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FKS 140 Heelpiece movement

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j.saaaarela
Posts: 1859 - Karma: 856
So today I got my new Scratches with this year's FKS 140's back from getting mounted at the shop. Of course, when I got home, I clicked in on the carpet, shuffled about for a few minutes, and felt the flex.

When I leaned forward to feel the forward flex, however, I saw that the heelpiece on both skis somewhat lifted with the boot--like the orange section tilted forward more when I flexed forward. The screws the hold the binding to the ski are secure, my DIN is right, and the forward pressure is exactly how it should be.

Has anyone else had this happen? Is it a significant problem? I can try to explain better what is happening if this explanation is unclear.

And +k as always to helpful responses.
Dec 15 2011 8:14PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
The arms on the heelpiece are supposed to move freely like that, it's one of the things that prevents pre-release on the FKS heel piece.
Dec 15 2011 8:23PM
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j.saaaarela
Posts: 1859 - Karma: 856
Ah, I see. Thanks for the input, 10/10.
Dec 15 2011 9:06PM
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Jo_n
Posts: 77 - Karma: 50
I got my 140's mounted earlier this season and they do the same thing, i have skied on them multiple times and nothing has gone wrong so i am pretty sure this is normal.
Dec 15 2011 9:38PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Anyone else have troubles with bending their brakes on fks 140s? On my old marker squires i didn't once but now i bend my fks's breaks about once every time skiing and its really annoying.
Dec 15 2011 9:47PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
Use a tool (pliers or something similar) to bend them out a bit more.
Dec 15 2011 9:51PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
What too you mean by bend them out? Like pull em higher? Farther away from my skis? Closer?
Dec 16 2011 4:52PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
Oh, I thought you were talking about them getting caught up on the ski/sidewall.

The reason the FKS brakes bend more on release is because they're held in place better because they're under the bindings themselves, other bindings have play, which is also what causes them to break off the ski, so the force applied to them be the release can be taken out (but if too much force is applied the screw holding them in place snaps), since FKS breaks don't have play, the force applied causes them to bend (and sometimes, unfortunately, snap).
Dec 16 2011 5:26PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Thanks man, yeah it just seems like every time i eject one of my breaks is completely messed up
Dec 16 2011 11:05PM
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huge-go
Posts: 1451 - Karma: 33
Sounds like you don't have enough forward pressure. The tab might say you have enough, but that's not always accurate. Does your boot lift a bit in the binding without actually coming out? That would be a sure sign you don't have enough.
Dec 16 2011 11:40PM
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LC.
Posts: 5952 - Karma: 2,423
This. Take them to a better shop who know how to adjust them properly. The tab is just a guide.
Dec 17 2011 6:16AM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
To me? or the OP?
Dec 17 2011 8:52AM
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huge-go
Posts: 1451 - Karma: 33
OP
Dec 17 2011 12:10PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Alright I also need some more help. Does anyone have any idea why my Fks release maybe more than they normally should when I land switch?

Like today I did this 5 and it wasn't the best of landings but my ski ejected and i caught an edge with the other ski, flipped over and smacked my face on the snow. Got cut up pretty bad but the worst part was that I cracked my grey polarized oakley lenses:(
Dec 17 2011 5:05PM
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CDdesign
Posts: 1015 - Karma: 92
why would you ever want to buy a binding where the forward pressure indicator doesnt accually work, even when its new?
Dec 17 2011 5:30PM
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huge-go
Posts: 1451 - Karma: 33
Because they're fucking awesome? It's not a big deal, anyone with a sliver of ski tech sense should be able to get them to set them properly without the indicator. I don't even look at the indicator anymore.
Dec 17 2011 6:32PM
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CDdesign
Posts: 1015 - Karma: 92

well im glad you dont adjust my bindings...

Dec 17 2011 6:39PM
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.RYAN66
Posts: 5381 - Karma: 235
do you want a medal or a cookie?
Dec 17 2011 6:43PM
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CDdesign
Posts: 1015 - Karma: 92
and accually legally, its a huge deal if a tech sets up bindings and the forward pressure indicator is not where it should be, causing the bindings to not test in the correct range, if the owner get injured they can sue the shit outa the shop...
Dec 17 2011 6:44PM
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I_liketobutter
Posts: 2664 - Karma: 997
seriously, your questioning fks'? the binding that 75% of pros/ams ride? the reason some don't is usually b/c they ride for salomon/4frnt/k2/marker

to the OP, bring them back to the shop and tell them what's wrong. if your boot isn't lifting its fine. if your boot is lifting bring them in.
Dec 17 2011 7:49PM
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huge-go
Posts: 1451 - Karma: 33
The point is sometimes on fks the forward pressure indicator would tell you the forward pressure is off, when it is in fact set properly. This is pretty well documented with anyone whose had more than one pair. Do you want your skis coming off all the time so you can have your little white tab in the right spot, or do you want your skis staying on? Choice is pretty clear.
Dec 17 2011 9:24PM
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SKI.ING
Posts: 2695 - Karma: 2,535
Do you want your knees blown on some random crash? Choice is pretty clear.
Dec 17 2011 9:28PM
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CDdesign
Posts: 1015 - Karma: 92
yup this, and that 75% of pros stat seems a little skued :-/  most of the pros i know use salomon driver bindings, or jesters
Dec 18 2011 1:00PM
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I_liketobutter
Posts: 2664 - Karma: 997
lulz at hating on fks
Dec 18 2011 3:43PM
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rozboon
Posts: 1642 - Karma: 868

They release completely normally. What you don't seem to get is that it's a well established fact that the FKS/Pivot indicator tab doesn't always line up exactly when the forward pressure is functionally correct. It all depends on the wear of the boot, which boot it is (the ISO DIN specification actually has quite a bit of leeway, to the tune of a couple of mm if I remember right so not all boots are the same).

I would much, much rather have a binding that was functioning completely correctly, with the indicator tab a couple of mm from where it's "supposed" to be, than have one that was "correct" but let my skis fall off at bad times. Disclaimer, if you even think about adjusting your FKS/Pivots your legs will curl up into prezels and you will die, not my fault ok?

The guy with the brake issues - take your ski, put it on a bench, click a boot into it. Then grab the back of the boot at the top and pull it forward, to mimic the forces of a heavy switch landing. If your forward pressure is out by a bit, the heel of the boot will rise and the brake will come down slightly (or a lot, if they're really out...) - this may be the problem you're having. More disclaimers, listening to the internet about your bindings will cause your skis to smash into 10000 pieces and embed in your eye sockets. So don't do it.

Dec 18 2011 6:36PM
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huge-go
Posts: 1451 - Karma: 33
What the guy in the post above me said. You don't know what you're talking about. They will come off fine when they need to and stay on when they need to. If people can't deal with their white tab not being lined up with the little hash marks, get another binding.
Dec 18 2011 9:48PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Am I more likely to tear my ACL with FKSs? I'm sort of worried because I have them set at 9 and I only weigh 140 lbs. Set at 9 though they seem to release near perfectly though.
Dec 19 2011 7:49PM
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CDdesign
Posts: 1015 - Karma: 92
with MOST any major binding set up properly, the chance of injury with DIN "X" is just about the same...
Dec 19 2011 7:52PM
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I_liketobutter
Posts: 2664 - Karma: 997
^dude, stop giving advice on shit you aren't knowledgeable on.

guys, don't come to this thread for reliable advice. yet another reason why if you don't know what you're doing, don't ask NS, bring it in to a good shop.
Dec 19 2011 8:02PM
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j.saaaarela
Posts: 1859 - Karma: 856
So I adjusted the porward pressure to where the brake arms don't move when I lean forward, but now i get a springy sound when I click in... Bad sign?
Dec 19 2011 8:10PM
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tomPietrowski
Posts: 7145 - Karma: 17,457
^ if you dont know what your doing dont try. FKS are great bindings but setting the foward pressure acuratly sucks. Take them to a good shop and get them set up by someone who knows the binding.
Dec 19 2011 8:17PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Where is the forward pressure meter on the bindings?
Dec 21 2011 5:09PM
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FerrisBueller
Posts: 8280 - Karma: 5,173
i dont think its a meter there are two screws on top of little black cylinders on the heel piece.
Dec 21 2011 5:27PM
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tomPietrowski
Posts: 7145 - Karma: 17,457
^ thats how you set the foward pressure but you do not use those to check the pressure. Take them to a shop
Dec 21 2011 5:29PM
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Crispy.
Posts: 6109 - Karma: 7,683
Is there anyway I can check the pressure without going to a shop?
Dec 21 2011 5:32PM
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tomPietrowski
Posts: 7145 - Karma: 17,457
There is yes, but why risk potenialy the rest of your season if you mess it up, when a shop can do it in less then 5 min and prob will not even charge you, if they just check the foward pressure.
Dec 21 2011 5:36PM
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Pool.
Posts: 2820 - Karma: 662
haha i did the same thing but instead broke my outrigger in half and got a black eye
Dec 21 2011 6:02PM
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SKI.ING
Posts: 2695 - Karma: 2,535
This is what I was getting at when I posted earlier guys. I'm not nitpicking about your little tab lining up for forward pressure or anything, I'm simply saying he doesn't know how to really do it so why not have a shop do it for him correctly. If he took it to a shop, they tested it, it released/retained properly, and the tab indicator didn't match up then obviously you would be right and he could ski with peace of mind. So quick to hate on this site, but thats what I was trying to say to him.
Dec 21 2011 8:24PM
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rozboon
Posts: 1642 - Karma: 868

You can check it based on the white tab at the rear of the heel, it should be within (or flush with, depending who you talk to) the 2 little black raised bits on either side of it.

However! Setting them juuuuust right tends to be a bit of an imprecise science, it comes down to boot-binding compatibility, how worn the boots are, exactly what length was used when mounting your binding, blah blah blah. You're really best off getting someone who knows the bindings well (not someone who is just going off what the 1 line in the paper manual say) and can check they are functioning correctly to set it.

Dec 21 2011 8:26PM
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j.saaaarela
Posts: 1859 - Karma: 856
Well I took it back to the shop and they set it differently than before. So I took them to another shop and they set them differently as well... So I adjusted them to what i thought was a good medium between those 3 settings, and went skiing today. No pre release, and they released when I needed them to, so I think I have it down.
Dec 21 2011 10:02PM
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I_liketobutter
Posts: 2664 - Karma: 997
haha, nice. its not such a bad things you had to do that. its a good learning process, now you have an idea how your bindings should be set. seems like a pain now, but those fks will easily last you 3+ years. i've got over 300 days on my 150's. the toes are still mint, the heels are pretty shot but still work just fine
Dec 21 2011 10:14PM
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smeeze
Posts: 879 - Karma: 126
I love the pivot heel pice.
Dec 21 2011 11:18PM
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Mr_pretzel
Posts: 4616 - Karma: 1,289
How does not one shop in norway have the binding testing machine? FML
Dec 28 2011 7:31AM
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ARMADAR7
Posts: 401 - Karma: 36
Bump, I just got new fks 140s and they were doing the same thing, I brought them back to the shop and they wouldn't help me because the dins ties tested properly but the heal of the boot is still moving up and down and it's frustrating the shit out of me, should I bring them to another shop or are they fine, I'm guessing they are not set up right because I don't think 300$ binding shoud allow the heel of the boot to move up and down without engaging the spring
Dec 10 2012 5:33PM
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DaysToCome
Posts: 1601 - Karma: 86
no. that din seems about right for your weight but it also depends on your skier type. And your likely to blow your knee skiing no matter what your din is.
Dec 10 2012 6:03PM
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easiestEC
Posts: 2471 - Karma: 489
this thread is awesome. popped up on google when i searched this problem too. good to see its not just me
Mar 10 2013 6:25PM
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