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How to not go broke getting a touring setup

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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
Seriously considering pulling the trigger on the CAST preoders but not sure what else to pair it with. Definitely looking for a 50/50 setup. My ideal would probably be the moment deathwish ( @cydwhit ) but would probably want to cut other costs in the setup if I got those. I would prefer to get actual touring boots, but only willing to spend about 400 on boots. I have the atomic hawx ultra 120s, would those work well with the conversion if I decided to go that route, and would I have to replace my medium wear soles first? Do the hawx ultra xtds fit exactly the same for if I buy online? What is a good but affordable beacon? (I'd stay out of avy terrain until I get some training, I ski in oregon so it's not as gnar as like utah)

**This thread was edited on Sep 11th 2020 at 12:39:14pm
Sep 10 2020 6:00PM
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clorox
Posts: 1728 - Karma: 4,863
I use kingpins on my touring setup, but Pivot 18's on everything else. If I did a 50/50 setup, I'd go CAST. My kingpins are currently on some Volkl Ledges. Feels so good not being very worried about core shots, and I'll just move them back to my JJ Zeros when there's more snow.

Honestly I'd start out touring on a setup with skis you're less worried about getting core shots with, especially if you don't have to drop a ton of dough to get skis mounted. Pins and heavy skis feel infinitely better than frames on any ski imo.
Sep 10 2020 6:28PM
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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
finderI use kingpins on my touring setup, but Pivot 18's on everything else. If I did a 50/50 setup, I'd go CAST. My kingpins are currently on some Volkl Ledges. Feels so good not being very worried about core shots, and I'll just move them back to my JJ Zeros when there's more snow.

Honestly I'd start out touring on a setup with skis you're less worried about getting core shots with, especially if you don't have to drop a ton of dough to get skis mounted. Pins and heavy skis feel infinitely better than frames on any ski imo.


That's a good idea. I should probably just throw them on my old beat up k108s for now and wait for a sweet deal on skis in the spring. They have the plastic pivots on em, but I'm willing to spend good money on CAST and metal pivots as I feel like there's really no competitor for a true 50/50 setup and they'll last me a long time.




Still gotta figure out the boots though
Sep 10 2020 6:48PM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
I'm a big CAST fan, but if you're trying to cut down cost and not already own a pair of metal pivot nor touring boots, I'd look into Daymaker.

With Daymakers you can use your current resort setup and your current boots (without conversion), you would just need skins.

Daymaker is a pretty soft commitment also, I bet it resales pretty easily once you're certain you like touring and want to upgrade your setup.



Last but not least, I'm not sure what your budget is but make sure to keep some $$ for the safety gear (and learn how to use it, maybe buy couple books, consider Avy class you know the spiel)
Sep 10 2020 7:18PM
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Grimesg
Posts: 136 - Karma: 1,013
colorado_frenchyI'm a big CAST fan, but if you're trying to cut down cost and not already own a pair of metal pivot nor touring boots, I'd look into Daymaker.

With Daymakers you can use your current resort setup and your current boots (without conversion), you would just need skins

This is what I did to get into touring and it’s the way to go in my opinion. Daymakers do resale well and I used them a bunch last season. I would say go for daymakers and buy some skins.

p.s. a pieps beacon is a good choice too
Sep 10 2020 8:05PM
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gorbdawggybrent
Posts: 970 - Karma: 8,769
what do y’all think of shift bindings?
also looking into touring
Sep 11 2020 1:08AM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
brentkimballwhat do y’all think of shift bindings?
also looking into touring

It’s a good bindings, it’s the lightest option in the “touring binding that ski down like a classic alpine binding” category.
It’s also the only one that doesn’t have moving parts (CAST and Duke PT you need to remove the toe piece to go uphill so there is always a risk of losing it, or idk it get frozen and you can’t clip it back that kind of stuff)
It’s also compatible with a vaste majority of boots (Same for Duke PT).

In the cons the forward pressure and AFD plate needs to be setup very accurately if you don’t want to deals with pre-release issues (it’s not that big of a deal, just follow the manual)
it gives bites on soft plastics boots
Finally maybe I got a defective one but I broke a toe piece going downhill, which was pretty sketch, but the warranty program hooked me up with a new toe piece no problem.
If you’re comparing to the Duke PT, you could also add the shift was released 2 seasons ago so everything that could go wrong with them as probably got discovered by now, where Duke PT being on their first season I guess you never know what to expect quality wise.

**This post was edited on Sep 11th 2020 at 12:15:13pm
Sep 11 2020 12:14PM
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gorbdawggybrent
Posts: 970 - Karma: 8,769
colorado_frenchyIt’s a good bindings, it’s the lightest option in the “touring binding that ski down like a classic alpine binding” category.
It’s also the only one that doesn’t have moving parts (CAST and Duke PT you need to remove the toe piece to go uphill so there is always a risk of losing it, or idk it get frozen and you can’t clip it back that kind of stuff)
It’s also compatible with a vaste majority of boots (Same for Duke PT).

In the cons the forward pressure and AFD plate needs to be setup very accurately if you don’t want to deals with pre-release issues (it’s not that big of a deal, just follow the manual)
it gives bites on soft plastics boots
Finally maybe I got a defective one but I broke a toe piece going downhill, which was pretty sketch, but the warranty program hooked me up with a new toe piece no problem.
If you’re comparing to the Duke PT, you could also add the shift was released 2 seasons ago so everything that could go wrong with them as probably got discovered by now, where Duke PT being on their first season I guess you never know what to expect quality wise.

**This post was edited on Sep 11th 2020 at 12:15:13pm

what shift binding specifically do you use
Sep 11 2020 12:35PM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
brentkimballwhat shift binding specifically do you use


I had the Atomic one with the DIN up to 13 (the 10 is new this season)
Sep 11 2020 12:43PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5075 - Karma: 43,042
Since I got tagged, here are all my thoughts: https://www.newschoolers.com/news/read/A-Newschooler-Guide-Backcountry-Ski-Gear
Sep 11 2020 12:46PM
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powpatrol
Posts: 1708 - Karma: 11,046
colorado_frenchyI had the Atomic one with the DIN up to 13 (the 10 is new this season)

shift doesn’t take normal alpine soles does it? panterra 100s specifically
Sep 11 2020 12:48PM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
powpatrolshift doesn’t take normal alpine soles does it? panterra 100s specifically


It is compatible with normal Alpine DIN (ISO 5355), and it's also compatible with GripWalk (not sure which year you have but the 2021 Panterra 100s is now GripWalk apparently while previous years were ISO 5355)

The shift is MNC (Multi-Norm Certified) which basically means it's compatible with pretty much any boot that has the classic lip on the toe, this article is pretty good to explain the different norms.
Sep 11 2020 1:02PM
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powpatrol
Posts: 1708 - Karma: 11,046
colorado_frenchyIt is compatible with normal Alpine DIN (ISO 5355), and it's also compatible with GripWalk (not sure which year you have but the 2021 Panterra 100s is now GripWalk apparently while previous years were ISO 5355)

The shift is MNC (Multi-Norm Certified) which basically means it's compatible with pretty much any boot that has the classic lip on the toe, this article is pretty good to explain the different norms.

So it’s usable with no pin inserts? Just got some lovely SGN rakkar 107s. I’ve got maybe 2019 Panterras? Black shell yellow clippas.
Sep 11 2020 2:28PM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
powpatrolSo it’s usable with no pin inserts? Just got some lovely SGN rakkar 107s. I’ve got maybe 2019 Panterras? Black shell yellow clippas.


Sorry for the confusion, it's usable with no pin insert in downhill mode, you still need pin insert to go uphill.

**This post was edited on Sep 11th 2020 at 4:18:22pm
Sep 11 2020 4:17PM
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powpatrol
Posts: 1708 - Karma: 11,046
colorado_frenchySorry for the confusion, it's usable with no pin insert in downhill mode, you still need pin insert to go uphill.

**This post was edited on Sep 11th 2020 at 4:18:22pm


Yea no worries that’s what i thought anyway
Sep 11 2020 5:01PM
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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
Thanks for the good tips on skis and bindings! Still tryna figure out the boot thing. Hawx ultra xtd 120s seem like the dream but they're pretty pricy, I'd need to find one from last year or the year before. What are some other bomber 50/50 boots that are similar? (97ish last, more focused on downhill performance than uphill) I read that hawx ultras, which are my current boot, are a good candidate for the CAST conversion since they are pretty light for a downhill boot, but I'm a bit skeptical. Has anyone done the conversion and can weigh in on how much it blows/is great to tour in a beefy alpine boot with beefy alpine liners and no walk mode? Wouldn't want to spend 250+ (cast says you need to get brand new soles for the conversion) if I could get some real boots for 400-500, but not sure if that will be possible. Is the converison at all worthwhile?
Sep 12 2020 3:15PM
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colorado_frenchy
Posts: 198 - Karma: 1,329
I can’t talk about the conversion but you could definitely scoop a pair of Lange XT Free 130 or Tecnica Cochise 130 from last season for 400-500
Sep 12 2020 7:34PM
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Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4906 - Karma: 17,498
abar.Thanks for the good tips on skis and bindings! Still tryna figure out the boot thing. Hawx ultra xtd 120s seem like the dream but they're pretty pricy, I'd need to find one from last year or the year before. What are some other bomber 50/50 boots that are similar? (97ish last, more focused on downhill performance than uphill) I read that hawx ultras, which are my current boot, are a good candidate for the CAST conversion since they are pretty light for a downhill boot, but I'm a bit skeptical. Has anyone done the conversion and can weigh in on how much it blows/is great to tour in a beefy alpine boot with beefy alpine liners and no walk mode? Wouldn't want to spend 250+ (cast says you need to get brand new soles for the conversion) if I could get some real boots for 400-500, but not sure if that will be possible. Is the converison at all worthwhile?


What size are your current boots and have you done much work to them?
Sep 13 2020 1:07PM
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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
mystery3What size are your current boots and have you done much work to them?


27.5, 310mm atomic hawx ultra 120, heat molded, they fit real nice but I've heard touring in alpine boots sucks so I was wondering if anyone has actually done the conversion and can weigh in
Sep 13 2020 3:41PM
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Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4906 - Karma: 17,498
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2020-Atomic-Hawx-Ultra-XTD-120-Mens-Ski-Boots-27-5/284010629726?epid=11035313785&hash=item42205a4a5e:g:dhEAAOSwsR5fXmcZ&redirect=mobile
abar.27.5, 310mm atomic hawx ultra 120, heat molded, they fit real nice but I've heard touring in alpine boots sucks so I was wondering if anyone has actually done the conversion and can weigh in


Is the fit exactly the same on the xtd models...it should be right?

**This post was edited on Sep 13th 2020 at 4:58:45pm
Sep 13 2020 4:57PM
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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
mystery3https://www.ebay.com/itm/2020-Atomic-Hawx-Ultra-XTD-120-Mens-Ski-Boots-27-5/284010629726?epid=11035313785&hash=item42205a4a5e:g:dhEAAOSwsR5fXmcZ&redirect=mobile


Is the fit exactly the same on the xtd models...it should be right?

**This post was edited on Sep 13th 2020 at 4:58:45pm


Damn that looks hella nice...
I never shop on ebay, how do you know it's legit? If it shows up and isn't actually in the stated condition I can dispute it right?
Sep 13 2020 5:59PM
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Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4906 - Karma: 17,498
abar.Damn that looks hella nice...
I never shop on ebay, how do you know it's legit? If it shows up and isn't actually in the stated condition I can dispute it right?


Tbh I don't shop there very much either and when I do it's usually an eBay "store"
Their feedback is good, if you use paypal or a credit card that would give you another layer of protection.
Sep 13 2020 6:40PM
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Hellblazer_23
Posts: 526 - Karma: 1,919
buy full tilts
Sep 13 2020 8:42PM
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abar.
Posts: 1062 - Karma: 6,890
Well, I dropped the paycheck and bought the boots off ebay and the cast system. Hopefully the boots are legit, if not I can dispute it with ebay and I used paypal. Super stoked on the cast, the guys were super helpful. I remembered that my bindings from when I raced for a few years in high school were looks with metal toes, the toes look exactly the same as the pivot toes, I emailed cast to ask about it and they verified that they (SPK 15s) will in fact work with the cast system using my low din pivot heels, so I just saved $400! So ready to get after it!
Sep 14 2020 6:08PM
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