Baltimore, MD.

slugworthI guess NS is a lot more conservative or at least stubborn and arrogant than I had imagined it to be. What is with you guys ganging up and down voting comments you disagree with, then up voting the ones which either are complete bullshit or contribute nothing to the conversation? It's sorta comical but really weird..

byuboundThe crap do you think the upvote downvote system is for? Its an easy way to show support for a post without having to post 'what he said'

plyswthsqrrlsfor the record, you are being just as stubborn and arrogant

slugworthHow am I being stubborn and arrogant? I'm making an observation

UglyboyIf it was a white person carrying the knife no arrest would of happened.

BombogenesisIf people up vote something you disagree with that makes them stubborn and arrogant? Am I understanding this correctly?

cornholiowas it ever determined that he did not run from the cops initially? because those are the reports i read. i feel like without this part of the story it's an entirely different situation.

i tend to think that in most cases if the encounter starts with a repeat offender running from the police, once the person is caught the cops are not going to be that lenient and will probably book them for anything and everything they can. call me crazy but i think they would do the same EVEN FOR A WHITE PERSON

the outcome of the event was definitely not justified but being uncooperative never, ever, helps your case.

Fred_BearWasnt there a report from another man in the back of the same van that gray was throwing himself into the divider wall seemingly trying to injure himself?

Fred_BearWasnt there a report from another man in the back of the same van that gray was throwing himself into the divider wall seemingly trying to injure himself?

UglyboyHe ran before after making eye contact with police officers. Yes, that furthered his case and makes you suspicious as fuck. But blacks are stopped way more often than whites. Blacks are 28 times more likely to be stopped. It's racial harassment.

cornholioi'm not arguing that blacks are stopped more than whites. but to make a blanket statement that "a white guy would not have been charged with having a pocketknife" is bullshit.

a white guy in the same situation (repeat offender who chose to run from the cops) would have been booked just the same.

hard to tell if he would have gotten a seatbelt tho

slugworthHow am I being stubborn and arrogant? I'm making an observation

Uglyboyhttp://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/04/30/freddie-gray-was-banging-against-the-walls-for-help-not-harm.html

http://www.newsweek.com/prisoner-disputes-report-freddie-gray-hurt-himself-comes-forward-not-get-327461

The other dude in the van retracted his statement

plyswthsqrrlsyou're refusing to concede any points from the other side, and are just being generally condescending in your remarks. you're making it sound like being conservative is a bad thing and in order to be "right" you need to be a liberal

slugworthi'm not saying being conservative is wrong, I'm just commenting that the majority of NS in this thread seem to sway more to the right wing side which surprised me. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm making an observation and commenting on all the post that get up voted which contribute nothing beneficial to the thread. Read through the pages man.

slugworthI'm aware of what it's for man. What I'm commenting on is all the up votes for the racist, conservative or arrogant comments and down vote rape for the one's that pertain to the conversation and make sense.

plyswthsqrrlsI've read through all the pages, which is why I made my comment on you being just as stubborn and arrogant as the people you're talking about. You are refusing to see the other side just as much as they are refusing to see yours.

This is what you said: "conservative or at least stubborn and arrogant," which is to imply that all conservatives are stubborn and arrogant. You tried to be subtle about it, but anyone with basic reading comprehension skills knew exactly what you were saying about people with conservative views.

Don't try to cop out of it, at least own up to what you said

slugworthI said it surprised me that the majority of NS in the thread seem to be right wing or conservative, due to the comments. The fact that the majority of up voted posts were complete trash and presented no logical or statistical information also surprised me, and yes they were for the most part sounding conservative. But really, who cares man, I have seen the issue from other sides and I'm more than willing to if the information is presented in a logical way.

kshaughnAs a math nerd, lets look at the numbers to really get an understanding of how cops are just a bunch of racist killers. I was having trouble finding data on just Baltimore, so I found it for all of the US from 2003-2009, but it should give us a good enough idea. Obviously this data isn't perfect (US vs Baltimore, how well this info is being reported), but by and large it will give us a solid picture. Source - Bureau of Justice Statistics

From 03-09 the FBI estimates that there were 98,000,000 arrests made in the US

During this time period there were 4,813 arrest-related deaths (not perfect, but gives us an idea)
That number includes deaths such as drug/alcohol related, suicides, and other types, but we can focus on the 2,931 (61%) that were ruled as homicides. Note that homicides will include 'justified' deaths, such as those that occur in a shootout

Only 31% of all arrest-related deaths were blacks (42% white) but we will look at all homicides because I don't have the arrest statistics by race (I know, not perfect data, but close enough)

So with the numbers we have, we get the following results:

0.00299% of all arrests lead to an arrest-related homicide. Remember this figure includes all races and what I consider to be 'justified' homicides where the person was shooting at the police. Therefore, that number is even smaller for the number of blacks that were killed 'for no reason'.

So just think about this- people are rioting and protesting and calling the police racist for something that happens in roughly 0.003% of arrests. So 99.997% arrests have no homicides at all, but we are going to call racism and demand reform for something that rarely happens. People are freaking out about something that almost never happens. If something works 99.997% of the time or even anything close to that number, cases where it doesn't work is an outlier, not a trend. I know these numbers are not perfect, but they are not going to be that far off given the number of arrests that occur each year, so put that into perspective before you start demanding change because of a few outliers.

plyswthsqrrlsok here's a stubborn and arrogant post that you seemingly ignored:

plyswthsqrrlsok here's a stubborn and arrogant post that you seemingly ignored:

slugworthTruthfully man i dont really care that much, its the internet. I read those statistics too and im not arguing with them. I dont have time to read every post or statistic and if i did that one would not and did not resonate like the others. the aspect of this arguement i was most concerned with had to due with excessive police force, the medias lack of attention to the peaceful demonstations and the growing supression of the poor and middle class.

slugworthTruthfully man i dont really care that much, its the internet. I read those statistics too and im not arguing with them. I dont have time to read every post or statistic and if i did that one would not and did not resonate like the others. the aspect of this arguement i was most concerned with had to due with excessive police force, the medias lack of attention to the peaceful demonstations and the growing supression of the poor and middle class.

plyswthsqrrlsIf you can't be bothered to read every post and statistic, just don't make generalizing blanket statements lumping all of them together as arrogant. Thats all I'm saying.

With regards to your last statement, "excessive" police force is and always has been a subjective issue, so arguing with the aim to change peoples' minds about it makes no sense.

The media exists to make money. They are running a business. You think people are going to tune in to watch people standing around chanting in "solidarity?" No. If there's a riot happening, no fucking shit the news will be covering it. People will tune it to watch it, and they will make money. It's not complicated, and before you tell me all about how "that's the whole problem maaaaan" then go out there and open your own completely unbiased media outlet and see how long you can keep it running with no viewership and zero people who give a fuck.

The lower and middle classes have always and will always be "suppressed." It's the nature of the class system, and its existed forever. It's not going to change, and burning your city to the ground will not help. You're arguing points that no one is going to refute, but no one gives a shit about because they have always and will always be true.

slugworthI'm not interested in you're views on the poor and middle class either. Does it not strike you as a reflection of the our current social consciousness? This is not about the few people burning buildings and starting fights, it's about long lasting socio economic problems which are beginning to surface again. Don't you think we should try to create some forms of equality in this country? I don't know why you're getting upset, but you better go back to your Ferguson form man. I'm not interested in this or restating what I already said.

slugworthyou're thread

slugworthI read your post "Ferguson is still the worst". Seems unbiased.. I don't think you're listening to or understanding what I've been talking about and addressing throughout this thread. I'm not interested in picking apart things I've said days ago in this thread. To quote someone in you're thread (i can't remember who)
"90% of this crap could have been avoided if the media (ABC, FOX, MSNBC, CNN, CBS, ect...) didn't hype this like it was world war 3. Damn near everyone who even knows about the issue has received their information secondhand through a bias medium. And the worst part is they're too dumb to realize it."

I'm not interested in you're views on the poor and middle class either. Does it not strike you as a reflection of the our current social consciousness? This is not about the few people burning buildings and starting fights, it's about long lasting socio economic problems which are beginning to surface again. Don't you think we should try to create some forms of equality in this country? I don't know why you're getting upset, but you better go back to your Ferguson form man. I'm not interested in this or restating what I already said.

.frenchyuglyboy and lord_byron for cutest couple 2k15 :^)

UglyboyTo be honest I didn't know Freddie ran from the police when I made the statement so there's some ignorance on my behalf and I retract my statement. I just thought it was a "random" stop search But there's still the underlying racist issue that blacks are 28 times more likely to be stopped which contributed immensely to his manslaughter.

The seatbelt should of been secured and I think is more of a police negligence than straight up racism.

cornholiosee that's another problem with these things is people are too quick to jump on the racism and harassment bandwagon without even bothering to look at the details. we all just assume because he was black the charges were racially motivated, totally ignoring the events leading up to the arrest.

UglyboyThe stops are more than likely racially motivated. Not in a "I hate blacks way" more just a racial stereotype. But on CBC they had an expert on the news talking about Freddie Grays death and he made the remark that normal police starting and stopping wouldn't of caused Freddies severe injuries and with the person who was also in the van retracting his statement of Freddie purposely trying to injure himself it begs the question did the drivers drive recklessly causing death? I'm not too familiar with how medical attention works if you're injured in a US police station so I can't really have an opinion on that. ( can't find source cause it was on TV while I was at work)

Anyways, whether or not it was racist is really a personal opinion matter. I don't think it was I think it was just police brutality and police misconduct. There's arguments for it being a race issue and not, mainly him running from the police (not race) and charging him with carrying a concealed weapon when it was legal (race).

plyswthsqrrlsSince all that Ferguson nonsense went down, I've been trying to keep myself out of these kind of discussions as best I can. All I'm trying to do is get you to see that people on both sides of this discussion are being completely stubborn; and standing on "your side" pointing fingers at conservatives is only going to get people pissed off. Liberals gonna liberate, conservatives gonna conserve... there isn't much use in trying to convince people their way of thinking is wrong.

All I'm really saying is that we need to recognize that social inequality is nothing new, it's been around since the beginning of time. It's just human nature. Ever since the first caveman got the dopest cave on the block, people have been separated into classes (not literally, but you know what I mean). It's just the way we are as a species.

Only thing is now everyone has access to shit tons of information from everywhere around the globe so we can all see exactly how fucked up we are, and now everyone wants to change it. It's not gonna happen.

Not trying to be inflammatory, just trying to get my two cents out there.

cornholioi can't tell which side of the race issue you're on with this post, it seems you're taking both. i will agree that it usually boils down to personal opinion, it just seems that too many opinions are formed before people try to get the story of what happened.

and i really don't see how anyone can say he was charged with a weapon because of race. a white guy in the same situation would have been charged too. you're suspicious as fuck when you take off running like that and they will try to find anything they can to write you up at that point.

UglyboyYeah I'm seeing both sides of the race issue. That's why I haven't really gotten into this forum too much to defend Freddie Gray because I don't think it was hugely race related. Yeah I guess you're right about an officer just wanting to fuck your day up and get you for everything he/she can do. But ive ran from the police before, pretty sure every NSer has, except Frenchy because he has respect for the law and will never break it.

Lord_Byroni have also never run, I Stood My Ground™ and defended my right to live longer than degenerate pigs.

Lord_ByronThen its true, the only option is the extermination of the white race.

Barefootin_Fiendbut then who would pay for all of your welfare and handout social programs...obamacare, obamaphones, etc? it's not like you're going to get a job and actually do something productive in society...

UglyboyYeah but if you run you get shot. If I run I have a funny story to tell my friends

Barefootin_Fiendbut then who would pay for all of your welfare and handout social programs...obamacare, obamaphones, etc? it's not like you're going to get a job and actually do something productive in society...

-benedettoStop acting like black people are the only ones on welfare..

I've seen you on NS for a while. I thought you were more down to earth then that..

slugworthI'm adding this to the fire. Everyone should take a look

http://www.salon.com/2015/05/04/11_economic_facts_about_the_presidency_that_show_how_hillary_clinton_can_win/

Barefootin_Fiendman, you're pretty fucking dense aren't you?

-benedettoDo explain.

-benedettoPerfect example right here of the us vs them mentality. We should all be on the same team. Why do you think different communities have their thoughts and stick with them so much. It's similar to defending your baseball team and talking shit about the other teams fans like they have done something to you. Everyone has different views of freedom and what America should be. The problem is, money is winning the game, in my opinion. And as long as someones direct life isn't affected and is going smooth, they could give a fuck less about the oppressed peoples. Rather, they just want to point fun at people who weren't born into middle to upper class white America like they could just change on a dime. There are different lifestyles everywhere. I'm going in circles here lol


Brain dead hippies resonates with me rather strongly. People who you think are "hippies", which in your eyes is a negative thing, believe they are open minded and accepting of others. Sometimes, their opinions are so strong that they start to use mean words and then you wonder how can they be a happy with that hate. However, what makes conservative people any better thinking they are right and have an open pass at bashing hippies? It's all just negative energy from our lives feeding through our fingertips onto a computer screen when meanwhile, none of know what the fuck we are talking about and going to stick to our sides.



tldr: we're all on team human. None of us are poor or on welfare (yet). None of us know what the fuck we are talking about. I quoted you Frenchy, because it fit with what I wanted to rant about.

Fred_BearHes doing the exact same thing as byron but from the opposite viewpoint