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For you religious NS'ers

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Parks.
Posts: 5612 - Karma: 1,093
My room mate recently told me that a couple years ago a priest at his church was arrested for diddling little boys. he proceeded to act as if it was no big deal and didn't really care. i dont go to church and have only been a couple times in my life; i thought it was more of a big deal than he did. so my question is this: if your priest turned out to be a sex offender, would it change any relationship you had with the church? or is it just my lack of experience in a church to think differently
Mar 25 2014 1:17AM
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Mids
Posts: 406 - Karma: 1,283
This is my point. and ^^^^

Sexual abuse is horrific and sick. I've had the blessing of not having to go through the pain of being abused but I have to imagine its traumatizing. I have to admit that the thought of being abused by a loved one is even more painful than I can imagine. A mother, father, or family member should be a trusted person in your life, and so should be a man of faith. I just can't have trust in priests with all the stuff going on. Just like I wouldn't have trust in family if things where going to shit.

Maybe if things change in the future, I may return to the catholic church, but as of now, it's not going to happen.

That's my opinion, I made the mistake of opening this thread and getting wrapped up in it. I just want to go back to goat semen jokes and not typing a paragraph every time I open a thread.




Mar 26 2014 10:00AM
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Wallisch_pl
Posts: 5260 - Karma: 1,022
I fucking hate people who argue, "Well, i asked god to get rid of all my problems because I'm to mucha bitch to do them myself", and they're surprised nothing happened? Why the fuck would God solve everyone's problems? I'm not religious at all, but why would God put us on earth to solve are problems and then take us to heaven?

All things wrote in the bible are just so stupid, I imagine people creating the list of sins just wanted people to live the life they want to live. Whether there is or is not a God, all religions are so stupid
Mar 26 2014 10:23AM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
It's your favorite video
Mar 26 2014 12:16PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10627 - Karma: 7,423
shhhhhhhhh, shhhhhhhhh

Click for larger image

Mar 26 2014 12:36PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
You you just proved my point, why you keep coming back into this thread and posting, is beyond me. Do you really think any person is going to open this thread and think you've made any good points or won an argument? Take your opinions out of NS and bring it somewhere where people will actually value you. Here's a great start http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=34523
Mar 26 2014 12:42PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10627 - Karma: 7,423
^ hum why, i agree with most scientific "fact" what is stupid and is that you think that you can prove everything for some reason, and you can't, its impossible to prove existence of anything. And that is where you fail as an atheist, and need to learn. I can't prove the existence of god, but its what i believe in, and you believe in science, thats fine. but when you try to tell other people off because you think your logical? I would start looking at the basic rules of science again, because it is blatantly obvious that you don't know what the fuck you are talking about.
Mar 26 2014 12:45PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
I don't believe in science as an absolute truth, I question everything, I look for a things that can be changed. Things can't always be 100% fact, and I'm always up for changing my opinion or learning something new. That's why when I was about 15 I learned about science, the facts proof and theories. And after taking a big step back and looking at all of it with an unbiased view. There is no denying that one makes sense on the other just doesn't. I know it's hard to admit that growing up you were believing something turned out actually be wrong. And it's easier to stick by faith and your childhood beliefs, then by actual logic and facts. But unless actual evidence is shown to me, there's no way I'm going to believe your so called proof of a a 2000 year old book that has been proven wrong numerous times, and keeps being changed to fit into an ideological belief. That's not evidence.
Mar 26 2014 1:06PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
Also what is a phone god?
Mar 26 2014 1:11PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10627 - Karma: 7,423
If you think any good Christian would take their faith from the bible then you really need to rethink your stereotypes.
Mar 26 2014 1:33PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
So what is your proof and evidence that god is real and made everything?
Mar 26 2014 1:45PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10627 - Karma: 7,423
That it is impossible for something to be made from nothing. Something had to have acted to begin everything. The dust or whatever material you think caused the big bang was not just there.
Mar 26 2014 1:50PM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
Nothing is impossible m8. If you need a man with a white beard to be the explanation for it all then that is like your opinion man.
Mar 26 2014 1:53PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
So did god come from nothing?
Mar 26 2014 2:04PM
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El_Barto.
Posts: 11661 - Karma: 24,364
What is your proof that there isnt a god? You have exactly the same amount if proof as roddy. Nobody knows and nobody will ever know.

Science in no way, shape or form says anything about god. No scientific laws or theories say anything about god.

It is something we will never know and we arent supposed to know. Maybe we find out when we die, maybe we dont. Anyone who claims one way or the other for fact is an idiot
Mar 26 2014 2:05PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
God* is eternal, has always been and will always be.
Mar 26 2014 2:11PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
And...how I feel about entering this conversation as a Christian.

Click for larger image
Mar 26 2014 2:16PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
Yes god could have done it, a unicorn could have done it, Zeus could have done it. Non of those can be disproved whats your point? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell's_teapot

You clearly did not read that we are still figuring this out and ideas are changing, we sure as hell don't know now, and we sure as hell didn't know 2000 years ago.
Mar 26 2014 3:13PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
So something can't come from nothing.

God comes from nothing.
Mar 26 2014 3:15PM
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El_Barto.
Posts: 11661 - Karma: 24,364
Youre right, i read like 5 posts. Im the most amount of right though
Mar 26 2014 3:55PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10627 - Karma: 7,423
something had to be there. Interesting that this is so hard to grasp for you.
Mar 26 2014 4:15PM
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Heart
Posts: 6156 - Karma: 3,462
Watching roddy try and argue about religion is like watching a puppy stumble over its own feet.
Mar 26 2014 4:26PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51621 - Karma: 162,057
Could say the same thing about religious people. There are good people on both sides as well as assholes.
Mar 26 2014 4:27PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
Exactly something can't come from nothing, now your getting it.

The universe can not come out of nothing, there had to be someone or something to create it. God is ETERNAL(http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/eternal), He did not come from anywhere because he has always been.

Mar 26 2014 4:38PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
So he came from nothing, the thing you said can't happen, happened you see your fallacy in your argument.
Mar 26 2014 4:40PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
No, but I do see you twisting my words to try and prove your point. You keep forgetting about the word eternal, I posted the link to its definition last time, but I guessed you missed it. So I will just post it here.

e·ter·nal
iˈtərnl/
adjective
  1. 1.
    lasting or existing forever; without end or beginning.

Without end or BEGINNING. you can not create something that does not have a beginning.
Mar 26 2014 4:51PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51621 - Karma: 162,057
If god is eternal, don't you think he'd get a bit bored? Trillions and trillions of years just sitting in space then one day "OMG I'M GOING TO MAKE THE EARTH AND THESE PEOPLE". I mean unless there were people and universes before us but I haven't heard many religious people down with that idea.

Also the idea of creating people and setting up these ridiculous experiments to play out and then in the end burn a bunch of them and take the rest up to heaven. If you used the brain "God" gave you, it would cause you to be skeptical of anything based completely off of faith. One can argue that the reason why he doesn't save everybody is because they didn't have blind faith. If you have the faith to believe in christianity, you're "faith" would have you believing in any religion depending on where you were raised. That is why these people from different areas feel as strongly about the religion they believe as somebody else. There's a pretty solid chance they're all wrong, but they have strong convictions regardless.

Also if doing good deeds matters, why would god burn somebody for eternity in hell that did great things for people gave to the poor anonymously etc simply because they remained somewhat skeptical? At the same time somebody who killed people, raped people, burned houses, stole money, skibladed and never once believed in god can except jesus on his death bed and go to heaven?

Then you have so many religious people hating on and mocking other religions as if those people are really so much different than them.



Mar 26 2014 4:59PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
If I was an all powerful person I would not get bored.

"If you used the brain "God" gave you, it would cause you to be skeptical of anything based completely off of faith." It is not completely based off faith, you can see God in His creation. Do you have faith in evolution or whatever you believe in?

Doing good deeds does not matter, because the requirements to get into heaven is that we are perfect, and obviously no one is perfect other than Jesus. That is why He had to die so he could take on our sin(imperfections), and we could be seen perfect in the eyes of God. The only way for this exchange of perfection and imperfection is through a relationship with Him.

"Then you have so many religious people hating on and mocking other religions as if those people are really so much different than them." Like I said above no one is perfect.

Also I loved this "At the same time somebody who...skibladed and never once believed in God can except Jesus on his death bed and go to heaven?"




Mar 26 2014 5:24PM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
I was following ya until you brought up heaven. Yeah, the aged old belief that life down here sucks but don't worry! Heaven will be amazing!
Mar 26 2014 5:28PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51621 - Karma: 162,057
For the record I'm bored today so I thought I would jump in. Whether you actually believe what you post is irrelevant. I shall reply until I find something better to do.

You may be able to see what you believe is god in his creation but why can't it have been created by any other god, random monster, power ranger etc.

So nothing you do on earth matters as long as you say you love jesus before you die. That makes sense. Do a bunch of terrible shit but later be seen as perfect versus a person who was imperfect but still did some great things being seen as firewood.

I refuse to believe skibladers go to heaven. It's against the moral fabric of my being. Skiers and boarders can both get along up there, that's totally cool but skibladers would just ruin the vibe.

What about gapers? What does the bible say about them? Oh you snaked 2,936,497 people in your life but you believe in jesus now so we're just going to forget about that?
Mar 26 2014 5:40PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
WELL IF GOD IS ETERNAL MAYBE THE UNIVERSE IS ETERNAL. If you can belief a demigod can always be, why not the universe as well, your argument makes no sense.
Mar 26 2014 8:15PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37379 - Karma: 119,905
god backwards is dog



Mar 26 2014 8:18PM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
You just blew my mind
Mar 26 2014 8:39PM
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airplaneface
Posts: 219 - Karma: 685
Maybe the universe is eternal good luck testing that though
Mar 26 2014 9:23PM
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Parks.
Posts: 5612 - Karma: 1,093
haven't been reading this thread religiously (hahaha PUN). Da fuck are discussing now? obviously not my original question
Mar 26 2014 9:30PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,175
The reason that you are confused is that you're forgetting a key attribute of God. That being God is SUPERNATURAL, meaning He exists outside of His creation. His creation is NATURAL, being the universe and everything within it. See we can't begin to grasp how God can be eternal (always been, always will be) because we don't experience that in our natural world. But that clearly isn't the case in the supernatural world, the world that exists OUTSIDE of the world we dwell in.
One could also stress the ontological argument. It argues for the existence of a Being that which no greater can be conceived. It is greater for a Being with these qualities to exist rather than to not exist and therefore it is greater for this Being to exist and be eternal rather than have a beginning and no end or a beginning and an end.
Mar 26 2014 9:32PM
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-MK-
Posts: 3253 - Karma: 5,332
Yeah, its fucked. And no, you can't trust people. So maybe we just shouldn't trust catholic churches due to some individuals fucked up life's... Unfortunately that's what it comes down to

But this should not change your view on the religion, but maybe your view on society
Mar 26 2014 9:38PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
I believe the universe is supernatural, how dare you be so closed minded and talk down to me because of what I believe.
Mar 26 2014 9:40PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,175
If you're not trolling then I am somewhat confused by your belief. Natural means something that isn't created by our hands. The universe isn't created by our hands and therefore is natural. Supernatural means (of a manifestation or event) attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature. The universe can be understood through the use of science and it is at the will of nature. If indeed there is a supernatural entity of the universe then that must be what was (and is but outside of it) before and the cause of the creation of the universe. That supernatural entity is God.
Mar 26 2014 9:54PM
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joshua
Posts: 5046 - Karma: 1,280
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/cosmological-argument/

I think you are getting at the Cosmological argument and/or argument from contingency?

Mar 26 2014 10:04PM
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joshua
Posts: 5046 - Karma: 1,280
Its really a very simple argument but pretty interesting.
Mar 26 2014 10:08PM
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tootinlard
Posts: 11 - Karma: 44
I am pretty religious i go to church almost every sunday but if my pastor or whatever did that i dont think i would go to church after that if he came back but untill he left i would go back to my church cause im still at the age where that can happen to me
Mar 26 2014 10:13PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,175
Yes I'm using part of the cosmological argument. There's actually an incredible website that answers many of the questions posed about Christianity and I encourage any and all of you to visit it because there is a wealth of information in it.
This page covers the arguments for the existence of God but you can navigate to other questions.
http://www.gotquestions.org/argument-existence-God.html
Mar 26 2014 10:21PM
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special-J
Posts: 1572 - Karma: 4,477
all the catholic corruption aside, I still fail to see how Christianity itself gets such a bad wrap. The religion promotes nothing but the general goodness of people. Whether you believe its a ridiculous, scientifically impossible lie or not, you can't tell me the ideas and values aren't positive.

Obviously I'm not talking about the people who think they are better than everyone else for going to church- it's supposed to be the complete opposite. It's a shame there are so many outliers who stain the religion.
Mar 26 2014 10:25PM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
I was raised Catholic and lots of things bother me. To start, they change the rules at will. For example, the idea that heaven is this magical place that if you follow the rules you'll be allowed in. People waste there lives trying to meet these made up credentials when there is no mystical place that is better than earth. It was a way to control the population centuries ago (still working). Might as well start promising Catholics 72 virgins like other religions. They already try to pretend it's paradise.
Then, there's the Catholic guilt. They try to make everybody feel bad about everything. People think God is constantly watching them. Well, he's not. Yeah, centuries ago when they thought the world was flat that was hell of a way to control people. Just make people think somebody is watching. Well nobody is watching. People can be good people without some wizard watching over them. Unless your dumb. Then, you need some fake rules to follow.
Then, there's the whole anti - gay and anti - abortion bullshit. Of course I know lots of Christians aren't exactly against gays, but, they'd pretend to be at church. Nobody in charge wants to stand up for equality. They already change the rules as they please. Yet they promote hate against gays or women who aren't ready for kids yet (abortion).
Mar 27 2014 5:36AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
^Damn I notice now some Grammer mistakes and no actual space when I hit enter on mobile.. whoops
Mar 27 2014 5:39AM
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-benedetto
Posts: 5238 - Karma: 1,359
How about 500 years ago when people had to pay the church for their penance? Tell me it doesn't smell like you just stepped in bull shit.
Mar 27 2014 8:00AM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
That's very convenient for you in this argument, you made up a magical man that applies to a new magical set of rules, that literally nothing that has ever existed before has to apply by it, yet no actual proof of it. There is honestly no point in arguing with you, it's like me trying to have a fake Pokémon battle with a three-year-old and he makes up a Pokémon That does a million damage per second and can never get hurt. There's no point continuing it, I suggest you look up some of the theories science believes about the universe. Like How the universe is going through a constant stretching and collapsing phase, so there was something before the big. As of right now I really like that theory, but as always evidence will come up and my opinion can change.
Mar 27 2014 8:16AM
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-benedetto
Posts: 5238 - Karma: 1,359
*multiverse
Mar 27 2014 9:08AM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,175
Well I didn't make that up. That is an actual attribute of God explained in the Bible.

Here's two articles that I encourage you to read that cover some of the theories that I'm sure fall under the ones you implied in your post about the universe. They are String Theory, M Theory, and the Theory of Everything (TOA). I also encourage you to check out The Case for a Creator by Lee Strobel.

http://www.gotquestions.org/string-theory.html
http://www.blogos.org/thinkabout/superstrings.html

I would also like to point out that a multiverse would not disprove the existence of God and that the theory actually crumbles in the face of science. I'll post an article by Dr. William Lane Craig that addresses the multiverse theory.
http://www.reasonablefaith.org/multiverse-and-the-design-argument
Mar 27 2014 12:46PM
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JAHpow
Posts: 7282 - Karma: 17,175
^Oops that was supposed to quote zzzskizzz last post
Mar 27 2014 12:47PM
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