Bernie Sanders will ruin America!!!!

CampeadorLiberalism truly is a mental disorder, it has become your religion. (Or is it socialism now?)

You idiot, you don't even know your own candidate's position on 4-year education. And clearly you do not understand simple arguments. Eliminating FAFSA loans would make college more affordable, that is beyond dispute. A college or university is still a business, and as a business they would be forced to drive down costs in order to have enrollment. Your pathetic university program teaches you nothing.

Eliminating FAFSA loans (you content now?) is not a practical solution. However, scaling back the loans and putting conditions on those loans (like any other types of loans) would be invaluable both to the long-term viability program, and to the poor 18-year old suckers who are signing themselves up for the indentured servitude of debt.

These are not complex positions to understand, but again, you suffer from a mental illness. Keep posting your redundant memes, they just further prove what an idiot you are.

Oh, and lastly, have fun paying back those loans for that useless degree you've got. What all you loser socialists have in common is your depressing low-end of the scale mediocrity.

Granite_StateSo is anyone who takes out a mortgage or car loan a sucker as well? Because right now you are blatantly stating that taking out a loan to invest in ones personal education is a bad idea. What terrible logic.


Conservatism is a far worse "mental disease". I mean we as a country weren't doing so bad until Bush took over and crashed the economy, started two worthless wars, and allowed corporate America to get so far out of control.

Must be nice to come from a wealthy family and take stances like this when your life has been easy from the start.

Oh, also, Chile is a fucking shithole.

CampeadorAnd yet the average Chilean citizen is more successful than you are, go figure.

And to answer your question, yes, absolutely. Anyone who takes out a loan that they cannot pay back is a sucker. For FAFSA loans, they are the most unfortunate of suckers, since the debt cannot even be dispelled through bankruptcy. Usually the institutions that provide loans should avoid such loans, but we clearly see that this is not the case with FAFSA loans (or with bank loans leading up to 2008).


But of course I understand the "blame Bush" spiel is the last resort of any cornered leftist (along with accusations of "racism", "xenophobia", "bigotry", etc).

S.J.WAnd anyone who takes out a loan who can't repay it is a sucker? So everyone's a sucker then? There is no guarantee that you will get a job after you get your degree. It is blind luck who get's a job after they finish their degree.

CampeadorAnd yet the average Chilean citizen is more successful than you are, go figure.

And to answer your question, yes, absolutely. Anyone who takes out a loan that they cannot pay back is a sucker. For FAFSA loans, they are the most unfortunate of suckers, since the debt cannot even be dispelled through bankruptcy. Usually the institutions that provide loans should avoid such loans, but we clearly see that this is not the case with FAFSA loans (or with bank loans leading up to 2008).


But of course I understand the "blame Bush" spiel is the last resort of any cornered leftist (along with accusations of "racism", "xenophobia", "bigotry", etc).

Granite_StateNot everyone is liquid enough to buy a house or car in full. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of paying off their loan and it doesnt make them a sucker.

As for the "Bush spiel" not really a spiel when he and his cabinet directly led to the housing crash of 2008. Just trying to give a little perspective, liberals aren't great at running this country, conservatives are worse.

.MASSHOLE.I love the hypocrisy here. Yes, Bush and his cabinet certainly helped lead the economy to the housing crisis but was he not appealing to the liberal ideology by saying everyone should be able to afford a home? Are adequate living conditions not a human right?

It sounds awfully like everyone should be able to afford an education, gain access to a livable wage, or any other basic human right's argument.

Granite_StateHow is that hypocrisy? The doling out of sub-prime loans to people who can't afford them is borderline predatory lending. The bulk of these people already had homes/apartments, it wasn't like he was giving homes to the homeless.

We are already seeing the same thing with student lending. Eventually that bubble will burst as well.

Providing k-14 education for free (through the tax payer) is not similar to this in any way. Either is the livable wage argument. Your point..is well...not really a good point.

.MASSHOLE.Was Bush handing out those loans? Nope. He merely advocated that people should be able to afford homes much like people should be able to afford education. You mention the loan bubble for education. It is in the trillions now, and if it were to come crashing down it would be catastrophic. That bubble got to that size because of a few reasons, but mainly the idea that college education is necessary for success.

The comparison to the wage and free college (not community college) sentiment is comes from the fact that people want their needs to be pandered to and are unwilling to accept the potential consequences for these actions.

Nothing is free or risk-averse in this day and age.

Granite_StateNo Im better than every Chilean citizen strictly on the premise that I don't live in that shitstain of a country Chile.

Not everyone is liquid enough to buy a house or car in full. That doesn't mean they aren't capable of paying off their loan and it doesnt make them a sucker.

As for the "Bush spiel" not really a spiel when he and his cabinet directly led to the housing crash of 2008. Just trying to give a little perspective, liberals aren't great at running this country, conservatives are worse.

The name calling is the icing on the cake, love it!

CampeadorHaha sure you are, yet the average Chilean citizens earns more per year than you do, you minimum-wage trash.

I was very specific in my argument, but you keep seeing only what you want to see. I'm not going to repeat it again for the likes of you.

It's quite depressing that besides being a poor socialist loser, you actually bask in it. And yet your only pathetic replies are to name-call the nation of Chile? As if your pathetic insults of a place you've never been bother me? I can only lament that you weren't around to meet Pinochet, besides that, I couldn't care less.

CampeadorHaha sure you are, yet the average Chilean citizens earns more per year than you do, you minimum-wage trash.

_Fluffy_http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/countries/united-states/


according to that^^^^*. Chile fucking sucks at everything. They are barely a member of the OECD And have only been for 5 years.

the average American citizen makes 3.5x more than the average Chilean citizen.

Chile is below Greece and Russia for median household income.

Lus146Oh nooooooooooooo. I hate free/cheaper educationnnnnnnnn. Too bad he can't even pass a bill right now because he's not the president yet. Do some research foagie.

louie.miragsnothing is free.

In other news:

Lus146Do you know the difference between socialism and communism? There is a huge difference do some research.

Lus146Oh nooooooooooooo. I hate free/cheaper educationnnnnnnnn. Too bad he can't even pass a bill right now because he's not the president yet. Do some research foagie.

californiagrownWhere is the money going to come from to pay for it?

Granite_StateMaybe from that ridiculous defense budget.

Granite_StateMaybe from that ridiculous defense budget.

californiagrownIt is one helluva lot cheaper to maintain a the best military than it is to build one.

I agree though, I think there is too much fat in the defense budget. What programs would you take money from?

californiagrownIt is one helluva lot cheaper to maintain a the best military than it is to build one.

I agree though, I think there is too much fat in the defense budget. What programs would you take money from?

Granite_StateYou could trim down operations and maintenance as well as military personnel. Atomic energy defense activities. Military construction. Really aside from R&D, family housing, and defense I think a lot can be trimmed from the remainder of the budget. The F35 program for instance, an absolute failure and costing the tax payers billions, yet we still have it around...

louie.miragsend the foreign wars


http://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/Bernie-Sanders-Rejects-Syria-No-Fly-Zone-Backs-Airstrikes--20151003-0015.html

To some, Bernie seems like a breath of fresh air when he describes the change he wants. He is not fooling me. Obama preached change too, and we're still in war. Remember when the whole country was against a war in Syria? Well, they managed to get involved anyway. And the Bern agrees.

https://syriathetruth.wordpress.com/

http://www.newstatesman.com/international-politics/2013/08/ugly-truth-behind-obamas-syria-plan

https://news.yahoo.com/doctors-without-borders-afghan-clinic-bombed-3-staff-045208716.html

And last but not least, powerful Ron Paul: (http://original.antiwar.com/paul/2015/10/05/i-wish-nobody-was-bombing-syria/)

I wish the American people would finally demand that their government end its destructive policy of trying to change any regime that does not bow to Washington’s demands. I wish Congress respected our Constitution enough to demand that the president seek a declaration of war before attacking a foreign country. I wish President Bush and his neocon advisors had never decided to overthrow the Syrian government. I wish President Obama had fired the neocons who led him from one foolish intervention to another. I wish the CIA had not trained rebels to fight alongside al-Qaeda in Syria. I wish we would reject the shrill cries of the warmongers. I wish the US media was more than just a propaganda arm of the US government.

Granite_StateEvery time I read your posts its in the voice of like a James Bond villian haha

I wish I was medium wage trash, sadly im not :(

_Fluffy_http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/countries/united-states/


according to that^^^^*. Chile fucking sucks at everything. They are barely a member of the OECD And have only been for 5 years.

the average American citizen makes 3.5x more than the average Chilean citizen.

Chile is below Greece and Russia for median household income.

Granite_StateEvery time I read your posts its in the voice of like a James Bond villian haha

I wish I was medium wage trash, sadly im not :(

Granite_StateSo Chile really does suck. Been saying that the whole time. What. A. Shit. Country.

Granite_StateThe F35 program for instance, an absolute failure and costing the tax payers billions, yet we still have it around...

CampeadorKind of like you, sans the part about billions, there's no way to know for sure the drain you are on the taxpayer.


Socialism in a nutshell: Kill the military to shower benefits on the left-wing voting bloc. No wonder members of the armed forces almost unanimously hate you.

ThaLoraxSoooo you're implying that "right-wingers" don't like to accept grants for college when it's available, they don't like being guaranteed health care coverage even with pre-existing circumstances, that they don't want homeless vets to be able to get food stamps, and that they would refuse free STD tests?

louie.miragsnothing is free.

In other news:

californiagrownNo he is just trolling, and racking up some pretty bad karma in the process.

Granite_StateI just love to see what he posts next! He has very intricate insults its awesome haha

californiagrownI would like to clarify that i meant real world karma. the real kind. Not the meaningless number count under your username.

californiagrownNo he is just trolling, and racking up some pretty bad karma in the process.

CampeadorIf you want to get on your knees for your buddy, I would suggest doing it outside of this forum, for decency's sake.

S.J.WOooh great meme. Much resourceful. Many facts. 10/10

louie.miragsAwesome, dude! You quoted the post I said was a joke and ignored my post a few up with all of the sources, facts and my opinions. Solid attempt (I guess?) at having a discussion

californiagrownThat's a whole lot of Americans you are putting out of work in the short term for HOPEFULLY a long term gain. And maintenance is not something you want to trim- take a look at Russia lol.

We are not at war with Syria...

We fight in and support oversea conflicts because they have a direct impact upon our economy. Not to mention, as the biggest baddest country going, don't you think we have the moral obligation to try and effect good in places where the people are brutalized and its economy valuable?

californiagrownThat's a whole lot of Americans you are putting out of work in the short term for HOPEFULLY a long term gain. And maintenance is not something you want to trim- take a look at Russia lol.

We are not at war with Syria...

We fight in and support oversea conflicts because they have a direct impact upon our economy. Not to mention, as the biggest baddest country going, don't you think we have the moral obligation to try and effect good in places where the people are brutalized and its economy valuable?

Granite_StateThe military is very similar to a business, the only difference being a business deals in a product or service and the military deals in war. We have no major wars going on currently, the market is slow. That means you need to scale back operations. We currently have 1.5 million front line personnel and over 1.1 million in reserves. We have 9,000 tanks, 41,000 AFV's, 2,000 SPG's, 1,300 towered artillery, and 1,300 multi launch rocket systems. We have 14,000 aircraft, 2,200 fighters, 5,300 transportation AC, 6,000 helicopters, and 920 attack helicopters. We have 20 aircraft carriers, 10 frigates, 62 destroyers, 72 submarines, and 13 coastal defense ships (Largest Navy in the world by far). Do we use all of these? No. Do we have to maintain all of these? Yes. We can still maintain our Army, Navy, and Airforce to the American standard, but we can also ramp down how many vehicles we have. Maybe in another WW scenario would we need to utilize all of those but that would really be the only scenario.

We have military personnel in over 130 countries and over 900 military bases world wide. All that cost quite a bit to maintain.

Now conservatives will say this is all necessary, but in my humble opinion I disagree. Don't get me wrong I love having the most potent military in the world, but even if we scaled down our defense budget by 1/3 we would still be miles ahead of second place.

To respond to compeador, LOL. So my military family hates me huh? Ok. Well Im sorry id rather see a chunk of our military budget go to fixing our horrendous education system and maybe help go towards refining our healthcare process and building infrastructure. My bad. I'm a shitty American, minimum wage trash, socialist, liberal, communist, college-aged hippie anyways right? Fuck my opinion lets keep the war machine rolling and help push the rest of the world into further hatred of the American way of life.

-benedettoA moral obligation to arm rebels which failed in Iraq and failing in Afghanistan..A moral obligation to bomb countries without an act of war? An obligation to bomb hospitals..You said it yourself..money money moneyyyyyyyyyyyy

CampeadorAnd I cannot help but laugh that each time you get called any number of variations of piece of shit, all you can come up with is comments about Chile.

I may be digging here, but I seem to remember you've talked somewhere about you and your fuck up family, which is quite sad.

californiagrownSo you think we should do nothing, just sit back and not try to make the world a better place? Let atrocities happen daily? Let women be brutalized and treated no better than dogs?

That's what gets me. There are many, many countries that need help- obviously and rightly we choose to help first the countries that affect our economy.

californiagrownSo you think we should do nothing, just sit back and not try to make the world a better place? Let atrocities happen daily? Let women be brutalized and treated no better than dogs?

That's what gets me. There are many, many countries that need help- obviously and rightly we choose to help first the countries that affect our economy.

S.J.WI agree with pretty much everything you said in that post so I'm not going to argue with you just because you said you didn't like Bernie. But I think you will agree with Bernie on foreign policy.


https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/777185/Bernie-Sanders--The-Vox-conversation

starts at 21:14

californiagrownSo you think we should do nothing, just sit back and not try to make the world a better place? Let atrocities happen daily? Let women be brutalized and treated no better than dogs?

That's what gets me. There are many, many countries that need help- obviously and rightly we choose to help first the countries that affect our economy.

Granite_StateI get your point and it is valid. That shit bothers me too. But sometimes it isn't our place. If you are a guest in someones house, you don't put your feet up on the coffee table, you don't go into their fridge and start grabbing food, you don't touch their shit unless they ask you or tell you its ok.

Why don't we focus on the issues we have here first, or national defense is pretty damn strong as it is. And though there are countless external threats, they aren't as close to affecting the American way of life as some forms of the media would have us agree. Why don't we help feed the millions of starving Americans we have here at home, many of them children? Why don't we try to curb this homeless epidemic that is sweeping the nation? Why don't we try to fix the problems we have in this country before we go trying to fix the problems we have in another? Sure we have a moral obligation to the world, but we also have one to ourselves, and that should come first.

-benedettoThat's not what I said. I don't have an answer but creating a power vacuum in countries prone to warfare and conflict trying to Americanize countries isn't working and cost taxpayers billions. I can't sit here and act like I have an solution because I don't. I would be overly arrogant if I acted like I did. It's beyond complicated. Don't place women as a scapegoat, I don't support anything remotely religious when it comes to oppression..To think we can help, even though it has failed in the past doesn't make sense, especially because of money, in my opinion. Is it about money? Or the women? Think about it.

californiagrownIf someone is beating the shit out of there wife, yeah, you should step in. Being the biggest and baddest means that we have the responsibility to protect the beaten down

Are you honestly comparing the problems in this country to the problems in Syria, Afghanistan, etc? It's "can't supersize my kids happy meal cause of the economy" vs I hope my family and I aren't killed tonight.



It is about a moral obligation to help those less fortunate than us. We don't have unlimited resources so we pick the battles that will hopefully effect the most benefit for them AND us.

You honestly believe we should stop trying to help prevent genocide, human rights abuses, and evil dictatorships? Even though we have the means to?