Begineer needs DSLR

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I don't know much about Nikon, but the best 'cheap' canon dslr's are the 5d1, 1d2/n, and the 20-50D. You will get so much more out of them than a rebel. As for lenses, for concert photography, a fisheye, fast standard like the tamron 17-50, and a fast tele, your est option would be the Canon 135mm L, but it's expensive, maybe look into older manual lenses and adapting them to eos.

Jun 30 2012 1:56AM

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Crazy Fool

Also a Ttl flash, yongnuo makes one that's like $150, forget the model though.

Jun 30 2012 1:57AM

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FatWhore

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I do understand, but if hes looking at d3100s and d5100s, the Canon comparable is a t2i or a t3i, his budget is must likely up to $800 in that case.

Jun 30 2012 2:35AM

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Really, you didn't think I realized that. Those are all under $800......

Jun 30 2012 11:28AM

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j.benziger

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Nikon d5100 its is a great camera! I just got one could not be more happier. The d5100 is a good buy just saying!

Jun 30 2012 11:30AM

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FatWhore

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I looked all of those up.... everyones over $950

Jun 30 2012 2:01PM

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Crazy Fool

Well then you weren't looking in the right place. These are all older cams so buying used is really your only option.

Jun 30 2012 2:39PM

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family_vacation

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nope.

I got a buddy set up with a 40d for like 450 bucks a couple weeks ago.

Jun 30 2012 2:41PM

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@th1337

GET A USED ONE... SERIOUSLY.

Just go to Adorama.com and look under their used section - particularly at Canon, since heaps of people sell canon gear on there, and it can be found for ultra cheap.. Nikon and Pentax are worth at least a gander, however. You never know what you'll find. I bought a Canon 10D on there a couple months back as a backup body for my 60D. With the Grip, extra battery, and all the necessary accessories (I already had a few lens offerings, but you can find them for like 50 bucks if you just want to get an older kit lens. If not, they have good condition used lenses on there for all kinds of solid prices) I got it for like 200$ or something.

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20488625.html

^104$ For an EOS 300D body (Digital Rebel here in the states) that comes with batter, charger, and instruction manual - which for a beginner is downright perfect for learning DSLR photography if you don't want to break the bank. You absolutely don't need to spend 500$ or something brand new to get into digital photography these days - there are enough people upgrading from their old bodies with cropped sensors and whatnot to the latest and greatest that all the companies are dishing out every year, that the used market is becoming loaded with great stuff that's still very useful.

Bodies come and go as far as becoming "obsolete" if you will, but for starting out, you can get a used body, and develop a lens collection for when you want to upgrade your body to something with enough resolution to blow your photo up and stamp it on the side of a 60 story building... Remember - lenses are forever - bodies aren't.

There are other deals on there too. PM me if you want any more information about used equipment.

(here's some other current offerings that are on Adorama right now in good condition for under 200)

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20503427.html

^Nikon 100D 164$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20503513.html

^Nikon 70D 164$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20504754.html

^Nikon D50 with 18-55mm Lens 199$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20487234.html

^Canon 10D 131.50$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20500104.html

^Canon Rebel XT 144$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20503748.html

^Canon Rebel XTi 154$

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20490314.html

^Canon 10D w/Battery Grip 159$ (exactly what I have)

http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20502004.html

^Pentax K10D 279$ (killer deal if you have some extra dosh)

Jun 30 2012 2:48PM

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FatWhore

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yeah, i didn't put much effort into it haha.

Jun 30 2012 4:39PM

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Crazy Fool

Dont post if you don't know what your talking about the ....

Jun 30 2012 4:48PM

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Insane

@aKrieg, I looked at the website, but really didn't know what to look for.

@zbphoto, thanks for all your suggestions.

I'm not trying to eat my cake and have it too, but could you guys recommend a certain model?

thanks. plus K to all

Jul 1 2012 12:40AM

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Woops I put aKrieg where I meant to put Dingosean. My bad. Thanks to both regardless

Jul 1 2012 12:42AM

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Crazy Fool

Well, noise performance is important, and you don't really need a fast camera, so I'd say 5dc, the 1d2n isn't great and higher ISO's. The XXd line is the co

Jul 1 2012 12:48AM

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Crazy Fool

*compromise*

Jul 1 2012 12:48AM

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@th1337

A good starting point would be actually comparing the timelines of each brand's digitalSLR's on Wikipedia. Just do a quick search for just about any DSLR made by either Pentax, Nikon, or Canon, and at the bottom of the page, it will have a linked timeline between each camera. This is an easy and fast way to compare cameras from the same company, as well as different companies.

As for a particular model? There's at least 4 or 5 cameras from each company above that would be in a very affordable price range (say under 250$). Look at cameras that are between 4 and 8 years old for the best value. Megapixel ranges would be anywhere from around 6.1 to 10.2 between those years (at least for the non-professional stuff, which you REALLY don't need to fork out the dough on)

If I were really to recommend any PARTICULAR camera, however.. based on an assumed price range, I'd recommend something like the Canon 10D, the Nikon D100, or the Pentax K100D. none of these would run you any more than 200$ (especially the 10D, as I've seen deals for that go CRAZY affordable)

If you find something like a Canon 20D, Pentax K200, or Nikon D80, jump on it because that's a great deal for any of those.

Otherwise, just do research and google stuff. There's only so much guys in here will tell you - not to mention, all this talk about 1D Mkii's and 5D classics (both are full frame (meaning a large sensor thats equivalent to that of 35mm film, and closer to the professional range than the cameras I have mentioned) is kinda ridiculous - seeing as the price of cameras like that will run you over 7-800 bucks or more, and you REALLY don't need anything like that - especially just starting out.

As for a good starter lens... for just about anything, a Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 is probably my recommendation. It's about 4-5 hundo (maybe under 400 if it's used) but it's a great lens that's far better than any kit lens you'd pick up. Otherwise, just get a kit lens that runs from about 28-100mm or so, and snag a cheap 35mm or 50mm Prime lens (non-zoom, that is) for higher quality shots.

Jul 1 2012 5:35AM

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michael_bc

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Many lower-end Nikon cameras have a ?-button. If you push it, it will display an explanation for whatever setting you are looking at. Very helpful for beginners.

If short on cash, I would try to get a Nikon D90... new or used. It's pretty much the same as a D7000 but can be found much, much cheaper. I think new it's even cheaper than a D5100 and it's a really solid camera that you won't outgrow quickly.

Keep in mind that the lens is much more important than the body (and this is where Nikon really shines, lenses).

If you get a D3100/D5100 type of camera, they are great cameras, but they limit you in your lens choice as they don't have an autofocus motor for older lenses, and they don't meter with many older lenses.

If you go the Nikon route, I'd recommend getting the 35mm f/1.8G to begin with (with or without the kit lens). It is a really good lens to learn with. If you are into live music photography, you could think of getting the new 85mm f/1.8G lens as well (or a similar older one).

Jul 2 2012 5:40AM

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TijmenDal

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Get a Canon 30/40D if you want to go with Canon.
Get a Nikon D200/D80 if you want go with Nikon.

And buy fast primes if you want to shoot indoors. And a flash. Get a Yongnuo-565. It's cheap, reliable, powerful and has TTL

Jul 2 2012 5:52AM

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S.C

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i would agree to some of that and disagree to other parts. I'd say a 20-50d would be a great option, or a 5d1 if he wanted to go full frame, but the 1d is a bit too huge of a camera for someone entering the world of photography. it might limit where he could take it/where he would want to take it, therefore rendering it worse than the other cams. unless hes shooting tons of sports he doesnt need the 1d, and even if he was id probably recommend the 7d over it

also a great alternative to the 135mm L is the 100mm USM. just as fast, similar (but slightly lower) build quality, similar AF, similar (but slightly lower) optical quality, and half the price and size.

Jul 2 2012 7:29AM

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Crazy Fool

7d's are nothing special. Noise on any digic 4 cam is brutal.

Jul 2 2012 4:43PM

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Insane

Would you recommend buying in a camera store, electronics store, or amazon/online?

And what all could I shoot with the Tamron lense? I'm not used to seeing lenses cost more than bodies but that's prolly cause I don't know shit about photography.

Jul 2 2012 9:28PM

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Crazy Fool

Best buy and other electronics stores generally have higher prices, B&H or used locally are your best bets. It is also sort of a rule to spend more on lenses than your body, they are what will improve your image quality and they hold their value more than bodies which get updated every few years. Fast glass is always a good buy.

Jul 2 2012 9:56PM

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Insane

I'm gonna ask a lot of stupid questions in this post so be prepared,

what is fast glass?

And from dingosean's posts i guess the canon 10d and the Nikon d50.. reviews for the d50 seem nice and the 10d's price is pleasing

thoughts??

Jul 2 2012 10:18PM

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Crazy Fool

Fast glass means a large constant aperture, like a lower number than f2.8, not only will it give you better low light performance, but generally glass it will be sharper when stopped up to f8-11

Jul 2 2012 10:31PM

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alexat955

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basically how much light the lens lets in. the lower the number, the more light it can let in

Jul 2 2012 11:37PM

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@th1337

Buy either on Craigslist locally (so you can make sure it works) or buy from a site like the aformentioned Adorama.com (there are several other options like it out there, but I just know from people that have purchased used equip, including myself, that they have some of the best customer service you'll ever deal with, and ship quick and fast - and they are pretty spot on with how they grade their used gear, so you don't have to cross your fingers much)

Ebay and Amazon are alright, and there are TONS of things on there - but you're usually hoping that someone posted the right photo, and hoping everything works as well as they say it does - at least from Adorama or something, you have a bit of a guarantee.

As for lenses, I'm just going to put this out there since I own both and collectively the cost me around 150 bucks total - get a 28-80mm 1:3.5-5.6 V USM kit lens from the late 1990's. It's one of the best kit lenses around from my experience, and has some of the smoothest and quietest autofocus since it's an Ultrasonic Motor - which is more accurate and quiet than other lenses (it might be one of the most affordable Ultrasonic Motor lenses from Canon). It's slow-ish as far as letting light in, but for outdoor stuff, it will cover most of the focal lengths you would have to deal with, and it's sharper than most other lenses. It will run you around 60-70$ used.

I'm not 100% positive if Nikon or Pentax have anything equivalent, but for my pentax camera I just use old manual lenses from the 70's and 80's that come good and cheap, and I'm Nikon-retarded for the most part.

And then, as every photographer should have, you should get a fast prime lens like a fixed 50mm or a fixed 35mm. Both are very practical, and will let in more light than any kit lens - so they will be better for night photography, or anything indoors. You can find a Canon or Nikon 50mm f1.8 for around 80-100 used. A new one will cost around 120 or so from either company, and they'll both be solid. Pentax's 50mm f1.7 is slightly faster, and maybe a little bit better quality? but i'd just recommend finding an older version of the same lens for around 50-60 bucks that's manual focus.

For 35mm primes, it's pretty much the same thing - only each company's lens will run you closer to 150$ rather than 100$ for the 50mm.

sparknotes? Get a decent kit lens with faster autofocus, that allows more light in than standard stuff, and a fast 50mm or 35mm prime and you'll be set for having a few lenses.

Jul 3 2012 3:42AM

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Insane

oh! that, i remember reading about that somewhere, but didn't recgonize, thanks for the refresh hahah +k

Jul 3 2012 3:59PM

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well, don't most cameras that you buy (new) come with a 35mm?

Jul 3 2012 4:05PM

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@th1337

a 35mm prime? Not that I know of. They usually come with a zoom kit lens with the 18-55mm focal lengths...

Jul 3 2012 4:51PM

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Insane

my bad, i'm a tard

Jul 3 2012 4:55PM

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@th1337

I personally went with the 10D because I already had a Canon 60D and access to t3i's, and wanted to use all the same lenses between two bodies - I wanted a 2nd body for time lapses so I could just waste shutter actuations all day with it, and so I could baby my 60D and K-x around a little more... before deciding which to sell (I'm parting with my K-x unfortunately - because it doesn't have a video mic jack =[ )

The D50 is definitely a beginner level camera, whereas the 10D is a slightly more "intermediate" level camera. Performance wise, they aren't too differen't however.

The 10D has 7 AF points, compared to the D50's 5 AF points

10D has the ability to fine-tune the white balance (kinda unnecessary if you have photoshop)

10D shoots 3 FPS in continuous shooting, D50 only gets about 2.5 or so

10D uses CF cards, D50 uses SD cards

10D has a 6.3 megapixel sensor, compared to the 6.1 on the D50 (so... negligible difference there)

10D has iso range from 100-3200 (H) and D50 goes only 200-1600 (that said, the Nikon has slightly better noise performance at 1600 than the 10D does at equivalent iso - it's still awful haha. Canon is better for bright light)

The LCD's are .2" in difference size wise.. so thats absolutely negligible...

10D uses a slower USB 1.0 for upload, but I really don't feel it's that slow to tell you the truth.. I pulled 1000 shots into this time lapse this morning in about 2 minutes...

Either way, they are very similar. I'd go with whichever one you find cheaper/in better condition or whichever one you find a better deal on lenses with. Here's Dpreview's side by side comparison on the two.

http://www.dpreview.com/products/compare/side-by-side?products=nikon_d50&products=canon_eos10d&sortDir=ascending

Jul 3 2012 8:08PM

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Insane

Wow you just shit on the D50 lol. But basically what youre saying is get whatever I find as a better deal or condition?

Jul 7 2012 5:35PM

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@th1337

Haha I wouldn't say I shit on the D50... but personally, I'd recommend the 10D as a camera. When I was deciding which cheap body to buy for time lapses and such, both the 10D and the D50 were on my list of potential bodies. I went with the 10D, but mostly because it was just sliiightly more advanced in some ways. I've been happy with my decision.

Jul 9 2012 12:10PM

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