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You can get a brand new impezza for that. Or a nice preowned outback. R32s and STIs will have been hammered on, stay NA and save yourself a bunch of headaches. SIs are a civic with a kit and fancy seats. Reliability will save you heaps
.Dadplease don't get a turbo subaru. the n/a engines are bomb proof but once you boost them they start to become questionable.
well really that goes for any car with a turbo. if you want reliability don't get a turbo car.
milk_manPassat 1.8t wants to dispute this claim
I will agree on the turbo subie comment and that the majority of turbo cars are a headache, but I've had two 1.8t jettas that made it to 200k without any major engine work.
Dude just get a new base impreza. Unless you care about having a cool car. New one is under 20k, you don't inherit someone else's problems, and it will run forever.
It's a really cool idea but for 20 grand you can probably get a 9 with around 100k miles or an 8 for 15 grand with around a 100k miles.. If you're good at working on cars that would be an amazing option
fuck everyone saying avoid turbo subarus, just don't be an idiot with it and they can be both incredibly fun and reliable. Forester XT has the best practicality/speed ratio, I wouldn't trade my '08 for anything. Gotta hunt for a 5speed with low miles though, they only made shitty automatics starting in '09 so your options for a stick are '04-'08
.Dadwell really that goes for any car with a turbo. if you want reliability don't get a turbo car.
not true. many turbo engine (the vw ALH engine being a good example) can easily run 500k miles with no engine issues (so long as you keep up with normal recommended maintenance). Many people have run those engines over 600k miles and the engine itself is rated at 25,000 hours (diesel engines are usually rated by time, not distance). At 60 m/h that's 1,500k miles.
Anyone who says turbo engines aren't reliable are full of shit.
turnt_tableOutback XT! More functional than a wrx, still a turbo subaru, and not as weird as a Forester XT.
whats your reasoning behind that? The outback is on a legacy frame vs the Forester being an Impreza frame, same as a WRX/STi. Every outback xt I've driven felt like a boat, the legacy 2.5 gt wagon doesn't feel that much better. I got rid of the stock suspension on my foz XT and threw the pink STi springs on and it feels just as tight while cornering as a stock STi. Sure the outback has more horizontal trunk space vs the foresters vertical, but the handling leaves a lot to be desired on the Outback
ski.the.eastwhats your reasoning behind that? The outback is on a legacy frame vs the Forester being an Impreza frame, same as a WRX/STi. Every outback xt I've driven felt like a boat, the legacy 2.5 gt wagon doesn't feel that much better. I got rid of the stock suspension on my foz XT and threw the pink STi springs on and it feels just as tight while cornering as a stock STi. Sure the outback has more horizontal trunk space vs the foresters vertical, but the handling leaves a lot to be desired on the Outback
I've driven all three (OBXT, FXT, STI), and while I agree the OBXT can be a bit boatish, the foz just felt really top heavy. They were all totally stock though, and I'm sure both the foz and the OBXT would benefit greatly from sway bars and stiffer suspension. Also the FXT I drove was one of the newer ones (past '09) so it was an automatic and heavier than the previous generation.
Also, I've never particularly liked the look of the foz, but that's totally subjective, in the end it's really all personal preference.
VinnieFnot true. many turbo engine (the vw ALH engine being a good example) can easily run 500k miles with no engine issues (so long as you keep up with normal recommended maintenance). Many people have run those engines over 600k miles and the engine itself is rated at 25,000 hours (diesel engines are usually rated by time, not distance). At 60 m/h that's 1,500k miles.
Anyone who says turbo engines aren't reliable are full of shit.
diesels are a totally different animal from gas engines. apples to oranges man.
turnt_tableI've driven all three (OBXT, FXT, STI), and while I agree the OBXT can be a bit boatish, the foz just felt really top heavy. They were all totally stock though, and I'm sure both the foz and the OBXT would benefit greatly from sway bars and stiffer suspension. Also the FXT I drove was one of the newer ones (past '09) so it was an automatic and heavier than the previous generation.
Also, I've never particularly liked the look of the foz, but that's totally subjective, in the end it's really all personal preference.
word I definitely agree both benefit from being stiffened up, fuck the new '09+ CVT foz XT mom mobile, you definitely gotta try an '04-'08 stick model.
Subaru went downhill bigtime IMO around '09 when they got rid of frameless windows and fucked their whole car line. They lost the classic subaru design and got rid of the outback XT, legacy GT wagon (could only get it in stick in '05 anyway), and after 2014 the hatch/wagon + turbo + stick combo doesn't exist. Fuck new Subaru
dont listen to the idiots saying buy a brand new car. worst idea. the value of a new car drops drastically the second you drive it off the lot. you can get a fantastic used car for under 20k
.Daddiesels are a totally different animal from gas engines. apples to oranges man.
turbo volvos are plenty reliable...really it comes down to how much boost you are running.
and op dont be lame and get a fwd. by r32 are you talking about the gtr or the vw? both of them are sweet cars. the gtr would be my pick out of that list. way better on the road than an wrx/sti. you could even lift it an inch or so with certain coilovers and run bigger snow tires and it would be pretty good in the winter. ATTESA awd has much more of a rear wheel bias than subarus 50/50 awd though. it will also be more expensive to repair, less fuel efficient, and possibly not as reliable.
250rturbo volvos are plenty reliable...really it comes down to how much boost you are running.
some people aren't car savvy enough to keep up with things like boost lines falling off and burning a couple quarts of oil every 2000km so i'm just going to assume op is one of those people.
on the other hand his price range is high enough that if he were to get an older turbo car it would likely be very low miles and the engine would be pretty strong. but in my experience, every turbo car i've dealt with (V70R, WRX, STI, Duramax, A4) all have burned oil between oil changes.
ski.the.eastfuck everyone saying avoid turbo subarus, just don't be an idiot with it and they can be both incredibly fun and reliable. Gotta hunt for a 5speed with low miles though,your options for a stick are '04-'08
While I am utterly in love with my 04 FXT and would buy one again if I had 20k to spend, it's just not an easy car to find in good condition. Keep in mind you are suggesting he buy an 8-12 year old car. A car that's year, model, and trim that is fairly sought after. The vast majority of those that are for sale are auto, rust buckets, or molested project cars. I spent months hunting mine down, drove 5 hours to pick it up, and still had to rebuild the engine.
No one is denying that a turbo Subaru is a fun car, but you can't deny that an n/a Subaru will be FAR more reliable than any turbo Subaru. Especially if you're buying used.
Young_pattyThe smartest move would be to buy 20 $1,000 2002 Subaru outbacks
I agree. With 20k I'd buy a $2000 car, put another couple grand into it, then have enough money for gas, insurance, and any other repairs for the next decade.
Boosted Subarus are fine if youre smart looking for them. So many subie fags trash on them in snow or dirt with mods but no tune or good maintenance to start. You could easily get a solid 07 wrx wagon thats clean, for all subarus you just need to make sure theyve been properly maintained. I wouldnt look for anything older than an 06 or else thatll be potentially problematic.
Maybe look into a Fiesta ST, even though theyre FWD you just need a good snow tire along with good driving skills or a non ken block like driving mentality. Could be over budget unless its used.
My buddy had an 08 r32 and it was so much better of a car than (almost) all of the subarus I have driven. VWs are going to be more on maintenance but in my opinion are the better car. My best friend currently has an 03 VW golf tdi and the thing rips. Its got over 300k miles on it and gets over 50 mpg (I know its diesel so you can't really compare but still). Good luck finding a golf R for 20k though. If you do buy it asap because the golf r is incredible.
Randy_QuenchWhile I am utterly in love with my 04 FXT and would buy one again if I had 20k to spend, it's just not an easy car to find in good condition. Keep in mind you are suggesting he buy an 8-12 year old car. A car that's year, model, and trim that is fairly sought after. The vast majority of those that are for sale are auto, rust buckets, or molested project cars. I spent months hunting mine down, drove 5 hours to pick it up, and still had to rebuild the engine.
No one is denying that a turbo Subaru is a fun car, but you can't deny that an n/a Subaru will be FAR more reliable than any turbo Subaru. Especially if you're buying used.
I also spent quite a bit of time to find a low mile manual fxt, they are still out there if you're lucky. All I'm saying is don't just immediately write off a turbo car. If you take care of them and don't go crazy modding they can be quite reliable
ski.the.eastfuck everyone saying avoid turbo subarus, just don't be an idiot with it and they can be both incredibly fun and reliable. Forester XT has the best practicality/speed ratio,
for real, turbo subarus are fine. but don't get a fuckin' forester (might as well get an ecoboost ford edge or some shit), just get a wrx.
Staticfor real, turbo subarus are fine. but don't get a fuckin' forester (might as well get an ecoboost ford edge or some shit), just get a wrx.
How is a '04-'08 forester xt remotely like a ford edge? Don't get me wrong I love the WRX/STi wagons, but I can fit so much more shit in my forester trunk. And its on an impreza frame so its compatible with most parts from a wrx/STi.
my car is a hatchback with ~30 cubic ft of room, has a turbo and has manual transmission. Where else can you find that combo? You sadly can't even get an equivilent subaru with that anymore :(
ski.the.eastHow is a '04-'08 forester xt remotely like a ford edge? Don't get me wrong I love the WRX/STi wagons, but I can fit so much more shit in my forester trunk. And its on an impreza frame so its compatible with most parts from a wrx/STi.
my car is a hatchback with ~30 cubic ft of room, has a turbo and has manual transmission. Where else can you find that combo? You sadly can't even get an equivilent subaru with that anymore :(
Are you serious? They are both lil crossovers (or baby SUVs), nearly identical cargo capacity, it's just a waste of a turbo on anything but a car.
Fwiw I think wrx wagons are bunk too, ugly and smelly with your boots in the main cabin.
Oh man you got 20K your options are endless...everyone in this thread is saying to spend all 20K on the car, they're wrong. This is what you do:
Buy a 4wd truck or SUV, v8 engine, early early to late 2000's. Spend no more than 10K, you can find something dope for 10K.
Take 4K and spend it on a mountain sled. You can get something around 08-09 probably that rips, and is in good condition. 144 track or longer.
Spend 500 on your gear for your sled. Bags, helmet, racks, etc.
Spend 1K or less on your trailer. Flatbed, nothing fancy.
So you've spent 15,500 at this point, and you're gonna have more fun during the winter than 99% of people out there.
If you don't have friends that have sleds, find a snowmobiling club in your area and make some new ones.
This is the plan!!!! Do this and profit this winter and for the rest of your life!
I believe it's the least expensive AWD car on the market.
My work has some of those I drive occasionally. They're not bad but 2 things that annoy the hell out of me:
1- the radio/touchscreen/camera thing. Everything about it is shit from the massive wait time from when you start the car to when the radio comes on to the delay on the tuner knob when you switch the station.
2- The delay when you put it in reverse/drive before it engages the throttle. so frustrating when doing even simple things like 3 point turns. Especially if you're trying to do them quick while traffic is coming.
rballs_dont listen to the idiots saying buy a brand new car. worst idea. the value of a new car drops drastically the second you drive it off the lot. you can get a fantastic used car for under 20k
Not necessarily true. The apr rates on a brand new financed car are around 1 to 5 percent. As soon as you go used that jumps to 5 to 10 a lot of the time. The 5gs you sace at the beginning equals out in interest over 5 or 6 years. Unless op has 20g cash to pay it all off, then disregard.
