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Titus69Crazy religous people make me nervous, when people say "god told me to......" it annoys me, no fucking way this guy who has millions of followers told you, only you to do something. Im so glad my parents dont care for religion. I respect and understand why people are religous but people that cross the line with it are awful.
Spagett+!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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eheathlooks what you guys did, you broke spagett
Shredit0My thoughts exactly. I had to go to a catholic middle school( parents thought it was a better education.) you would get in trouble for saying anything that is not "praising God" in their terms
Titus69Damn, I went to church youth group thing that was overnight with my friend and a few others in November, (his church is crazy religous) and a state trooper/church employee yelled at our bus for being innappropriate and went off on how "jesus and god are very real" and that the point of the night, which was full of things like lazer tag and bowling etc was to celebrate what jesus did for us and shit. Never going back, I finally realized those things are made so the church goers bring in new members. I was gonna lash out at the guy for trying to push religion on us guests but hes an aggressive ass guy and a state trooper...Plus a hot group of chicks were on the bus.
Shredit0word. thats what happened to us at the school. every activity or field trip was overrun by overly religious people who's every other sentence would be like a parable about the bible or some shit.
Titus69I mean thatll happen at a religous school but damn, screaming about religion to kids who may be skeptical about it isnt a way to influence them to attend your church, I just stuck to my beliefs and ignored the jerk. The other kids with me were with me when I said they were way to pushy on religion, they did it last year by starting the night off with some stupid movie about a guy who doesnt believe in god ends up saying he does right as he dies. Good thing we all wont even be here next year so I wont even have to deal with it.
Titus69Damn, I went to church youth group thing that was overnight with my friend and a few others in November, (his church is crazy religous) and a state trooper/church employee yelled at our bus for being innappropriate and went off on how "jesus and god are very real" and that the point of the night, which was full of things like lazer tag and bowling etc was to celebrate what jesus did for us and shit. Never going back, I finally realized those things are made so the church goers bring in new members. I was gonna lash out at the guy for trying to push religion on us guests but hes an aggressive ass guy and a state trooper...Plus a hot group of chicks were on the bus.
Shredit0kind of seems like at every religious school there is probably going to be something like this. I bet that movie touched the heart:)
BortySometimes those things are chill though. Was in one as a kid. Every year there was this big decent size event we went to after a hockey game. Free trip to hockey game, free ticket, ended up down on the ice racing an RC truck against some other guy and one the thing, then listened to a shitty devotional after the game for a half hour or so, then played laser tag and rollerbladed till like 5am.
There's some beer I heard about somewhere where they have really awesome beers. 2 beer limit but it's free. I figure you could probably sneak another couple and a few free beers and some music isn't that bad to get your sunday rolling.
If churches had free buffets I'd be tempted to come back to Jesus though.
Titus69My normal friends and I were like "what the fuck?" Then they gave us a sheet asking if it changed our views on Jesus and god and I answered no and it asked for a reason I said "he's fake ayy lmao"
californiagrownYeah, i probably wouldnt be stoked either if i busted my ass putting on an event meant to show how fun churchlife can be, and what a cool community that congregation has, and then some shithead kids started shitting all over it and had no intention of participating in good will.
Buddy, if you wanted to get all that fun stuff for free, the least you could do is have some fucking manners and respect what they believe. Damn.
e.moneydon't know if anyone has ever heard of the christian youth group called Young Life. That fucking shit is a cult. People who I have grown up with all of my life are now super religious after going to a handful of their meetings. Shits creepy man
e.moneyTold my parents that I no longer had faith in religion and they freaked out. They aren't even very religious. The only time we ever go to church is on Christmas.
californiagrownHow have they changed for the worse?
Gotta tell em sometime- hopefully it at least gets you out of going to church on Xmas and easter haha. They'll be fine. You didn't change at all and they'll come to realize it doesn't really matter as long as there kid is happy and healthy.
Nikolausim just hoping that humanity will see the foolishness of religion and cast it away once and for all
Spagett+Legit crying as I type this. Keyboard is soon going to be broken and waterlogged, soaked from my tears.
e.moneyI guess they really haven't changed for the worse. They're still my friends and that's all that matters. Just found it strange that they went 0-100 religiously once they started doing this.
Also, when it comes to religion, I'm more into the whole idea of being a good person and giving back to the community/those in need. I've drifted away from the whole worshipping a divine power who has our lives planned out for us. I explained this to them and it made things better.
Thanks for the insight man
Titus69Thats never gonna happen, there will always be forms of religion, sadly.
JustGoWithItWas it like this?
http://youtu.be/P8Aq00yJSxo
I doubt all religion will disappear before we do; however, in the coming generations I feel atheism will grow in prevalence in modern societies to the point where religious people will be the minority.
Nikolausim just hoping that humanity will see the foolishness of religion and cast it away once and for all
Titus69Exactly, modern day kids are definitely starting to care less and less for religion and I think it's from seeing the result of how crazy the extremely religious people can be
JustGoWithItThat and having access to more information on the internet. Ive always had doubts about my faith, however it wasn't untill I started listening to conversations and debates with people like Dawkins, Krauss, ect... Did I really start to reject religion.
e.moneydon't know if anyone has ever heard of the christian youth group called Young Life. That fucking shit is a cult. People who I have grown up with all of my life are now super religious after going to a handful of their meetings. Shits creepy man
Titus69My somewhat friend and his brother who are insanely religious use to try and force it on my brother and I back when I was in middle school. They always made fun of people who didn't believe in God and shit. I also just simply believe in science overall and don't really think some fucking man in the sky made everything. I'm fine with most religions but if you push your nonsense on me, I could go off.
Titus69I also just simply believe in science overall and don't really think some fucking man in the sky made everything.
californiagrownQuick question: what theory, other than God, is a more valid theory for how matter came into being?
eheathlooks what you guys did, you broke spagett
JustGoWithItPair production
californiagrownWhy?
Religon has given everyone i know, who is religious, a feeling of solace, community, and greater purpose. It has had absolutely no negative effect on them. Why do you want to take that away from them?
californiagrownQuick question: what theory, other than God, is a more valid theory for how matter came into being?
Titus69I was gonna lash out at the guy for trying to push religion on us guests
onenerdykidI think because they can have all of those positive things without believing in something on insufficient evidence. It's not that people want to take the positive things themselves away (solace, community, greater purpose, etc), it's that people would rather they find those same things through the better evidence that is widely & readily available to us. When people believe things on insufficient evidence and then make life decisions/rules of law/scientific claims on it, it isn't exactly the ultimate achievement of human existence. Why is it that believing things on insufficient evidence is ok in the realm of religion but in no other walk of life? If you went to work as an engineer and told your boss that you had a new idea for a certain project and the idea came to you in a dream through the voice of an angel, how long do you think your boss would continue to take you seriously? I seriously doubt he/she would let you work on any remotely consequential project, let alone lead other people in the project.
Believing things on insufficient evidence can lead to politicians to want to make certain rules that stifle scientific progress (i.e. seeking to ban the teaching of evolution in certain schools) or dramatically decrease the health of a certain society (i.e. believing that using condoms are a greater evil than helping to reduce the spread of AIDS in Africa). Beliefs have consequences and beliefs held on insufficient evidence will always be trumped by beliefs held on sufficient evidence.
Again, it's not that people want to take the positive things themselves away (solace, community, greater purpose, etc), it's that people would rather they find those same things through the better evidence that is widely & readily available to us.
Our knowledge is ultimately limited by our experience of the universe. If we cannot experience (be able to study/examine/subject to scientific inquiry) something, it will be impossible to possess actual knowledge of something. At this point we will only have belief, not knowledge. Now, some beliefs are founded on insufficient evidence but some are founded on sufficient evidence and I would think you would agree that something believed on sufficient evidence is better than something believed on insufficient evidence.
The concept of "God" by itself is not self-contradictory (as opposed to a square sphere or a married bachelor, which cannot and never will exist), and that means that God could very well exist. Could God then be the ultimate cause of the universe? Yes, God could. But what is the sufficient evidence for this to be true? That evidence does not yet exist. What else could be the ultimate cause of the universe? Another equally plausible (but not provable either) is that the universe was self-caused- the ultimate cause is so basic and so necessary that there is no cause before it and it therefore must have been caused by itself. Equally plausible, yet not provable. We cannot prove either of these questions because we (currently) cannot get to the point before it was all created and examine it.
Also, if you are going to ask the question of what caused the universe, you should also ask what caused God to exist? I think you will find the answer to be the same as the one above- God is so necessary that he caused himself. But again, that is merely belief and not knowledge.
californiagrownIf it is just as simple and easy to find all of the positives of religon in other things in life, why do people still choose religon? My parents belief isnt hurting you. There are countless scholars, scientists and doctors whose belief isnt holding back science or health. Why should they go searching for something they have already found- comfort, solace, community, sense of purpose, etc? Organized religon is a guide to each person's individual relationship with their god. They have to work out for themselves what is allegory and what is "fact". Unlike the basketball court, hate the player not game. Humans have free will- it isn't religon causing the bad things, its human will.
As for the last part, science fails just as wholey as religon in its attempt to explain "what started it all". So if that kid " believes" in science he's got some questioning to do.
onenerdykidTo your first question, easy- religion is much more widely offered as a form of moral education than a philosophical one, for example. There will simply be more religious people because it is more often taught. If we specifically look to ethics and people who are genuinely concerned about it, I think people would see that doing the right thing for its own sake is more praiseworthy and honest than doing the right thing because God will punish you in all of eternity if you don't do it or reward you in Heaven if you do do it. If anyone is genuinely concerned with ethics, they will see the latter to be void of actual ethical content. And if you (meaning people in general) don't want to be concerned with actual ethical content, that is of course your right. People, like you and your parents, are of course free to believe whatever you want. But I would think that if you are trying to find real answers to your questions then beliefs held on insufficient evidence will always be inferior and less fruitful to beliefs held on sufficient evidence.
While it is true that people are the masters of their will and therefore ultimately responsible for their actions, you would be greatly mistaken to say that religion doesn't put certain idiotic beliefs in people's heads and encourages (command!) them to behave in certain idiotic ways- the "game" itself is to blame here. If the game tells me that the townspeople should stone a woman to death on her father's doorstep for being found to not be a virgin on her wedding night, or that if anyone who leaves the faith should be killed immediately, then I think we are more than right to question the integrity of the game itself. In these respects there is no player who can play that game the right way. So yes, it is much of the time, a question of the game, not the player.
Thirdly, I most definitely agree with you that science has not answered all of our questions yet. There are a great deal of mysteries to be unraveled but if history is to be any indicator here, it is only a matter of time (who knows how long) until they are figured out. Perhaps not all, who knows? But again, in these matters it will also be better to hold beliefs that are based on sufficient evidence.
californiagrownPeople "do the right thing" because it feels right. In other words it is people's conscience that guides their decisions.
To many religious folks (including how I was taught), your conscience is a part of your personal relationship with God. Of course the church helps to guide your morals, but the overriding factor in decision making is the inner conversation between yourself and your conscience (God's word).
It just seems like you are trying to get rid of something that people enjoy for no other reason than you disagree and because you think its inefficient. Again, how is my parents' or any member of their church's congregation beliefs hurting you or this world. As far as I can see, its just helping.
Hate the player, not the game.
As for the science hasn't explained everything's totally. But I, along with the rest of the scientific community think its fun to theorize about things we cannot experiment on. It just bugs me when people shoot down the possible existence of God as simply not possible, when there hasn't ever been a more likely theory proposed as to the start of matter. The existence of a God in some form is a scientific possibility... However small.
Folks who are 100% certain one way or another annoy me. At least the church teaches doubt is natural. In my experience athiests tend to be certain and condescending.
californiagrownIt just seems like you are trying to get rid of something that people enjoy for no other reason than you disagree and because you think its inefficient. Again, how is my parents' or any member of their church's congregation beliefs hurting you or this world. As far as I can see, its just helping.
Hate the player, not the game.
As for the science hasn't explained everything's totally. But I, along with the rest of the scientific community think its fun to theorize about things we cannot experiment on. It just bugs me when people shoot down the possible existence of God as simply not possible, when there hasn't ever been a more likely theory proposed as to the start of matter. The existence of a God in some form is a scientific possibility... However small.
Folks who are 100% certain one way or another annoy me. At least the church teaches doubt is natural. In my experience athiests tend to be certain and condescending.
JustGoWithItThere actually is a very clear understanding of the origin of matter. Space-time is a different story. There is no way to disprove God, however, that is not how science works. I could claim the Flying Spaghetti Monster exists and that he has Devine intervention and you couldnt disprove it. Would anyone look at that as a logical explanation to the nature of reality though? No.
californiagrownHow did matter come into being?
JustGoWithItI already said, through Pair Production which occurred very early after the big bang to produce hydrogen. I assume you have heard about Einstine's famous equation E=mc^2? It basically states that matter and energy are one in the same. There are a lot of great videos explaining it on YouTube.
californiagrownDo you understand the theory? If you do, I'd love to hear a dumbed down explanation as to how matter, as a singular thing, came into existence.
californiagrownAnd by matter I mean any namable particle of light, energy, sausage, or strawberry.
JustGoWithItOh you're asking where everything came from, not just matter itself.
Here is a good explanation.
This is a copy and paste so all credit to
Harvard.edu
The "inflationary universe."
The leading idea is called the "inflationary universe" model. The key assumption of this model is that just before the Big Bang, space was filled with an unstable form of energy, whose nature is not yet known. At some instant, this energy was transformed into the fundamental particles from which arose all the matter we observe today. That instant marks what we call the Big Bang.
A remarkable consequence of this model is that, if even a pinpoint of space contained this primordial form of energy, then the pinpoint of space would expand extremely rapidly and would bring into existence more of the same kind of energy. In fact, all the matter in the universe could have arisen from a bit of primordial energy weighing no more than a pea. This amazing scenario is a consequence of applying Einstein's theory of gravity to the inflationary universe model. Thus the known laws of nature can in principle explain where the matter and energy in the universe came from, provided there was at least a tiny seed of energy to begin with.
A model is useful only if it makes predictions that can be tested with evidence. The inflation model makes several testable predictions. One of the most important is that the primordial energy would have been "lumpy" - i.e., unevenly spread out in space - due to a kind of quantum noise that arose when the universe was extremely small. This pattern would have been transferred to the particles that burst into existence during the Big Bang. As a result, the matter that filled the universe then would not have been uniformly spread out; some regions would have slightly more matter, some slightly less. This lumpiness of the baby universe is fortunate for us: Had the universe been uniformly filled with matter, then stars and planets would never have formed. We wouldn't be here.
californiagrownSo there have been no attempts to explain where, how, and what "the beginning" was? Outside of religon, that is.
