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CAST Si&I System?

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patagonialuke
Posts: 1627 - Karma: 8,686
So I am currently in the research phase of getting a touring setup and was wondering if anyone here had experience with the CAST SI&I system which uses plates to let you swap out a alpine toe piece for a dynafit. The system sounds great, but I'm skeptical so I was hoping someone on NS had used it.
Jan 21 2016 8:03PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5074 - Karma: 43,034
Depends on what you want to use this setup for.

Here is a good review:http://blistergearreview.com/gear-reviews/cast-sii-alpine-touring-system
Jan 21 2016 8:20PM
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Hugh_Conway_jr
Posts: 746 - Karma: 467
CAST is build on the notion that Pin bindings are not reliable enough ... maybe this was true in 2010 ... but its 2016 son!

The Beast and the Kingpin now fill the hole in the Pin binding market for High din binders. Even the G3 Ion is a solid contender.

I personally ride ions, and since swapping out the heal piece with the 2016 update, I have had no issue with them (that fix was for uphill performance ... that being said, it depends on the level of performance you are looking for.... how hard do you really huck your meat? now, there is a difference in the release style..so that may appeal to you more.
Jan 23 2016 1:05AM
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patagonialuke
Posts: 1627 - Karma: 8,686
The CAST system caught my interest not only due to the fact that you get alpine binding downhill performance when touring (which may not be a big deal anymore due to said advancements in tech bindings) but also because I will likely be splitting my time between resort and BC, so the idea of being able to have full on alpine binding when I want was appealing. I am just getting started as far as BC goes so I'll probably be doing mostly resort skiing for the first season or so.
Jan 23 2016 2:12PM
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Hugh_Conway_jr
Posts: 746 - Karma: 467
I use pins on my daily drivers ... I love how close to the ski they put you and the reduced weight is a bonus.

The only time I regretted them, was when I was waiting at the top of the chair, and tried to stand up on my tips ... that caused a release that wouldn't have happened with a traditional DIN binding . They handle bumps , drops, crud and groom just fine.... I am not jibbing with them, or sessioning the park however ... so I cant talk them up in that respect.

Either way, you just need something to get you out there. It will take you a while to figure out your own personal preference... in the meantime, all I am saying is that AT binding technology is was better than it was just a few years ago.
Jan 23 2016 7:05PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5074 - Karma: 43,034
Hugh_Conway_jrCAST is build on the notion that Pin bindings are not reliable enough ... maybe this was true in 2010 ... but its 2016 son!

The Beast and the Kingpin now fill the hole in the Pin binding market for High din binders. Even the G3 Ion is a solid contender.

I personally ride ions, and since swapping out the heal piece with the 2016 update, I have had no issue with them (that fix was for uphill performance ... that being said, it depends on the level of performance you are looking for.... how hard do you really huck your meat? now, there is a difference in the release style..so that may appeal to you more.


Ehhh, depends on how much inbounds skiing you are looking a doing. I've skied the Kingpin inbounds a fair bit, and my roommate had the Beasts on his daily drivers. Sure you can do it, but I don't totally see the point. And regardless, I'd still feel like I was rolling the dice on my knees.

And I disagree, I think a big part of the reason CAST exists is a safety aspect. I know plenty of people that only ski FKS's, they won't buy other bindings. The CAST system allows you to still have the proven retention and DIN release (and lateral release, and elasticity) of your favorite alpine binder. I understand why guys combining pretty big tours with heavy hucking are on that system.

As for the Ions, hope that 2016 heel is the real thing. I've got more than a few days on the 2015 ones, and one of my partners is on them full time. Not impressed. Risers get floppy and the break pops down like mad.

patagonialukeThe CAST system caught my interest not only due to the fact that you get alpine binding downhill performance when touring (which may not be a big deal anymore due to said advancements in tech bindings) but also because I will likely be splitting my time between resort and BC, so the idea of being able to have full on alpine binding when I want was appealing. I am just getting started as far as BC goes so I'll probably be doing mostly resort skiing for the first season or so.


Honestly that's the biggest and best argument for CAST I've seen. That said, if you are doing minimal touring, a frame binder will be cheaper, and something like the Guardian will ski just fine inbounds.
Jan 23 2016 9:46PM
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Hugh_Conway_jr
Posts: 746 - Karma: 467
cydwhitAs for the Ions, hope that 2016 heel is the real thing. I've got more than a few days on the 2015 ones, and one of my partners is on them full time. Not impressed. Risers get floppy and the break pops down like mad.




Dude! the 2016 heel piece is the real deal. There are 6 pairs among my crew, last year 5 pairs had shit performance on the up, brake release, spontaneous release into ski mode from tour and floppy risers .... not to mention really weird wear pattern on the risers.

Talked to g3 direct, the sent us out new heels in the fall, and all of the problems have disappeared. They failed to outright acknowledge the problems mentioned...and heel fix says its for some other problem (a broken tab that results in floppy ramp syndrome i think) ... but I was a rather quick and painless process. Give them a shout. it's worth it.
Jan 24 2016 1:08AM
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Elg
Posts: 2998 - Karma: 3,880
Anyone got any personal experience with this? I'm highly considering it for a pair of pow skis i don't have bindings for yet.
Mar 1 2016 1:18PM
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VD.
Posts: 4054 - Karma: 4,565
Pointless*. It's one in a long line of many pointless so called AT 'innovations' - MFDs, Beasts and now this.

*I say pointless, although this is perhaps a little unfair. Much like MFDs and Beasts, they do serve a purpose, but they cater to such a specific user that they are as good as when discussing their merits among pedestrians.
Mar 1 2016 8:04PM
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Jaybrtn
Posts: 375 - Karma: 643
ElgAnyone got any personal experience with this? I'm highly considering it for a pair of pow skis i don't have bindings for yet.


Just installed the cast system a few weeks ago, although I've only had time to take them out once. I loved them. Tech toe uphill and my trusty fks for the ride down makes everything so much better. Granted, I haven't toured on a full tech setup before, only a frame binding and these, so maybe I'm just stoked on something I shouldn't be, but it works for me. I split my time between inbounds and bc, so its perfect for the riding I do. The only problem I had with them was getting some ice/snow in the plates that made switching from the dynafit toe to the fks toe a little difficult. Busted out a knife to scrape the ice out which helped. But I assume over the next few tours I'll figure out a more effective way to take care of that issue.
Mar 3 2016 7:11PM
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Barmski
Posts: 4342 - Karma: 811
I have the cast system, it is awesome. Small scraper tool or blow torch solves the ice build problem. Being able to drop and send anything is awesome and the reason why I have it. Theres just certain terrain I wont take my dynafits in. Highly recommend CAST for sure.
Mar 5 2016 8:48AM
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Jaybrtn
Posts: 375 - Karma: 643
BarmskiI have the cast system, it is awesome. Small scraper tool or blow torch solves the ice build problem. Being able to drop and send anything is awesome and the reason why I have it. Theres just certain terrain I wont take my dynafits in. Highly recommend CAST for sure.


Mini blow torch is an awesome idea. Definitely using that.
Mar 7 2016 2:26PM
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gapersarefriends
Posts: 2158 - Karma: 4,270
anyone on sth2's with the cast system?
Apr 4 2016 12:07AM
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250r
Posts: 2276 - Karma: 1,013
i dont really have the best understanding of the mechanics behind a safely releasing binding. how would the heel of a pivot/fks be superior to that of the kingpin?

the kingpin's heel has two settings, one for vertical, and one for lateral release. they even rotate like the pivots. that being said, is the cast system actually safer than kingpins?
Apr 5 2016 8:13PM
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oxiclean
Posts: 615 - Karma: 688
250ri dont really have the best understanding of the mechanics behind a safely releasing binding. how would the heel of a pivot/fks be superior to that of the kingpin?

the kingpin's heel has two settings, one for vertical, and one for lateral release. they even rotate like the pivots. that being said, is the cast system actually safer than kingpins?


The kingpins still have a pin system in the tow, which releases differently than non-tech bindings.
Apr 24 2016 10:17PM
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250r
Posts: 2276 - Karma: 1,013
sagerobThe kingpins still have a pin system in the tow, which releases differently than non-tech bindings.


yea i realize that, but comparing the cast system with dynafit toes and p18 heels to the kingpins, is the cast system actually safer? the heel is what is in question here.

my guess would be that no, the cast system is not an upgrade in safety from the kingpins. and kingpins are lighter and have a lower stack height.
Apr 25 2016 2:47AM
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patagonialuke
Posts: 1627 - Karma: 8,686
250ryea i realize that, but comparing the cast system with dynafit toes and p18 heels to the kingpins, is the cast system actually safer? the heel is what is in question here.

my guess would be that no, the cast system is not an upgrade in safety from the kingpins. and kingpins are lighter and have a lower stack height.



If you're just looking at the heels, they are not very different as they are both alpine style with a good deal of elasticity. However, the CAST system is definitely more solid in the toe area because you're swapping out the inelastic pin-style toe for an elastic alpine toe of the P18 on the way down. For example, the dude that just won the One of Your Days contest was on Kingpins, but in one of the very first shots it shows him locking out the toes, and therefore disabling release. Had he been on the CAST system or any other alpine binding, he would not have had to compromise the safety release on his toepieces.
Apr 25 2016 1:24PM
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250r
Posts: 2276 - Karma: 1,013
patagonialukeIf you're just looking at the heels, they are not very different as they are both alpine style with a good deal of elasticity. However, the CAST system is definitely more solid in the toe area because you're swapping out the inelastic pin-style toe for an elastic alpine toe of the P18 on the way down. For example, the dude that just won the One of Your Days contest was on Kingpins, but in one of the very first shots it shows him locking out the toes, and therefore disabling release. Had he been on the CAST system or any other alpine binding, he would not have had to compromise the safety release on his toepieces.


Ah I didn't think of swapping them out at the top. Seems like a bit of a hassle.
Apr 25 2016 2:14PM
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JohnJonsz
Posts: 317 - Karma: 871
250rAh I didn't think of swapping them out at the top. Seems like a bit of a hassle.


The whole swapping transition is the biggest downside to the cast system. As mentioned above, ice freezes in the small notches while you skin up. So when I get to the top, first thing I do after taking off my pack is to switch the toe pieces (before they freeze up more). It typically takes me a minute each to get the ice/snow off and switch toepieces. I like the blowtorch idea and need to get a smaller one for the portable dab rig anyway haha thanks.

Assuming you don't have a mini blowtorch, transitions are even longer and more difficult if its super cold out. The routine gets easier the more times you do it, but can be frustrating at first. In terms of transition time/effort, most tech bindings are quicker/easier than AT bindings (like dukes or guardians), and both of those are much quicker/easier than the CAST system.
Apr 28 2016 1:02PM
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JohnJonsz
Posts: 317 - Karma: 871
follow up because that ^ post seems too negative and I really like the system. As Cy said, it depends what your skiing. If you're doing 1-3 hr skins to pow runs with airs and maybe doing multiple laps, then CAST is the best product out right now. Big mountain style riding in the backcountry. Anything else then you don't need them. If you don't tour much and just cruise under 50mph and never hit jumps/cliffs then don't bother.

Source- I have CAST plates with Din 18s on pow skis that are 122 underfoot. Dynafit vulcan boots and FT12 toepieces. This year I've used them ~30 days... most of those days were top ski days of the year. I agree with everyone who's said that with CAST you can ski more confidently and safely than with any other touring setup. Also it works out great on days when you plan to mostly backcountry but end up just riding inbound laps with friends. One ski quiver. Ideally you're on CAST for backcountry days with demanding lines and multiple transitions. Not ideal for bigger uphill days ...over 4k vert ft uphill is about my threshold for taking a lighter full tech setup.
Apr 28 2016 2:06PM
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