 11:21PM
4 1
profile picture
Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4810 - Karma: 17,052
tominiemenmaaHow come it's sold as 8-18 DIN if it doesn't work properly on the scale it was sold at?


This is sort of an old school way of thinking. In reality they have to pass tests at all DIN and they're fine to run anywhere in the range. There is no need to buy Pivot 18s if your DIN is 8 of course and it would be prudent and economical to buy a binding of which you will be in the mide of the range.
Nov 21 2021 11:27PM
5 0
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
tominiemenmaaHow come it's sold as 8-18 DIN if it doesn't work properly on the scale it was sold at?


i think it is so the spring has wiggle room: tighter and lower. P 18 is perfect if u run your din 10+ i would say
Nov 21 2021 11:31PM
1 0
profile picture
tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,385
That's what I've always thought. My bindings are all Pivots, I buy them mainly because they can take a beating and last forever. Some are 15 some are 18 and I ride them between 9 and 10.5 depending on the ski & occasion. My first pair of bindings were Squires and they exploded on a very casual slam after a few months so decided to dive to the other end of the pool.


mystery3This is sort of an old school way of thinking. In reality they have to pass tests at all DIN and they're fine to run anywhere in the range. There is no need to buy Pivot 18s if your DIN is 8 of course and it would be prudent and economical to buy a binding of which you will be in the mide of the range.
Nov 21 2021 11:35PM
3 0
profile picture
lilnoid666
Posts: 379 - Karma: 738
tominiemenmaaThat's what I've always thought. My bindings are all Pivots, I buy them mainly because they can take a beating and last forever. Some are 15 some are 18 and I ride them between 9 and 10.5 depending on the ski & occasion. My first pair of bindings were Squires and they exploded on a very casual slam after a few months so decided to dive to the other end of the pool.


*the deep end
Nov 21 2021 11:48PM
2 0
profile picture
tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,385
Yup. Never has the situation Pivoted, I've kept the Look ever since.
ButteryStix69*the deep end
Nov 22 2021 3:17AM
2 0
profile picture
anders_a
Posts: 1680 - Karma: 5,603
comparing squire to pivot 18s..
Nov 22 2021 4:52AM
2 0
profile picture
tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,385
True story bro 🤷😁
anders_acomparing squire to pivot 18s..
Nov 22 2021 12:32PM
1 0
profile picture
tarm
Posts: 76 - Karma: 385
Yo, had my 15s mounted at buckmans out in PA, and the toe piece moved more than in your video and the dildo didn't go nearly all the way up. Shitty shop told me it was right until asked the manager which then he just increased the toe piece DIN the toe piece still moved but much less but the dildo doesn't go nearly all the way up and I can push it 15 degrees further towards the heel of my boot. Skiing tmmrw, am I fuckd?
Nov 27 2021 2:03AM
2 0
profile picture
elm.
Posts: 1493 - Karma: 13,497
Are u sure they're compatible with your boot? Gripwalk/alpine/WTR?

Also I've found the white tab is useless when setting forward pressure. When you put your boot in the dildo should go about halfway up then "click" into the right position. It's more of an art than a science.
Nov 28 2021 12:07PM
3 0
profile picture
anders_a
Posts: 1680 - Karma: 5,603
rotate dildo & dildo feel is key. kinda stupid, but yeah
Nov 28 2021 1:27PM
1 0
All times are Eastern (-5)