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The Whole Gun Debate Deal

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theabortionator
Posts: 51666 - Karma: 162,558
So people post all these memes, articles, and whatever about how they need guns to protect themselves against the government and what not.

Saw one that said "I don't need a gun or want a gun, but I have a gun and if the government ever says I can't that's when I'll need a gun" or something like that. It's a nice sentiment, the old cowboy standing up to the evil lawman to take back the town kind of deal.

At the same time, when the fuck is anyone ever going stand up to the government with their guns? I'm not saying they should or shouldn't just that it's something I can't really see happening. At the same time they're bitching about how they need guns to protect their freedoms, they're voting/supporting the people who are oppressing them and stripping them of the freedoms that they supposedly need guns to protect.

If you can't even stand up to the government with a ballot, you sure as fuck aren't going to do anything constructive with your guns.

Just sayin


Sparknotes: guns are bad mmmkay
Jun 24 2015 3:53AM
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onenerdykid
Posts: 6660 - Karma: 10,905
This should be good.https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/773698/Jim-Jefferies---US-Gun-Control---Live-Stand-Up-Comedy---Best-comedian-ever-2015
Jun 24 2015 3:59AM
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bostonbomber
Posts: 19 - Karma: 25
Jun 24 2015 7:31AM
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987321654hgfd
Posts: 5133 - Karma: 5,447
bostonbomber


lol

Anyway, there are so many idiots on both sides of the gun argument. I'm pretty pro-gun, but some of the things I see people say and post for guns is retarded. Most of these fat rednecks couldn't even get their ass off the couch if a revolution started.
Jun 24 2015 8:11AM
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Huck_Norris
Posts: 11487 - Karma: 18,627
This isn't a blatant attempt to stave off boredom at all. Nope, nothing to see here!
Jun 24 2015 8:23AM
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JGWI
Posts: 2842 - Karma: 7,812
I bet this thread makes it to 10 pages.

This idea that guns are needed to overthrow the government is nothing more than attempt to rationalize the necessity of guns. inb4 I get called anti gun I will say that I personally own four. I don't own any "assault" weapons but I do understand why people do. On the other side of things I do not like hardly any of the legislation being proposed to try to help 'curve' gun violence. Background checks I am 100% supportive of. Any hardware ban I feel is just plain stupid. As someone who tends to lean to the Liberal side I shake my head and ask how people can logically think any of that is going to work. Personally I feel it is just a way to shut the public up. I honestly wish the United States would follow Canada's model but throw out the stupid bans or classes on weapons as well as the whole ATT thing. If people would start looking at this logically and throw out the emotional aspect I feel this debate would be over quick. The fact that children died at Sandy Hook as opposed to a bunch of prisoners is irelivant. And using parents as poster boys to advocate gun control is only creating more of a problem rather than solving anything.

Wow I really jumped around there.
Jun 24 2015 8:25AM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
How many dead horses are we beating now on the first page?
Jun 24 2015 8:32AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
JAHpowHow many dead horses are we beating now on the first page?


I am going to add a "gay rights" and a "marijuana legalization" thread to beat more ponies
Jun 24 2015 8:49AM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
louie.miragsI am going to add a "gay rights" and a "marijuana legalization" thread to beat more ponies


Don't forget abortion!
Jun 24 2015 9:08AM
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theBearJew
Posts: 10951 - Karma: 15,633
louie.miragsI am going to add a "gay rights" and a "marijuana legalization" thread to beat more ponies


McDonald's workers deserve $15/hr!! The confederate flag is bad and racist!!
Jun 24 2015 9:15AM
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S.J.W
Posts: 7609 - Karma: 31,185
Damn this horse has been beaten more times than SFB as a child.
Jun 24 2015 9:17AM
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Barefootin_Fiend
Posts: 7618 - Karma: 4,727
S.J.WDamn this horse has been beaten more times than SFB as a child.


"This horse has been beaten more times than my dick" would have been a pretty good one to use, too.
Jun 24 2015 9:39AM
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.Hugo.
Posts: 17360 - Karma: 28,485
S.J.WDamn this horse has been beaten more times than SFB as a child.


Making a joke about child abuse.... wow
Jun 24 2015 9:46AM
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hishighnesss
Posts: 149 - Karma: -50
are you fucking kidding me?

do you know how many times this fucking thread has been made

what do you mean by debate? you honestly expect a someone on this site to give you a decent opinion, its a bunch of uneducated 16 year old on here. i really do not understand the purpose of this, unless you like the hear dumb fucking opinions
Jun 24 2015 10:50AM
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Charlie*
Posts: 198 - Karma: 579
hishighnesssare you fucking kidding me?

do you know how many times this fucking thread has been made

what do you mean by debate? you honestly expect a someone on this site to give you a decent opinion, its a bunch of uneducated 16 year old on here. i really do not understand the purpose of this, unless you like the hear dumb fucking opinions


...you joined NS 5 days ago. Chill out
Jun 24 2015 10:58AM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22708 - Karma: 76,635
I mean realistically Americans just need better weapons.

So amend the constitution to make it the right to bear drones armed with nukes instead of just guns. Fucking send it.
Jun 24 2015 11:11AM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,687
Mr.BishopI mean realistically Americans just need better weapons.

So amend the constitution to make it the right to bear drones armed with nukes instead of just guns. Fucking send it.


Na, some 14 year old with a blackberry could hijack it.
Jun 24 2015 11:28AM
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purplepants420
Posts: 343 - Karma: 884
Americans just want to keep their guns because it's been on the bill of rights ever since America became an independent country. They think that if they lose their guns, they won't have any control over the government. What rights will they strip from us next? Something I heard my dad say when he found out about this whole matter.
Jun 24 2015 11:29AM
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B.Snow
Posts: 1859 - Karma: 92
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkXchv55Vao
Jun 24 2015 12:43PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37398 - Karma: 120,260
have your guns, that's fine. but I really feel like the average small town militia group wouldn't stand any chance against our own Military and their tactics. we'd simply get slaughtered and they would have no problem with it at all.
Jun 24 2015 1:03PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
DeebieSkeebieshave your guns, that's fine. but I really feel like the average small town militia group wouldn't stand any chance against our own Military and their tactics. we'd simply get slaughtered and they would have no problem with it at all.


small town militias in Afghanistan stood a chance against the US army. I mean it may have been because they hid in schools and hospitals and such and knew the terrain far better and had the help of all the locals, but they still stood a chance.
Jun 24 2015 1:08PM
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OregonDead
Posts: 6899 - Karma: 24,605
Mr.BishopI mean realistically Americans just need better weapons.

So amend the constitution to make it the right to bear drones armed with nukes instead of just guns. Fucking send it.


I think that was the intent of the original bill. For the people to have equivalent weapons. The way technology trickles down the whole drone thing may be a great equalizer or maybe just the beginning of the end of time.
Jun 24 2015 1:14PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
^Lol no they didn't. That was not a civilian milita. It also wasn't on home soil. Any attempt to resist the US Government at this point by any concept of a "well armed militia" would be sort of like an elementary school basketball team suiting up against the Warriors.
Jun 24 2015 1:14PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37398 - Karma: 120,260
VinnieFsmall town militias in Afghanistan stood a chance against the US army. I mean it may have been because they hid in schools and hospitals and such and knew the terrain far better and had the help of all the locals, but they still stood a chance.


true, but you look at some of these groups and they are all just dipshits that own guns, im sure there are ex-military guys that have banded up, but I also feel like the average American definitely wouldn't be as smart as say the Vietnamese people were or the insurgency in the middle east we've been fucking with for ever now.

its more fucked up that people are considering the thought of a civil war in this country, regardless of what its for. its fucking 2015, why is this even a slight possibility, you know?
Jun 24 2015 1:15PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
J.D.^Lol no they didn't. That was not a civilian milita. It also wasn't on home soil. Any attempt to resist the US Government at this point by any concept of a "well armed militia" would be sort of like an elementary school basketball team suiting up against the Warriors.


lol yes they did. If they didn't stand a chance the war in Afghanistan would have been over in a couple years. We're on 14 years now. It's still not over. Will it ever even end in a victory? Probably not.

Also I wasn't specifying civilian or not and I wasn't specifying whose territory.
Jun 24 2015 1:23PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
I guess 'militia' might not be the best word for who they've been fighting in Afghanistan though.
Jun 24 2015 1:26PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37398 - Karma: 120,260
VinnieFI guess 'militia' might not be the best word for who they've been fighting in Afghanistan though.


oh without a doubt, i feel like the same could be said about the rebel forces fighting against assads army in Syria, too. those dudes make some fucking crafty artillery pieces.
Jun 24 2015 1:28PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
J.D.^Lol no they didn't. That was not a civilian milita. It also wasn't on home soil. Any attempt to resist the US Government at this point by any concept of a "well armed militia" would be sort of like an elementary school basketball team suiting up against the Warriors.


Kinda like ISIS being the JV team...

;)

But suppose people in the military thought the government was wrong and joined the "militia"?
Jun 24 2015 1:33PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
VinnieFAlso I wasn't specifying civilian or not and I wasn't specifying whose territory.

Then wtf was the point of your post if you're admitting there's no resemblance?
Jun 24 2015 1:43PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
JAHpowBut suppose people in the military thought the government was wrong and joined the "militia"?

At that point it's no longer a populist uprising, it's a military coup, and the civilian portion of the rebellion is basically superfluous.
Jun 24 2015 1:44PM
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987321654hgfd
Posts: 5133 - Karma: 5,447
VinnieFlol yes they did. If they didn't stand a chance the war in Afghanistan would have been over in a couple years.

/QUOTE]

No, they wouldn't stand a chance. The entire war we have not come even close to flexing all of our power. If our goal was to wipe Afghanistan off the map it would've happened within the first month.

Look at the first Gulf War. The coalition forces mopped up Saddam's army in 3 days after a less than a month of air strikes.
Jun 24 2015 1:46PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
J.D.Then wtf was the point of your post if you're admitting there's no resemblance?


point being that militia have and can stand a chance against the US military. The resemblance being they are both militia. It is very relevant.
Jun 24 2015 1:48PM
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hishighnesss
Posts: 149 - Karma: -50
this is sure some high quality intellectual debate
Jun 24 2015 1:59PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
The whole question was whether a militia of U.S. civilians could stand a chance against the US Army if they chose to resist the govenrment! You then draw a comparison to a trained militia halfway around the world? How is that at all analogous? They're completely different scenarios, but the participants technically fall under the same broad category of type of fighter? You're just making arguments for the sake of it.
Jun 24 2015 2:02PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
J.D.You're just making arguments for the sake of it.


pretty much what 1/3 of my posts on NS are from

I found I learn more in 90 minutes of arguing over the internet than I did in 90 minutes of class time. Plus if I'm going to be sitting on a computer anyways I might as well do something entertaining and educational.
Jun 24 2015 2:08PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
Well, fuck, that's good to know; I couldn't tell if you actually agreed with what you were typing... in the future I'll avoid wasting my time.
Jun 24 2015 2:10PM
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corona
Posts: 12797 - Karma: 32,757
J.D.Well, fuck, that's good to know; I couldn't tell if you actually agreed with what you were typing... in the future I'll avoid wasting my time.


nooo. there's nobody else on this site who can make me feel dumb (no homo). It actually makes me look up so much stuff to try and put together arguments and regardless of the side I'm arguing for I end up learning a lot.
Jun 24 2015 2:19PM
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YoungGun.
Posts: 267 - Karma: 562
I don't want guns to protect me from the government. I want guns to go hunting and shoot targets. I also live in a very rural area so I don't know why that is a problem.

I just bought a Glock 19.That shit is FUN.
Jun 24 2015 3:08PM
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SKI.ING
Posts: 2695 - Karma: 2,535
Lol

Jun 24 2015 3:49PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
Mr.Bishopbear drones




I like it
Jun 24 2015 4:41PM
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270on420out
Posts: 7508 - Karma: 51,058
Charlie*...you joined NS 5 days ago. Chill out


Ah you see that member is Actuallyisdolan. Got permabanned like 2-3 years ago, but has lived on through many aliases.
Jun 24 2015 5:12PM
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Barefootin_Fiend
Posts: 7618 - Karma: 4,727
THEDIRTYBUBBLEAh you see that member is Actuallyisdolan. Got permabanned like 2-3 years ago, but has lived on through many aliases.


idk....dolan had a totally different style. i don't think it's him.
Jun 24 2015 5:24PM
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Kreech
Posts: 4178 - Karma: 3,024
onenerdykidThis should be good.https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/773698/Jim-Jefferies---US-Gun-Control---Live-Stand-Up-Comedy---Best-comedian-ever-2015


Came here specifically to post this. That guy is amazing
Jun 24 2015 8:45PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
Of course we don't need to ban guns, but at the same time we can not just willy-nilly give anyone who's not doesn't have a criminal record a gun. You need to be a bit stricter before saying here you go. I really don't think that's an unreasonable stand but I know pro gun people freaked out when I say it.
Jun 24 2015 9:20PM
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.frenchy
Posts: 18221 - Karma: 12,323
dont tread on me bitch
Jun 24 2015 9:37PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
nocturnalOf course we don't need to ban guns, but at the same time we can not just willy-nilly give anyone who's not doesn't have a criminal record a gun. You need to be a bit stricter before saying here you go. I really don't think that's an unreasonable stand but I know pro gun people freaked out when I say it.


I had a super long response on what goes into a firearm transfer but I accidentally hit the cancel button and lost it...

I'm not going to retype it but in essence there is a lot of information that is needed before the firearm can be transferred. I sell firearms and it is a long process. Even for states without wait periods. I can assure you no firearms are just given away willy-nilly at any firearms dealer. And it's not only up to the government if the transfer takes place or not. I as the seller have the right to deny a person on the spot without running a background check if I feel uneasy about them.

I understand why people want private sales to become more strict because it's really only up to the sellers discretion. However some states require a private sale go through an FFL dealer.

I also understand the mental instability argument but I don't see that problem being tackled. All I ever hear about is banning high capacity mags, "assault" rifles (please never use that term though as it's inaccurate for the firearms description), and certain ammunition.

We need to stop blaming the guns. We need to instead help those that would use guns for harm.
Jun 24 2015 10:16PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
JAHpowI had a super long response on what goes into a firearm transfer but I accidentally hit the cancel button and lost it...

I'm not going to retype it but in essence there is a lot of information that is needed before the firearm can be transferred. I sell firearms and it is a long process. Even for states without wait periods. I can assure you no firearms are just given away willy-nilly at any firearms dealer. And it's not only up to the government if the transfer takes place or not. I as the seller have the right to deny a person on the spot without running a background check if I feel uneasy about them.

I understand why people want private sales to become more strict because it's really only up to the sellers discretion. However some states require a private sale go through an FFL dealer.

I also understand the mental instability argument but I don't see that problem being tackled. All I ever hear about is banning high capacity mags, "assault" rifles (please never use that term though as it's inaccurate for the firearms description), and certain ammunition.

We need to stop blaming the guns. We need to instead help those that would use guns for harm.


Completely and totally untrue I have friends in Florida who have bought gun's at garage sales no back round checks or anything. Happens all the time, read that last sentence if people are going to use guns for harm we should give out guns after we screen people to make sure we're not giving guns to those people, and we should also help the people that need the help. you need to help both sides of the issues its not one or the other.
Jun 24 2015 10:29PM
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.frenchy
Posts: 18221 - Karma: 12,323
nocturnalCompletely and totally untrue I have friends in Florida who have bought gun's at garage sales no back round checks or anything. Happens all the time, read that last sentence if people are going to use guns for harm we should give out guns after we screen people to make sure we're not giving guns to those people, and we should also help the people that need the help. you need to help both sides of the issues its not one or the other.


I live in CT and my own guns are from private sales. so what, i'm not mentally disturbed, just like most of the law abiding population.


Someone would know not to sell a mentally unstable person a fire arm.
Jun 24 2015 10:30PM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22708 - Karma: 76,635
cobra_commanderNa, some 14 year old with a blackberry could hijack it.


Ok shit... so you need to add the right to bear nukes, drones and weapons-grade h@x.
Jun 24 2015 10:32PM
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987321654hgfd
Posts: 5133 - Karma: 5,447
nocturnalCompletely and totally untrue I have friends in Florida who have bought gun's at garage sales no back round checks or anything. Happens all the time, read that last sentence if people are going to use guns for harm we should give out guns after we screen people to make sure we're not giving guns to those people, and we should also help the people that need the help. you need to help both sides of the issues its not one or the other.


He did say there were states that don't require any background check for private sales.

Every legit gun store in the US requires a background check.
Jun 24 2015 10:35PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,176
nocturnalCompletely and totally untrue I have friends in Florida who have bought gun's at garage sales no back round checks or anything. Happens all the time, read that last sentence if people are going to use guns for harm we should give out guns after we screen people to make sure we're not giving guns to those people, and we should also help the people that need the help. you need to help both sides of the issues its not one or the other.


To your first part, no, that is totally and completely true. Maybe you misread. It's up to the sellers discretion, in most states, if they want to sell the gun. Yes, no backgrounds are required. However, in some states a transfer through an FFL is required and in all states (if I'm not mistaken) an FFL is required for a private transfer across state lines.

Second part, like I said I understand that argument. For some screening may work, for others the game can be played. How much would it help? I don't know but I won't deny that it would stop some people.
Jun 24 2015 10:40PM
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