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finderI have a switch that I don't really use at all, but I'd probably actually play it if I could get skate on there.
Doom is really fun on switch in multiplayer if you want to get addicted to something. Its like the original halo but the gore is supersatisfying, especially compared to the disney-friendly recent halo titles that have no blood or anything.
This reminds me of some sort of collectible shit that was around when i was a kid. They were like different sports balls with an angry face on it or something.
tbh I hope not. No hate towards the switch, it looks like a fun system with great first party games, but cross platform titles barely worked between xbone/ps4 to switch without major compromises, now with everything next gen riding off the performance of the SSDs, even more compromises would have to be made, including to the PS5/XBX versions which would suck to be dragged down by the switch like that. Microsoft weirdly said they're going cross platform for all their first party titles for at least the first 1-2 years which is wack because that won't allow these games to truly shine on the new xbox beyond just slightly shinier graphics. On the other hand Sony said they are all in on the PS5 and no cross platform, which is the right move IMO.
The ps5 SSD is groundbreaking tech and judging by the ratchet and clank trailer (I timestamped that link to the part I'm referring to) it can load completely new complex environments in ~2 seconds. For those who don't know: that absolutely smokes any console and even beats all but the very bleeding edge of PC parts that have barely become available, and is going to completely change the way developers approach making their games. Without the bottle neck of ~8 seconds/1gb of traditional slow mechanical hard drives and having to hide loading in the background during constrained parts of levels, they can basically do whatever they want with no noticeable loading times, no hacks/tricks around bottlenecks anymore. Fuck holding back on any of that just to squeeze a game into a compromised switch (or XBone) port. Just let the switch continue its separate path and let these next gen games truly shine
a_burgerinb4 its just the skate 3 mobile thing jason dill was asked to be in
yeah I didn't forget about that...the optimistic side of me hopes they wouldn't be that stupid to ignore a decade of dedicated fans simply wanting a normal sequel, no major formula shift. I feel like even a ton of people would be super down for a Skate remaster that bundles all three games into one + the DLCs and a slight polish on the graphics and call it a day...but if this news is truly a proper skate 4 then this is super exciting
but the pessimistic side of me needs to remember this is EA we're talking about and after they cash their massive checks from the FIFA and Madden micro-transactions for the season they probably don't give a single shit about anything else, including what the fans truly want
coming out with this hype a decade later and having it actually be a shitty mobile game full of microtransactions would be into almost comedic levels of ignorance, none of us would be laughing
IanAvery-Leaftbh I hope not. No hate towards the switch, it looks like a fun system with great first party games, but cross platform titles barely worked between xbone/ps4 to switch without major compromises, now with everything next gen riding off the performance of the SSDs, even more compromises would have to be made, including to the PS5/XBX versions which would suck to be dragged down by the switch like that. Microsoft weirdly said they're going cross platform for all their first party titles for at least the first 1-2 years which is wack because that won't allow these games to truly shine on the new xbox beyond just slightly shinier graphics. On the other hand Sony said they are all in on the PS5 and no cross platform, which is the right move IMO.
The ps5 SSD is groundbreaking tech and judging by the ratchet and clank trailer (I timestamped that link to the part I'm referring to) it can load completely new complex environments in ~2 seconds. For those who don't know: that absolutely smokes any console and even beats all but the very bleeding edge of PC parts that have barely become available, and is going to completely change the way developers approach making their games. Without the bottle neck of ~8 seconds/1gb of traditional slow mechanical hard drives and having to hide loading in the background during constrained parts of levels, they can basically do whatever they want with no noticeable loading times, no hacks/tricks around bottlenecks anymore. Fuck holding back on any of that just to squeeze a game into a compromised switch (or XBone) port. Just let the switch continue its separate path and let these next gen games truly shine
yeah I didn't forget about that...the optimistic side of me hopes they wouldn't be that stupid to ignore a decade of dedicated fans simply wanting a normal sequel, no major formula shift. I feel like even a ton of people would be super down for a Skate remaster that bundles all three games into one + the DLCs and a slight polish on the graphics and call it a day...but if this news is truly a proper skate 4 then this is super exciting
but the pessimistic side of me needs to remember this is EA we're talking about and after they cash their massive checks from the FIFA and Madden micro-transactions for the season they probably don't give a single shit about anything else, including what the fans truly want
coming out with this hype a decade later and having it actually be a shitty mobile game full of microtransactions would be into almost comedic levels of ignorance, none of us would be laughing
That trailer was impressive, do you think it will actually be like that when the game comes out? Unfortunately it seems like the trailers for games look so much nicer than the game itself
IanAvery-Leaftbh I hope not. No hate towards the switch, it looks like a fun system with great first party games, but cross platform titles barely worked between xbone/ps4 to switch without major compromises, now with everything next gen riding off the performance of the SSDs, even more compromises would have to be made, including to the PS5/XBX versions which would suck to be dragged down by the switch like that. Microsoft weirdly said they're going cross platform for all their first party titles for at least the first 1-2 years which is wack because that won't allow these games to truly shine on the new xbox beyond just slightly shinier graphics. On the other hand Sony said they are all in on the PS5 and no cross platform, which is the right move IMO.
Seeing as this game won't be out for at least 18 months, Nintendo has time to figure it out, because skate on switch would be the best thing ever.
I don't think the switch will hold it back much AND they can make a version just for switch that doesn't operate the same and the switch is no slouch, it has an SSD and is more powerful than a ps4, I don't think its that unrealistic that switch will also get skate.
little1337That trailer was impressive, do you think it will actually be like that when the game comes out? Unfortunately it seems like the trailers for games look so much nicer than the game itself
I understand your pessimism but yes that trailer is showcasing what we can expect with the new SSD, its not pre-rendered. Death Stranding and UC4 are both examples of the final product looking even better than the trailers, so not everything is tricks. The CEO of Epic confirms that the SSD is next level and they just showcased Unreal engine 5 running on it with similar instant loading like the ratchet trailer.
eheathSeeing as this game won't be out for at least 18 months, Nintendo has time to figure it out, because skate on switch would be the best thing ever.
I don't think the switch will hold it back much AND they can make a version just for switch that doesn't operate the same and the switch is no slouch, it has an SSD and is more powerful than a ps4, I don't think its that unrealistic that switch will also get skate.
TBH i hope they release it for PC but we'll see.
This isn't a Nintendo issue, unless they were to magically drop the Switch 2 in that timeframe with an extreme shift in hardware priorities, but thats pretty much not gonna happen. The switch may utilize an SSD, but its significantly slower and capped at 32gb, and for expansion it only supports UHS-I microSD cards. No matter if you use a game cartridge, SD, or the internal storage the switch is closer in speed to a PS4s mechanical HDD than the PS5s SSD.
If anyone has played Tony Hawks American Wasteland they'll remember the claim of "no loading screens" between areas of the map, which were actually super narrow tunnels/hallways that hid the loading in the background as you skated through. If you skated through as fast as you could the frame rate would plummet and it would freeze up to force enough time for it to load. What I'm saying about the PS5 is developers will no longer have to resort to trickery like that since there will be no more loading to hide. Making a Switch (or even PC version that supports HDDs) will require compromises that will negatively affect all versions of the game, instead of making it next gen only and going all-in on these huge constraints being lifted from game design. Theres zero way to make that Ratchet and Clank game on a switch or PC without butchering the entire concept of the game hopping through those portals.
The switch is also definitely not more powerful than a PS4, thats like the claims of an iPad being more powerful than most PCs. Like an iPad its running an ARM processor, for the switch its an underclocked Tegra from 2015. PS4/XBone/Ps5/XSX all run x86 like a PC and you can't really compare directly. What you can compare is cross platform games and I havnt seen a single one that runs better on switch than the rest. Witcher 3 for example was already quite compromised to squeeze onto PS4 compared to the PC version, the switch version looks like a PSP game...
A PC skate 4 release would be way easier since its all x86, but that circles back to minimum requirements changing significantly this generation. I hope we start to see PC games forcing NVMe SSDs as minimum spec in order to play, otherwise the tides will turn to PCs being what holds console games back, vs the current console games holding back PCs. HDDs suck and are holding things back bigtime
tbh the only way I see Skate coming to the switch is if they remaster 1-3 + the DLCs and throw it all together in one game, thats way more in-line with what the switch hardware can realistically handle
sorry for the long post I'm passionate about this tech despite not even being a big gamer for the last decade until quarantine hit. Gaming in 2020 is getting pretty exciting
little1337I hope they make it for current gen too bc I dont want to have to buy a new console but god damn it for skate I will
all my previous posts explain why that'd be shittier than just letting the game fully excel on next-gen. If anything would make it worth it to the average NSer tho, it'd be Skate 4. This generation is a way bigger leap than PS3-PS4 and even PS2-PS3 IMO instant loading is gonna completely change game design down to the core
eheathI mean, you're gonna wanna buy the new consoles dude, theyre gonna load instantly and run very well. Imagine using a computer/console with an HDD.
Ya true, it's definitely impressive and I absolutely would like one, I just can't imagine them being too cheap especially at launch. My xbox broke at the beginning of quarantine so i bought a new one bc I would be too bored without it but I feel like I should have just waited and saved up for a ps5
IanAvery-LeafA PC skate 4 release would be way easier since its all x86, but that circles back to minimum requirements changing significantly this generation. I hope we start to see PC games forcing NVMe SSDs as minimum spec in order to play, otherwise the tides will turn to PCs being what holds console games back, vs the current console games holding back PCs. HDDs suck and are holding things back bigtime
I think you're overestimating how much the fast memory really helps, there are plenty of games (gta5 for example) that work just fine in HDDs. The processor and gpu will hit a bottleneck before the SSD does.
eheathI think you're overestimating how much the fast memory really helps, there are plenty of games (gta5 for example) that work just fine in HDDs. The processor and gpu will hit a bottleneck before the SSD does.
if you look into how they built GTA V (or any game basically) its all tip toeing around the massive storage bottleneck. Everything up until this point is made with that assumption and limits, so now this is going to be a massive shift in game design now that developers are no longer tied down to those restrictions. You're right its not gonna really help games that were built for HDDs, but its gonna allow a whole new class of games that wouldn't work at all with HDDs
Mark Cerny's PS5 presentation is an hour long I'm not saying watch all that, but please look into the PS5 and the custom memory controller they built to utilize the speed of that SSD and have it be in balance with the CPU/GPU, no bottlenecks.
Its easy to be dismissive, but I think people will be very pleasantly surprised by the PS5, this is truly a next gen system
IanAvery-Leafif you look into how they built GTA V (or any game basically) its all tip toeing around the massive storage bottleneck. Everything up until this point is made with that assumption and limits, so now this is going to be a massive shift in game design now that developers are no longer tied down to those restrictions. You're right its not gonna really help games that were built for HDDs, but its gonna allow a whole new class of games that wouldn't work at all with HDDs
Mark Cerny's PS5 presentation is an hour long I'm not saying watch all that, but please look into the PS5 and the custom memory controller they built to utilize the speed of that SSD and have it be in balance with the CPU/GPU, no bottlenecks.
Its easy to be dismissive, but I think people will be very pleasantly surprised by the PS5, this is truly a next gen system
I'm very aware of ps5s custom memory controller and yes there will be new ways to program games/new ways games will operate. That being said, the GPU and CPU are high end as of 2019, I've heard many ps5 games have a hard time running at 60fps... my point is the SSD is great and will change how developers make a game, but the ps5 will get bottle necked by its cpu and gpu before they can even get close to utilizing 5GB/s transfer rate on the ssd.
Again, I'm not dismissing anything, 5GB/s is huge as NVMe 3.0 is 1.5GB/s, its very cool and will shape the future of storage and game design. But, CPU and GPU will still be the largest factors that will determine frame rate, graphic quality and complexity of graphics and maybe thats different now because before, as you said, the HDD held it back, but its not like the ps5 is a super computer.
VT_scratchpaging everyone in the NSG thread that said this would never happen...
I mean, if THPS wasn't coming out and getting a lot of hype it never would have. could have post a billion more times on their insta about skate 4 and they never would have done it.
They got jealous of the THPS hype and decided to send it and announce it.
eheathI'm very aware of ps5s custom memory controller and yes there will be new ways to program games/new ways games will operate. That being said, the GPU and CPU are high end as of 2019, I've heard many ps5 games have a hard time running at 60fps... my point is the SSD is great and will change how developers make a game, but the ps5 will get bottle necked by its cpu and gpu before they can even get close to utilizing 5GB/s transfer rate on the ssd.
Again, I'm not dismissing anything, 5GB/s is huge as NVMe 3.0 is 1.5GB/s, its very cool and will shape the future of storage and game design. But, CPU and GPU will still be the largest factors that will determine frame rate, graphic quality and complexity of graphics and maybe thats different now because before, as you said, the HDD held it back, but its not like the ps5 is a super computer.
I agree the PS5 is not some magic super computer, but I think we can agree to disagree on how heavily the CPU/GPU will bottleneck, everything I've read from developers points towards it being more balanced than it looks on paper. I truly believe the SSD (and the surrounding system) being fully utilized will be at the core of all PS5 games, not just some afterthought, but time will tell on that. ~5% of steam users on PC have systems with an equivalent or better GPU than the PS5/XSX, and thats not even accounting for whether they're using a NVMe SSD, SATA SSD, or an old HDD. We're at an interesting turn of events where consoles used to be strictly mediocre gaming PCs and worse in all aspects except convenience, but now they're actually leading the charge in very key ways. If new PC games continue to allow users to run them with HDDs then they will become the ones holding back progress
Also 60fps isn't the end-all-be-all. Sure for multiplayer shooters and other high paced games it helps, but it looks arguably weird and not worth the compromises for single player narrative games. Thats why most games target checkerboard 4K 30fps lock on the PS4pro/Xbox X this current generation, when they could easily do a lower resolution solid 60fps. On the few games that give you the option personally I've been picking 30fps lock and higher resolution every time. In anticipation for the sequel I've been playing the Last of Us remaster and it looks amazing in 4k 30fps, both 1800p target 60 and 1080p locked 60fps options look bizarre and don't fit the gameplay, and especially ruins the cutscenes.
30fps with the correct 33.3ms frametime looks excellent and I hope thats what developers target for PS5 singleplayer narrative games, I know I've also used death stranding as example already but it shows how amazing a game can look even on the non-pro PS4 and frame rate is never an issue with that gameplay, theres no 60fps option even on the Pro. For faster pace games they've already showcased Gran Turismo 7 running native 4K 60, so when the compromises are worth it we'll see plenty of 60fps games
IanAvery-LeafI agree the PS5 is not some magic super computer, but I think we can agree to disagree on how heavily the CPU/GPU will bottleneck, everything I've read from developers points towards it being more balanced than it looks on paper. I truly believe the SSD (and the surrounding system) being fully utilized will be at the core of all PS5 games, not just some afterthought, but time will tell on that. ~5% of steam users on PC have systems with an equivalent or better GPU than the PS5/XSX, and thats not even accounting for whether they're using a NVMe SSD, SATA SSD, or an old HDD. We're at an interesting turn of events where consoles used to be strictly mediocre gaming PCs and worse in all aspects except convenience, but now they're actually leading the charge in very key ways. If new PC games continue to allow users to run them with HDDs then they will become the ones holding back progress
Also 60fps isn't the end-all-be-all. Sure for multiplayer shooters and other high paced games it helps, but it looks arguably weird and not worth the compromises for single player narrative games. Thats why most games target checkerboard 4K 30fps lock on the PS4pro/Xbox X this current generation, when they could easily do a lower resolution solid 60fps. On the few games that give you the option personally I've been picking 30fps lock and higher resolution every time. In anticipation for the sequel I've been playing the Last of Us remaster and it looks amazing in 4k 30fps, both 1800p target 60 and 1080p locked 60fps options look bizarre and don't fit the gameplay, and especially ruins the cutscenes.
30fps with the correct 33.3ms frametime looks excellent and I hope thats what developers target for PS5 singleplayer narrative games, I know I've also used death stranding as example already but it shows how amazing a game can look even on the non-pro PS4 and frame rate is never an issue with that gameplay, theres no 60fps option even on the Pro. For faster pace games they've already showcased Gran Turismo 7 running native 4K 60, so when the compromises are worth it we'll see plenty of 60fps games
I mean im not trying to disagree, just learning more and more, but I'm just seeing it differently than you. I know this because of your second part, saying 60fps is fine...
lol im trolling a little mostly because as a PC player I play at high frame rates with a high refresh rate. Most tvs are 60fps, so yeah 60 is fine but as soon as you play games at 144 theres no going back, I know you could appreciate such an atheistic difference.
IanAvery-LeafI understand your pessimism but yes that trailer is showcasing what we can expect with the new SSD, its not pre-rendered. Death Stranding and UC4 are both examples of the final product looking even better than the trailers, so not everything is tricks. The CEO of Epic confirms that the SSD is next level and they just showcased Unreal engine 5 running on it with similar instant loading like the ratchet trailer.
This isn't a Nintendo issue, unless they were to magically drop the Switch 2 in that timeframe with an extreme shift in hardware priorities, but thats pretty much not gonna happen. The switch may utilize an SSD, but its significantly slower and capped at 32gb, and for expansion it only supports UHS-I microSD cards. No matter if you use a game cartridge, SD, or the internal storage the switch is closer in speed to a PS4s mechanical HDD than the PS5s SSD.
If anyone has played Tony Hawks American Wasteland they'll remember the claim of "no loading screens" between areas of the map, which were actually super narrow tunnels/hallways that hid the loading in the background as you skated through. If you skated through as fast as you could the frame rate would plummet and it would freeze up to force enough time for it to load. What I'm saying about the PS5 is developers will no longer have to resort to trickery like that since there will be no more loading to hide. Making a Switch (or even PC version that supports HDDs) will require compromises that will negatively affect all versions of the game, instead of making it next gen only and going all-in on these huge constraints being lifted from game design. Theres zero way to make that Ratchet and Clank game on a switch or PC without butchering the entire concept of the game hopping through those portals.
The switch is also definitely not more powerful than a PS4, thats like the claims of an iPad being more powerful than most PCs. Like an iPad its running an ARM processor, for the switch its an underclocked Tegra from 2015. PS4/XBone/Ps5/XSX all run x86 like a PC and you can't really compare directly. What you can compare is cross platform games and I havnt seen a single one that runs better on switch than the rest. Witcher 3 for example was already quite compromised to squeeze onto PS4 compared to the PC version, the switch version looks like a PSP game...
A PC skate 4 release would be way easier since its all x86, but that circles back to minimum requirements changing significantly this generation. I hope we start to see PC games forcing NVMe SSDs as minimum spec in order to play, otherwise the tides will turn to PCs being what holds console games back, vs the current console games holding back PCs. HDDs suck and are holding things back bigtime
tbh the only way I see Skate coming to the switch is if they remaster 1-3 + the DLCs and throw it all together in one game, thats way more in-line with what the switch hardware can realistically handle
sorry for the long post I'm passionate about this tech despite not even being a big gamer for the last decade until quarantine hit. Gaming in 2020 is getting pretty exciting
all my previous posts explain why that'd be shittier than just letting the game fully excel on next-gen. If anything would make it worth it to the average NSer tho, it'd be Skate 4. This generation is a way bigger leap than PS3-PS4 and even PS2-PS3 IMO instant loading is gonna completely change game design down to the core
I think Evan meant to say switch is more powerful than ps3, not ps4. And from everything ive read it seems switch is significantly more capable than ps3 or xbox360, even though in some metrics such as gigaflops its comparable. I like account for the full potential of a systems hardware tho, and for this the tegra x1 that switch runs on is a 500 gigaflop (In fp 32) chip so when its running at only 200 gigaflops in handheld its having a really easy time. Maybe computers dont care how hard you run them but i always think of it like a car that has a big engine that you hardly tax when accelerating is going to last longer than a car with a small engine that you have to rev to the tits every time you accelerate. Also switch can double its data rate if it uses fp16 calculations which is where the 1 teraflop figure comes from as the max flops that the tegra can run. But usually in docked mode the switch is putting about twice as many flops as ps3/xb360 and in handheld they are about even. But lets not forget that ps3 and xb360 were pretty damn powerful machines; so its pretty impressive the switch can pull the same weight in such a small/energy efficient platform. Play grand theft auto 5 on xbox360 and tell me its a weak console.
heres a picture of outlast 2 on switch in portable mode.
Pretty sick right?
also heres a good sum up on why switch is a more capable console than ps3 and xbox360.
DolanReloadedI think Evan meant to say switch is more powerful than ps3, not ps4. And from everything ive read it seems switch is significantly more capable than ps3 or xbox360, even though in some metrics such as gigaflops its comparable. I like account for the full potential of a systems hardware tho, and for this the tegra x1 that switch runs on is a 500 gigaflop (In fp 32) chip so when its running at only 200 gigaflops in handheld its having a really easy time. Maybe computers dont care how hard you run them but i always think of it like a car that has a big engine that you hardly tax when accelerating is going to last longer than a car with a small engine that you have to rev to the tits every time you accelerate. Also switch can double its data rate if it uses fp16 calculations which is where the 1 teraflop figure comes from as the max flops that the tegra can run. But usually in docked mode the switch is putting about twice as many flops as ps3/xb360 and in handheld they are about even. But lets not forget that ps3 and xb360 were pretty damn powerful machines; so its pretty impressive the switch can pull the same weight in such a small/energy efficient platform. Play grand theft auto 5 on xbox360 and tell me its a weak console.
heres a picture of outlast 2 on switch in portable mode.
Pretty sick right?
also heres a good sum up on why switch is a more capable console than ps3 and xbox360.
Also unless youve played something like doom on switch holding the console in your hands you wont really understand. Theres something about having the screen right in front of you as you lay your fat ass supine on the couch that transcends the experience of playing a console on your tv. I guaruntee that the switch 2 is going to be even more ridiculous than the current switch is and it will probably outsell the shit out of sony and microsoft consoles when it comes out.
technology is getting so absurd these days that it sort of becomes a question of “why not?” as in, why not make our console portable? Screens have such high resolutions these days and batteries are holding so much more energy these days and systems are so much more energy efficient these days... so why not make the console portable?
At least subjectively for me, i find doom on switch in portable to be more visually pleasing than red dead redemption on my brothers xb1x. Red dead is way more detailed than doom on switch, but i completely would rather watch my screen on my switch. The handheld experience is really addictive.
eheathI mean im not trying to disagree, just learning more and more, but I'm just seeing it differently than you. I know this because of your second part, saying 60fps is fine...
lol im trolling a little mostly because as a PC player I play at high frame rates with a high refresh rate. Most tvs are 60fps, so yeah 60 is fine but as soon as you play games at 144 theres no going back, I know you could appreciate such an atheistic difference.
I think by saying "theres no going back" we just fundamentally disagree that more = better when it comes to frame rate, and thats ok to disagree. I have seen plenty of 60 and 144hz gaming in person and tbh I understand the competitive advantage for fast multiplayer shooters, but I personally don't like multiplayer games like that anyway, so without that advantage I'd never opt for high frame rate, especially for single player games where IMO it looks very bizarre and unnatural. I'm not sure what you mean by saying I said "60 is fine", since it benefits certain experiences and hurts others. I'm not saying its a goal for all games to reach, almost the opposite. VR is the only time I agree high frame rate is essential for all types of gameplay but thats a whole other discussion (would love to play HL: Alyx one day when the Index is more reasonably priced, that game looks insane).
I see single player narrative games as a cinematic style experience with all the cutscenes mixed into the gameplay, so 30fps with a perfect 33.3ms frametime is as close to cinematic 24fps film style as you can get in gameplay, and obviously has the added benefit of maxing the graphics compared to the compromises needed for higher framerate. Basically most PS2, PS3, and PS4 games were developed with the 30fps target and I'm confident for single player games it'll continue with the PS5, and I don't see that as a failure or weakness, just where the priorities lie. I know Death stranding is coming out on PC next month and I'm stoked PC gamers will have the opportunity to play that gem, it's currently beautiful looking like a half film/half game in its current state, and 144hz or even 60 would honestly take away from that.
DolanReloadedI think Evan meant to say switch is more powerful than ps3, not ps4. And from everything ive read it seems switch is significantly more capable than ps3 or xbox360, even though in some metrics such as gigaflops its comparable. I like account for the full potential of a systems hardware tho, and for this the tegra x1 that switch runs on is a 500 gigaflop (In fp 32) chip so when its running at only 200 gigaflops in handheld its having a really easy time. Maybe computers dont care how hard you run them but i always think of it like a car that has a big engine that you hardly tax when accelerating is going to last longer than a car with a small engine that you have to rev to the tits every time you accelerate. Also switch can double its data rate if it uses fp16 calculations which is where the 1 teraflop figure comes from as the max flops that the tegra can run. But usually in docked mode the switch is putting about twice as many flops as ps3/xb360 and in handheld they are about even. But lets not forget that ps3 and xb360 were pretty damn powerful machines; so its pretty impressive the switch can pull the same weight in such a small/energy efficient platform. Play grand theft auto 5 on xbox360 and tell me its a weak console.
heres a picture of outlast 2 on switch in portable mode.
Pretty sick right?
also heres a good sum up on why switch is a more capable console than ps3 and xbox360.
idk if Heath truly meant ps4 or was a typo for ps3 but you didn't have to go though the trouble of convincing it's more powerful than a ps3, since thats a very true statement. Where we can agree to disagree on is how impressive that is. Literally nobody whose buying a switch is taking what you just said about power into account, it seems like pretty much every switch sale is based around some key 1st party Nintendo games, since they have continually been putting out some excellent ones since day one with BotW
my argument is that the playing field for 3rd party developers was already very uneven last gen when you compare switch versions of games that are also on xbone and PS4 (not even including the pro and one x). Now with the huge leap this new gen of systems is taking, the entire core experience surrounding games built with those systems in mind is literally not possible on the switch hardware. In order to port to the switch, serious compromises have to be made to either by making the switch version basically a different game, or watering down the PS5/XSX version to the point where core gameplay mechanics are changed to also work on the switch version that lacks a fast (and also always can be assumed by the developer to be in use) SSD.
Watering down leaves people unhappy, but if the switch still wants to hang expectations have to drastically change, like when the gameboys were a thing and there was plenty of ported GBA games that were obviously completely different than xbox/ps2/gamecube versions. I see this new gen as splitting off from the switch where developers can focus on getting the most out of PS5/XSX, and for Switch games can focus on the flexible and fun experience that makes it so great
IanAvery-LeafI think by saying "theres no going back" we just fundamentally disagree that more = better when it comes to frame rate, and thats ok to disagree. I have seen plenty of 60 and 144hz gaming in person and tbh I understand the competitive advantage for fast multiplayer shooters, but I personally don't like multiplayer games like that anyway, so without that advantage I'd never opt for high frame rate, especially for single player games where IMO it looks very bizarre and unnatural. I'm not sure what you mean by saying I said "60 is fine", since it benefits certain experiences and hurts others. I'm not saying its a goal for all games to reach, almost the opposite. VR is the only time I agree high frame rate is essential for all types of gameplay but thats a whole other discussion (would love to play HL: Alyx one day when the Index is more reasonably priced, that game looks insane).
I see single player narrative games as a cinematic style experience with all the cutscenes mixed into the gameplay, so 30fps with a perfect 33.3ms frametime is as close to cinematic 24fps film style as you can get in gameplay, and obviously has the added benefit of maxing the graphics compared to the compromises needed for higher framerate. Basically most PS2, PS3, and PS4 games were developed with the 30fps target and I'm confident for single player games it'll continue with the PS5, and I don't see that as a failure or weakness, just where the priorities lie. I know Death stranding is coming out on PC next month and I'm stoked PC gamers will have the opportunity to play that gem, it's currently beautiful looking like a half film/half game in its current state, and 144hz or even 60 would honestly take away from that.
idk if Heath truly meant ps4 or was a typo for ps3 but you didn't have to go though the trouble of convincing it's more powerful than a ps3, since thats a very true statement. Where we can agree to disagree on is how impressive that is. Literally nobody whose buying a switch is taking what you just said about power into account, it seems like pretty much every switch sale is based around some key 1st party Nintendo games, since they have continually been putting out some excellent ones since day one with BotW
my argument is that the playing field for 3rd party developers was already very uneven last gen when you compare switch versions of games that are also on xbone and PS4 (not even including the pro and one x). Now with the huge leap this new gen of systems is taking, the entire core experience surrounding games built with those systems in mind is literally not possible on the switch hardware. In order to port to the switch, serious compromises have to be made to either by making the switch version basically a different game, or watering down the PS5/XSX version to the point where core gameplay mechanics are changed to also work on the switch version that lacks a fast (and also always can be assumed by the developer to be in use) SSD.
Watering down leaves people unhappy, but if the switch still wants to hang expectations have to drastically change, like when the gameboys were a thing and there was plenty of ported GBA games that were obviously completely different than xbox/ps2/gamecube versions. I see this new gen as splitting off from the switch where developers can focus on getting the most out of PS5/XSX, and for Switch games can focus on the flexible and fun experience that makes it so great
Yeah. I think switch is powerful enough for what it is, even if it cant handle the top shelf games on ps5/xb2.
i think within 5 years nintendo will bust out a switch 2.0 that is between 2 to 4 times more powerful and is “good enough” to keep switch2 owners happy even though everybody knows it cant handle ps5/xb2 shit.
Why do you not find xbox360/ps3 level power impressive? I remember playing call of duty 2 in 2006 and thinking “Jesus the detail on this game is insane“. Compared to red dead 2 on xb1x its nothing but as far as playability, i think ps3 xb360 level power is good enough to create substantially satisfying visuals.
**This post was edited on Jun 25th 2020 at 11:46:44pm
I wonder if we will be getting a new map or if we’re returning back to a variation of port caverton. Either way super stoked on it. I have over 1200 hours on skate 3 and I am already itching to play it.
DolanReloadedYeah. I think switch is powerful enough for what it is, even if it cant handle the top shelf games on ps5/xb2.
i think within 5 years nintendo will bust out a switch 2.0 that is between 2 to 4 times more powerful and is “good enough” to keep switch2 owners happy even though everybody knows it cant handle ps5/xb2 shit.
Why do you not find xbox360/ps3 level power impressive? I remember playing call of duty 2 in 2006 and thinking “Jesus the detail on this game is insane“. Compared to red dead 2 on xb1x its nothing but as far as playability, i think ps3 xb360 level power is good enough to create substantially satisfying visuals.
**This post was edited on Jun 25th 2020 at 11:46:44pm
totally agree the switch is great at what it is, and seems like 1st-party Nintendo games look great on it. BotW really squeezed what they can out of it right at launch and set a solid bar.
since you asked, no, 2005 360 and 2006 Ps3 levels of performance in 2017 just isn't that impressive to me when just a year later the A12X was putting down Xbox One levels (not 100% directly comparable) of performance in a thinner, passively cooled iPad. I too remember playing a COD 2 demo in GameStop back in the day and being impressed, especially by the smoke effects. Now if you revisit and look at that game now...its pretty bad and looks like a 5+ year old iPhone game.
Again, nobody is buying a switch for its performance/gives a shit about tflops or any other nonsense thats irrelevant compared to fun thoughtful gameplay, which the Switch has plenty of. My argument remains that with the hardware in the new gen coming out the Switch is pushed to basically the gameboy equivalent now and games will no longer be cross comparable without severe compromises or hopefully just re-imaginings instead. The gap was already significant but with next gen its just not even in the same general realm
Young_pattyI sweat to god if I have to buy a new counsel to play this shit I will not be hyped.
That being said I will absolutely do it if there is party mode included
each console generation has been slowly increasing in length to now 7 years since the PS4 came out and the PS5 release this fall. This game has barely entered development and is easily ~18+ months out, and it'd be very disappointing if after a decade+ of waiting it's not a ps5/Xsx game. Like you mention it'll probably be a convincing factor for a fair amount of people to upgrade
I'm not holding my breath but I agree fingers crossed for proper party play again after they removed it in skate 3. Passing the controller(s) around for Fun track multiplayer is peak Skate IMO, online multiplayer sucks in comparison
