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Ask a Mormon

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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
What's up guys, I know ns is pretty anti-religion but I thought it'd be cool to have you guys ask whatever you want and I'll do my best to give you guys accurate responses. I'm LDS but I have a bit of a nuanced approach to religion so we may have more in common than you think. It'll be cool if we get some legit questions in here but it is nsg so I'm prepared for the worst!
Jan 12 2014 12:27AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
Hey man, that's not good advice.

Religion is for the simple minded. The opposite of finding your full potential. It is having a book explain to you the reasons for birth, dying, morals etc. Instead of learning these lessons on your own. Religion is a way to control the population. And last, but not least, religious people can be really stuck up too when they don't except outsiders or people with separate ways of thinking. (ex. the view of gays by some Christians)
Jan 12 2014 3:17AM
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eheath
Posts: 61604 - Karma: 123,122
i find this insanely ironic coming from the guy who is very aggressive about his (stupid) vegan beliefs.
Jan 12 2014 3:21AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
Yes everyone except for self proclaimed atheists ( the smallest fraction of people when it comes to religious belief might I add) is simple minded
Jan 12 2014 3:29AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
In fact ill let you in on a little secret. your no more simple minded, or smarter than anyone else. your average, you were told what to believe, listened to enough people, and now have your own set of believes, that doesn't make you smarter than anyone else because you believe existence happened in a different way.
Jan 12 2014 3:36AM
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ski.cats
Posts: 577 - Karma: 352
so you cant see some people using religion as an indoctrinated crutch?

also, *youre
Jan 12 2014 3:38AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
Hey man, I didn't mean to offend you.

What is more simple: 1. Taking the bible's explanation of life, or figuring it out for yourself? 2. Being a good person because of fear (of God) or figuring out for yourself the right way to live? See where I'm going with this?
Jan 12 2014 3:38AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
I can see it working both ways.

also, *you're if you are going to grammar nazi, do it correctly.
Jan 12 2014 3:40AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
again, you are obviously offended. I did not mean that. I also did not assume I was better or smarter than anybody else. I did mean to hit a weak spot in your ego. This was a thread about religion. You are the one getting butthurt. That is why religious groups made it taboo to discuss religion, because they do not want discussion. Once the faith gets questioned, it is only a matter of time.
It is OK to think outside your comfort zone sometimes...
Jan 12 2014 3:41AM
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doGelyst
Posts: 2492 - Karma: 509
somewhat unrelated but

science > *

tried and tested. don't believe it? try it for yourself.

not just some fiction book.

as for the whole history / creation thing, who knows. earth is 65 million years old. Us current humans are 10k yrs tops. Piss in a bucket on the grand scheme.
Jan 12 2014 3:42AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
Your putting yourself up higher than everyone else because your choosing not to be simplistic?
Jan 12 2014 3:43AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
Im not offended at all, i deal with dill weeds like you all the time. Hell I'm living with one right now.

honestly if you think that people have never thought about other types of existence, than obviously you are the one who needs to think about his opinions of certain people.
Jan 12 2014 3:45AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo I just mean have your own opinions. If you want your opinion to match up with the bible or whatever that is your call. If you have never taken a second to realize that what you were taught growing up may not be true, then take that second now.
Jan 12 2014 3:46AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
I am so confused to be honest. Why are you resorting to name calling, but say you are not offended? What do you mean people never thought about other types of exitense? I never said that? I do like discussions though, this is a forum...
Jan 12 2014 3:49AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
I have, i self proclaimed myself as an atheist for 3 years. Than i took a good look at what the big bang theory etc... and i discovered, that it is unfeasible that the entire universe to have just started, something had to have started it all.
Jan 12 2014 3:49AM
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louie.mirags
Posts: 6015 - Karma: 5,029
word I hear ya.. that's deep
Jan 12 2014 3:51AM
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MNS
Posts: 5386 - Karma: 3,241
Haha. I can't tell if you're serious
Jan 12 2014 5:48AM
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DENIM_CHICKEN
Posts: 526 - Karma: 2,558
Wait, are you elder cunningham??
Jan 12 2014 8:33AM
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FuckAllOfYou
Posts: 3864 - Karma: 2,518
This thread is incredibly sad.
Jan 12 2014 9:03AM
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BackseatBrah
Posts: 139 - Karma: 118
If people try to justify religion by saying people who "believe" in science (lol) are just listening to what they are told at a young age, that's incredibly stupid, find another way.
Jan 12 2014 10:39AM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
http://www.utlm.org/newsletters/no68.htm#JOSEPH%20SMITH%20GUILTY
Jan 12 2014 7:39PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
How does a church led by a prophet of god make mistakes?
Jan 12 2014 7:40PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Then, what's the point of labeling yourself as a "mormon?"
Jan 12 2014 7:44PM
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Spagett+
Posts: 3499 - Karma: 14,884
LOL this mormon kid was so nice and NS was such a dick to him.

Also after seeing book of mormon I want to be mormon. Cause a mormon just believes.
OP:

Jan 12 2014 8:01PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
We believe in continuing revelation but they are not infallible. They are human beings and make mistakes like you or I and have certain limitations.
Jan 12 2014 8:03PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
I don't follow... The world of mormonism is much broader than most people realize, you don't have to be 100% conservative.
Jan 12 2014 8:05PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
I figured it would be this trial. There is considerable debate still as to whether this trail happened because the official court transcript is lost. I tend to think it happened but I don't see a misdemeanor in glass-looking invalidating his prophetic calling. He certainly wasn't perfect and I don't expect him to be. Bottom line is, you have to read the book of mormon and pray to know whether it is true or not. I have no problem with people not believing but I'm just trying to shed some light on my perspective that it has to be a spiritual experience rather than an occam's razor approach.
Jan 12 2014 8:20PM
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eheath
Posts: 61604 - Karma: 123,122
I'm convinced you're a troll now. How could anyone believe and "pray" to god but yet believes in science. You also have the complete opposite beliefs of any legitimate mormon.
Jan 12 2014 8:23PM
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Wallisch_pl
Posts: 5260 - Karma: 1,022
OP is it true that Mormons have triannual sacrifices? Which are of up to 5,OOO people?
Jan 12 2014 8:23PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
If divine revelation can be false then what's the point of it?
Jan 12 2014 8:26PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Is there anything of which you can conceive that would invalidate his prophetic calling to you?
Jan 12 2014 8:28PM
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Jib_High
Posts: 189 - Karma: 224
So Atheism the word that means lack of belief in a deity or deities is a religion. Please tell me how that makes any sense to you.
Jan 12 2014 8:35PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Who said I haven't had a spiritual experience? Pretty sure that when I look up into the sky and see this, that counts.

Click for larger image
Jan 12 2014 8:38PM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
Staring up at the sky is not a spiritual experience.
Jan 12 2014 8:40PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
You're doing it wrong then.
Jan 12 2014 8:50PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
Do I really? Or do I, an actual mormon not fit into the narrative of what a mormon "is" according to your self ascribed narrative? You're very condescending, but I am not a troll. I know TONS of mormons who believe in science, evolution and things of that nature and all pray to God.
Jan 12 2014 8:55PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
I never accused you of not having spiritual experiences. I was just trying to share my experiences. If we knew each other I'm sure we'd have a lot in common and obviously disagree on others.
Jan 12 2014 8:58PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
No. We don't sacrifice anything. We do have a sacrament where we partake of bread and water as symbols of Christ's body and blood, similar to the eucharist in other forms of Christianity.
Jan 12 2014 9:02PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Not directly, but it was implicit in this statement: "it has to be a spiritual experience rather than an occam's razor approach."

I don't see how Ocaam's Razor and spiritual experiences are mutually exclusive. In fact, I would think that OR's demands belief that spiritual experience is a neurobiological function with a pretty clear evolutionary genesis.



Jan 12 2014 9:11PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
I guess not, because I base my beliefs on the fruits that he produced, i.e. book of mormon, pearl of great price, the doctrine and covenants and temple rites.
Jan 12 2014 9:19PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
I was arguing that religious belief is much more complex and difficult to believe in than simply dying, and if you accept OR's approach then religion is not for you. But I can't deny the spiritual experiences I've had. Btw, I've seen the video before and I do like it and I certainly think it's a valid viewpoint, I just think there's more to it than that.
Jan 12 2014 9:27PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Ok then could anything convince you those texts were false?
Jan 12 2014 9:30PM
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Wallisch_pl
Posts: 5260 - Karma: 1,022
why do you gUYS THINK IT'S FUNNY TO EAT CHRIST
Jan 12 2014 9:32PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
What if I were to tell you I've had a deep spiritual experience by which I came to know for certain that there is no intelligent force behind the structure of the universe? Can you describe the spiritual experiences you've had?
Jan 12 2014 9:35PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
There is already considerable evidence showing that the book of abraham isn't a literal translation of the papyri it was claimed to derive from. The Book of Mormon has many anachronisms and problems pointing toward 19th century authorship. There are many good arguments that for both sides I could cite but I don't know how productive that will be. For people who believe and believe they have spiritual experiences, nothing can convince them it is false. I know people who believe the book of mormon is 19th century literature but believe the church is still true and claim the book of mormon is "inspired fiction".
Jan 12 2014 9:39PM
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stickski
Posts: 1938 - Karma: 1,529
In person, I could do a decent job describing everything. I'm afraid everything I want to say is far too long winded to type up on an internet forum. If you had that spiritual experience I would respect your right to believe that. Spiritual experiences don't make you know; I still only believe and rely on faith despite my experiences and religious conviction.
Jan 12 2014 9:43PM
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-benedetto
Posts: 5238 - Karma: 1,359
The chances have to be 1 in somewhere near infinity that the answers to all of life's questions were on some golden tablet on some farm in Upstate, NY..

Ok..more of Mormon bash than a question
Jan 12 2014 9:45PM
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FuckAllOfYou
Posts: 3864 - Karma: 2,518
I just think the whole idea of a religion, in such a world determined by chance and law, with such natural tendencies (see: laws) and solid processes that it can only be made up. The more I learn, experience and grow, the more religion just seems silly and sadly desperate. I'm not trying to put myself higher than anyone, as I struggled with being a christian and believing my whole life up until about a year ago. With the way the world works, religion (and all paranormal/supernatural shit) just cannot happen or exist. I just don't see how.

whatever people interpret, it's coincidence.

that's just my view.
Jan 12 2014 9:53PM
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Bill.Nye
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 2,109
Ok, so you don't "know" the religion is true, you acknowledge that religion likely has a naturalistic origin, you acknowledge that Joseph Smith likely simply wrote the BoM and didn't transcribe it from anywhere, you acknowledge that the religious texts aren't literal or even original in many cases, and you accept the scientific evidence (not the biblical account) or the origin of life, the universe, and everything in it.

I guess my question is, why use the label "mormon" on yourself? Isn't this classification which you have adopted merely a consequence of your cultural circumstance, and therefore inherently divisive for no real reason? Why not shed that label and simply be a "person" like everyone else, in stead of a "mormon?"
Jan 12 2014 10:59PM
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eheath
Posts: 61604 - Karma: 123,122
Click for larger image
Jan 12 2014 11:02PM
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