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Vail releases protocols for upcoming season. Reservations only. "Locals" only.
This is going to be scary. Backcountry skier numbers have been steady rising for years now, this year will spike! Along with that spike will be accidents and deaths.
For those of us with experience and knowledge is going to be “do I roll the dice with full trail heads if possible idiots or do we now venture farther, earlier, away from where the masses will go”
RudyGarmischThis is going to push so many people out into the BC this year, I can't wait...
I think another way or perspective to look at this is looking at golf. This past summer.
I’m an avid golfer. 2-5 times a week usually. When you golf, you have to book or “reserve” a spot. This summer every golf course near me has been packed. Now some of this is due to more private courses then public, but the influx of people working from home and staying full time at their vacation homes has brought demand way up.
This could translate into possible similar situation with skiing. Influx of more people in ski towns, who are still “working” from home or getting out of the city. Even with reservations and pandemic we could see a very busy winter on the slopes - but not off slope (hotel, restaurant, bar)
The mass migration out of cities (due to pandemic and political issues) is at an all time high. These are mainly your high middle class and upper class, but that makes up 75% of your skier base. Real estate values in ski towns is at an all time high.
The skier numbers in last saw were industry wide. All resorts all companies. Last winter was a great winter for skier numbers and revenue across the board, even with shutting down a month early. March skier visits and revenue makes up a very small %. Numbers were hit before early closings for most places.
I haven’t been part of the Vail overloads for a while and the ski biz in general. But I’m still “involved enough” to keep good tabs. I haven’t looked at Vails numbers specific besides the fact their stock got crushed right off the bat but is rebounding quite nice and almost is back to pre-pandemic
I know I’m blowing this thread up but what stops someone with a season pass from not making a reservation and just going?
Is the technology there on the back end to “activate” your pass when you make a reservation? And if you don’t, your pass is just “off”
What stops me from trying to go through the RFID scanner, my pass is “off” but I argue with the employee saying “no no I made my reservation, there must be a mistake” and since I’m already here, in line, holding up the line because gate won’t open - they just let me go?
SkiBum.I know I’m blowing this thread up but what stops someone with a season pass from not making a reservation and just going?
Is the technology there on the back end to “activate” your pass when you make a reservation? And if you don’t, your pass is just “off”
What stops me from trying to go through the RFID scanner, my pass is “off” but I argue with the employee saying “no no I made my reservation, there must be a mistake” and since I’m already here, in line, holding up the line because gate won’t open - they just let me go?
they'll probably have protocol to pull you out of line to discuss it. Kind of like how if you get caught using someone else's pass they'll just pull you out of line.
SkiBum.I know I’m blowing this thread up but what stops someone with a season pass from not making a reservation and just going?
Is the technology there on the back end to “activate” your pass when you make a reservation? And if you don’t, your pass is just “off”
What stops me from trying to go through the RFID scanner, my pass is “off” but I argue with the employee saying “no no I made my reservation, there must be a mistake” and since I’m already here, in line, holding up the line because gate won’t open - they just let me go?
This is going to be such a fucking shitshow in PC......Our ski team just got entirely fucking hosed because of this.......Families knew what they were getting into with COVID but all that money spent to maybe get a slot of skiing for their kid to train...Fuck, so many refunds are gonna be issued.
DeebieSkeebiesThis is going to be such a fucking shitshow in PC......Our ski team just got entirely fucking hosed because of this.......Families knew what they were getting into with COVID but all that money spent to maybe get a slot of skiing for their kid to train...Fuck, so many refunds are gonna be issued.
Thanks vail for fucking over locals yet again.
maybe I'll see you more at the bird this year then?
SkiBum.I think another way or perspective to look at this is looking at golf. This past summer.
I’m an avid golfer. 2-5 times a week usually. When you golf, you have to book or “reserve” a spot. This summer every golf course near me has been packed. Now some of this is due to more private courses then public, but the influx of people working from home and staying full time at their vacation homes has brought demand way up.
This could translate into possible similar situation with skiing. Influx of more people in ski towns, who are still “working” from home or getting out of the city. Even with reservations and pandemic we could see a very busy winter on the slopes - but not off slope (hotel, restaurant, bar)
The mass migration out of cities (due to pandemic and political issues) is at an all time high. These are mainly your high middle class and upper class, but that makes up 75% of your skier base. Real estate values in ski towns is at an all time high.
Yes, this is absolutely the way to look at it. Just because you have a membership to a golf course, which technically entitles you to unlimited golf, it does not necessarily mean you get to play whenever you want. Yes, there will be days when you want to ski, but might not be able to go. This is very similar to a golf course, if its a holiday weekend, chances are you can't just show up at 9 AM and tee off. If you know there is a specific day, you just make a reservation. I look at the positives of this situation as well. Newschoolers ripped Vail apart last winter when there were 2 hour lift lines, won't the reservation system help to solve this? Imagine if golf courses just let people tee off whenever they wanted, it would be a total nightmare.
kbrandoYes, this is absolutely the way to look at it. Just because you have a membership to a golf course, which technically entitles you to unlimited golf, it does not necessarily mean you get to play whenever you want. Yes, there will be days when you want to ski, but might not be able to go. This is very similar to a golf course, if its a holiday weekend, chances are you can't just show up at 9 AM and tee off. If you know there is a specific day, you just make a reservation. I look at the positives of this situation as well. Newschoolers ripped Vail apart last winter when there were 2 hour lift lines, won't the reservation system help to solve this? Imagine if golf courses just let people tee off whenever they wanted, it would be a total nightmare.
A powder day in Colorado is completely skied off by 10:30. Maybe powder days will an all day thing
BigPurpleSkiSuitmaybe I'll see you more at the bird this year then?
Even with the refund option, and as much as I love Snowbird from a mountain/skiing perspective, the fact that resorts are still charging what they are for passes is scummy imo. Having a hard time pulling the trigger on that decision, man. Id like too, but its starting to get more and more difficult to look past the awful aspects of this industry. They gotta make money, sure, but over $600 for a ski pass that requires additional booking still to maybe get a shot at skiing is absurd.
DeebieSkeebiesEven with the refund option, and as much as I love Snowbird from a mountain/skiing perspective, the fact that resorts are still charging what they are for passes is scummy imo. Having a hard time pulling the trigger on that decision, man. Id like too, but its starting to get more and more difficult to look past the awful aspects of this industry. They gotta make money, sure, but over $600 for a ski pass that requires additional booking still to maybe get a shot at skiing is absurd.
Snowbird isn't owned by Alterra, they're Powdercorp. They have yet to announce any reservation system, and none of the people I know up there have heard anything yet. Yes, it will likely be a reservation system, but they might look at it as an opportunity to stay afloat if they don't use a reservation system.
I’m back on the fence now of thinking of getting an Ikon pass now. I’d assume they do this same deal Vail is doing - and more I think about it the more I’m okay with it.
I think I’ll plan skiing just how I plan golf. And $600 +\- is way cheaper then how much I’ve spent of golf this summer, haha
DeebieSkeebiesEven with the refund option, and as much as I love Snowbird from a mountain/skiing perspective, the fact that resorts are still charging what they are for passes is scummy imo. Having a hard time pulling the trigger on that decision, man. Id like too, but its starting to get more and more difficult to look past the awful aspects of this industry. They gotta make money, sure, but over $600 for a ski pass that requires additional booking still to maybe get a shot at skiing is absurd.
SkiBum.I know I’m blowing this thread up but what stops someone with a season pass from not making a reservation and just going?
Is the technology there on the back end to “activate” your pass when you make a reservation? And if you don’t, your pass is just “off”
What stops me from trying to go through the RFID scanner, my pass is “off” but I argue with the employee saying “no no I made my reservation, there must be a mistake” and since I’m already here, in line, holding up the line because gate won’t open - they just let me go?
It's super locked down. I went through it last season. When you arrive, you can only park in designated areas, and there is someone at the entrance to those areas who verifies through your car window your ID, and the reservation confirmation you printed out ahead of time, or you show it to them on your phone.
You then park where they tell you and walk to a check in area near the lift. This check in person sits at a table, and verifies your reservation (which has a barcode on it that they scan) and ID again, and then scans your pass. At that point you can enter directly through a gate that allows you to walk to the lift line. You can't just walk up to the RFID scanner in the lift line. There's no way.
**This post was edited on Aug 28th 2020 at 3:22:22pm
skeirmanIt's super locked down. I went through it last season. When you arrive, you can only park in designated areas, and there is someone at the entrance to those areas who verifies through your car window your ID, and the reservation confirmation you printed out ahead of time, or you show it to them on your phone.
You then park where they tell you and walk to a check in area near the lift. This check in person sits at a table, and verifies your reservation (which has a barcode on it that they scan) and ID again, and then scans your pass. At that point you can enter directly through a gate that allows you to walk to the lift line. You can't just walk up to the RFID scanner in the lift line. There's no way.
**This post was edited on Aug 28th 2020 at 3:22:22pm
So uh.... like ... if I sneak in... my pass still works on the Rfid right?
And in reference to ops post and the link, did Vail define”local”. Is it state by state, or a xx kilometer radius..?
SavageBiffSo uh.... like ... if I sneak in... my pass still works on the Rfid right?
And in reference to ops post and the link, did Vail define”local”. Is it state by state, or a xx kilometer radius..?
I'd imagine it wouldn't be that hard to 'deactivate' everyone's pass, and then only activate passes that are reserved for that day. I know it's pandemic and all, and any skiing is good, but goddamn, this ain't what I paid for. No recourse though unfortunately.
BigPurpleSkiSuitI'd imagine it wouldn't be that hard to 'deactivate' everyone's pass, and then only activate passes that are reserved for that day. I know it's pandemic and all, and any skiing is good, but goddamn, this ain't what I paid for. No recourse though unfortunately.
I’m still waiting to see what ikon and their resorts do... I mean there’s no resorts in my state on ikon so idk....and if I can’t travel to at least big sky, sugarloaf and my “home” away from home resort of snowshoe idfk I might lose it altogether and just spontaneously combust...
I don’t know locations iof any backcountry, access points etc really, and I’d have to travel for that, take some classes etc... I know some shit but I’m no expert on any avy stuff
I just hope ikon/altered slightly more lax than vail, designate certain lodges for out of towners, or make me quarantine , ban me from all but the slopes and refuse ski patrol and meds from helping me if I’m in need idc but let me ski and gimme a friggin ride back up , that’s all I need. Path down, chair or lemme walk up
I was just thinking that but as I read over the article I couldn’t find where it says locals only, and it seems like this is really set to cater to season pass holders too
partyandBSNot sure if its been said but employees dont need to reserve days. Go get ypu a holiday help position and skip the reservation system
SkiBum.I know I’m blowing this thread up but what stops someone with a season pass from not making a reservation and just going?
Is the technology there on the back end to “activate” your pass when you make a reservation? And if you don’t, your pass is just “off”
What stops me from trying to go through the RFID scanner, my pass is “off” but I argue with the employee saying “no no I made my reservation, there must be a mistake” and since I’m already here, in line, holding up the line because gate won’t open - they just let me go?
I'm sure they thought about and will have the technology ready by then, don't be a Karen arguing with an employee (who's probably a fellow ski bum) when you know you're in the wrong...
kbrandoYes, this is absolutely the way to look at it. Just because you have a membership to a golf course, which technically entitles you to unlimited golf, it does not necessarily mean you get to play whenever you want. Yes, there will be days when you want to ski, but might not be able to go. This is very similar to a golf course, if its a holiday weekend, chances are you can't just show up at 9 AM and tee off. If you know there is a specific day, you just make a reservation. I look at the positives of this situation as well. Newschoolers ripped Vail apart last winter when there were 2 hour lift lines, won't the reservation system help to solve this? Imagine if golf courses just let people tee off whenever they wanted, it would be a total nightmare.
Yes and no. If social distancing and not letting more than two unrelated people ride in the lifts/gondolas together, means the lifts/gondolas run at 50% or less capacity, you might have 2 hour lift lines anyway. On the plus side, the powder won't get tracked out as fast.
SavageBiffSo uh.... like ... if I sneak in... my pass still works on the Rfid right?
And in reference to ops post and the link, did Vail define”local”. Is it state by state, or a xx kilometer radius..?
That's the thing, there is no RFID scan in the actual line, its only at the check in area that they scan your pass. Once you are inside the area, you go through the line without showing your pass. SO you could hike or skin in and be inside the secured area and be good to go. I imagine they are gonna have to address this.
VT_scratchI don't see anything regarding "locals" only
It’s in the title of OPs thread for Christ sake. Made me think it was locals only til I re read it 3 times , now I’m ok with all the protocols they are taking, it’s basically what we expected all along.
broken_skier0Yes and no. If social distancing and not letting more than two unrelated people ride in the lifts/gondolas together, means the lifts/gondolas run at 50% or less capacity, you might have 2 hour lift lines anyway. On the plus side, the powder won't get tracked out as fast.
I don’t think lift lines will increase Drastically since they are limiting #of skiers, and the way they are pairing people, and likely to organize lines it may actually speed things up.
SavageBiffMy biggest worry at this point is I won’t be able to reserve 100+ days
I usually get 60-80 as a weekend warrior, but Snowbird is independent. I really hope independent resorts see this as an opportunity to not limit season passholders and lash out against Ikon and Epic
BigPurpleSkiSuitI usually get 60-80 as a weekend warrior, but Snowbird is independent. I really hope independent resorts see this as an opportunity to not limit season passholders and lash out against Ikon and Epic
That’s a lot for a weekender. I’m the opposite I aim for Monday thru Thursday , use the other days for fam, travel etc , I will ski a weekend if it’s powder day, but damn those lines, I’ve waited 45 minutes before and I know that’s nothing like the volume/waits you guys see
SavageBiffIt’s in the title of OPs thread for Christ sake. Made me think it was locals only til I re read it 3 times , now I’m ok with all the protocols they are taking, it’s basically what we expected all along.
I don’t think lift lines will increase Drastically since they are limiting #of skiers, and the way they are pairing people, and likely to organize lines it may actually speed things up.
lol wut?
That's what I'm saying. It's in the thread title yet in the article I didn't read anything regarding locals only, nor have I read anything regarding locals only by any of the statements I've seen vail put out.
My post was pointing out that I'm either missing something, or this thread title is very misleading.
That's what I'm saying. It's in the thread title yet in the article I didn't read anything regarding locals only, nor have I read anything regarding locals only by any of the statements I've seen vail put out.
My post was pointing out that I'm either missing something, or this thread title is very misleading.
Ya op your causing a panic with your misleading title
If ikon/alters goes the route of vail I do t see it being that bad. What’s gonna hurt you for instance? We’re gonna get priority pick on reserve days and week of reserve days (# of spots permitting ) and as the season goes on they have already said they wanna drop the reserve system if possible.
Read the real article from vail or watch ski essentials t5fridays for the 28th of august they explain in more accurately.
I have tried forever to get to customer service at Epic if you have a issue other then a purchase they are not interested.But recently I discovered they know sign language,I posted a new member picture for my pass and got a call the next day from Management.I will never get involved with these people again.They rip the heart out of skiing
Here’s your long lost twin , maybe the two of you can get together and have a pity party
PyduckI have tried forever to get to customer service at Epic if you have a issue other then a purchase they are not interested.But recently I discovered they know sign language,I posted a new member picture for my pass and got a call the next day from Management.I will never get involved with these people again.They rip the heart out of skiing
