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onenerdykidNot exactly like K2, but close. While Lange's boots do have tech inserts directly in the shell, the soles are WTR not Alpine ISO/DIN and (as pictured) will not work in true alpine bindings. As pictured, they will need to work with WTR, MNC, or touring bindings.
Also, isn't there already a 16/17 thread started?
.MASSHOLE.I didn't see it, not that I looked too hard for it.
I assume you have gotten your hands on them then. Are they basically their XT with tech soles then?
Interesting choice if they did.
onenerdykidHaven't had my hands on them yet and only seen them from this picture. Lange just launched the updated XT last year, so I don't think there are any real mold changes beside the tech insert update.
.MASSHOLE.Odd given that there are better AT boots out there in terms of downhill and uphill performance.
KyleAWhat tech boot would you say offers better downhill performance than an XT 130?
MartianManI always thought the K2 idea was genius. Is there truly a downside to putting tech inserts onto Alpine DIN soles? Seems like it loses almost no performance and opens up a ton of options. Why don't all companies stick inserts on boots that have big mtn/sidecountry features? (i.e. Dalbello Lupo, Salomon Quest Max)
cobra_commanderIt does not meat ISO 5355.
Rossi does not currently indemnify their bindings to work with K2 boots with the tech insert. Marker does, not sure if Amer does.
It also costs money and pushes the cost of the boot up. If you are using a tech binding why not just swap soles and use a rocker sole that walks better with improved traction? K2 released a rocker rubber sole for the Pinnacle this year.
tomPietrowskiNo one wants to swap soles all the time though. The k2 just works. I love the fact I can take those boots out and ride any possible binding without changing anything.
cobra_commandersure, and you save 5 minutes to get a boot that doesn't scramble or walk near as well. It takes a lot more time to wax and tune that second ski every five-ten days you ski it.
MartianManI always thought the K2 idea was genius. Is there truly a downside to putting tech inserts onto Alpine DIN soles? Seems like it loses almost no performance and opens up a ton of options
cobra_commanderIt does not meat ISO 5355.
onenerdykidEmphasis on the meat. According to Alpine ISO 5355, you cannot have any interference on the surface of the boot's interface to the binding. So, on paper, tech inserts violate this. From there, it just depends on how much of a legal risk a brand wants to take. Brands have always known this, which is why they have gone with the Touring ISO 9523 or WTR or swappable norm grip pads.
tomPietrowskiWhat is the actuall issue with having the inserts out of interest. I get they are changing the surface but is it a strength issue or more of one that it could potentially catch or somthing. And how is it differnt then say a wtr sole with inserts whic could still be used in a warden for example. Just interested and figure you're the man to ask.
onenerdykidIt's just the rules of the Alpine norm and such restrictions are not present in the Touring norm or WTR norm. Providing a safe, consistent release is the main goal of the TÜV (the norm testing organization) and the norm is incredibly strict and detailed in regards to what you can and can't do.
cobra_commanderLast update was 2005 I believe, before that 1997.
I doubt they will change it. Amer, Rossi, and whomever else they can get on board (Marker{Dalbello} comes to mind) will likely attempt to work with TUV to create a new standard (using WTR as a guide). TUV can then test new bindings and boots against that standard.
Or they could change it, but that would be complex with the push for a non horizontal boot sole surface.
tomPietrowskiYeah will be interesting to see what happens in the coming years. I would like to know more about the TUV thoughts on tech inserts as although on paper its not allowed I really had no issues what so ever using many different bindings.
onenerdykidThe short answer is that there is currently no norm for tech insert shape or design- almost every boot company has their own unique shape. This means that there could be a tech insert in a boot that does not agree with the alpine binding in some way (for example, the tech insert could get hung up on the little rollers in the toe piece during a lateral release).
.MASSHOLE.Do you think there ever will be a norm?
onenerdykidI hope so. It would definitely make things easier.
tomPietrowskianalpine
tomPietrowskiAs brands can you guys ever have any kind of power in this respect. For example (and I realize it's not likely) but say you guys, salomon, Rossi, k2 etc all came together and created analpine sole with inserts you were all happy with, could you then have some pressure over TUV to consider changes or are you more pressured to not go outside what the TUV want.
onenerdykidI hope so. It would definitely make things easier.
.MASSHOLE.Anything cool in the pipeline that you have been hearing rumors about and want hint to us?
onenerdykidThere might be a new alpine boot from us that you might be interested in :)
w_skierso the other day someone posted a picture of some camo and yellow full tilts which a rep supposedly showed them that are the new Tom Wallisch pro model.
I was skeptical after that nike ski boots thread a while back but the thread appears to be deleted soooooo...
tomPietrowskihttps://www.newschoolers.com/news/read/What-Full-Tilt#PLxuVBWP0yBVUQbY.97
Line_SkisWe're making new skis! Shiny colors and all!
Line_SkisWe're making new skis! Shiny colors and all!
GhiniRossi will stop selling rebranded Look bindings... So less FKS color choices for those who color match all their gear...... Hurray!
GhiniRossi will stop selling rebranded Look bindings... So less FKS color choices for those who color match all their gear...... Hurray!
Line_SkisWe're making new skis! Shiny colors and all!
.MASSHOLE.Interesting, where did you see this?
GhiniHeard on ISPO..
.MASSHOLE.Too bad. I wonder if Rossi will just put all their athletes on Look bindings then.
gapersarefriendsin the BLACK & WHITE edit from stubai that was just posted, are the guys riding new atomic park skis?
gapersarefriendsin the BLACK & WHITE edit from stubai that was just posted, are the guys riding new atomic park skis?
.MASSHOLE.Grab a screen shot and post it here. I bet OneNerdyKid can confirm or deny
gapersarefriendsin the BLACK & WHITE edit from stubai that was just posted, are the guys riding new atomic park skis?
Carl_the_LlamaPretty sure it's just a custom ski graphic maker promo-thing that Atomic is doing. Europe only atm if if I'm not mistaken.
tomPietrowskiArcteryx are making a tourin boot aparently. Any amer boot designers able to fill us in with some details?
.MASSHOLE.WHAT?
Their own or just a rebrand from another Amer sports company?
cobra_commandernot an arcteryx boot designer, but can fill you in. It will walk a little 'differently' than other tech boots on the market.
