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First set of skins... HELP

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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
Hi all!

I've recently purchased a set of Daymakers to convert my ON3P Kartel 108s, 189cm, w/ pivot 18s into a touring set up. I am going to be touring relatively casually (hence getting daymakers and not a dedicated set up) I was hoping to get advice on skins.
A good friend of mine who has a fair bit of touring, mountaineering and ice climbing experience has suggested G3 Alpinist skins. I have had a browse and he suggests the Alpinist + Universal in 115mm. He said the width doesn't need to cover the tip and tail as much (considering the rocker I'd imagine this to be true) does this sound like a reasonable bet? I have heard that BD skins are also a good bet. There are a few options of them on the site I usually use (freezeproshop british site) and I am just asking if the recommendation I have is a good one or if I should consider alternative options.
6'2" and 165lbs, strong skier (if that info is needed)

Can't wait to get out into the BC on my first touring trip!!
Nov 12 2018 9:02AM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5065 - Karma: 42,824
Personally I've had terrible experiences with the Alpinist and would recommend staying away. The glue on some pairs has a tendency to get uber sticky and gloppy so that it stays on your bases after you rip your skins. Would not recomend. Have had a great experience with BD, BCA, and Climbing Skins Direct options
Nov 12 2018 11:40AM
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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
cydwhitPersonally I've had terrible experiences with the Alpinist and would recommend staying away. The glue on some pairs has a tendency to get uber sticky and gloppy so that it stays on your bases after you rip your skins. Would not recomend. Have had a great experience with BD, BCA, and Climbing Skins Direct options


Hi there, thank you for the response, do you have any recommendations for BD skins? My regular ski shop has a couple different options; glidelite mohair mix, glidelite mohair mix and ascension nylon... wondering what would be the best for a relatively casual user, or what the differences are?
Nov 12 2018 6:53PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5065 - Karma: 42,824
MF-HARPHi there, thank you for the response, do you have any recommendations for BD skins? My regular ski shop has a couple different options; glidelite mohair mix, glidelite mohair mix and ascension nylon... wondering what would be the best for a relatively casual user, or what the differences are?


For a beginner pure nylon skins will be your best bet. Generally speaking, nylon has the most grip and the least glide, mixed skins are somewhere in the middle, and mohair skins have the least grip and most glide. Nylon is also the most durable. As you learn to skin you don't really care about glide, but extra grip really helps as you learn to kick turn and use steeper icier tracks. Then, as you develope your technique you can graduate to mixed or pure mohair skins.
Nov 12 2018 8:09PM
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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
cydwhitFor a beginner pure nylon skins will be your best bet. Generally speaking, nylon has the most grip and the least glide, mixed skins are somewhere in the middle, and mohair skins have the least grip and most glide. Nylon is also the most durable. As you learn to skin you don't really care about glide, but extra grip really helps as you learn to kick turn and use steeper icier tracks. Then, as you develope your technique you can graduate to mixed or pure mohair skins.


Thank you so much!!

https://www.freezeproshop.com/black-diamond-ascension-nylon-sts-skins/path[offset]:78/path[search]:black%20diamond/size:66155

I have found these Black Diamond nylon skins on a website that my uni ski club has a discount for, they only come in 140mm and 110mm on a 108mm underfoot ski with a 137mm tip (Kartel 108) should I get the 140mm or 110mm? I've heard that the narrower option shouldn't be a problem because of actual contact area and also saves weight. Or would getting the 140mm anbd doing more trimming be a better option? I could also look for availability in other sizes on an alternate website but the discount helps!

EDIt: there are options for 125mm on other sites would that be the best bet?

**This post was edited on Nov 12th 2018 at 8:16:09pm
Nov 12 2018 8:14PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5065 - Karma: 42,824
MF-HARPThank you so much!!

https://www.freezeproshop.com/black-diamond-ascension-nylon-sts-skins/path[offset]:78/path[search]:black%20diamond/size:66155

I have found these Black Diamond nylon skins on a website that my uni ski club has a discount for, they only come in 140mm and 110mm on a 108mm underfoot ski with a 137mm tip (Kartel 108) should I get the 140mm or 110mm? I've heard that the narrower option shouldn't be a problem because of actual contact area and also saves weight. Or would getting the 140mm anbd doing more trimming be a better option? I could also look for availability in other sizes on an alternate website but the discount helps!

EDIt: there are options for 125mm on other sites would that be the best bet?

**This post was edited on Nov 12th 2018 at 8:16:09pm


125 is your best bet. Personally I'd go 140 and trim if you can't do 125. Your setup is already heavy, cutting 6 grams of skin material doesn't get you anything.

Get tech bindings, light skis, and touring boots if you want to care about weight, otherwise ignore it and focus on useability.
Nov 12 2018 8:47PM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,939
Black Diamond Ascension STS (get the STS so you don't have to futz with attaching the tip clip. it's a fucking BITCH)

I have 3 sets. They're great. You'll like em.
Nov 12 2018 11:43PM
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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
I'll get some 125s from another site then. 140mm are more expensive so money saving doesn't really exist even with the discount.

Thanks guys!!
Nov 13 2018 9:33AM
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OregonDead
Posts: 6853 - Karma: 24,210
MF-HARPI'll get some 125s from another site then. 140mm are more expensive so money saving doesn't really exist even with the discount.

Thanks guys!!


If they are more $ get the 110s. They are still wider than your skis are under foot. A lot of people just get skins that are about 2 mm smaller than their skis are underfoot and then don't cut them. I was skeptical but tried this when I got skins for my Hojis but that's what Hoji does and I was looking at a better deal on the 110mm skins. They work great and I really doubt I'd notice any difference with wall to wall coverage at the tips and tails. I doubt I notice the weight difference at the beginning of the day but I'm starting to believe that every little bit adds up over the course of the day.
Nov 13 2018 1:21PM
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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
DingoSeanBlack Diamond Ascension STS (get the STS so you don't have to futz with attaching the tip clip. it's a fucking BITCH)

I have 3 sets. They're great. You'll like em.


Been deliberating on pulling the trigger... just wondering if you buy any 'skin savers'/'cheat sheets' for your skins, or do they come with some sort of mesh that goes between the glue. heard these extend skin life. Think I'm going to get BD Ascensions STS in a 125mm
Nov 27 2018 11:15AM
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Non_State_Actor
Posts: 4673 - Karma: 16,373
Sorry to threadjack but I'm in the same situation and there are a bunch of "help with skins" threads right now.

I've read through a bunch of the threads and the same recs come up but I'm looking at Faction skins which are the glueless/"vacuum" style. Does anyone have any experience with these? I know Fischer makes some as well. Are they complete garbage or a viable option for someone looking to get their feet wet with some really short tours/resort/side country stuff?
Nov 27 2018 3:30PM
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jesshotter1
Posts: 2 - Karma: 25
Hey!

I got BCA magic carpets for my first skins (still have them 3 years later and they're still going strong) They take a little setting up in the beginning, but totally worth it. The only thing is, once you've cut them, then you cant adjust the length unless you go for shorter skis. Really good on holding you on the uphill. If you do go for these though, the glue is ultra strong in the beginning, so get skin savers for sure.

good luck!
Nov 28 2018 4:05AM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,939
MF-HARPBeen deliberating on pulling the trigger... just wondering if you buy any 'skin savers'/'cheat sheets' for your skins, or do they come with some sort of mesh that goes between the glue. heard these extend skin life. Think I'm going to get BD Ascensions STS in a 125mm


Never fucking use skin savers. I deliberately do not give them to customers. They don't really increase the life of the skin, as I've noticed from how they've been used in rental fleets, and if anything, become a fucking pain in the dickhole in the field, and turn your skin into a sloppy, goopy waffle.

They will ship with the skin savers, but I'd recommend just putting them in a parcel, and mailing them back to Black Diamond or whomever you get them from... or repurposing them for something else.
Nov 28 2018 1:43PM
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milo-mcsenderson
Posts: 604 - Karma: 7,671
DingoSeanNever fucking use skin savers. I deliberately do not give them to customers. They don't really increase the life of the skin, as I've noticed from how they've been used in rental fleets, and if anything, become a fucking pain in the dickhole in the field, and turn your skin into a sloppy, goopy waffle.

They will ship with the skin savers, but I'd recommend just putting them in a parcel, and mailing them back to Black Diamond or whomever you get them from... or repurposing them for something else.


Okay thanks dude! any advice on cutting BD skins, looks pretty straight forward apart from screwing in the tip clip
Nov 29 2018 10:05AM
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jorb.co
Posts: 2581 - Karma: 468
I have a question about skin length... also for 189 cm skis. K2 Shreditors in this case.

The G3 Alpinist skin marked for use 183-189 cm the skin is really stretching to fit.

I have not taken the plastic off of the glue yet.. It stays snug but due to ski camber, ski is pulling away underfoot. I have never had to stretch a skin this much to fit it...

Does anyone think it will be ok if I use them like this? will the added tension cause problems with the glue staying on proper??

I appreciate any advice if anyone has experienced this :) :)
Dec 8 2018 6:06PM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,085
bigfatdoodooheadI have a question about skin length... also for 189 cm skis. K2 Shreditors in this case.

The G3 Alpinist skin marked for use 183-189 cm the skin is really stretching to fit.

I have not taken the plastic off of the glue yet.. It stays snug but due to ski camber, ski is pulling away underfoot. I have never had to stretch a skin this much to fit it...

Does anyone think it will be ok if I use them like this? will the added tension cause problems with the glue staying on proper??

I appreciate any advice if anyone has experienced this :) :)


Unless you're getting a ton of snow between your skins and skis, I bet you'll just see them stretch a little and be fine in the long run. If that snow does get in there, it'll be frustrating.
Dec 8 2018 11:58PM
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LeeLau
Posts: 104 - Karma: 633
Skin savers are pretty good for summer storage if you're storing somewhere that may get warm. Personally mine get stored in a cool place but Ive heard of disasters happening when some skins get warm
DingoSeanNever fucking use skin savers. I deliberately do not give them to customers. They don't really increase the life of the skin, as I've noticed from how they've been used in rental fleets, and if anything, become a fucking pain in the dickhole in the field, and turn your skin into a sloppy, goopy waffle.

They will ship with the skin savers, but I'd recommend just putting them in a parcel, and mailing them back to Black Diamond or whomever you get them from... or repurposing them for something else.
Dec 9 2018 12:40PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5065 - Karma: 42,824
bigfatdoodooheadI have a question about skin length... also for 189 cm skis. K2 Shreditors in this case.

The G3 Alpinist skin marked for use 183-189 cm the skin is really stretching to fit.

I have not taken the plastic off of the glue yet.. It stays snug but due to ski camber, ski is pulling away underfoot. I have never had to stretch a skin this much to fit it...

Does anyone think it will be ok if I use them like this? will the added tension cause problems with the glue staying on proper??

I appreciate any advice if anyone has experienced this :) :)

The other guys are right.

Also, it's real easy to just wire a ski strap onto that tail strap on G3 skins and extend it a few inches so you're not stretching it so much....
Dec 9 2018 7:21PM
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