Denial of god

Lord_ByronOne of my favorite quotes "Question everything and everyone always, even me".

God fearing individuals aren't brave enough to question everything. It must suck, being forced to live in a boring plane of existence where all the answers have already been dictated to you.

Here's one last big difference: If science found evidence of something that disproved evolution or the big bang, we would eagerly accept that new information.

Religious people would run from it, as they always have and always will. The fear of information and wisdom is the fear of cowards.

californiagrownAnd you can't just rule out a possibility(athiesm) with no evidence or better explanation.


I havent made anything black and white. Athiest and religous folks have...even though their philosophy is based upon faith and belief.

If you believe in the many shades of grey you dont prescribe to a religon, and are varying levels of agnostic.

Lord_Byronanyone, extreme zealot or not, who chooses to ignore logic and reality and instead base ideas and actions on faith, is a fool and a coward.

Mr.LemonPieI feel like it is pretty simple...Sometime in our future humans think we learn how to use time travel, go back in time and fuck something up creating the big bang.

californiagrownhow was matter created? that was the question. good luck coming up with an answer that doesnt involve varying degrees of magic.

Mr.LemonPieIt wasn't ever created, it's always been in existence at some point in time...You're just looking at time like it's a number line, only going in one direction while in reality it is completely bendable we just don't understand it yet. Which may be seen as magic but the first guy who created fire probably seemed like a magician too.

I mean, I'm not saying I don't believe in a lot of weird things or that my TOE isn't based more on belief than science but I honestly believe that humans created the universe (big bang) we just don't know how we did it yet.

californiagrownI don't believe you are God. I can't prove you are not, but i have no faith you are God, returned to earth.

Why is that tough to understand?

californiagrownYup. Athiests are a 10. A 10 requires faith beyond the provable...

californiagrownthat is just as illogical as crediting God for everything we dont understand.

zzzskizzzNice appeal to faith, your argument is abandonment of reason in an argument and a call to faith to say god exists, usually when reason clearly leads to disproving the conclusion of an argument. It is the assertion that one must have (the right kind of) faith in order to understand the argument. Your bullshit opinions and faith doesn't mean anything. There's no proof God made anything therefore he doesn't exist. if the Bible didn't exist or you've never read it before you wouldn't believe in God. that's like me trying to disprove a little kids imaginary friend I know it doesn't exist but I can't scientifically prove it dosent.

Mr.LemonPieIt wasn't ever created, it's always been in existence at some point in time...You're just looking at time like it's a number line, only going in one direction while in reality it is completely bendable we just don't understand it yet. Which may be seen as magic but the first guy who created fire probably seemed like a magician too.

I mean, I'm not saying I don't believe in a lot of weird things or that my TOE isn't based more on belief than science but I honestly believe that humans created the universe (big bang) we just don't know how we did it yet.

californiagrownYou do understand that people are constantly reevaluating their beliefs and dealing with doubt constantly, right?

To think that non religous folks are the only people with open minds, is very close minded thinking...

blondie.I do understand this. However, why bother making up an arbitrary answer to the question in the first place? For comfort? For meaning and purpose? We are meaningless and purposeless in the universe, and the only meaning and purpose we have is that which we give ourselves and each other as a society. Certainly if there is a higher power, he doesn't care any more about humans than he does about all those aliens in galaxies millions of light years away.

Over centuries the ideas that "god did this, religion made that" have been fought back with science, and religion has constantly had to redefine itself, giving up things it once held as "god's creation." Will this trend not continue? Who knows! But that's the interesting part. One can't just make up an answer to what one doesn't know. It's meant to be left blank until it can be proven.

blondie.Over centuries the ideas that "god did this, religion made that" have been fought back with science, and religion has constantly had to redefine itself, giving up things it once held as "god's creation." Will this trend not continue? Who knows! But that's the interesting part. One can't just make up an answer to what one doesn't know. It's meant to be left blank until it can be proven.

californiagrownAll you are disproving is the literal interpretation of the bible...

Paedophile-PopeAnd, for me, that's enough to dismiss it.

When the bible first came to be it was deemed infallible. It's only with the advances in knowledge and technology that the bible has gone from infallible to inherent to allegorical/metaphorical as a way to stay relevant in the face of conflicting evidence.

californiagrownregarding the above, a simple religous philosophy pretty much covers all your bases-

God created this earth, shaped the path along which evolution occured to ensure humans would be created, and is now sitting back essentially watching his "children" grow and live and thrive. initially he judged humans very strictly but then his son came down to kick it, died, and reported back that life down here is tough. Since then, god has had a much lighter hand and is obliged to forgive us when we fuck up. Instead of being heavy handed in his overseer role, he sits back and lets nature take its course.

Essentially, god is responsible for guiding the very, very Macro of life and everything else happens according to natural law.

blondie.The fat that you provided an answer without proof means that you didn't cover my only base. If this is so, then someday we will be able to prove it. The singularities in nature will point the one, undeniable conclusion that god did it all. But until then, it's not appropriate to say that. Why can't it remain unanswered?

californiagrownNope. shitty analogy. If millions of people swore on their life they have felt the presence of said imaginary friend, then sure it would be similar.

I have literally no idea wtf you tried to say in your first sentence(?).


If you can provide a more logical reason for the origin of all matter than the theory of a higher power creating it, im all ears.

zzzskizzzFallacy in numbers, if millions of people say they believe and feel something that doesn't make it any more true than one person saying it. a bunch of people also used to believe there were Greek gods..... you can conjure particles from a vacuum under the right conditions. Which means you actually can make something from nothing. You haven't given me a theory of how everything was made, you believe somebody just went poof and it appeared. I don't know how the universe was made or why its here that's a ridiculous question. I'm willing to admit I don't know and I don't have the answers and never will it's a ridiculous question and knowing or not knowing the answer doesn't change anything.

californiagrownBecause people have a theory they feel strongly is correct based upon personal experience.

blondie.Fair enough. I would in turn argue that personal experience is not repeatable nor is it provable, and thus it isn't real. Plus "experience" is tied to brain function which is a whole other bag of who knows what.

I think we're arguing the same things, but from different angles, and we land on the divide of being able to answer "the question" or not. You say that it's okay, I say that it's not. That's the way it is and I'm fine with that.

californiagrownOh no, Im agnostic leaning heavily towards atheism. But i was raised Lutheran and respect the hell out of religon. I also understand it and the faith required.

I take issue with ignorant, self-righteous, athiests like yourself who feel the need to denegrate anyone who holds a different, but similarly unprovable, belief than you.


If you can come up with a more likely scenario for the creation of all matter and the universe id love to hear it.

zzzskizzzIf your so called agnostic view which is a bullshit term you really believe he either exists or he doesnt. Saying you're agnostic is like saying you're undecided voter. I think we can both agree gods not real, but we can't say it because its not politically correct. No pun intended but I don't understand why you're playing devil's advocate and taking your to 1% of he mite be real and trying to justify his existence.

blondie.This might be one of the most poorly worded posts I've ever read, but I get the point.

Cali has a point - you just can't know. We don't have the means to know just yet. Someday we will, but not today (actually, who knows? it's only 11AM for me). Its fine to "believe" there's no god but technically you have no proof for this. Your only evidence is prediction based on the trend of science explaining what religion had tried to answer as "god's work." That and the fact that it's statistically stupid to expect that one out of an infinite number of possibilities is the thing that is occurring without any proof whatsoever.

You can't just stand up and yell "science!" That's not how it works. Science is a method that relies on proof and repeatability. From this standpoint, while you may have a very good hypothesis, the question is absolutely unanswerable at this point.

.otto.I am a christian.. and i defintatly dont believe the world was created in 6 days. I have more of Long day view

zzzskizzzThere's no proof for a unicorn doing it either, doesn't mean it's as statistically possible. The problem is you're trying to make it seem like it could be 50 50. Theres a 50 percent chance he does exist or he doesn't exist, That's not how it works.

kickcactusThe only way Jesus could walk on water was if the water was frozen lmao.

kickcactusThe only way Jesus could walk on water was if the water was frozen lmao.

californiagrownIf you can provide a more logical reason for the origin of all matter than the theory of a higher power creating it, im all ears.

Lord_Byronanyone, extreme zealot or not, who chooses to ignore logic and reality and instead base ideas and actions on faith, is a fool and a coward.

DeebieSkeebiesbut the water is no longer a liquid, it is a solid u dum dum idiot girl lol get rekt and show me ur titties

blondie.Can you read? I explicitly addressed what you just said.

zzzskizzzWe agree man calm down, I was reiterating your point. I didn't mean you as in you I met you as in Cali I FUCKED UP.

JSONI really want to express my view on this subject, but then I think about it and realize its an online forum and we are arguing for no reason.

Z-JuiceAnd what is the "logic and reality" that nullifies faith in this argument?