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ON3P Caylor vs. Armada JJ

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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
I am currently riding 179 Hellbents, and I need some advice on what my next pair of pow / all around skis will be. I am 16, 6'3", and 170 pounds. My Hellbents were fun for the really deep days at Squaw / Alpine, but as soon as I got into choppy conditions, they turned into a pain to ski. I know that the Caylor and JJ will both be good choices in powder, and switch landings, but it is how the skis handle after the powder is all gone at the end of the day that I am worried about. Any advice on what would be a better all around pow ski would be greatly appreciated. Also if you think that these skis are really not the best options, I will be willing to hear other options.
Sep 29 2012 12:45AM
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Session
Posts: 5372 - Karma: 22,047
Caylor makes the JJ it's bitch when it comes to choppy conditions. Longer turn radius coupled with a stiffer shovel make the Caylor the superior choice.
Sep 29 2012 12:57AM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Thanks for the reply. Also add the 4FRNT YLE to that list.
Sep 29 2012 1:01AM
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Session
Posts: 5372 - Karma: 22,047
YLE is fully symetrical, and a softer. I believe that the Caylor will hold up better in chop. One thing ON3P does is build ski's that handle crud, a while still being playful
Sep 29 2012 12:41PM
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50Kal
Posts: 2828 - Karma: 5,373
I demod some JJs last year. Great for untouched powder, suck in the chop. Just too soft. This was at Snowmass. Cant imagine what it would be like on the west coast with the extra water in the snow.

Also found this on the worlds best review site. It's about the caylor 2012 model but from what I understand it's only improved.
http://blistergearreview.com/gear-reviews/on3p-caylor-191cm
Sep 29 2012 1:11PM
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ForeverYung
Posts: 8385 - Karma: 2,060
So stoked to get my pair
Sep 30 2012 12:01AM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Ok so caylors it is. So stoked to order them!
Oct 1 2012 6:40PM
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Alistair.
Posts: 458 - Karma: 212
I want Caylors but living in the UK and being on a a reasonably tight budget means I have to pay stupid amounts to get them here and stupid amounts on income tax/customs shite.
Oct 1 2012 7:50PM
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Kreech
Posts: 4178 - Karma: 3,024
Reading this makes me so fucking stoked for the pair I'm trading for. Bout to be on some '10 graphic 191s and I could not physically be more excited.
Oct 1 2012 7:54PM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Yeah I'm in the exact same boat as you as far as the stoke factor goes.  All of the damn ski movies that are coming out right now aren't helping.  The more I hear about on3p, the more confident that these are going to be the best skis that I have owned!
Oct 1 2012 8:58PM
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fennjack
Posts: 286 - Karma: 129
JJ
Oct 1 2012 10:01PM
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bibs_skibum
Posts: 4462 - Karma: 449
dont listen to this idiot, he's exactly wrong. OP i owned both for 2 seasons each and if you have any questions pm me. Caylors beat JJs in everything
Oct 1 2012 11:20PM
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jfrauen
Posts: 183 - Karma: 35
Did you ski the AK JJ? I have them and they are super nice through the chop. I have no complaints with my AKs

Oct 1 2012 11:42PM
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Session
Posts: 5372 - Karma: 22,047
Men don't ski pow ski's with fucking a fucking 18 meter turn radius. Why they call that ski the AK is beyond me. Who the fuck would want to ski that twitch monster on an AK face?
Oct 2 2012 12:44AM
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Dubins
Posts: 174 - Karma: 33
Thall, wester, jp... Just to name a few..they are men! Gota love the ON3P fanboi!!
Oct 2 2012 3:10AM
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BirtDike
Posts: 1258 - Karma: 514
JJ is for average people. Caylor is not the best, but its more of an athletes ski...
Oct 2 2012 3:39AM
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Kreech
Posts: 4178 - Karma: 3,024
This This This.

Also, just because you CAN ski a certain ski in certain conditions doesn't make it the best available ski for the job. Even if Jacob and Tanner and those guys use the standard retail AK JJ for Alaska, that says more about their skiing ability than the goodness of the ski. I'm sure Seth Morrison could ski a symmetrical park ski in AK, does that mean it's the best ski for AK? No. Same with the AK JJ. It's good for making short pivoty turns, but due to it's very short turn radius (about 10m shorter than the Caylor. 195 AK JJ = around 18m, 191 Caylor= 27.4) it becomes unstable at speed. FWIW, if I was going to go to Alaska, I'd take either a 196 4frnt Renegade or a 192 DPS Lotus 138 Flex 3 or a 193 On3p Cease and Desist. Just sayin.
Oct 2 2012 10:02AM
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jfrauen
Posts: 183 - Karma: 35
Have you actually skied the AK JJ? Or are you just going off what you think. There's a reason the JJ skis are rated well by freeskier
Oct 2 2012 11:27AM
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50Kal
Posts: 2828 - Karma: 5,373
This years Freeskier review was the worst I have ever seen it in my life. I stopped my subscription to them cause it was so bad. Might pick up a powder subscription now.

Oh and here is what a real review looks like. It's on your AK JJ so it's informative to say the least.
http://blistergearreview.com/gear-reviews/update-armada-ak-jj-195cm
Oct 2 2012 1:13PM
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Alistair.
Posts: 458 - Karma: 212
Essentially saying that the AK JJ is decent but not in crud?

I want Caylors but it'll cost me $200 to get them shipped to the UK after Tax + Custom Duties..
Oct 2 2012 1:33PM
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ikindalikeskiing
Posts: 1381 - Karma: 142
i love my jj's but i envy the people with caylors. both are really great skis i just cant afford the caylors
Oct 2 2012 2:17PM
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steve0
Posts: 1130 - Karma: 1,294

I have JJ's and I love them, but I won't dissagree with what people are saying...I ski at Jay Peak (East Coat), and to me it's the perfect ski for a pow day here.

They are really soft, especially in the tip and tail, which for me means super fun butters on groomed rollers between the pow in the trees and the liftline.

They have a really tight turning radius, which for me is great in the super tight trees we have here.

I can't speak for how they might ski on an AK face, but if I ever get lucky enoug to make a trip out there I'll let you know...

Oct 2 2012 2:41PM
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N.Skinner
Posts: 1512 - Karma: 19
They may be more expensive, but they will save you money in the end. Not only are the 100x more fun, they are way more durable as well. I've been on my Caylors for 2 seasons now and don't plan on getting a new pair. I've averaged probably 50 pow/chop days on them a year. I rode JJs for a season, probably about 30-40 pow/chop days and they were significantly more beat up than my Caylors are now, after 2 seasons.

I guess if you dont have the money, you dont have the money. But if you can come up with it somehow, it is definitely worth it.


Oct 2 2012 4:04PM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Do you guys think that the quality of on3p will be the same even though they are switching factories to make a greater quantity of skis?
Oct 2 2012 6:13PM
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Session
Posts: 5372 - Karma: 22,047
They basically moved down the street to a bigger location that allows them the flexibility. It's still the same people making ski's. It's not like they moved to fucking China. The old factory was small.

They can make more ski's because they can start earlier in the year than in the past. And have the room/equipment to do it.
Oct 2 2012 6:23PM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Yeah that kinda what I was thinking but I just wanted to make sure
Oct 2 2012 6:41PM
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iggyskier
Posts: 10447 - Karma: 10,016
Same equipment, same people, same process. Just different (albit much larger) location with more of everything.

Quality wise, we should be better than ever as the new space allowed us to bring even more processes in-house, giving us more control over our production process. Honestly, if there is ever a year where our production quality decreases compared to the year before I will retire. There are always improvements to be made and I suspect we will always be tweaking and developing the process in ways that improve quality and performance.

As for the caylor vs jj question - two different skis for two different skiers. Both of great for the right person. But they are very different. If you want light, small turn radius, highly manuverable, JJ is the best option. If you want better stability, float, and larger turn radius, then caylor would be the right choice.
Oct 2 2012 6:48PM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Now I really can't wait till the ski season when I get the caylors. As soon as I thought I reached maximum stoke level, I got more stoked.
Oct 2 2012 7:18PM
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bighomieflock
Posts: 2040 - Karma: 2,445
Ya, what is he thinking. That retard thinks this is some kind of personal opinion.
Oct 2 2012 7:25PM
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clive_bixby
Posts: 1834 - Karma: 499
i completely agree with this. I love my JJ's (not the ak's) for what they are. I feel like I could ride them every day at any of the resorts on an average snow year in CO (when I still lived there). Though, our snow varies quite differently from what I understand, I have never skied the PNW with that said. So I think you need to take the time to evaluate what you want the ski to do for you, demo some, and then ultimately make that decision. Hell, it took me 3 years (and 2 different pow sticks) to land on the JJ's, but honestly I am glad I did, because I will be keeping them until they break. I know its hard, and I know a ton of people want to buy ski's without demoing them, but it is something that will make it so much more worth it when you can actually keep a ski for multiple seasons and know exactly what to expect from the ski simply from knowing the ski. I'm sure the Caylors are great, and I am sure that they out perform the JJ's in some ways and some opinions, but I am 100% sure that the JJ's out perform the Caylors in some ways and some opinions. I can't stress it enough.. DEMO, find what ski you are most comfortable on, then drop the dimes. I wouldn't buy a ski strictly off of opinion from posters on this site (no offense guys, i'm 100% confident some of you guys know your shit).
Oct 2 2012 8:23PM
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luv2shred
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Yeah I agree with what you are saying about the demos but I don't know where I can demo on3p in Tahoe. If you guys know of any places let me know.
Oct 2 2012 9:57PM
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