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Sharpness Issues: Canon 60d + L Lenses + Lightroom

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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
Hey guys,

So I've been getting really pissed off lately because my photos just aren't coming out as sharp as the used too. I shoot with a Canon 60d, 17-40 F4L, 50 F1.8, and a 70-200 F4L, thats pretty good glass. I know my 17-40 has to be shot F8-F11 for best results, same with my 70-200. 50mm is just a piece of shit, don't ever buy it, the amount of light fall off is just stupid wide open. I try to stay between ISO 200-800, but I shoot a lot at night and don't always have my flashes with me so sometimes I have to push it up to ISO 2000+. I'm pretty OCD about keeping my lenses clean, and I have good filters on all of them.

I have a feeling thats its something in my workflow, as apposed to on camera thats causing this issue. I'm shooting RAW, the super-flat colour profile that Will Start uses (posted it on here a while ago), importing to Lightroom, editing, and then exporting as Jpegs for web use. I'm fairly competent in Lightroom, and I know that over editing causes a decrease in sharpness and increase in noise, so I try to stay away from playing with the exposure too much.

Few other things that have crossed my mind. Lens Calibration issues (don't know much about this), or a dirty sensor as I've noticed a decrease in sharpness since I got my camera. I've also heard that shooting Jpeg actually comes out sharper than Raw, doesn't make sense to me so if someone can explain, I understand the difference in data stored, but wouldn't more data = higher sharpness.

I know that was long but thanks for the read, you can check out any of the links in my sig for examples.

Thanks,
Zack.

Sparknotes: Why aren't my photos coming out sharp: Workflow, dirty sensor, or lens calibration issues. I have a decent body and good glass.
Feb 16 2012 1:08PM
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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
One more thing, I have used Lightroom's lens profiles in the past, knowing that it decreases quality. For landscapes/architecture its really important that the lines are straight (well to me it is) and my 17-40 has a ton of distortion.
Feb 16 2012 1:15PM
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1337
Posts: 31046 - Karma: 29,167
could be the superflat picture style, I know they crank down the sharpness for video use. I'd avoid using it for photo.
Feb 16 2012 3:07PM
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Rob.
Posts: 189 - Karma: 16
Correct me if I'm wrong, but picture styles should not change what if captured by your camera in RAW format. It will, from my understanding, change what settings it uses to display the image. You should therefore be able to remove the picture styles in post, without loss. Obviously, for JPEG and videos, this wouldn't apply.
Feb 16 2012 4:05PM
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123+ski
Posts: 2832 - Karma: 581
I think this should be true. not sure about sharpening, but when I shoot raw with a black and white picture style, I can pull up the pictures in color in lightroom, can't do this with jpegs
Feb 16 2012 4:15PM
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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
That turns sharpness all the way down, but again, I'm shooting raw so that can be removed as Rob said. If thats the problem then I'm an idiot, but I'm not sure thats whats causing it. Any suggestions for colour profiles, I like the super flat because it gives you so much flexibility in post, but if its removing sharpness...

My basic workflow is import, get exposure and WB correct (basic panel, don't use bright/contrast), curves, add a bit of clarity if needed, and burn + dodge if needed. Export in Jpeg and archive.

Any one know about sharpness in jpeg vs raw?


Feb 16 2012 6:30PM
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1337
Posts: 31046 - Karma: 29,167
take some test photos trying the different picture styles with different lenses right now and post results?
Feb 16 2012 6:36PM
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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
All Jpeg straight from camera, exif in the title/description.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/zackbarwin/sets/72157629350317819/
Feb 16 2012 7:17PM
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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
I've been shooting with my custom profile for months, and I'm noticing a decrease in sharpness. The first 3.5 pages of my flickr we're all shot with it. Nothing else has changed. Hence I'm wondering if its worth getting my sensor cleaned.
Feb 16 2012 7:20PM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,404
I have no problem getting sharp images with my 17-40 at f4....

basic sharpening in camera raw + contrast is all you need ost of the time, sometimes a bit more then that is needed though
Feb 16 2012 7:27PM
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1337
Posts: 31046 - Karma: 29,167
they didn't look dramatically dull, maybe its just my monitor/setup.
Feb 16 2012 7:30PM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,404
wait, people actually shoot with picture styles? um.....
Feb 16 2012 7:52PM
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1337
Posts: 31046 - Karma: 29,167
for video, yes. they are incredibly handy, esp. for these canon dslrs. the "superflat" or "cinestyle" pushes the whites and blacks down/up (respectively) to create a flatter image where colors aren't clipped by the h264 codec (in compression, it tends to save the most data in the mids and drop out the detail in the highs/lows). It's image is much easier to grade than something with extremes pushed in camera.
Feb 16 2012 7:58PM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,404
i understand video, but for pictures there is no point, raw + knowing how to edit is all you need
Feb 16 2012 7:59PM
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1337
Posts: 31046 - Karma: 29,167
very true. I usually forget to switch to my regular profile when shooting pictures but i have yet to notice a huge difference
Feb 16 2012 8:01PM
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mammothpunks
Posts: 5724 - Karma: 372
If you are using Lightroom, the picture styles do nothing, they only provide the jpg preview that will show up before the full raw file loads in lightroom. If you are using the canon DPP software, your raw files will show up with the applied photo style, with the option to also change the settings (which are the same as what you find in the picture style menu with the addition of exposure and a few other RAW settings.) Not sure what your problem is but picture styles only apply to JPGs if you are using lightroom.
Feb 17 2012 12:59AM
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snorlax-one
Posts: 145 - Karma: 22
Did you use a tripod for the sharpness test ?
If not do that and use mirror lockup and the timer, then post 100% crops.
Feb 17 2012 10:37AM
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Rob.
Posts: 189 - Karma: 16
I was also going to say to check the micro adjustment of the focus, but those test shots on your flickr are all small enough apertures to probably not make that the problem. 100% crops of the point that you focus on will be helpful.

To remove potential focusing problems, set up the camera on a tripod, and manual focus using 100% crop preview on the camera to get the point of interest to be as sharp as possible on the LCD. That way you should know whether or not focusing is causing your problems (though I doubt it is).
Feb 17 2012 11:45AM
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zahava
Posts: 7791 - Karma: 12,039
Of course, had to test out my new manfrotto.
Feb 17 2012 12:29PM
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dispatchQ_main
Posts: 2619 - Karma: 629
Are you adding the lut body? If you even can in lightroom? If your using cinetyle you need the lut body, the 2 were designed as a pair, its almost useless without it. Also don't use a super flat to expose your shot, use the picture style closest to your final idea of the image then switch to superflat. This is mostly video advice, but may be useful for pictures.
Feb 17 2012 4:05PM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,404
as has been said, picture styles do absolutely nothing if you are shooting raw, don't ever worry about them, leave your camera on the standard one and learn to edit properly (i suggest PS over LR)

sharpening is such a basic process, it takes all of 5 min to do
Feb 17 2012 4:40PM
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