It looks like you are using an ad blocker. That's okay. Who doesn't? But without advertising revenue, we can't keep making this site awesome. Click the link below for instructions on disabling adblock.
Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post.
Register to become a member today!
PmooreLookin like some sort of new trekker alternative! Long live FKS for the downhill
Oh man someone finally got to it. Last year I was looking for someone to do injection moulding to make toes and heels, basically the base of a trekker frame to stack a dynafit toe on. I thought about machining a prototype but I didn't have plastic block big enough.
Looks like they're using the Dynafit/Pierre toe as well which is sick:
The idea has been out for a while though, because when I was searching up to see if that combo had been made before and someone on TGR had proposed it with a janky MS paint cut and paste job. I'll see if I can dig it up.
For anyone who doesn't get what's going on in the photo above (which is trying to be sneaky and secretive) it's basically this:
That is the janky photo I was talking about. Way better than Trekkers, way better than CAST, way better than any AT frame binding. On the downhill you have your pure ski and binding interface, on the way up you have a nice simple system that's easy to install and remove, and if you do somehow get fucking rowdy it will release and your brakes will work (no voile straps turning your ski into a torpedo).
If for some reason it isn't as I've described then they've fucked up.
NinetyFourFor anyone who doesn't get what's going on in the photo above (which is trying to be sneaky and secretive) it's basically this:
That is the janky photo I was talking about. Way better than Trekkers, way better than CAST, way better than any AT frame binding. On the downhill you have your pure ski and binding interface, on the way up you have a nice simple system that's easy to install and remove, and if you do somehow get fucking rowdy it will release and your brakes will work (no voile straps turning your ski into a torpedo).
If for some reason it isn't as I've described then they've fucked up.
Thats exactly what it is, just keeping it secretive cause they are still early in testing
PmooreThats exactly what it is, just keeping it secretive cause they are still early in testing
Aha yeah, I'm good calling it out because I have no idea who is behind that. I'll admit that I'm also super jaded on a lot of 'secret' hiding the ski industry does when it produces very little in the ways of innovation.
Dude, nice! Now I don't want you guys to feel obligated in anyway but like damn, I feel like this thing is in good hands. Most others who would tease anything would just let it float on and then keep it bottled away somewhere. That's where I feel jaded. I hate the fact that there's supposedly boatloads of things to be privy about but they never see the surface. I have a feeling this won't fall into that category.
NinetyFourOh man someone finally got to it. Last year I was looking for someone to do injection moulding to make toes and heels, basically the base of a trekker frame to stack a dynafit toe on. I thought about machining a prototype but I didn't have plastic block big enough.
Looks like they're using the Dynafit/Pierre toe as well which is sick:
The idea has been out for a while though, because when I was searching up to see if that combo had been made before and someone on TGR had proposed it with a janky MS paint cut and paste job. I'll see if I can dig it up.
That looks pretty sweet. Any idea how the toe piece is removed for downhill? Also, are the FKS ISO certified for touring boots? I know the CAST system promotes use of the FKS as well so I'm guess so?
iLLbiLLyThat looks pretty sweet. Any idea how the toe piece is removed for downhill? Also, are the FKS ISO certified for touring boots? I know the CAST system promotes use of the FKS as well so I'm guess so?
Currently, the only boot you can use out of the box with the cast system is the K2 Pinnacle. Otherwise you have to get tech inserts put in your alpine boot toes. I imagine in the next year or two we will start seeing an option on some boots with swappable soles to have tech fittings and no rocker to accommodate systems like the SI&I.
iLLbiLLyohhh nvm i see. Its mounted same as the daywreckers.
Which is going to be super sick though. That opens up a broad range of boots and bindings that can be used. The only drawback is that it will be slightly heavier than touring with normal Dynafits, but it's still lighter than lifting the heelpiece of a frame binding with each step. Probably similar to touring with Beasts. Skiing down though it will be pure heaven.
The number of people who actually need FKS for the things they are touring to is tiny. If you're Sam Anthamattan, rocketing down 30m ice patches at speeds that put the Millennium Falcon to shame, ok. Sure. I get it. But everyone else should look at Ions or Radical 2s or Beasts and pipe down.
I continually find it amazing that people are really interested in making products for this category. In this instance, you need a tech compatible toe, but DIN certified sole, which seems a hard combo to find (most sole blocks don't work that way, if I am thinking through correctly). Same problem with the CAST system.
Peoples' eyes seem a lot bigger than their dicks with most of these systems.
LiteratureThe number of people who actually need FKS for the things they are touring to is tiny. If you're Sam Anthamattan, rocketing down 30m ice patches at speeds that put the Millennium Falcon to shame, ok. Sure. I get it. But everyone else should look at Ions or Radical 2s or Beasts and pipe down.
I continually find it amazing that people are really interested in making products for this category. In this instance, you need a tech compatible toe, but DIN certified sole, which seems a hard combo to find (most sole blocks don't work that way, if I am thinking through correctly). Same problem with the CAST system.
Peoples' eyes seem a lot bigger than their dicks with most of these systems.
I feel you on that for sure. I was skeptical of Dynafits for years, but have never really had any issues since I started using them. There is most definitely a place for Trekkers and any future alternatives though. I'm never hitting a jump on Dynafits, nor am I doing anything switch. Sure you can lockout the toe, but how many heel pieces have broken off Radicals over the years? Even on the newer "fixed" version. Also, for the people touring a handful of times a year, dropping $2000 on a tech setup is pretty crazy when you can get something that lets you use your existing, reliable gear for a fraction of the cost.
KyleAI feel you on that for sure. I was skeptical of Dynafits for years, but have never really had any issues since I started using them. There is most definitely a place for Trekkers and any future alternatives though. I'm never hitting a jump on Dynafits, nor am I doing anything switch. Sure you can lockout the toe, but how many heel pieces have broken off Radicals over the years? Even on the newer "fixed" version. Also, for the people touring a handful of times a year, dropping $2000 on a tech setup is pretty crazy when you can get something that lets you use your existing, reliable gear for a fraction of the cost.
I'll be the first to admit they aren't perfect: blew up three Dynafit heels last winter (two Speed Radical, one Radical FT), mostly because I was pushing them too hard. I've since dialed back on my Speeds, and plan to upgrade to either Rad 2s or Beast 14s for my more sendy pow touring setup.
For what I have heard about the new bindings a brand are working on it will kill this whole cast style idea. I can't say anything but watch out for some exciting changes in how touring bindings are both considered and produced.
PmooreLookin like some sort of new trekker alternative! Long live FKS for the downhill
Yeh! Equally stoked and disappointed on this.
Looks real slick, and just what I've been looking for. But I had also been at the stage of sending parts to print for my own diy job. These are looking expensive so maybe I'll crack on with a homebrew pair.
cobra_commanderI wonder how well this skied down, given the boot and binding pictured.
I just assumed it was removable but now that you mention it. It does look like its part of the actual binding mount. Im so interested, how dare they taunt me !
tomPietrowskiFor what I have heard about the new bindings a brand are working on it will kill this whole cast style idea. I can't say anything but watch out for some exciting changes in how touring bindings are both considered and produced.
tomPietrowskiFor what I have heard about the new bindings a brand are working on it will kill this whole cast style idea. I can't say anything but watch out for some exciting changes in how touring bindings are both considered and produced.
I just cannot see that happening. There will always be a group of people who simply wont sacrifice any amount of downhill performance meaning FKS are the ONLY option. On atleast one of their setups anyways.
Sure I am all about a lighter setup for mellower days but I just dont see any binding being good enough to please both people charging and hitting jumps as well as the lightweight tech crowd because anything either frame or tech at this point is miles away from being good enough to hit jumps on comfortably for me.
That being said I would love to see what you are speaking of because it may be a better option then currently is available for mellow backcountry pow days but I am skeptical that it will be anything in the form of a groundbreaking new product.
PmooreI just cannot see that happening. There will always be a group of people who simply wont sacrifice any amount of downhill performance meaning FKS are the ONLY option. On atleast one of their setups anyways.
Sure I am all about a lighter setup for mellower days but I just dont see any binding being good enough to please both people charging and hitting jumps as well as the lightweight tech crowd because anything either frame or tech at this point is miles away from being good enough to hit jumps on comfortably for me.
That being said I would love to see what you are speaking of because it may be a better option then currently is available for mellow backcountry pow days but I am skeptical that it will be anything in the form of a groundbreaking new product.
Hopefully you guys get to see them at ispo (I have not seen them so I'm really interested too) but it may be the ispo after.
from what I know it is a very cool concept and once you think about it it's like oh yeah that makes total sense. Let's hope it works.
tomPietrowskiHopefully you guys get to see them at ispo (I have not seen them so I'm really interested too) .
I wouldn't get too carried away. There are a lot of products that I get told about that 'are game changers' and will be available to test 'latter this season' that never go anywhere.
leaves it to kitty cats to build a better mousetraps
stopped by to peak at em
much lighter much lower stack height and way easier adjustments
i'm not sure other than a cast modified boot why if you had a tech fittings ya wouldn't
just ski a high din tech binder
but ive never ridden the dildos or get the infatuation
used daywreckers for a season or so
till them og frischi damirs came across the pond in the late nineties
changed the game
now they're dinosaurs
SFBv420.0leaves it to kitty cats to build a better mousetraps
stopped by to peak at em
much lighter much lower stack height and way easier adjustments
i'm not sure other than a cast modified boot why if you had a tech fittings ya wouldn't
just ski a high din tech binder
but ive never ridden the dildos or get the infatuation
used daywreckers for a season or so
till them og frischi damirs came across the pond in the late nineties
changed the game
now they're dinosaurs
Are they carbon fibre? They look like they are, and if thats the case, I cannot imagine they're too cheap.
SFBv420.0leaves it to kitty cats to build a better mousetraps
stopped by to peak at em
much lighter much lower stack height and way easier adjustments
i'm not sure other than a cast modified boot why if you had a tech fittings ya wouldn't
just ski a high din tech binder
but ive never ridden the dildos or get the infatuation
used daywreckers for a season or so
till them og frischi damirs came across the pond in the late nineties
changed the game
now they're dinosaurs
this is on point.
I think they could be a good option for those crazy whippersnappers who like to ski and land backwards. Not a lot of tech, or even touring bindings that I would want to put those forces on.
PmooreI just cannot see that happening. There will always be a group of people who simply wont sacrifice any amount of downhill performance meaning FKS are the ONLY option. On atleast one of their setups anyways.
Sure I am all about a lighter setup for mellower days but I just dont see any binding being good enough to please both people charging and hitting jumps as well as the lightweight tech crowd because anything either frame or tech at this point is miles away from being good enough to hit jumps on comfortably for me.
That being said I would love to see what you are speaking of because it may be a better option then currently is available for mellow backcountry pow days but I am skeptical that it will be anything in the form of a groundbreaking new product.
Some of the frame bindings out there are rock solid. I don't have experience with any besides Dukes, but those are super solid. I've beaten the shit out of those and they've held up as well as looks and jester pros.
Has anyone heard any rumors about a BD Jetforce bag 2.0? I'm debating on pulling the trigger on the current model, or waiting for the next model. I'd be way bummed to get the current version, and then find out they're coming out with a new one next month.
cobra_commanderI wouldn't get the current jet force unless you are sold on the technology being superior.
It's heavy as fuck
It's expensive as fuck
It's unproven as fuck
Yeah, weight is my biggest concern, luckily, my approaches are limited to less than a few hours, and the majority are off resort tours. I don't have any multi-day trips where weight would be a real issue. I'd assume that V2.0 is going to be lighter.
I'm not too concerned about price, since I'm fortunate enough to be able to get pro-form pricing.
And as far as unproven, the entire airbag genre is statistically unproven, but I do believe that the Jetforce technology is a fantastic direction that it is heading.
While Germans are known for their engineering, they are not known for their poetic creativity, or sarcasm for that matter. Binding in German is Bindung and this is a combination of pin + Bindung. While semi-clever in German, it's a facepalm for the rest of the world.
LiteratureThe number of people who actually need FKS for the things they are touring to is tiny. If you're Sam Anthamattan, rocketing down 30m ice patches at speeds that put the Millennium Falcon to shame, ok. Sure. I get it. But everyone else should look at Ions or Radical 2s or Beasts and pipe down.
I continually find it amazing that people are really interested in making products for this category. In this instance, you need a tech compatible toe, but DIN certified sole, which seems a hard combo to find (most sole blocks don't work that way, if I am thinking through correctly). Same problem with the CAST system.
.
man ive been preaching this for years now. I am down with the whole dynaift on the up and fks on the down but that doesnt solve the boot issue. You are still trapped with purchasing a tech boot and the technology in bindings has caught up substantially so the need for these systems is irrelavent. what we need are more boots being designed for freeride/touring capabilities and for them to be good at both.
Arc'teryxs airbag is coming next year. 2000 pieces only worldwide. Similar to Jetforce, more expensive offcourse. Heard some impressive details today and it has some nice features.
Since we want a few in our shop I'll say no more.
ChasingFlakesThis is interesting. great name, i think this could do well, addressed the trekker issues whats it weigh?
Thanks! Weight is on par with trekkers now, we are finalizing the design for manufacturing and will be doing quite a bit of finite element analysis to maximize weight reduction of the cut out designs, should be able to bring it down a good deal more as we refine it! They are alot more compact than trekkers and are massively stiffer.
CTDThanks! Weight is on par with trekkers now, we are finalizing the design for manufacturing and will be doing quite a bit of finite element analysis to maximize weight reduction of the cut out designs, should be able to bring it down a good deal more as we refine it! They are alot more compact than trekkers and are massively stiffer.
My thoughts exactly. Lot's of improvements on the day wrekker! Best of luck.
