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Bad ski technique

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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
So many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
Paul.clearly the best skier on the mountains...

Well, I think was ahead of my time where the Bond girl (she really was English - Tilly was her name) is doing that repetitive motion at 1:43 -- it became Instagram's Boomerang effect in 2015. Skyfall was also released just prior to that trip.

Racers aren't picking up blondes on chairs and then filming with them. Racers are hurting too much from their "stacking technique" or just too tired or jarred. Ski from the heart.. people are gonna respond positively.
9 years ago
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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
Paul.Just gonna toss in this video I found by clicking a few links on your profile. Not sure why anyone wasted their time debating you, clearly the best skier on the mountains...

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/831366/The-name-is-Heart-Carver


Wtf did I just watch seriously....Hahahaha
9 years ago
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Dddsz
Posts: 3042 - Karma: 7,323
californiagrownSconnieThe constant judgement of skiers by skiers is unacceptable. I experience it on chairlift rides and on NS.

Really? Maybe you're just very thin skinned, can't laugh at yourself, and are unable to accept objective criticism.


Im not talking about hate directed at me, I didn't make that very clear. I constantly listen to people make fun of skiers from the lift and trash their style or lack of style, throw snowballs, and act like genuine douchbags.
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
Paul.Just gonna toss in this video I found by clicking a few links on your profile. Not sure why anyone wasted their time debating you, clearly the best skier on the mountains...

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/831366/The-name-is-Heart-Carver


Dude looks like he is having a blast, an looks like id have a blast heartcarving on those sticks if i was wearing a jean jacket vest, and 4 gourlokos deep. If that is that guys steeze and he is into it.. by all means. But no one stays into the same thing year after year... progression is fun. whether technically, stylistically, or the magnitude.

IMO In order to have maximum fun and allow yourself to ski as freely as possible, you need all the tools in your bag... including the hard learned skills of an ice course and/or bump course racer
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
Any asshole with cajones can slide down a slope at speed with minimal control or edgeing and just a whole lot of just balancing.
9 years ago
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MIHoodlum
Posts: 245 - Karma: 257
Most places still have gaper days. Newschooler skiing is about breaking the rules. Just cause racers can bash gates does not mean they are a good switch skier.
9 years ago
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MikeWeinerONE
Posts: 501 - Karma: 1,215
MIHoodlumMost places still have gaper days. Newschooler skiing is about breaking the rules. Just cause racers can bash gates does not mean they are a good switch skier.


Does that make them bad switch skiers?
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
californiagrownIMO In order to have maximum fun and allow yourself to ski as freely as possible, you need all the tools in your bag... including the hard learned skills of an ice course and/or bump course racer


This is an important point... CT was already in his mid-teens before he started in the park. And Tanner was into moguls. Parks and fat skis weren't a thing until later in their ski lives, right? Anyway, if you want change, you have to let go of something and grab onto something else. If nothing exists, you have to invent it.

To be a good musician I think you really need to work in a lot of different environments and situations: eg. studio/live, styles, groups, time signatures.

Who hates snowboarding but has never tried it? Personally, I think snowboarders pump their turns too much. I mean skiing and snowboarding should be minimal input, maximum output. Those who play drums or do martial arts would know the more you can concentrate your body into that hit, the better you are. I'd say that's the essence of good technique in anything: the mastery you have over your energy and your body. Possibly the easiest way to become aware of this is by watching a 100m sprint: have a look at the style of the winner in slow motion.
9 years ago
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.Hugo.
Posts: 17360 - Karma: 28,494
Do you guys realize who youre arguing with? Idk why any of you even bother with this guy anymore.
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
.Hugo.Do you guys realize who youre arguing with? Idk why any of you even bother with this guy anymore.


Heartcarving is the purest form of soul skiing. You better ask somebody!
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
californiagrownHeartcarving is the purest form of soul skiing. You better ask somebody!


Anyone on my friends list has said something good about HC at some point, and interesting most stopped cold after I did that. I'll build the Meathammers (and Gayton) eventually (perhaps in few years) but I don't think about HC everyday like I used to since putting it in the public domain.

I'm still waiting for people come up with something better, or at least something different in terms of real skiing and radical new ski designs. There's a lot to love and like about skiing, but if we're talking about pure sensations, without fear and pain, but still with exhilaration, there's just nothing out there that delivers consistently. Park and pow have that, but few attain that level and can keep it going consistently. Backcountry and helicopters are not an option for most people, and hiking, poor snow, lack of guides and avvies inhibit so many people.

I mean even Dadali, CT, Harlaut and Gagnier all have metal in their bodies. Also, I think the big question of this era is would you trade-in your major injury for a life without skiing (or a rapidly shrunken life.) I read Gagnier saying that that's his biggest regret: not backing out of that run.

Also, for people that love park and jibbing so much, shouldn't you be in the half-pipe and taking it to the next level?
9 years ago
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kami
Posts: 567 - Karma: 4,668
baby_HCAnyone on my friends list has said something good about HC at some point, and interesting most stopped cold after I did that. I'll build the Meathammers (and Gayton) eventually (perhaps in few years) but I don't think about HC everyday like I used to since putting it in the public domain.

I'm still waiting for people come up with something better, or at least something different in terms of real skiing and radical new ski designs. There's a lot to love and like about skiing, but if we're talking about pure sensations, without fear and pain, but still with exhilaration, there's just nothing out there that delivers consistently. Park and pow have that, but few attain that level and can keep it going consistently. Backcountry and helicopters are not an option for most people, and hiking, poor snow, lack of guides and avvies inhibit so many people.

I mean even Dadali, CT, Harlaut and Gagnier all have metal in their bodies. Also, I think the big question of this era is would you trade-in your major injury for a life without skiing (or a rapidly shrunken life.) I read Gagnier saying that that's his biggest regret: not backing out of that run.

Also, for people that love park and jibbing so much, shouldn't you be in the half-pipe and taking it to the next level?


Why do you think pipe is the thing to take the sport to the next level? If you look at the "new school" skiers who have highly influenced the sport like Candide for example they are taking the sport to the next level in every facet.
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
kamiWhy do you think pipe is the thing to take the sport to the next level? If you look at the "new school" skiers who have highly influenced the sport like Candide for example they are taking the sport to the next level in every facet.


Next level in terms of acrobatics and just raw time spinning in the air.

Wait, even Gagnier said quads aren't worth it. Yeah, pulling out park spins on-piste (thanks to CT) and in BC is next level right now. But what if you don't like spinning or can't get to pow. Urban is also next level but to me that's as weird and unattractive ski ballet. It also ruins your skis.

I just watched the snowboard documentary We Ride: The Story of Snowboarding.. great film. And interesting that snowboarding was initially called skiboarding by Tom Sims and that jibbing in the 90's and hiphop culture caused snowboarding to get called snow-skateboarding. To me if you called Urban skiing snow-rollerblading, that wouldn't attract so many people because rollerblading is pretty dead right now, or at least not nearly at the level it was in the late 90s when it was still in the x-games?

But with all this talk of kids with bad technique, "next level" I think has become simply broadening your experience of skiing to all its facets.
9 years ago
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poonis
Posts: 255 - Karma: 1,461
OP is probably that guy who thinks that everyone who doesn't speak english should go back to their own country
9 years ago
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CabbyArrant
Posts: 780 - Karma: 4,126
ozzywrongSo many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.


That's all well and good but I come from a place where very few people are aware of what good ski technique is let alone have it. I mean I have been trying to teach myself good form but it's hard when there really isn't anybody to teach it or anybody for you to emulate
9 years ago
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KravtZ
Posts: 6637 - Karma: 2,629
Paul.Just gonna toss in this video I found by clicking a few links on your profile. Not sure why anyone wasted their time debating you, clearly the best skier on the mountains...

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/831366/The-name-is-Heart-Carver


HAHA dude you SUUUUUUUUUCK at skiing. I get it you're having fun and all. But when it comes to proper form, style, technique...you need to shut your mouth cause you have NONE of that.

I can GUARANTEE you if you were placed on any remote form of a difficult off piste trail that required skill to get down fast with good form and style you would fail miserably.

Please stop talking when it comes to how to ski properly.
9 years ago
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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
CabbyArrantThat's all well and good but I come from a place where very few people are aware of what good ski technique is let alone have it. I mean I have been trying to teach myself good form but it's hard when there really isn't anybody to teach it or anybody for you to emulate


You have the internet right ? Use that.. There's videos on YouTube that will teach you.
9 years ago
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fatmilf
Posts: 66 - Karma: 191
KravtZ...its raising an entire generation of people who think being "good" at skiing involves hitting rails and spinning off jumps.

That has NOTHING to do with being a good skier.


This is utter horseshit. Being good at hitting rails and jumps is being good at one type of skiing. Going off of cliffs and down shoots is being good at a different type of skiing. Being good at Slalom or GS is being good at yet another type of skiing. Stop acting like these are all the same thing. Should we all start racing, skiing park, big mountain and backcountry just to please you judge mental fucks? It's freeskiing for a reason
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
fatmilfThis is utter horseshit. Being good at hitting rails and jumps is being good at one type of skiing. Going off of cliffs and down shoots is being good at a different type of skiing. Being good at Slalom or GS is being good at yet another type of skiing. Stop acting like these are all the same thing. Should we all start racing, skiing park, big mountain and backcountry just to please you judge mental fucks? It's freeskiing for a reason IP


Actually the only part of skiing that has next to no carryover to another is park haha.

So if you suck at the majority of skiing, but are good at park... you still suck at skiing.

In anycase, why wouldn't you want to be a great all around skier? It opens up a world of options for fun in the mtns :)
9 years ago
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profa_212
Posts: 9278 - Karma: 41,198
Hmmmm I'm a wee but confused. I understand what the stacked position is..but at the same time I've always been told that on steeps I should "point" to initiate my next turn. This in turn ruins the stacked position.

So what situations is the stacked position better than pointing?
9 years ago
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jca
Posts: 4183 - Karma: 6,390
fatmilfThis is utter horseshit. Being good at hitting rails and jumps is being good at one type of skiing. Going off of cliffs and down shoots is being good at a different type of skiing. Being good at Slalom or GS is being good at yet another type of skiing. Stop acting like these are all the same thing. Should we all start racing, skiing park, big mountain and backcountry just to please you judge mental fucks? It's freeskiing for a reason


do what you want but it's way easier to be good at skiing park if you can ski with proper technique in lots of variable conditions.
9 years ago
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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
californiagrownActually the only part of skiing that has next to no carryover to another is park haha.

So if you suck at the majority of skiing, but are good at park... you still suck at skiing.

In anycase, why wouldn't you want to be a great all around skier? It opens up a world of options for fun in the mtns :)



So on point...
9 years ago
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brett_fisher
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 10,519
I get what your saying but if your so into turns go ski race op.
9 years ago
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brett_fisher
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 10,519
I get what your saying but if your so into turns go ski race op.
9 years ago
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K-Dot.
Posts: 3790 - Karma: 8,349
OP you aren't the first to say this nor will you be the last. You sound jaded and bitter. If these people really are bad at skiing why do you care? People who aren't good at skiing will always exist, live and let live. Also the whole aim of freeskiing is to be free of any rules. There is no wrong way to ski until you make it about competing. Freeskiing is about having fun. Let these kids have fun, who cares if they adhere to some ideal that you have for skiing.

I do agree that it is annoying at times though. Cocky park rats that think they're the shit based solely on their ability to ski park are annoying. But what cocky skier isn't? I see plenty of condescending big mountain skiers that act like park tricks don't take any skill which is equally wrong. Your hate and pretentiousness accomplishes nothing.

Finally, lots of park skiers are good skiers. Most every pro park skier can hold their own in some real terrain. Some comp robots do look awkward but for the most part pro skiers are just really good skiers fundamentally. You can't get to the level they're at without it. Good skiing form hasn't been lost. Often park skiers put their own flare on their approach to the mountain. To you this might seem like bad form but is it? If they're in control and taking a different approach to skiing who are you to say they're wrong?

Look at skiers like:
Sami Ortlieb
Karl Fosvedt
John Ware
Collin Collins
Etc.

The list goes on. There are plenty of good skiers our there and coming up. Take a chill pill OP
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
KravtZHAHA dude you SUUUUUUUUUCK at skiing. I get it you're having fun and all. But when it comes to proper form, style, technique...you need to shut your mouth cause you have NONE of that.

I can GUARANTEE you if you were placed on any remote form of a difficult off piste trail that required skill to get down fast with good form and style you would fail miserably.

Please stop talking when it comes to how to ski properly.



Just looked at your vid from Feb 2016 --- what a terrible skier you are!
9 years ago
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fatmilf
Posts: 66 - Karma: 191
ozzywrongSo on point...
You should write a rule book on skiing about what everyone HAS to do to be a "good" skier. How many years of racing should I do? What percentage of my time on mountain am I allowed to spend in the park. You really seen to have it figured out since you're pro and everything.
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
fatmilfYou should write a rule book on skiing about what everyone HAS to do to be a "good" skier.


"Good" is subjective but I would compare skiers by looking at:

- amount of injuries (are they a titanium robot?)
- amount of time per day they ski (can they ski the whole day without getting tired)
- overall speed (are they actually moving over the terrain and getting g-forces)
- can they handle turns at speed (moguls is the ultimate in turn frequency)
- how many reasonable, non-threatening conversations can they hold per day on the lift (this comes down to not being out of breath and weary)
- how many "breaks" per day do they need (are they always tired from the technique or is their gear wrecked/unsuitable)
- how many times per day does their ski release (are they over-extending themselves)
- how much time do they spend waiting around in the park (are they overly hesitant to drop-in or are they sacrificing good skiing elsewhere just to be in an overly-full park)
- how much snow covers one's clothes (how meaty are their stacks?)

I could go on... but these criteria do not even evaluate a person's body position or movements .. they are things an instructor can't assess.
9 years ago
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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
fatmilfYou should write a rule book on skiing about what everyone HAS to do to be a "good" skier. How many years of racing should I do? What percentage of my time on mountain am I allowed to spend in the park. You really seen to have it figured out since you're pro and everything.

You should write a book on how to be a little dick shit talker .
9 years ago
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JichelMusten
Posts: 750 - Karma: 2,889


OP just trying tell everyone how good he is
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Park skiing by a race trained dude. I call them crossovers. That said I know tons of "untrained" kids who carve at a very high level, way better than the OP's Bond video.
What say you about his style points?

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/812712/Bachelor-Parks-Real-Laps-Grant-Hamlin-Feb--9th-2016
9 years ago
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270on420out
Posts: 7525 - Karma: 51,354
TECHNIQUE SQUIDWARD
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
DominatorJacquesPark skiing by a race trained dude. I call them crossovers. That said I know tons of "untrained" kids who carve at a very high level, way better than the OP's Bond video.
What say you about his style points?

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/812712/Bachelor-Parks-Real-Laps-Grant-Hamlin-Feb--9th-2016


It isnt about "everyone should race" its about everyone should be able to be a technically sound(not neccesarily amazing) skier. Having the skills that are taught in racing, or learned on your own opens up so many doors of fun on the mountain.

It doesnt matter how you learn, just that you do!
9 years ago
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willysworld
Posts: 2116 - Karma: 5,485
californiagrownIt isnt about "everyone should race" its about everyone should be able to be a technically sound(not neccesarily amazing) skier. Having the skills that are taught in racing, or learned on your own opens up so many doors of fun on the mountain.

It doesnt matter how you learn, just that you do!

Again this guy is very much onto the exact point I'm trying to make. Thank you. Freeskiing is meant to be free yes.. But bad ski form is bad ski form.. Just like bad surfing is bad surfing.. If you are a hack and can't ski the rest of the mountain with good form, carve a proper turn or ski powder all backseat with horrible body position but can do double corks and 450 onto a rail.. You are not a good skier you are a park rat that can side slip down the mountain and look like a monkey with poor form while you do it .. Education is the key to moving this sport in the direction it needs to go in my opinion. Freeskiing is heading to new plateaus of awesomeness but the fundimentals of learning how to ski and carve a turn properly will never change and are one of the most important factors I being a really good skier not just a park rat that can huck off a jump.
9 years ago
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ManesPhoney
Posts: 94 - Karma: 256
You don't necessarily need a racing/mogul background to develop a good skiing form. But it sure does help. However I don't think there is a "perfect" technique. The key is to adapt your skiing to the terrain and snow conditions and just feel it. You have to develop a form that fits you not the other way round. Pioneers like Candide, Benchetler, THall, McConkey did their own thing and thats why they stood/stand out. There were like 1000s of Mogul/race skiers but these guys never really gave a damn on what other people thought about their form and their overall approach on skiing and so should you
9 years ago
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Simsyb
Posts: 48 - Karma: 149
ozzywrongSo many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.


Thank Candide
9 years ago
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Zimmy
Posts: 1258 - Karma: -1,327
SimsybCandide


I want to see CT on the heartcarves in the backcountry, because they are a slow-speed (and hands-free) pow ski at their core. (Bond on groomers is just theatrics.)

I'd expect twice the turns, twice the spins, twice the switch and possibly half the sluff

Just a thought.. and these skis already exist.
The other fella that used them was a park skier.

Lots of dreamy 80s synth backing tracks.
9 years ago
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Scotty_B
Posts: 287 - Karma: 423
I would argue that the short pole phenomenon is causing bad upper body posture. Like when they fit your poles at the shop im pretty sure its for correct upper body posture..arms out in front is what I was told.
9 years ago
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Rusticles
Posts: 2180 - Karma: 1,337
ozzywrongSo many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.


californiagrownActually the only part of skiing that has next to no carryover to another is park haha.

So if you suck at the majority of skiing, but are good at park... you still suck at skiing.

In anycase, why wouldn't you want to be a great all around skier? It opens up a world of options for fun in the mtns :)


Does this mean that tammy whalnuts, joss christensen, henrik harlaut, dale T and alex sloppy are all terrible skiers?

You guys honestly sound like butt hurt monkeys jelly of the park skiers who get all the love because they can slay park. The reality of it is that the park skiers will excel at being "all mountain" or a "big mountain" skier long before an all mountain skier or big mountain skier will excel at park
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
Scotty_BI would argue that the short pole phenomenon is causing bad upper body posture. Like when they fit your poles at the shop im pretty sure its for correct upper body posture..arms out in front is what I was told.



No, they're sized for pushing power.
9 years ago
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Scotty_B
Posts: 287 - Karma: 423
californiagrownNo, they're sized for pushing power.


ty sir
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
RusticlesDoes this mean that tammy whalnuts, joss christensen, henrik harlaut, dale T and alex sloppy are all terrible skiers?


Huh? Where was that said or implied? Or did calling out skiers who dont know how to carve strike a nerve with you?

You're the one who sounds butthurt over an opinion lol
9 years ago
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Rusticles
Posts: 2180 - Karma: 1,337
californiagrownHuh? Where was that said or implied? Or did calling out skiers who dont know how to carve strike a nerve with you?

You're the one who sounds butthurt over an opinion lol


because they're probably not the best at skiing outside the park so they must not be that good?

Hasn't struck a nerve with me, just find it funny that so many people like to rag on park skiers, like they give a fuck that they're being judged or that some "all mountain" skier thinks they're turns suck.
9 years ago
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KravtZ
Posts: 6637 - Karma: 2,629
RusticlesDoes this mean that tammy whalnuts, joss christensen, henrik harlaut, dale T and alex sloppy are all terrible skiers?

You guys honestly sound like butt hurt monkeys jelly of the park skiers who get all the love because they can slay park. The reality of it is that the park skiers will excel at being "all mountain" or a "big mountain" skier long before an all mountain skier or big mountain skier will excel at park


Very true...park is a very niche skillset in the world of skiing. That being said pretty much every single pro I guarantee you can shred outside the park like none other. All those dudes you listed have videos out there of them shredding pow/big mountain/backcountry.
9 years ago
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
Rusticlesbecause they're probably not the best at skiing outside the park so they must not be that good?

Hasn't struck a nerve with me, just find it funny that so many people like to rag on park skiers, like they give a fuck that they're being judged or that some "all mountain" skier thinks they're turns suck.

Well, if I can ski a steep featured line as well as a a pro park skier, yeah, they aren't a great skier in my mind. Oh shit, my opinion is different than yours!!!

I prefer some who looks totally in control and as though they are playing with the features of the mountain as opposed to slipping and surviving at speed till the next air.

Should I not voice my opinion on where I would like to see skiing and edits progress?
9 years ago
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EvesHerbal
Posts: 30 - Karma: 49
I had my first ski season this year and I was trying to learn park with technique mixed together but it just doesn't work. you see, for a dude that never skied before in his life to hit a rail is something out of this world. by the end of the season I was carving through double blacks confidently and beginning to hit the first rails on the beginner park. Style does lack but the point im trying to make is: for me it only clicked when i began getting the fundamentals on point. I skied with a friend of mine that is a beast on moguls and groomies but for some reason he won't try park, cliffs and jumps at all (scared to fall? i dont know) but im pretty sure if he gave it a try he would learn all the stuff that took me a season in a day.

bottom line, you need the technique and yes you will progress so much faster with it, but I'd say balls to try new stuff and be creative is more important.
9 years ago
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