nvm, the US is going to shit...

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Oh god... shoot me now.

Sarah
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Nov 30 2004 9:44PM

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the best part is the poll next to it.

-Pat

Nov 30 2004 9:44PM

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bigJ

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darn, that sucks

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Nov 30 2004 9:45PM

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freeski1620

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i quit!

'what?' Lauren every time you ask her a question for the first time!

skiing what i thought this was a porn site and every one i was talking to were sexy ppl ..i thought skiing was a sex term we all uesed. damn!-twintiprider

Nov 30 2004 9:48PM

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jarossamdb7

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im not suprised
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Democrats are sexy: since when have you seen a good looking peice of elephant?

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Nov 30 2004 9:48PM

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Haha yeah, I noticed that poll. Classic.

Sarah
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-Jay (rebel)

Nov 30 2004 9:49PM

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jarossamdb7

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about that they are teaching religion in school^

and ya the poll is fuckin awsome
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Democrats are sexy: since when have you seen a good looking peice of elephant?

www.johnkerryisadouchebagbutimvotingforhimanyway.com

''When they attacked us'' - Rudolph Giuliani former republican mayor of NYC referring to Iraq in an interview on NBC news after the presidential debate

Nov 30 2004 9:49PM

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SmoKinSkier

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I see nothing wrong with providing 2 theories and letting the students decide but thats just me

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-kamikaze

Nov 30 2004 9:51PM

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there is a lot wrong with it. ever seen fossils? science may be somewhat screwy in the ways it gets information, but it's rock solid for the most part. Evolution may be a theory, but there is a lot of scientific fact to back it up. intelligetn design is complete and utter bullshit. it's not a theory, it's religious bullshit.
-Pat

Nov 30 2004 9:53PM

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SchweitzerSki

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who needs science? just get rid of it and the us would be happy.
-------------------------------

'One celebrity that irritates me is that commercial voice-actor Thurl Ravenscoft. His performances as Tony the Tiger have recently become wan, dispassionate, and uninspired. Ravenscoft's newborn apathy threatens the vitality of a great American icon. I can scarcely consider such a tragedy without also bracing myself for convulsive fits of grief-grief of a fallen hero'-John Symms

Nov 30 2004 9:55PM

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to quote a quote from fark...

'Well, we've developed an admittedly imperfect but nonetheless workable screening process to keep every idea under the sun from being taught in basic k-12 core courses as fact or even reasonable alternatives.
The lesson plans have to be structured logically; you can't teach algebra before you teach arithmetic. The material has to be widely accepted by the relevant professionals, it's best to teach material which has withstood the test of time. In science or history the lessons have to be backed by evidence or make sense, and the material needs to underscore the basics because we are talking about K-12 curricula.
ID comes up short on all these criteria. IDC makes no valid testable predictions, it is not widely accepted, and far from withstanding the test of time IDC has failed miserably and was rejected long ago. Furthermore what little has been presented as candidate lesson plans underscoring ID as advocated by the Discovery Institute rests entirely on criticisms of evolutionary biology (many of which are hardly credible and are in fact well known Young Earth Creationist crap), Irreducible Complexity, or mathematics involving algorithms and topology, none of which can be taught effectively to students in K-12 schools without substantial prerequisite course work in basic skills.

Precisely because IDC fails all these criteria, the IDCists try end run those safeguards and steamroll over those protocols by appealing directly to grass roots orgs. The IDCists lobby-just as the holohoaxers lobby-mostly to religious groups, cultural prejudice and bigotry, and ignorance by presenting highly dubious misinformation to the public as equally valid to the mainstream conventional explanations. Their goal is openly stated; to bring intense political pressure on local school boards, elected officials, and textbook publishers, to teach these fringe ideas as equally valid regardless if they've met the above criteria that all other curricula must meet.

To allow that to happen is to do our children and ultimately our culture an educational disservice. It's dishonest, it's unethical, it opens up an expensive can of worms because every self proclaimed victim of conspiracy and persecution with a whacky idea clamors for teaching time, it's inaccurate, it's counterproductive to our interests as a species, and I hope most importantly for theists and atheists alike, from a moral perspective alone it reeks.

~DS~'

just because I don't feel like typing it all out myself. that should give a little perspective.
-Pat

Nov 30 2004 10:00PM

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after doing some serious reading on intelligetn design, I take back what I said aobut it being religious bullshit. It's not creationism, although therte are similarities. However, it IS being pushed many religious groups, and this is a case where it was as well. Therefore, I stand by my statements about religion.
-Pat

Nov 30 2004 10:04PM

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Which best describes your views of the origin of life?

Man developed with God guiding, 38%

Man developed with no help from God, 13%

God created man in present form, 45%

Source: Gallup Poll, conducted Nov. 7-10. The poll surveyed 1,016 adults; the margin of error is plus or minus 3 percentage points.

well, that seals the deal, I am moving to canada.
-Pat

Nov 30 2004 10:06PM

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Sharpy

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I think that teaching evolution is fine, saying god created evolution is fine, but shouldn't be taught, thats something mom and dad can at least bestow upon their children. Saying god created man from scratch and the earth and their was no evolution is wrong.

Nov 30 2004 10:23PM

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Jasmine

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in the northeast too... shameful

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Nov 30 2004 10:37PM

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Thank goodness I'm out of school already. I'd probably go apeshit if I started hearing that crap being taught in my school.

Sarah
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'what's wrong with princess. I wish I was a princess'
-Jay (rebel)

Nov 30 2004 10:59PM

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eheath

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im def moving to canada when im 18
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Nov 30 2004 11:07PM

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I'm moving to Canada in a month or two. =) Yay for being eighteen.

Sarah
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'what's wrong with princess. I wish I was a princess'
-Jay (rebel)

Nov 30 2004 11:12PM

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IHOP

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Hey inteligent design was in my Wired a couple of months ago...i didnt read it though, ill have to now.

Nov 30 2004 11:20PM

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Meh42

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wow, just wow. i had the biggest response to that article typed up in message window. i then apparantly hit the newschoolers message length limit, which ended up slicing off the lower half of the response. thinking that wasnt all that bad, at least i still have the first half i went and posted it, like an idiot not copying it anywhere. what do you know, ive been on NS for over 3 hours and instead of posting my message it prompts me to log back in.
_________________________________________________________

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Dec 1 2004 12:12AM

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Meh42

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ahh but the final remark i never got to type was that the US isnt really going to shit, its just been set back in time. Think about it, the moralistic 'values' that Bush campaigned and won under were once common to both parties and the world over. To be identified as someone who wasn't religious and lacked deep-seated moral values would be instant political suicide. The same thing is for this, at least darwin and evolution is in most of our schools, when he first came out with the origin of species , he was intellectiually stoned by the world as a whole.

My overall point is just that the US is still progressing, it just keeps encountering and eventually overcoming the last remenants of a dying culture.
_________________________________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

Dec 1 2004 12:19AM

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Ski-hobo

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damn fundamentalist

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Dec 1 2004 12:59AM

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the_friesz

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I want to play devil's advocate here Patty... But why does 'intellignet design' automatically mandate that it must be linked with religion. I don't know exactly how the schools will be teaching it, but discounting theories is as ignorant as holding Darwin's theory as unquestionably correct. Open your minds, cause there's too much in this world that can't be explained away.

'...Smoking's bad, smoking killed my dad. Yeah, he was driving down the highway one day and as he was lighting his cigarette, it blew out the window. So he jumps out the door to save it, and ran himself over. Uh, you mind if I smoke?' -Olie Ollaussen, Ski Bum extraordinaire

Dec 1 2004 2:12AM

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Insomniac

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Thats total bullshit, it has no place in school. School is for learning, not guessing. It's like they're trying to screw with our heads or something. 'Oh, evolution isnt true, there was some higher power that helped us somehow.' How does that help us learn?
-CraigeD
------------------------------------------------

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Or do you mean to say: 'you're' gay?'-Tom Sorrell

Dec 1 2004 4:11AM

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SiverMike

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they should definitley teach both theories, because a theory isn't the truth, because we do not know the truth. And to leave certain theories out is the most retarded thing i have ever heard.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Bush in '04-When keeping it real goes wrong!

Dec 1 2004 5:06AM

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friez, as I said, ID has little to do with religion, however, it's because of religious people that it is being pushed. Read the article.
-Pat

Dec 1 2004 5:43AM

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Crazy Fool

intelligent design theory needs to be addressed in schools. schooling involves critical thinking, correct. so the ultimate question of where did the universe come from ought to be addressed, and the intelligent design theory is a great theory to address where the evolution and big bang theories seriously lack.

the intelligent design theory in general is great science, and deserves to be heard, so to be blunt, i think you all are wrong in being angered by it.

-Joel

'joel...has curly hair..

its hard not to stare.

he's tall too...he's like, way up there.

this poem sucked, but i don't care!'

-lucyford

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lanky steeze

Dec 1 2004 6:15AM

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btw, i have really read into evolution, creationism, and intelligent design, this is a debate that really fascinates me.

so if you want to learn more about intelligent design, read a book called 'darwin's black box' by dr. michael behe. if it makes a difference, he is not religious. anyhow, his arguments concerning irreducible complexicity are very very strong...

-Joel

'joel...has curly hair..

its hard not to stare.

he's tall too...he's like, way up there.

this poem sucked, but i don't care!'

-lucyford

~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~

Capital City Rider

Dragons Lair

lanky steeze

Dec 1 2004 6:21AM

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that's kinda what I was saying in teh 'after doing some reading' post. ID is NOT a religions based theory. However, the people pushing it ARE religious, and are doing it for religious reasons. If it was presented in a way that was not for religious reasons, I wouldn't have a problem with it as much.
-Pat

Dec 1 2004 9:26AM

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J.D.

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The problem is when people start inverting ID in an attempt to prove that God exists. If you do that, you lose the argument automatically.

------------
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Dec 1 2004 9:34AM

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Justo8484

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i think i posted this in another thread a while back, but after writing 'origin of species' darwin later admitted that he made it all up and it was basically a load of crap... thats not to say that the other guy who had the same findings right around teh same time (dont remember his name off the top of my head) didnt find any conclusive evidence for it. a lot of the theory certanly makes sense, but you cant look at just one to find the ultimate answer of where we all came from.

Dec 1 2004 9:38AM

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yeah, darwin did kinda screw up in the origin of species. it is such a largely popular and ridiculously influential book, but even darwin himself said his theory shouldnt be taken seriously if a few conditions were not met. these conditions havent been met as of yet.

by the way, does anybody else know the full title of the origin of species? im curious...

-Joel

'joel...has curly hair..

its hard not to stare.

he's tall too...he's like, way up there.

this poem sucked, but i don't care!'

-lucyford

~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~

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Dragons Lair

lanky steeze

Dec 1 2004 9:49AM

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Justo8484

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On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection? i think thats it.

Dec 1 2004 9:56AM

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the proof I have of evolution is the more recent (in terms of the world as a whole). we have seen SIGNIFICANT evidence of evolution from apes and other similar mamals. We have also seen it in plants and baterias, and many other types of living orgamisms. Things adapt, and if they don't, they die. Granted, the theory that we have all evolved from a single celled orgamism is mind blowing and has no proof behind it, but the other parts of the theory about species evolving into what we are today from other species is hard to argue against. Granted, I have not read the exact theory of evolution or ID, but from my understanding of both, evolution as a whole IS the truth, and there are a lot of scientific facts to back this up.
-Pat

Dec 1 2004 9:58AM

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justo, its longer and much more racist than that.

-Joel

'joel...has curly hair..

its hard not to stare.

he's tall too...he's like, way up there.

this poem sucked, but i don't care!'

-lucyford

~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~

Capital City Rider

Dragons Lair

lanky steeze

Dec 1 2004 10:05AM

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'On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life'
-Pat

Dec 1 2004 10:07AM

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interesting tidbit I found about him denouncing his theory.

It has been supposed that Darwin renounced evolution on his deathbed. Shortly after his death, temperance campaigner and evangelist Lady Elizabeth Hope claimed she visited Darwin at his deathbed, and witnessed the renunciation. Her story was printed in a Boston newspaper and subsequently spread. Lady Hope's story was refuted by Darwin's daughter Henrietta who stated, 'I was present at his deathbed ... He never recanted any of his scientific views, either then or earlier.'
-Pat

Dec 1 2004 10:08AM

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