Why are people going to vote for bernie?

.MASSHOLE.More just frustrated. You are so close-minded as you claim some conservatives are. People like you are what the world a bipartisan place with no room for compromise.

Are you even going to address my comment about the universal healthcare system? Or is the single-payer system the only one you want?

S.J.WNo I really don't give a fuck about what you have to say to be honest. We are obviously never going to agree and I'm not going to waste my time on you.

.MASSHOLE.And that right there, is my point proven.

If you are unwilling to have an open mind, then you are just like Trump, the Tea Party, and every other close-minded party in politics that you so often try to put down.

Having a close-mind is hurting the world more than any thing else.

At least I am willing to hear out arguments and provide counterpoints or admit to being incorrect.

I just hope you realize there are many ways to solve these issues. Universal Healthcare is a broad term and is more than just a single-payer system. Education doesn't only have to come from college, it can come from trade schools. Breaking up big banks won't fix the issues if the enforcement lacks. The list goes on.

S.J.WWe've had discussions on Bernie over and over again, and it's always the same shit. I'm not going to budge on my position defending universal health care because I know how amazing it can be. It's literally beating a dead horse and I'm not about to start beating said horse again.

K-Dot.Grr. I hate this attack on any Democratic policy. Its not like these ideas are done to make the citizen pay more money. They are always designed to minimize costs. Take healthcare for instance. Yeah, your taxes are going to be higher, but you won't be spending as much as if it were privatized. This kind of thinking is so simple, I don't know why people act like the government is just trying to steal their money.

Oh, and Obama is gonna take all of your guns and ammo too, better buy more right?

KravtZBecause honestly I dont care about the vast majority of other people. I get great healthcare through my company at a very very reasonable price and good deductibles. So now I have to pay more for others even though I am good in my current situation. You see the problem? Its not my problem others have issues...its there own problem.

.MASSHOLE.But do you want Universal Healthcare or a Single Payer System? A Single Payer System is a version of Universal Healthcare, but Universal Healthcare is not a version of a Single Payer System...

S.J.WOkay to answer your questions. Single payer. Happy?

.MASSHOLE.Alright, then do everyone a favor and stop denouncing lack of universal healthcare when it is, in fact, part of the American system. The ACA is considered a compulsory insurance system, which, in fact, is a type of Universal Healthcare. The ACA is actually similar to what your favorite country, Australia has.

S.J.WCool really don't care. Ask anyone on the street what the difference between universal health care and single payer is and they won't be able to tell you the difference. And if you want to get so strong armed on the definitions of each then go right ahead. Because I'm going to continue to use universal health care as a synonym for single payer because that's what most people think it is.

S.J.WCool really don't care. Ask anyone on the street what the difference between universal health care and single payer is and they won't be able to tell you the difference. And if you want to get so strong armed on the definitions of each then go right ahead. Because I'm going to continue to use universal health care as a synonym for single payer because that's what most people think it is.

.MASSHOLE.You probably should. You sound like an idiot if you don't know the difference because well.

I can't believe I am defending Hillary but people were all up in arms when she was against a Single Payer System because she talked about Universal Healthcare in prior speeches. There is a MASSIVE difference.

An uninformed electorate combined with a close-minded one will ruin any country. You are a walking example of the issue at hand. Hopefully one day you can realize that.

S.J.WDid you not read my post? I do know the difference... I just can't be fucked to use proper terminology because other people don't know the difference and when people talk about universal health care they're usually talking about a single payer. And I'm not like you where I get a boner everytime I correct someone on the difference.

And don't try to use me as an example of not changing an opinion. In the last state election in Australia I voted for Mike Baird who is the member of the liberal party in NSW (right wing). So I won't change my opinion on a single payer health care system so that makes me a shining example of someone who won't change his opinion? Happy that I used the correct terminology?

You say you want to have intellectual discussions and will admit you're wrong if proved otherwise. Easier said than done when I haven't seen you admit you're wrong once on this site, or are you just always right?

.MASSHOLE.Then make that clear. Because you are continuing the state of misinformation among a population that frankly needs to be informed if they are to make a difference. I can't imagine OneNerdyKid is always talking about a single payer system when discussing universal healthcare.

No, you won't change your opinion on something no matter how much misinformation OR correct information you have. You earlier stated you were unwilling to engage in any sort of conversation because we don't see eye to eye. That is unfortunate because it means you are unwilling to listen to the other side.

I will admit if I am wrong. Unfortunately you have failed to prove me as incorrect, rather you just prove we have differing opinions. I NEVER take my word as absolute truth, rather I show the information I have, why I believe in it, and why I stand behind it. I try not to provide statements without information. If PhD. economists, statisticians, and industry experts are incorrect, then I am incorrect. I will admit it.

If Bernie wins this elections and passes every major thing he has proposed, I will never post on NS again.

S.J.WNo I really don't give a fuck about what you have to say to be honest. We are obviously never going to agree and I'm not going to waste my time on you.

S.J.WNo I didn't want to discuss single payer health care because we've done it so many times. It's been done, it's a dead horse and I'm not going to continue beating a dead horse anymore. I have better things to do with my day than beat a dead horse about health care. When did I say I didn't want to discuss any politics? You're literally throwing words into my mouth. Are you going to admit you were wrong about that? Probably not...

.MASSHOLE.See above. We are in a thread discussing politics, healthcare is part of politics is it not?

I was just trying to see if you understood grouping a Single Payer System together with a Universal Healthcare System was actually incorrect and frankly providing misinformation.

Titus69He has very few pros, the man has never worked a real world job and doesn't understand how money works. All the kids at school want him literally just for free college. The man wants to raise a country where its "everyone wins" so nobody actually has to work hard. This country is gonna go further into shit no matter who we get.

S.J.WOh my god, and what we're we talking about? Health care. And what do I not want to discuss anymore because it's a dead horse and neither of use will change our opinion on it? boom health care. Oh my god, no way!!!!!

Fred_BearI agree 100%. Id be paying a considerable amount more than i am right now.

S.J.WOh my god, and what we're we talking about? Health care. And what do I not want to discuss anymore because it's a dead horse and neither of use will change our opinion on it? boom health care. Oh my god, no way!!!!!

McNocheYou are getting destroyed right now, son!
Let me guess your response will be "don't want to beat off a horse" Am I right ?

McNocheYou are getting destroyed right now, son!
Let me guess your response will be "don't want to beat off a horse" Am I right ?

Huck_NorrisY'know, it really is sad that peoples' minds actually work in this way.

Ignorance seems like a warm blanket and a pair of headphones to you fucking cretins nowadays. It's as if just saying something monumentally stupid like "He doesn't even know how money works" liberates you from the need to even look through the facts or historical relevance of the point at all.

Honestly, area all your thoughts in crayon flipbook animation or just your political ones? I seriously hope you're joking but you do seem stupid enough to actually believe Bernie doesn't know how money works. In case you missed it, he called out everyone before the collapse of '08 and called the full fallout of that bubble to a fucking T you stupid fucking meatgazer. If anybody knows money and the economy it's him. He has 100% been on point as to exactly what this country's financial and debt problems are. He warned us-> He tried to stop it-> It happened anyways-> Now he's trying to fix it -> fucking morons like you act like none of that ever happened and he's crazy/doesn't know what he's saying.


Go fuck yourself. Idiots like you are the problem. At least pay the smallest iota of attention to the actual relevant issues or just shut your fucking cockwarmer and get the fuck out of here. If that's teh shit you're going to spew I'm going to verbally fist you so fucking hard your mother is just going to start crying wherever she is and have no idea why.

Titus69Relax.
So you want Bernies plan's that cost over a trillion dollars in total to pass? Good thing our national debt isnt bad.....

Titus69Relax.
So you want Bernies plan's that cost over a trillion dollars in total to pass? Good thing our national debt isnt bad.....

B1tchJust ignore this guy. He is to deep to even reach.

Huck_NorrisGet your numbers straight!

The cost is estimated at around $15T... But we STILL COME OUT AHEAD because it is estimated by the same algorithms that without this system going into effect, that cost would be $30T. DOUBLE. We are paying DOUBLE right now for shitty coverage, huge copays and limitless medical bills should someone run us over etc.

It's getting an astronomically better deal for way less money. I honestly don't understand how you guys can only look at the details in this proposal that you support your shitty opinion but it's pretty basic math once again. It's fine if you don't want to look at the actual fucking numbers and live in fairy tale land- be my guest- but don't regurgitate half the story here and expect others to not notice.

You can't say what it'll cost without saying what it'll save. If there's a net gain for us, that's really the point.

McNocheYou are getting destroyed right now, son!
Let me guess your response will be "don't want to beat off a horse" Am I right ?

.MASSHOLE.It depends what numbers you look at. His party says one thing, some economists say other things. Obviously he has a lot of variables in play that need to come to fruition, so it is tough to say it will be THAT cheap relative to what we have.

http://www.vox.com/2016/1/28/10858644/bernie-sanders-kenneth-thorpe-single-payer

J.D.Bernie supporters are the Democratic equivalent of the Tea Party. Just as brazenly impractical, just as sure of their own moral authority, just as mile-wide-inch-deep in their thinking. The Tea Party has outlandish ideas like a 10% flat tax to buy your vote with money, Bernie has free state college. Neither makes any sort of fiscal sense.

In principle, some measured approach to some of the policies might make sense. But he's basically running Howard Beale's campaign.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/811442/Network---Mad-as-Hell-Scene

AKhoodratIf taxpayer funded state college is just as ridiculous of an idea as a flat tax then tell me why one country in the world, Hong Kong, has an actual flat tax while much of Europe has taxpayer funded state college?

Huck_NorrisGo fuck yourself.

I corrected him. If you don't want to be corrected, don't say stupid shit like "The guy who called the economy's collapse with 100% accuracy has no idea what he's talking about when it comes to economics and money"


The only thing I'm too deep into for you to "reach" is reality. You know- math and relevant points and such. It's fun! You should try it sometime!!

Huck_NorrisThink about it for a second though- even if it cost THE SAME AMOUNT, we would still be way ahead of where we are now because we could all get whatever we needed without fear of massive medical bills. Why wouldn't you want that?? I just don't get it. Tell me why that would be a bad thing!

Titus69He has very few pros, the man has never worked a real world job and doesn't understand how money works. All the kids at school want him literally just for free college. The man wants to raise a country where its "everyone wins" so nobody actually has to work hard. This country is gonna go further into shit no matter who we get.

jmellberg800who is payind for college? someone has to. and its gonna be the young people who do it. there just setting themselves up for debt 20 tears down the road

Titus69I know, student debt is a major problem but if its free college, who's gonna pay for the college? (I'm actually curious)

LonelyDamn could you do anything in this thread besides dick riding and shit posting. I have yet to see a constructive contribution from you.

brov1lol at this, there is no way that we have a democratic congress any time soon, maybe a democratically controlled house, but senate lol no. also you realize that the democratic party doesn't even endorse bernie because he is unrealistically radical. and even if we did have a democratic congress, most democrats aren't radical enough to support someone like bernie so nothing would happen either way.

Huck_NorrisThe point there is that if your company isn't on the hook for a massively inflated insurance and healthcare cost, they can afford to pay you more and everybody ends up winning. When the cost of healthcare is reduced, you can put more meat on the bone for everybody and that's the real point. I know you guys understand basic math, this shouldn't be a stretch for you to get.

Huck_NorrisThe point there is that if your company isn't on the hook for a massively inflated insurance and healthcare cost, they can afford to pay you more and everybody ends up winning. When the cost of healthcare is reduced, you can put more meat on the bone for everybody and that's the real point. I know you guys understand basic math, this shouldn't be a stretch for you to get.


Besides, I'm sick of hearing "Well I have good healthcare so fuck everyone else."


I have really good healthcare and insurance too, but I can tell you've never had a major surgery as things like that are still super fucking expensive! Get into a car accident, get cancer or get laid off and see how shit goes for you- even with great insurance you're going to pay out the fucking nose. Just because it's working for you right now doesn't mean it's always going to be peaches & cream forever, and like I said before- insurance does as little as it possibly can for you despite the massive amounts they fleece us for. Your short-sightedness is actually pretty sad in this case, as I find it ignores a lot of fairly obvious details that are key to the issue as a whole. Please stop that. You aren't safe and even with the best insurance, you could be on the hook for hundreds of thousands if you have a bad accident etc. You. Aren't. Safe.

californiagrownMy biggest issue with fully socialized healthcare is the quality of care... Basically I will pay an insurance tax that covers care at approved hospitals and clinics, unfortunately those will be the "laymen" facilities. All the top tier doctors and surgeons will open private practices and govt insurance will not cover all/most of that Bill, so private insurance is now needed in addition to the govt insurance... And then I'm back paying more. This is how it works in some European countries.

Additionally, I really like being able to go in to my doctor at lunch, have him/her authorize an MRI for that afternoon, and then have my meniscus scoped 2 days later. That would likely be a month+ long process with govt run healthcare due to the requirement that the govt authorize such expensive procedures. All socialized healthcare systems I've ever looked into provide a very slow level of service for non-essential expensive procedures+ they will require you try the least expensive treatments first even if the doctor and yourself would rather go with the more expensive treatment.

.MASSHOLE.As I stated , I was merely trying to see if you understood the nuances that differentiated the universal healthcare term and single payer system.