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Calf/ Soleus PAIN after every day skiing.

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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Hey all, I’m a good skier and have been for a few years. Starting mid last year, my soleus muscles flare up, especially on my right side. I have heard things about backseat, etc. I had them fitted with a boot fitter, molded, and ended up buying pro wrap intuition liners to try and solve the problem. It didn’t, every day I ski, that spot is tender tender to the touch, and I take a week break for it to feel better. Have been doing tons of calf raises and stretches. Any suggestions? Thanks guys. Just wanna get skiing again.


grant



Nov 29 2020 3:46PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Also, I used an older pair of my boots that were fine at the time, and they made my calves feel the same way. Maybe worse. Any help is appreciated, going to boot fitter soon as well
Nov 29 2020 3:51PM
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shinbangclan
Posts: 1177 - Karma: 7,546
Had this problem a lot last season from simply overskiing, skiing backseat, and trying to butter too much. If taking it easy doesn't work, that's when I would go to the hardware, which it seems you have already done. Rest, strengthen, and pop an advil seems like your best bet.
Nov 29 2020 3:58PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
I gotcha. I’m going to pop a hefty amount of Advil ina few days and take the whole day easy. No butters, no backseat. Gonna ski Normal for once. I don’t want to, wish I could go hard but I get it. Thanks man
Nov 29 2020 4:03PM
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SendyMcSendyface
Posts: 2730 - Karma: 22,990
Are you using the stock insoles, or do you have superfeet or something similar?
Nov 29 2020 5:12PM
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SavageBiff
Posts: 3483 - Karma: 14,753
Your muscles etc should adapt, especially if you ski frequently, I ski til I’m in pain but it goes away after 2 or 3 weeks, somethings up with either the fit of your boot, liner, your insoles, or stance, also an underdeveloped muscle in one area makes other muscles work harder when they shouldn’t, if your not training legs that is.
Nov 29 2020 7:30PM
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ericforman
Posts: 722 - Karma: 6,212
Go to Physical therapy if you have any kind of decent health insurance. Persistent problems like this tend to be best addressed by people who have some idea what they are doing and hold you accountable for doing your exercises.


also if you are doing a lot of butters / presses I would stop for a bit.
Nov 29 2020 7:31PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
SendyMcSendyfaceAre you using the stock insoles, or do you have superfeet or something similar?


I use the stock insole for the boot and for the liner. Custom footbed would be nice I’m sure.
Nov 29 2020 8:26PM
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SendyMcSendyface
Posts: 2730 - Karma: 22,990
Grant_TarbellI use the stock insole for the boot and for the liner. Custom footbed would be nice I’m sure.


Stock insoles are absolute garbage. They do do nothing to support your foot. With the boot properly buckled, your foot will be forced into an unnatural position. A pair of good footbeds will keep your foot in its proper shape. They don't have to be expensive custom ones, a pair of superfeet is like $40, and will probably make a difference.
Nov 29 2020 8:47PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Thanks mane. I have an appointment with what some would say is the best boot fitter in Portland, to take a look at my setup. In the meantime, lots of strength exercises for the lower legs and custom foot beds. Appreciate your words my friend!

grant
SendyMcSendyfaceStock insoles are absolute garbage. They do do nothing to support your foot. With the boot properly buckled, your foot will be forced into an unnatural position. A pair of good footbeds will keep your foot in its proper shape. They don't have to be expensive custom ones, a pair of superfeet is like $40, and will probably make a difference.
Nov 30 2020 12:11AM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
HA. I know this is a joke but I have to say, I can’t even fit into a full tilt. Their biggest 30.5 and my toes are crunched like a Corolla met a cow. We need bigger sizes!! Not all of us have tiny dicks
The referenced post has been removed.
Nov 30 2020 12:13AM
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musclehamster
Posts: 248 - Karma: 1,231
Grant_TarbellHA. I know this is a joke but I have to say, I can’t even fit into a full tilt. Their biggest 30.5 and my toes are crunched like a Corolla met a cow. We need bigger sizes!! Not all of us have tiny dicks


may not have the biggest dinghy in the ocean but itll float forever
Nov 30 2020 12:14AM
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The.Fish
Posts: 2269 - Karma: 4,988
I used to have this issue and was convinced that I was a decent skier. Then somebody told me that I should be skiing with forward shin pressure at all times essentially. This fixed my issues for the most part. If I try to do a tail butter, it flares up really bad, but my normal skiing is fixed. In 2019 I did a 3 day trip to salt lake and I was crying just trying to ski blues at snowbird because I couldn't take the pain. Fast word to 2020, I skied blacks at vail and beaver creek all day with no problems boot wise. I really made an effort to not get sent to the backseat and I think that is what helped.
Nov 30 2020 2:09AM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
The.FishI used to have this issue and was convinced that I was a decent skier. Then somebody told me that I should be skiing with forward shin pressure at all times essentially. This fixed my issues for the most part. If I try to do a tail butter, it flares up really bad, but my normal skiing is fixed. In 2019 I did a 3 day trip to salt lake and I was crying just trying to ski blues at snowbird because I couldn't take the pain. Fast word to 2020, I skied blacks at vail and beaver creek all day with no problems boot wise. I really made an effort to not get sent to the backseat and I think that is what helped.


Word up. I’m gonna make sure I’m never dropping back or takin my pressure off, thanks mane
Nov 30 2020 2:11AM
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f100prerunner
Posts: 504 - Karma: 1,313
I used to have this problem when my boots didn’t fit...a lack of footbeds could definitely be causing it as well
Nov 30 2020 3:35AM
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SavageBiff
Posts: 3483 - Karma: 14,753
I believe I’ve diagnosed your problem, stop tucking your Dick into your boots
Grant_TarbellHA. I know this is a joke but I have to say, I can’t even fit into a full tilt. Their biggest 30.5 and my toes are crunched like a Corolla met a cow. We need bigger sizes!! Not all of us have tiny dicks
Nov 30 2020 5:35AM
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TheHamburglar
Posts: 3895 - Karma: 3,315
Grant_TarbellHA. I know this is a joke but I have to say, I can’t even fit into a full tilt. Their biggest 30.5 and my toes are crunched like a Corolla met a cow. We need bigger sizes!! Not all of us have tiny dicks


LMAOOOOO

- Full Tilt wearer
Nov 30 2020 7:05AM
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Session
Posts: 5379 - Karma: 22,153
Grant_TarbellThanks mane. I have an appointment with what some would say is the best boot fitter in Portland, to take a look at my setup. In the meantime, lots of strength exercises for the lower legs and custom foot beds. Appreciate your words my friend!

grant


So, you're going to see Greg Coulter?
Nov 30 2020 11:48AM
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BagOTricks
Posts: 815 - Karma: 3,351
@SkierPT might have some input
Nov 30 2020 2:08PM
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Yung_Gnarley
Posts: 9092 - Karma: 3,022
SessionSo, you're going to see Greg Coulter?


I was going to ask where to go in Portland for bootfitting. Not sure if I trust EVO...
Nov 30 2020 2:13PM
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Session
Posts: 5379 - Karma: 22,153
Yung_GnarleyI was going to ask where to go in Portland for bootfitting. Not sure if I trust EVO...


In my experience, Evo is not bad for buying your boot, and getting a decent fitting. But they are always super busy. If you really want to get dialed in then Greg is the man. There is a reason pro's and Olympians go to him. I always would get my boot at a shop. Maybe get a small amount of work done on initial purchase. Then make an appointment with Greg. I also have had him make all my make my footbeds and then bring them with me for fitting as well.

https://www.facebook.com/BootsAndMorePerfomancebyGreg
Nov 30 2020 3:23PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Yes sir
SessionSo, you're going to see Greg Coulter?
Nov 30 2020 3:51PM
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tomPietrowski
Posts: 7147 - Karma: 17,493
Footbeds are a must for sure, but also how tight do you have your boots? When you lean forward with them fully tightened how much room do you have between the liner and your calf?
Nov 30 2020 4:00PM
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katrina
Posts: 2395 - Karma: 15,192
Go back to the boot fitter. You may need a footbed or to cant the cuff. Getting stronger will help too for sure.
Nov 30 2020 9:50PM
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FapMasterFLEX
Posts: 608 - Karma: 333
Sorry to hear this man. That pain stinks. A few things to help though - I had the same problem when I used to ski krypton's and or FT's. I swapped for a lower flex tongue and it went away, try that. 2nd, you should invest in a vibrating foam roller or ball. You gotta get bloodflow into that area. It's a soft tissue injury that will never heal properly on it's own. You need to work it out. Hit your calf, hipflexor, quad, and bottom of your foot. It's all connected. If you get one, make sure it has a smoother surface. Don't get a roller with bumps. I used to have a lot of muscle pain/injuries specifically in my calf. I started going to TB12 in Boston and it changed the game. Stretching is relatively useless on our calves. Active movement/rolling will do wonders. Saved my skiing lol.
Dec 1 2020 10:04AM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Thanks man I’m def gonna get one. Appreciate you!
Dec 1 2020 1:01PM
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FapMasterFLEX
Posts: 608 - Karma: 333
https://tb12sports.com/shop/products/tb12-vibrating-pliability-mini-sphere this is the one i use. I swear by it.
Grant_TarbellThanks man I’m def gonna get one. Appreciate you!
Dec 1 2020 3:22PM
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SkierPT
Posts: 2177 - Karma: 4,720
I LOL’ed at the TB12 idea.
Go see your local physio. You can stretch and do heel raises all you want and it may not be targeting exactly what is the underlying issue. To me it sounds like a tibial stress syndrome aka shin splints, but hard to tell without more detail.
Dec 1 2020 10:13PM
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freestyler540
Posts: 13083 - Karma: 18,720
SkierPTTo me it sounds like a tibial stress syndrome aka shin splints, but hard to tell without more detail.

Shin splints=backseat skiing. OP need better positioning on his skis.

Damn OP, those are dark as fuck. Mine were never that back and I could barely stand. Is your boot too tights. Looks like bad circulation
Dec 1 2020 11:04PM
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Chunderface
Posts: 2514 - Karma: 9,860
Suffered bad from acute pain behind and above my achilles on both legs for a few seasons. I went to two different highly recommended bootfitters, who each did tweaks to by shells and liners. Didn't help. Eventually I got into a better fitting boot, and learned to stop getting back seat. The back seat thing is what I believe caused the problems. Even still though, if I do something wrong to tweak the area, the pain will flare up bad. Like someone above said, it doesn't just heal. I need to do some pt or something I'm sure.
Dec 2 2020 7:13PM
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Potguy
Posts: 125 - Karma: 147
This isn't always the best solution, but if your boots have adjustable forward lean, you can try adjusting them to be more upright.
Dec 4 2020 4:05PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Bump bump anyone else experiencing this? Shit hurts
Mar 12 2021 9:07PM
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Chunderface
Posts: 2514 - Karma: 9,860
Grant_TarbellBump bump anyone else experiencing this? Shit hurts


Did you see a PT? Gotten worse?
Mar 12 2021 9:34PM
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f100prerunner
Posts: 504 - Karma: 1,313
Did you get foot beds?
Mar 12 2021 10:32PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
Sure did, doesn’t seem to have helped the lower outside calf pain
Mar 12 2021 10:33PM
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katrina
Posts: 2395 - Karma: 15,192
Hate to break it to you but if you think the backseat caused it you might need 2-6 weeks to let the area calm down to really see if the footbeds and boot fits are helping.
Mar 13 2021 9:58AM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
skeirmanDid you see a PT? Gotten worse?


Yep pt twice a week and hasn’t helped
Mar 13 2021 2:41PM
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f100prerunner
Posts: 504 - Karma: 1,313
Your boots likely fit too loose. I had the same issue until I finally got good fitting boots.
Mar 13 2021 4:06PM
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Grant_Tarbell
Posts: 79 - Karma: 87
f100prerunnerYour boots likely fit too loose. I had the same issue until I finally got good fitting boots.


I can see that, I have skinny legs and wrap liners that can be hard to get tight
Mar 13 2021 4:07PM
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BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6975 - Karma: 60,943
That’s what I was thinking. Sounds like the volume is too big around the calves and heel
f100prerunnerYour boots likely fit too loose. I had the same issue until I finally got good fitting boots.


Grant_TarbellI can see that, I have skinny legs and wrap liners that can be hard to get tight
Mar 14 2021 7:38AM
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zmvnk
Posts: 180 - Karma: 218
This sounds like classic your foot is bigger then your calf size. Basically all boots size measurements are based off of size 26.5 so for example if your in a krypton that is 100mm that means that if you are truly a size 30.5 31.5 then that means the last/width in that size is more around 106mm give or take. This turns a mid volume boot to high volume real quick. If you get a well made custom that is specific for your arch this will help to support and shorten up your foot. With this you can size down a size maybe two depending how high ur arch is. Full tilts and dalbellos also have heat moldable shells which can help get that length out the gate 3-4mm. After that if its still to tight on ur toes your boot fitter can punch out the toe box. I’ve run into this problem with customers and will put them in a low volume boot like the atomic ultra and this helps to support there long foot/skinny calf’s.
Mar 14 2021 8:29PM
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jompcock
Posts: 1530 - Karma: 11,313
Had the same exact pain when I switched to new boots this year (nearly identical shell, new liner). I've been skiing way more since classes are online and it got especially bad when I skied like 16 days in a row
Mar 14 2021 8:46PM
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tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,387
Soooo have any of you guys solved this problem of yours? I've had this kind of pain here and there, never to a point where it would stop me skiing tho. But having some atm and trying to be smart, just don't know exactly how.
Nov 26 2021 12:14AM
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hemlockjibber8
Posts: 5977 - Karma: 3,543
Keep seeing PTs and doctors, or really good bootfitters. It's too hard to tell over the internet.



The peroneal nerve is there. It could be getting irritated from pressure but to be hurting long after makes me think otherwise.



Peroneal tendonitis could be the issue. I would guess this to be honest. The muscles in the area (soleus, fiburlaris longus and brevis) get a huge workout and can easily become overloaded and stress the tendon.



Fitness and stretching can really help. But gear set up is a big one. If you ankle is able to roll in your boot, or your foot collapse, you need to use these muscles to pull your foot back. Think about the muscles you use to hold your ski up on the inside edge if your foot is collapsing or your ankle is rolling.

Get supportive custom footbeds.

Make sure your boot supports your foot and ankle, TIGHT.

Stop using wide skis for a while (extra leverage is bad). This is huge.

Have your canting and cuff alignment checked (two different things).

Make sure your boot is an appropriate flex. Ie. you can absorb bumps but the boot will support you.

Give it time to heal.



If you can't find help in person, we can work some magic here with photos.
Nov 26 2021 1:29AM
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WoFIowz
Posts: 9788 - Karma: 72,405
tominiemenmaaSoooo have any of you guys solved this problem of yours? I've had this kind of pain here and there, never to a point where it would stop me skiing tho. But having some atm and trying to be smart, just don't know exactly how.

Yes. It's called a doctor who will refer you if necessary to a PT.
Nov 26 2021 1:35AM
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tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,387
Thanks for your input captain obvious. Trying to be pre-emptive and avoid the doctor phase, as doctors often have zero understanding of skiing injuries. I'm good friends with a sports physiotherapist and will of course consult him as well if things escalate that far.
HypeBeastYes. It's called a doctor who will refer you if necessary to a PT.
Nov 26 2021 2:12AM
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hoodratz47
Posts: 12020 - Karma: 9,475
I found them to be far to narrow
Grant_TarbellHA. I know this is a joke but I have to say, I can’t even fit into a full tilt. Their biggest 30.5 and my toes are crunched like a Corolla met a cow. We need bigger sizes!! Not all of us have tiny dicks
Nov 26 2021 2:50AM
2 0
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SavageBiff
Posts: 3483 - Karma: 14,753
Many years ago I solved this. You need to strengthen the muscles in front of your shin and stretch your calves. %100 problem solver unless you’ve already got a serious injury, same technique as fixing bad posture.
Wrap a power and around something, sit down, wrap around toes in extension and flex toes towards yourself pulling the band with toes, hold, real slow release on the eccentric.
Stretch calves do not strengthen.


Also as said before, a good boot fitter, orthotics etc, make sure your properly aligned, not in need of canting just in case the pain is coming from a nerve up above rather than just poorly fitting boots and poor landings.

Master tip- don’t tuck your friggin bed sheets in, keep covers loose so your toes aren’t forced into pointing down, you’ll wake up pre tight and ready for injury.
tominiemenmaaSoooo have any of you guys solved this problem of yours? I've had this kind of pain here and there, never to a point where it would stop me skiing tho. But having some atm and trying to be smart, just don't know exactly how.


hemlockjibber8Keep seeing PTs and doctors, or really good bootfitters. It's too hard to tell over the internet.



The peroneal nerve is there. It could be getting irritated from pressure but to be hurting long after makes me think otherwise.



Peroneal tendonitis could be the issue. I would guess this to be honest. The muscles in the area (soleus, fiburlaris longus and brevis) get a huge workout and can easily become overloaded and stress the tendon.



Fitness and stretching can really help. But gear set up is a big one. If you ankle is able to roll in your boot, or your foot collapse, you need to use these muscles to pull your foot back. Think about the muscles you use to hold your ski up on the inside edge if your foot is collapsing or your ankle is rolling.

Get supportive custom footbeds.

Make sure your boot supports your foot and ankle, TIGHT.

Stop using wide skis for a while (extra leverage is bad). This is huge.

Have your canting and cuff alignment checked (two different things).

Make sure your boot is an appropriate flex. Ie. you can absorb bumps but the boot will support you.

Give it time to heal.



If you can't find help in person, we can work some magic here with photos.
Nov 26 2021 6:05AM
1 0
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tominiemenmaa
Posts: 573 - Karma: 3,387
Thanks. Haven't skied a day without custom footbeds. Recently switched to stiffer tongues and as I was already thinking that's the likeliest cause for this.

What I've also done is achieved proper heel hold for the first time ever after buying a pair of ZipFit liners.

Hopefully switching back to stock tongue will resolve this.
SavageBiffMany years ago I solved this. You need to strengthen the muscles in front of your shin and stretch your calves. %100 problem solver unless you’ve already got a serious injury, same technique as fixing bad posture.
Wrap a power and around something, sit down, wrap around toes in extension and flex toes towards yourself pulling the band with toes, hold, real slow release on the eccentric.
Stretch calves do not strengthen.


Also as said before, a good boot fitter, orthotics etc, make sure your properly aligned, not in need of canting just in case the pain is coming from a nerve up above rather than just poorly fitting boots and poor landings.

Master tip- don’t tuck your friggin bed sheets in, keep covers loose so your toes aren’t forced into pointing down, you’ll wake up pre tight and ready for injury.
Nov 26 2021 7:58AM
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SavageBiff
Posts: 3483 - Karma: 14,753
Those things are important as well, didn’t say before but a booster strap style strap can also help, but ultimately it’s your bodies ability to withstand these forces through strength and flexibility once the other parameters such as foot beds etc have been established
tominiemenmaaThanks. Haven't skied a day without custom footbeds. Recently switched to stiffer tongues and as I was already thinking that's the likeliest cause for this.

What I've also done is achieved proper heel hold for the first time ever after buying a pair of ZipFit liners.

Hopefully switching back to stock tongue will resolve this.
Nov 26 2021 9:25AM
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