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Bill introduced in North Carolina to create official state religion, which also states each state is sovereign

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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
Full article: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/03/north-carolina-religion-bill_n_3003401.html
Republican North Carolina state legislators have proposed allowing an official state religion in a measure that would declare the state exempt from the Constitution and court rulings.

The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion." The legislation was filed in response to a lawsuit to stop county commissioners in Rowan County from opening meetings with a Christian prayer, wral.com reported.
That's a short excerpt for the TL;DR crowd. Does anybody think there's any sort of legal plausibility for this? It goes directly against the US Constitution as I understand it.
Apr 3 2013 7:24PM
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Arabian
Posts: 680 - Karma: 1,021
...which will be promptly defeated by the Constitution on the grounds that IT'S NOT CONSTITUTIONAL.
Apr 3 2013 7:25PM
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ILLinoisance
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What does that matter?

#YOLO
Apr 3 2013 7:26PM
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Granby_killdozer
Posts: 2351 - Karma: -11,750
lol inb4 nc bashing
Apr 3 2013 7:27PM
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1337
Posts: 31049 - Karma: 29,195
I LOL'd
Apr 3 2013 7:29PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
I love that half of the conservatives who claim to love the constitution actually have no idea how it works.
Apr 3 2013 7:31PM
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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
I do think it's a little humorous that the same group of individuals who cite the constitution for gun rights (a supporter of the bill recently also introduced a pro-concealed-weapons amendment to the state constitution) are clearly going directly against it in this case.
Apr 3 2013 7:32PM
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Pancake_Fucker
Posts: 1839 - Karma: 1,910
America is weird. I go play hockey now.
Apr 3 2013 7:33PM
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Spagett+
Posts: 3499 - Karma: 14,884
Petition to ban the state of North Carolina
Apr 3 2013 7:38PM
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ILLinoisance
Posts: 3527 - Karma: 5,398
I find it equally humorous that the same side who says a woman should be able to choose what she does to her own body in terms of abortion is the same side that banned a person's right to choose to eat trans fats in NYC.
Apr 3 2013 7:44PM
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Pancake_Fucker
Posts: 1839 - Karma: 1,910
I thought you Americans wanted more land, not less.
Apr 3 2013 7:48PM
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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
Fair. I'll certainly concede that point as I don't want to get into a wider argument in this thread.
Apr 3 2013 7:50PM
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alex=
Posts: 1738 - Karma: 2,835
This. Rowan county is an hour away from where I'm at right now, and they are fucking DUMBASSES
Apr 3 2013 7:50PM
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.frenchy
Posts: 18221 - Karma: 12,317
Petition to ban the state of North Carolina: Denied.
Apr 3 2013 7:52PM
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Huck_Norris
Posts: 11487 - Karma: 18,627
Not to mention that it applies to everyone, not just them personally. Facepalmsville.

Apr 3 2013 7:58PM
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Granby_killdozer
Posts: 2351 - Karma: -11,750
yeah... because a couple law makers in some ass backward, bum fuck nowhere county represent the entire state's population... go fuck your self!
Apr 3 2013 7:59PM
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cydwhit
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Hate to say it but since when has that actually mattered? Constitution gets "reinterpreted" and pushed aside all the time
Apr 3 2013 8:00PM
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Zimmerman
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The hypocrisy is off the charts!
Apr 3 2013 8:02PM
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ILLinoisance
Posts: 3527 - Karma: 5,398
No argument. I'll say that both sides have some major flaws in their ideology.
Apr 3 2013 8:07PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5067 - Karma: 42,847
also no hate but how is it necessarily unconstitutional? The first amendment says:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
I dont think that really shoots this down, I believe that the only other semi relevant clause is about no religious test for office, this is just off the top of my head so feel free to correct me
Apr 3 2013 8:12PM
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MothaHucker
Posts: 4678 - Karma: 2,591
dear lord I'm glad my liberal family moved out of that shit hole of a state...
Apr 3 2013 8:15PM
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Mr.Sloth
Posts: 5091 - Karma: 13,469
Signed. They're little shitters
Apr 3 2013 8:16PM
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Rachy
Posts: 4355 - Karma: 2,761
Apparently my family took their place.

Multi-racial atheist family for the win! Can't wait to have my mom call me about this one.
Apr 3 2013 8:20PM
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Wulfty
Posts: 344 - Karma: 1,876
Lol politics. I'll go back to living in a cave now.
Apr 3 2013 8:33PM
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GayWolf420
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America!
Apr 3 2013 8:50PM
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Stose
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And then we entered the 21st century
Apr 3 2013 9:29PM
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*TURBONERD*
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It's widely accepted that the first part of that means that Congress shall pass no law creating a hierarchy of religions in any way.
Apr 3 2013 9:42PM
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cydwhit
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Yep, right with you, Is Congress doing this? No, I don't think so. This comes across as more of a states' rights issue than a constitution issue to me. Too often people say "Well the constitution says church and state are separate" when they actually need to read the thing. I'm not trying to stir up the pot here, just trying to look at what the Constitution says on the subject since it has been called in as the authority. Honestly I think they have a right to advance this bill, and whether it is passed or not is not a matter of constitutionality. Again, I am not trying to start a church and state argument but rather clarify the constitutionality of this bill.
Apr 3 2013 9:52PM
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jibcrew1
Posts: 1505 - Karma: 522
god my state is fucking retarded
Apr 3 2013 9:52PM
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lands11
Posts: 1818 - Karma: 1,677
Did two people from different political parties just come to an agreement in 4 posts on NS? You two should run our country. +k to both of you
Apr 3 2013 9:53PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5067 - Karma: 42,847
Seriously, that was great!
Apr 3 2013 9:55PM
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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
Unless it's not specifically listed as a power of Congress (and this is, albeit as something they cannot do), then it's not a states' rights issue. Again, that's how I understand it and I'm no Gov major or anything, so feel free to correct me.
Apr 3 2013 10:41PM
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Chron_Rabbit
Posts: 988 - Karma: 1,567
I wish the United States government would declare Mormon influence over the state government in Utah unconstitutional. Them niggaz is crazy
Apr 3 2013 10:45PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5067 - Karma: 42,847
Me neither but the tenth amendment says:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

In my understanding the constitution is a comprehensive list of government powers but not of the people's rights.

Thanks for the civility
Apr 3 2013 10:51PM
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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
I feel like you're saying what I am, honestly. The 'establishing a religion' is expressly prohibited by the Constitution, so it falls under something not reserved to the States or to the people. So, the government has no power to do this.

No problem, I appreciate the civility on your end as well.
Apr 3 2013 11:39PM
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Ben.
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However contrary to popular belief states are subject to federal law. North Carolina isn't "sovereign".
Apr 3 2013 11:40PM
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cydwhit
Posts: 5067 - Karma: 42,847
Yes, my distinction is in congress establishing the religion as opposed to the state doing it. I also felt like if people were just going to say " well they're dumb, the constitution says they can't do that" we should look at the relevant parts of the constitution. I think it all comes down to this whole "sovereign state" thing, not necessarily what agenda that state is trying to push
Apr 3 2013 11:47PM
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fujarome
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There's also the supremacy clause.

Basically, if the constitution says you can't do it, you can't do it.

Will be interesting to see how this progresses though
Apr 3 2013 11:49PM
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*TURBONERD*
Posts: 15080 - Karma: 9,151
Like Ben said, no state within the US is sovereign; they're only independent to the point where they begin to violate federal law. Establishing this type of law would be in clear violation of the Constitution, which is federal law.
Apr 3 2013 11:50PM
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Ben.
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Precisely. As far as I can tell this will be thrown out on that notion.
Apr 3 2013 11:51PM
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Italian.Stallion
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*ahem* 14th amendment *ahem*
Apr 3 2013 11:53PM
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alex=
Posts: 1738 - Karma: 2,835
Everyone here in NC is a rich white republican basically. The people who aren't rich and white don't even vote it seems like. All the politicians I see are rich white and GOP
Apr 4 2013 12:59AM
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