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DlCKThe China–Cornell–Oxford Project was a large observational study conducted throughout the 1980s in rural China, jointly funded by Cornell University, the University of Oxford, and the government of China.[1] In May 1990, The New York Times termed the study "the Grand Prix of epidemiology."[2]
The first two major studies were led by T. Colin Campbell, professor of nutritional biochemistry at Cornell, who summarized the results in his book, The China Study (2004). Other lead researchers were Chen Junshi, Deputy Director of Institute of Nutrition and Food Hygiene at the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine in Beijing, Richard Peto of the University of Oxford, and Li Junyao of the China Cancer Institute.[3]
The study examined the diets, lifestyle, and disease characteristics of 6,500 people in 65 rural Chinese counties, comparing the prevalence of disease characteristics, excluding causes of death such as accidents.[4]
californiagrownJust keep banging your head against the wall. The china study is bunk, and has been accepted as such for the past few decades by the scientific community. Read up on it, seriously. It's a case study on bad science.
As for my other points, you have yet to address them, other than reposting the article I was referring to...
I get the feeling you think, that I think veggie protein is bad. It's not. My stance, is that for the majority of people in the gym dairy based protein is just as good yet significantly cheaper. That's all I've been saying.
DlCKIt's "come on man"
I dislike you.
californiagrownfor the majority of people in the gym dairy based protein is just as good yet significantly cheaper. That's all I've been saying.
mirozYou seem to misread people's posts, adding animosity where there is none and finding argument in semantics (which often turns into real arguments). You are so defensive about your assertions you won't consider any new ideas or perspectives. I don't think cali was picking a fight with you, I think he was asking legitimate questions...
DlCKAnd you are wrong, that's what I've been saying!
Pure Pea protein $5.69/lb
http://www.amazon.com/100-Pure-Protein-grams-Pwdr/dp/B0017OFSDW
Pure Hemp protein $9.92/lb
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0012C2GFM/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?qid=1439497695&sr=8-2&pi=AC_SY200_QL40&keywords=hemp+protein+powder&dpPl=1&dpID=511amsgUXpL&ref=
Pure Rice protein $9.83/lb
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00014DLC4/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1439498294&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SY200_QL40&keywords=rice+protein+powder&dpPl=1&dpID=51-K5frezVL&ref=plSrch
Pure Whey protein $9.79/lb
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B002XULC5W/ref=mp_s_a_1_6?qid=1439497834&sr=8-6&pi=AC_SX110_SY165_QL70&keywords=pure+whey+protein&dpPl=1&dpID=51H5JwUA5iL&ref=plSrchPure Casein protein $12.83/lb
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00IUHMO1I/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?qid=1439498062&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SY200_QL40&keywords=pure+casein+protein&dpPl=1&dpID=51oe5xGG80L&ref=plSrch
If anything it's all the same and just depends on whatever good deals are out there. So if they all cost the same why not get the superior product, or why not get veggie protein?
DlCKNo, Californiagrownparanoid won't except my new idea/perspective which is a much newer idea than whether we should take whey or not. You have it backwards. I posted the "new" product and he asked me what "that veggie shit" was.
californiagrownWhat is the $/gram protein?
The dymatize elite WHEY I buy is $0.71/serving at 25grams protein per serving.
DlCKyou are paying 2.8 cents per gram of protein
the pea protein is 1.2 cents per gram of protein
the rice protein is 2.7 cents per gram of protein
Its not cheaper.
I dont doubt you have a high tolerance for milk product but that doesnt account for all the other negative side effect of dairy products I listed earlier.
Extra vitamins and minerals add to the value of the powder making it an even better deal. Satiety IS NOT a bad thing.
californiagrownA decent diet an multi gets you enough micronutrients, and I could argue about chemicals in your veggie protein till the cows come home haha.
Those are great deals you found. One of the complaints I read about most with veggie protein (pea especially), is that the taste pretty terrible, and you need a blender- a shaker just doesn't cut it.
What are your experiences?
DlCKThe mrm stuff I posted earlier is organic, no chemicals. I love the taste of it too. You are right about the shakers though, its chalky with just water and a shaker. I use a hand blender and almond milk and it tastes incredible.
DlCKThe mrm stuff I posted earlier is organic, no chemicals. I love the taste of it too. You are right about the shakers though, its chalky with just water and a shaker. I use a hand blender and almond milk and it tastes incredible.
californiagrownHow much is that stuff per gram protein? Could be a good add in to my morning smoothie and a good way to vary my protein sources even more!
BenWhitLot of back pedaling going on around here. I don't like it. Not one bit.
californiagrownHow much is that stuff per gram protein? Could be a good add in to my morning smoothie and a good way to vary my protein sources even more!
DlCK4.5 cents per gram of protein.
Supplement Facts
Serving Size: 1 scoop(38g)
Servings Per Container: 30
Ingredient Amount % % Daily Value****
Calories 150
Calories from Fat 30
Total Fat 3g 5
Saturated Fat 0g 0
Trans Fat 0g 0
Cholesterol 0g 0
Sodium 290mg 12
Potassium 50mg 1
Total Carbohydrates 7.5g 2
Dietary Fiber 4g 16
Sugars 1.5 †
Sugar Alcohols 2g †
Protein 22g 44
Omega 3 (From Hemp, Chia & Flax Powders) 740mg †
Omega 6 (From Hemp. Chia & Flax Powders) 360mg †
MRM High ORAC Antioxidant Blend 300mg †
-Grape Seed & Skin Extract, Blueberry Extract, Raspberry Powder, Cranberry Powder, Prune Powder,
-Cherry Powder, Bilberry Extracy, Strawberry Powder, Broccoli Cruciferous Extract, Spinach Powder
-Tomato Powder, Carrot Powder, Onion Powder
Omega 9 (From Hemp, Chia, & Flax Powders)
There is a lot more going on than just plain whey so it's worth the insignificant increase. compare it to the whey you have and see the difference.
californiagrownMy normal diet covers everything else. im looking for a protein supplement... and at double the price of my normal whey, ill pass. If i can get a read on the quality of certain Pea protein powders, id be interested in trying those out in my morning smoothie.
DlCKI want to hear this perfect diet of yours.
what product do you use?
your math is off a bit btw.
What does it cost per gram for organic whey protein?
californiagrownDon't worry though, WHEY will remain my go to powder haha. It works out to a similar price, and is much more convenient... Not to mention quick absorbing.
californiagrownMy diet has dark leafy greens at every meal, berries at breakfast, and various veggies with hummus and nuts for snacks... amongst the various meats and starchy carbs i also eat.
See one of my above posts for the protein i use, and its cost.
Im not sure why you are taking this so personally?
BenWhitI know that I cannot tolerate products with egg albumen in them. I know this because when I take them on an empty stomach, my farts smell like rotten eggs. I'm all for a good protein fart, but egg albumen tears my digestive tract apart. I've been on the same bottle of MusclePharm combat for 3 months now because I'm having a tough time tolerating it immediately post workout.
I also wonder if I'm beginning to develop a certain degree of lactose intolerance. Growing up, I used to drink milk with dinner every night. When I got to college, I stopped doing that. Now, when I have a milk/ice cream heavy night, I get the stink farts/shits the next day. It may also be a result of crushing a pint of ice cream at a time.
DlCKI'm not I just wanted to hear what your macros are and what you do to meet your micros. almost nobody meets the rda for every vitamin and mineral on a daily basis So I was intrigued by what it is you eat in order to have a perfect diet on a daily basis. I'm genuinely curious as to how you do it. Is it just a multivitamin that does it for you? What exactly do you mean by "starchy" carbs?
do you by 10 pounds of protein At a time?
californiagrownI don't count my macros because, frankly, I don't need to. No one does unless they're prepping for a show.
DlCKReally? No one should know what macros they need in their diet? Really? Obesity is an epidemic in our country.
Just say your not sure instead of saying stupid shit like this.
DlCKReally? No one should know what macros they need in their diet? Really? Obesity is an epidemic in our country.
Just say your not sure instead of saying stupid shit like this.
DlCKReally? No one should know what macros they need in their diet? Really? Obesity is an epidemic in our country.
Just say your not sure instead of saying stupid shit like this.
californiagrownThis is a thread meant for constructive discussion and advice.
cobra_commanderas far as obesity is concerned, macros are mostly irrelevant.
it doesn't matter how dialed your macros are and how 'clean' you eat. If you are eating 500 calories than you need everyday, you will get fat.
If if you are eating 250 calories less than you need, you will be lean. It can be a mix of McDonalds, Arby's, and Dunkun Doughnuts.
At the end of the day, calories in, calories out will dominate your body compensation. Dialing in your macros, timing your macros, and cleaning up your food sources will help fuel performance, and help a little bit with body composition. they only build however, on the foundation that your total cal consumption sets.
DlCKI've been trying to give you advice for a page and a half but you are too content and perfect to accept it.
cobra_commanderas far as obesity is concerned, macros are mostly irrelevant.
it doesn't matter how dialed your macros are and how 'clean' you eat. If you are eating 500 calories than you need everyday, you will get fat.
If if you are eating 250 calories less than you need, you will be lean. It can be a mix of McDonalds, Arby's, and Dunkun Doughnuts.
At the end of the day, calories in, calories out will dominate your body compensation. Dialing in your macros, timing your macros, and cleaning up your food sources will help fuel performance, and help a little bit with body composition. they only build however, on the foundation that your total cal consumption sets.
DlCKI've been trying to give you advice for a page and a half but you are too content and perfect to accept it.
AVOID DAIRY PRODUCTS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE IN EVERY SITUATION INCLUDING PROTEIN POWDERS. YES, WHEY PROTEIN WORKS VERY WELL BUT IT IS DERIVED FROM DAIRY AND THEREFORE SHOULD BE AVOIDED, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE EATING 3 POUNDS OF IT EVERY MONTH.
WHILE THE PRODUCT I POSTED IS SLIGHTLY MORE EXPENSIVE, MOST VEGGIE PROTEINS ARE MUCH CHEAPER THAN MOST WHEY PROTEINS.
http://www.nutritionmd.org/nutrition_tips/nutrition_tips_understand_foods/dairy.html
MY ADVICE TO ALL YOU WONDERFUL PEOPLE IS TO GO AGAINST WHAT YOU "KNOW" ABOUY DAIRY AND CONSIDER ELIMINATING IT ENTIRELY. THIS INCLUDES WHEY AND CASEIN
you can choose not to take my advice and that's totally cool, but dont attempt to label what I'm saying as "bro science"
DlCKI've been trying to give you advice for a page and a half but you are too content and perfect to accept it.
AVOID DAIRY PRODUCTS IF AT ALL POSSIBLE IN EVERY SITUATION INCLUDING PROTEIN POWDERS. YES, WHEY PROTEIN WORKS VERY WELL BUT IT IS DERIVED FROM DAIRY AND THEREFORE SHOULD BE AVOIDED, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE EATING 3 POUNDS OF IT EVERY MONTH.
WHILE THE PRODUCT I POSTED IS SLIGHTLY MORE EXPENSIVE, MOST VEGGIE PROTEINS ARE MUCH CHEAPER THAN MOST WHEY PROTEINS.
http://www.nutritionmd.org/nutrition_tips/nutrition_tips_understand_foods/dairy.html
MY ADVICE TO ALL YOU WONDERFUL PEOPLE IS TO GO AGAINST WHAT YOU "KNOW" ABOUY DAIRY AND CONSIDER ELIMINATING IT ENTIRELY. THIS INCLUDES WHEY AND CASEIN
you can choose not to take my advice and that's totally cool, but dont attempt to label what I'm saying as "bro science"
cobra_commanderas far as obesity is concerned, macros are mostly irrelevant.
it doesn't matter how dialed your macros are and how 'clean' you eat. If you are eating 500 calories than you need everyday, you will get fat.
If if you are eating 250 calories less than you need, you will be lean. It can be a mix of McDonalds, Arby's, and Dunkun Doughnuts.
At the end of the day, calories in, calories out will dominate your body compensation. Dialing in your macros, timing your macros, and cleaning up your food sources will help fuel performance, and help a little bit with body composition. they only build however, on the foundation that your total cal consumption sets.
saskskierYou sound about as pretentious as a vegan crossfitter.
Get off your high horse. Different things work for different people.
louie.miragsI disagree with the "as long as it fits your macros" when it comes to fast food and soda. Look into the negative effects of those foods. Look into where Mcdonalds gets their burgers from and how they prepare them. Also, diet soda says zero calories. But, that shit gets you fat.
The quality of your food is just as important as calories in calories out.
DlCKNew information is usually ridiculed.
You response is about as generic as they come.
75% of the worlds population is lactose intolerant. There is NOTHING in dairy that you can't get from other foods.
The negatives out weigh the positives.
Not to mention how incredibly Unsustainable the dairy industry is.
saskskierThat isn't new information.
louie.miragsI disagree with the "as long as it fits your macros" when it comes to fast food and soda. Look into the negative effects of those foods. Look into where Mcdonalds gets their burgers from and how they prepare them. Also, diet soda says zero calories. But, that shit gets you fat.
The quality of your food is just as important as calories in calories out.
DlCKNaw bro as long as you burn more calories your good. Everyone knows that sugar fat and protein are all the same and it doesn't matter how much of each you get as long as your not lazy. I literally only drink Mountain Dew and I'm perfectly fine because I only drink 1800 calories worth.
californiagrownSo you guys have proved the 2nd law of thermodynamics to be false?
Having correct macros is certainly an easier way to alter body comp, but if you think eating at a sustained calric deficit will not force your body to lose weight, idk what to tell you.
DlCKGo tell your grandma milk is bad. See what she says.
californiagrownSo you guys have proved the 2nd law of thermodynamics to be false?
Having correct macros is certainly an easier way to alter body comp, but if you think eating at a sustained calric deficit will not force your body to lose weight, idk what to tell you.
louie.miragsIf you think we should promote people being "skinny fat" I don't know what to tell you.
Fast food and diet soda are horrible for you. I don't give a fuck how many calories you eat. This is a serious thread as you have stated. Promoting calories in calories out eating fast food is ridiculous. If a fat beginner joins the thread and read that he is going to stay fat and unhealthy.
Plus, there is more to health than looking skinny or fat. So, no need to promote mcdonalds and diet soda being OK iifym.
californiagrownSo you guys have proved the 2nd law of thermodynamics to be false?
Having correct macros is certainly an easier way to alter body comp, but if you think eating at a sustained calric deficit will not force your body to lose weight, idk what to tell you.
saskskierSaying milk is bad because it doesn't work for some people is like saying nuts or grains or anything else are bad because some people are allergic to them.
DlCKThis isn't physics. Are you trolling me right now?
Do you know the difference between between fructose and glucose?
What about MCTs or LCTs?
The food you eat has thermogenic properties. Did you know the calories in beer dont count because of the thermogeic properties of beer?
do you know the difference between anabolic and catabolic?
What is you base metobolic rate? It's surely not the same as mine.
joe and jim are identical twins. If joe eats only high fat, high sugar meals and Jim eats only lean meats and veggies but both have the same caloric Intake will joe weigh the same as Jim?
I understand that you don't want to believe anything I have to say because you don't like me so will you listen to a Harvard professor and cardiologist?
"This study shows that conventional wisdom — to eat everything in moderation, eat fewer calories and avoid fatty foods — isn't the best approach," Dr. Dariush Mozaffarian, a cardiologist and epidemiologist at the Harvard School of Public Health and lead author of the study, said in an interview. "What you eat makes quite a difference. Just counting calories won't matter much unless you look at the kinds of calories you're eating."
- Dr. Mozaffarian, Harvard Cardiologist
californiagrownI think eating a "typically healthy" diet based around generally meeting your total calories is a better long term way to go about it.
californiagrownScience ain't your strong suit, huh?
Please explain to me how someone who takes in 2000Kcals, and burns 2100Kcals can gain weight/mass? Seriously.
If you can, you are in line for Nobel Peace prize.
californiagrownScience ain't your strong suit, huh?
Please explain to me how someone who takes in 2000Kcals, and burns 2100Kcals can gain weight/mass? Seriously.
If you can, you are in line for Nobel Peace prize.
DlCKYou are ignoring pretty much my entire post.
