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Expert line closed because of gapers.

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Tikayt
Posts: 1031 - Karma: 1,543
I went skiing with some friends in Flaine (france) and passed by the park and noticed all the expert kickers were closed when they didn't seem to be in bad shape. So I went down to the park lodge and basically asked why. Well, same story, accidents because gapers in the landing, gapers braking arms and legs because of overspeed, rail kicks and broken on sides. So the park shapers just closed everything so no hit happens.
I asked them to open just one or two kickers and fortunately they said yes which is very nice from them.
Just saying, because of gapers, people like us can't do their sport.
Feb 28 2013 2:59AM
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Heart
Posts: 6156 - Karma: 3,462
That's why more resorts need to adopt park passes. Pay like $10 and watch a video on how not to be a gaper - get a pass. Keeps the gapers out and it means way less traffic in the park
Feb 28 2013 3:18AM
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p-fo
Posts: 9372 - Karma: 6,155
Unfortunately, unless it's someplace like Breck, Key or PC, where the park is a destination, they lose money on it, and in tight economic times, it bites the dust. Why my mountain dropped it. Patrol isn't happy, but understands, and they've been seeing more accidents. It also hasn't gotten TOO bad so far. Most of the gapers stay off the big line anyway.
Feb 28 2013 3:33AM
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[tk]
Posts: 3863 - Karma: 1,906
My home mountain tried this, did not work at all. Youd think there would be less gapers and kids, but nope. Having a park pass seemed like the coolest thing ever for little kids, and of course the parents had to get one along with them. I swear, park passes attract gapers. Needless to say, they stopped doing it after that year.
Feb 28 2013 5:43AM
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SloanKettering
Posts: 691 - Karma: 465
Ski sundown needs some park passes
Feb 28 2013 7:05AM
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roddy116
Posts: 10630 - Karma: 7,454
skiing ability test? then park pass?
Feb 28 2013 8:10AM
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SkiBum.
Posts: 3600 - Karma: 3,909
Park passes are not the answer. They are a pain and a waste of revenue and make for unhappy gapers, which is where money comes from.
Feb 28 2013 10:31AM
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skia4life89
Posts: 2400 - Karma: 172
I hate park passes. They dont work, and nobody pays attention to the rules anyway. Plus it keeps the park crew at my mountain from fixing lips and setting up new features because they are too busy checking passes. It has ruined our terrain park IMO.
Feb 28 2013 10:35AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
.
Feb 28 2013 10:43AM
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TNORTS
Posts: 2077 - Karma: 2,756
I was at okemo during mlk weekend. The park pass seems pretty effective there. Noone was on nor'easter except for park skiers and riders. Blackout had a couple of gapers but nowhere near the amount that there would have been without a pass.
Feb 28 2013 11:14AM
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Randy_Quench
Posts: 5447 - Karma: 4,343
I was just gonna drop in here to mention okemo.

Okemo's Nor'easter park requires a peeps pass and it is totally effective. At the top is a park crew guy turning away anyone who doesn't appear to know what they're doing. Or at least last year thats how it worked. GREAT SYSTEM if its used properly.

Loon on the other hand, requires the same park pass but does nothing to enforce the rule. so obviously it is much less effective.
Feb 28 2013 11:18AM
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fortyvalve
Posts: 1442 - Karma: 1,573
okemo is hit or miss with checking passes, i was there about 3 weeks ago and i watched a family just ride right though over the lips and stop on the knuckle. depends on the day. then you have carinthia which doesn't check, i'm there every weekend and accidents in the park happen but aren't too bad, most of them contribute to people who do ride park getting cut off on the landings by people who just ride down Nitro
Feb 28 2013 11:23AM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
Is that new? I've never had anyone hassle me about a park pass there but haven't gone very much and haven't been in a while.



It's one of those things that you just have to look at the options, look at your resort and try and figure out what works best for you. A lot of things work great one place but not another.

Feb 28 2013 12:18PM
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freeskibum82
Posts: 6355 - Karma: 5,055
I think the park pass needs to be coupled with a small feature park that they have to hit everything in before they can enter a larger park. two levels or park pass..
Feb 28 2013 1:22PM
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Heart
Posts: 6156 - Karma: 3,462
I feel like maybe a strictly enforced no rentals in the park policy would do wonders
Feb 28 2013 1:27PM
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wasatch_rat
Posts: 1772 - Karma: 2,951
nah man brightons been doing this for a few years now but only for the big jump line. everything else can be hit with a day pass, but their not taking chances with the biggest jumps. everyone i've talked to thinks its great too.
Feb 28 2013 1:33PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
Instead of having 2 levels of park pass it would make more sense to have a park pass on your bigger parks and leave you smaller parks pass free.

If you're super beginner park, and family beginner/intermediate parks don't have park pass, why go through the effort of getting a park pass just to hit the bigger stuff. The rail take offs are about the same height, and there will be more people for them to snake so obviously the small parks would be the way to go.


I've also thought of designing a park that is all rail takeoffs with out the rails. Also nice tall, steep landings but with no jumps. Call the park "The Gapeway" or something.

^Not serious, well kind of serious in a non joking frustrated by gapers kind of way.


There's also the fool proof, park starts out with a 40' gap. Anything that falls in the middle ends up in one of these Click for larger image
that funnels all the children into the slide at the mcdonalds down the road.
Feb 28 2013 2:02PM
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Jibberino
Posts: 2089 - Karma: 1,346
Problem is that in Europe people would flat out reject the idea of a park pass. In most European countries you are expected to be in charge of your own safety, including your safety in the park. You are allowed to do and go anywhere you want, and if you hurt yourself, it's your responsibility. Of course the resorts don't want accidents, but in general the above mentioned is the policy of most resorts.

I work as a park shaper, and the gaper frequency in my park has been fucking out of control this year, but strangely enough we haven't had too many accidents. To counter the increasing threat from gapers, we have decided to basically make a gaper park next year. Small jumps, small boxes, some knuckles, basically stuff that you would have to try very hard to hurt yourself on. Which i'm sure the gapers will figure out how to do. In addition, we're gonna make it as obvious as possible that you are entering the "pro" park, and maybe make it so that you have to side step like 3-4 m up the hill to get in. We will see how it works.
Feb 28 2013 2:04PM
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Randy_Quench
Posts: 5447 - Karma: 4,343
I think they implemented it 4 years ago. You might not have been hassled if you have the "look" of someone who knows what they are doing. they really only stop you if you are a family or little kid pizza-ing into the park. Which works out because you dont have to stop and show your park pass every time you lap.
Feb 28 2013 2:30PM
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chacha33
Posts: 959 - Karma: 4,163
At my home mountain they have park crew out constantly "fixing" things. What they really do is wait for gapers to come in and then kick them off. It works pretty well because park crew's excuse is that they dont have the right skill set. I live in Iowa though so its pretty much all gapers that managed to get their church to do a trip to the mountain. We actually do have a mini terrain that is for gapers and comps sometimes. It works really well
Feb 28 2013 2:53PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
Word that seems like a legit policy. I don't need no stinking park passes.


I've never actually gotten a park pass anywhere, and would be confused on how to go about it. It's not a big deal at your home mountain to grab one for the season but it seems like a pain in the ass to get one for a mountain you're just hitting for the day.


FUCKING GAPERS RUIN ERRRTHANG
Feb 28 2013 3:08PM
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Mag
Posts: 8155 - Karma: 14,809
Preventing people trying the jumps just prevents them learning how to hit the jumps, unless you're meaning they're extremely bad.
Feb 28 2013 3:16PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
It would never work but since we're going down this road.

The best way to go about that would be to make it a standard system.

"Gapers blow park solutions"

So at your local mountain you go and take your test or submit your footage or whatever of you riding at whatever your best level is. You get cleared for a b c or balls out level of parks. Now when you go with your family to colorado on break, you simply go to the desk and she pull up that information for you that you already have a b level ability and prints you out a pass. Or it's just a pass that already covers everything and they don't have to look it up.


Would be way too much of a clusterfuck though for what it's worth. I think the old fashioned verbal abuse policy might still be the best.
Feb 28 2013 3:48PM
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a_burger
Posts: 5235 - Karma: 20,715
Wachusett does this right, they have a park pass for the main park, and then they have a mini park with some boxes, rollers, and small jumps for free.


Either that or just put moguls at the top of the park, never see a gaper in the park ever again (snowboarders can learn to deal with it)
Feb 28 2013 3:53PM
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Big.Bird
Posts: 563 - Karma: 180
'gapers' pretty much means that they are extremely bad..if your clearing the jumps then you should obviously be allowed to ride them
Feb 28 2013 4:15PM
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himay5
Posts: 208 - Karma: 174
The entrance to every park should contain a jump with a shark tank in the gap with no way around it.
Feb 28 2013 4:33PM
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Mag
Posts: 8155 - Karma: 14,809
True, but he said they were gapping to flat.
Feb 28 2013 4:35PM
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sNaubi
Posts: 1633 - Karma: 2,357
1. Build humungus jump
2. let gapers become too scared to jump
3. ?????
4. hit it
Feb 28 2013 4:40PM
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Fluttershy
Posts: 586 - Karma: 763
the problem is that the videos (at least at my mountain) dont really stress the important things. our list to get a pass is:

make a plan
look before you leap
respect gets respect
easy style it

those are the only 4 things you need to know in order to get a pass. i feel like the videos need to stress that sitting on the backside of a jump will get you and other people hurt. and they need to explain park edicute more
Feb 28 2013 4:48PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
ooooor not
Feb 28 2013 4:49PM
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nagger
Posts: 1576 - Karma: 883
I've seen park passes work great. they really only work where you have a lot of staff and money, like a chain owned resort or whatever.
Feb 28 2013 4:49PM
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a_burger
Posts: 5235 - Karma: 20,715
it was a joke
Feb 28 2013 4:55PM
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Fluttershy
Posts: 586 - Karma: 763
i doubt the legitimacy of that claim. but if the mountain were to put moguls there, where would they store them in the winter?
Feb 28 2013 5:07PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
How do they make the snow white?
Feb 28 2013 5:14PM
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HungryHypocrite
Posts: 765 - Karma: 939
at the park entrance they should just say Twins or gtfo.. they do it at the airbag at mottolino and it keeps the gaper injuries at a minimum
Feb 28 2013 5:31PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
Irrelevant and unnecessary...Park passes never work, people will either get in without one or just do whatever it takes to get a pass (case in point...I've never gotten a park pass at any mountain the requires them, including Butternut, Stratton, Brighton, and others...I didn't even know you needed one at Brighton till the next day). Park passes just cause problems, both legally and maintenance wise, if one person gets into the park without a pass and gets hurt the mountain now faces major legal issues. Also, if you have a park pass then you need someone at the top of the park checking those passes, Sundown has two park trails, that means two park staff are now just sitting at the top of the hill checking for passes instead of raking (this is especially bad considering since we're such a small mountain we generally only have two park staff on at a time...therefore no one is maintaining the park).

Park passes (at least at most small mountains) are just an excuse to charge $5-$15 extra bucks and have a park guy sit in a shack and get high all day instead of actually raking.
Feb 28 2013 5:36PM
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ForeverYung
Posts: 8385 - Karma: 2,060
Somewhat related, I was at Mount snow last Friday and standing at the top of the 2 jump line on Inferno (carinthias XL trail for you that don't know). I see a mom and dad bring there 5 kids down and over the deck of the first jump (70 ish ft table) and they are all snow plowin down the landing and it takes a while before they come back into view. If someone just came bombing in and hit the jump, it could end up real bad.
Feb 28 2013 5:47PM
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90053
Posts: 2565 - Karma: 3,728
mandatory 15 ft trench at the start of every park, with like bear traps and venomous snakes in it
Feb 28 2013 6:05PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51664 - Karma: 162,493
In those situations you hell git the fuck outta herrrrr.

Gapers and there families and fucking stupid.


You can do it joey! You climb up that jump ramp. YEah now roll over it, now climb up the landing! YEAAA YOU DID IT! YUR SUCH A GOOD SKIER JOEY! LETS STAND ON THE LANDING FOR A WHILE AND THEN SNOW PLOW DOWN IT AND HEAD FOR THE NEXT ONE!

YEAAAAAA!!!!!!!
Feb 28 2013 6:11PM
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.squirrely.
Posts: 7563 - Karma: 7,546
lol
Feb 28 2013 6:21PM
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HungryHypocrite
Posts: 765 - Karma: 939
HAHAHA the gapeway :D get this guy a medal just because
Feb 28 2013 6:31PM
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Mr.DarthVader
Posts: 1322 - Karma: 556
no they dont
Feb 28 2013 6:33PM
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ABinThe603
Posts: 529 - Karma: 126
So if I want to go for the day, I need a ticket and a park pass?
Feb 28 2013 7:09PM
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fortyvalve
Posts: 1442 - Karma: 1,573
like i said before it's hit or miss with them but you'll probably have to buy both yes
Feb 28 2013 7:12PM
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llambert
Posts: 1005 - Karma: 81
Plus sundown would lose business by closing trails to park rats only
gapers are gonna cut you off its part of life get used to it
Feb 28 2013 8:12PM
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kootenayklaus
Posts: 3914 - Karma: 2,179
I'm a park staff at my resort and we enforce this rule, but it is impossible for me/other staff to be in a million different positions amongst the park at all times. I turn away kids who have rentals, but it really does nothing as to the filtering of gapes.. I don't know how it is at other hills, but it has almost no effect at my small hill in southern Ontario.
Feb 28 2013 8:23PM
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suup
Posts: 1485 - Karma: 4,367
If there was a park only lift then you could do park passes with ease
Feb 28 2013 8:29PM
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LiquorLanch
Posts: 1909 - Karma: 1,046
Loon requires a pass? When did this start?
Feb 28 2013 11:08PM
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Auzy
Posts: 569 - Karma: 1,827
I think if people don't know the rules to the park and are going through and being stupid, sitting on landings and so on they should just lose their pass.
Mar 1 2013 2:12AM
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will_powder
Posts: 3194 - Karma: 5,445
The best solution is to give a little snow shower and a angry word and they get the message.
Mar 1 2013 2:32AM
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Tikayt
Posts: 1031 - Karma: 1,543
If you have a dedicated lift for the park, then you can control. Vars Park has a dedicated one but doesn't filter since you have several lines adapted to your level, expert line is.. expert.
But where I was in Flaine, you have one lift for park + piste and kids are like "hey dad can we go in the park"--> shit happens. It becomes a highway in no time.

But yes, having a lift dedicated to the park is a potential solution.

I remember having several fights with parents when I would see how they slice the lips. When I see that, I kinda become a sensible danger in the park towards the kids and often the parents come to me to argue.
"Be careful, can't you see there are kids in the way"
I'm like

"hey, this zone isn't for you kids to slice what we shape every evening, this is called a snowpark and it has dangerous features, now when you bring you kids in the park and accident happens because one of us bumped into your kid, perhaps you should reconsider who is the danger".

Parents tend to be "im-the-one-who-knows-I-skied-20-years-before-you-were-born" so you can't explain them without getting into an arguement.
Mar 1 2013 3:50AM
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