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Did my local shop 'eff up?

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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Hey NSer's. I made this thread in Gear Talk aswell, but realised I needed quick eyes time as I'm going back to the shop tomorrow.

I need some knowledge and opinions on a waxing I got a local shop 3 days ago. Shouldn't be too hard for some quality advice on what to do. Please bear with me as I'm shit at writing/wording plus knowing fuck all about wax/tune etc shit does't help.

So, I have a pair of K2 Revivals in 9.8/10

I recently picked up a Living Social coupon for a lift ticket to Bear Valley, $50 in store credit and a FULL service tune up, total cost of coupon was $70 (Promotional value $120)

Went in, spent the credit, got the ticket, got the FULL tune-up. (picked up my skis 2 days later)

Didn't check my skis condition at time of pickup.

Skied all day on them yesterday, came home. Wiped the bases and noticed one of my tails.

Click for larger image

The rivets have been completely flushed with base?! Uneven at that. Looks like what ever method of buffing up my bases was done was held to long on. Notice as well, the notch missing at the tip. Unsure weather the missing edge is linked to the reason for the rivets being ground down as I never noticed it before but again, Its only missing on that ski.

Heres a pic of my other tail. Clearly not ground down and flush. You can even see where the clean base starts from having dirty tips.

Click for larger image

So they fucked up right?

Theres no way I could of done this? I bailed a few times in the park, but nothing like what I'd expect you'd have to do to ground them down that much.

Obviously I'm going back there with my skis tomorrow to see what they say. Just want some advice before I go in there on what to say and expect. These are my first pair of skis and love them like a newborn, but seriously, A FULL tune up shouldn't entail a grounding down and what looks like negligence with tools should it?

Another query I have is, should a FULL tune up be more than a waxing? Any gouges I had on my bases should of been filled right?
I think because I got the tune-up for a discounted price, corners were cut and I just got cheapo tune. Instead of getting the FULL service the coupon said I'd get. More bothered by the fuck up than the difference in the tune up but again, I don't know shit.

Anyone else had problems like this? What dd the shop say? Have I got a leg to stand on being as I've skied on them since the tune-up and didn't check them at pick up?

Any thoughts/opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Lee.


Nov 29 2011 2:41AM
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-AP-
Posts: 819 - Karma: 344
I don't think there's any way you could've done that damage unless you rode on straight concrete or something. And even then there would be scratches on the base so you would know that you did it. I don't really think it's a big deal unless you intend on using the rivets. I don't think there's anyway that will slow you down but maybe those rivets will be weaker and pop out on you.
Don't worry about the gap between the edge, I have revivals and the edge looks just like yours. Your shop definitely messed up but I'd say it's up to you whether to do anything about it. That kind of damage seems mostly cosmetic to me.
Nov 29 2011 2:54AM
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tbayskier
Posts: 1138 - Karma: 1,642
Read the whole thing carefully.  Three points:

1. The edge crack is normal.  It is a seam from where the manufacturer puts the edge together, all twin tips have some sort of edge seam at the top of the ski.  Do not worry about it.

2.  The grinding off of the rivets is a problem.  When the store used a base grinder to texture and smooth your base they tilted the ski too high when they were pulling them off the grinder, and wore down your rivets.  PERSONALLY I would not care.  They are park skis, they are going to be bashed and wrecked soon anyways.  HOWEVER, I'm pretty sure you have a leg to stand on in getting some type of reimbursement.  They should not have ground down the rivets, and you are now more vulnerable to a tip/tail delamination.  Prime opportunities for delams would occur from big icy impacts and smacking and tapping the ground down tip into rails. I really doubt you're going to have a problem, but if you're feeling zealous you can try and get some free shit.

3.  Judge what you ask for by the personality of the owner.  If the owner is rude and uncaring, ask for a brand new pair of skis, and get pissed. Be demanding; they messed up your skis(even though it's probably not a problem).  If the owner is pleasant and sympathetic, maybe lay off a little.  In all reality it's not a big deal. 


Those are my thoughts, make sure you approach the shop in a respectful manner, only get loud if the shop is uncaring or rude to you.   I work at a shop so I kind of get how things go down service wise. 

Good luck. 
Nov 29 2011 2:56AM
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tbayskier
Posts: 1138 - Karma: 1,642
One more note, a full tune would  include a base tune.  That means running the skis through a grinder.  The grinder fucked up your rivets. 
Nov 29 2011 2:58AM
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grambo
Posts: 1125 - Karma: 93
How is $70 for a full tune a good deal on livingsocial/groupon? It should be $50 2 for 1 full tune type pricing to be a good deal. What a lame shop, and 100% for sure they ground the rivets.
Nov 29 2011 2:59AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
The flushed rivits are not from you riding over anything. They were ground down when the tuning shop performed a base grind, Someone did not lift up the feed wheel in time and the rivits were run across the grinding stone for what appears to be a good amount of time.
I know this because i did the same thing when i was tuning my old jung fujas. It is very easy to do if you are not paying attention.

Also if you received a full tune at a value of 120$ then yes any deep base scratches or damage should have been repaired
Nov 29 2011 3:01AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
awww shit, i got beat but ya your shop fucked up haha
Nov 29 2011 3:02AM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
the rivets shouldn't have been touched, but honestly it wont effect your ski at all. They rivet is still there and in one piece, it just doesn't stick up. Really, k2 tip/tail rivets are almost just for looks, im pretty sure they barely hold anything in place. I had a pair of vicious' like 5 years ago and i had a rivet fall out and it was no big deal, most skis dont come with rivets anyway...
Nov 29 2011 3:31AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Awesome responses. Many Thanks.

The store is a family run business and I guess pride themselves on being in business for years, at least their last website did. (They just got a new one)

I've been to the store a good few times in the past few weeks, so most of the employee's know my face. Got fitted for FT's a month ago, have been back since to get them tweaked. Might need to go back again as they still weren't that comfy after a 2nd day on em. But I think thats another visit. Got footbeds with them so I get lifetime adjustments with my boots. Definitely don't want to tarnish my relationship with the store because of this, but definitely don't want to get ploughed over.

Not keen on having my skis fucked thorough error and I'm really not sure anything less than them being fixed or better being a solution. I know you say it's cosmetic. Unless I plan on using skins? I don't But still. Will not be spending all the time in the park so, these need to last and any chance of early de lamination because of the error should be addressed.

Thanks again for the advice. A little bit worried about what to say and expect in all honesty.
Nov 29 2011 3:34AM
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tbayskier
Posts: 1138 - Karma: 1,642
the man speaks truth.  as a park ski i really wouldn't give a fuck.  I mean you're gonna be riding steel pipes with them and basically throwing them off stuff right........
Nov 29 2011 3:34AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
dont go in accusing anyone, just explain the situation. You should probably think about what you want out of the conversation before you go in. You used a free voucher so im not sure what the refund process would be.
Nov 29 2011 3:41AM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
Honestly, they are going to give you shit. If you're lucky, they might give you like a store credit or maybe a free tune. Your ski isn't broken, it has not lost any value, yes they should have done a better job but still, if it makes you that mad then don't give them anymore service. I'd say go in, be nice, dont demand anything and hopefully you'll get an apology and maybe a free wax, i wouldn't expect much more than that.
Nov 29 2011 3:44AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
Tis the truth. Sucks, but its pretty realistic
Nov 29 2011 3:47AM
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Static
Posts: 8560 - Karma: 4,138
get on judge judy
Nov 29 2011 3:50AM
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tbayskier
Posts: 1138 - Karma: 1,642
yep.  i'd just ask for a free wax coupon, and just point out that your ski is a little bit fucked up. Hell, i probably wouldn't even mention it haha.  but i go through like 2 pairs of park skis a winter. 
Nov 29 2011 3:50AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Well kinda. I generally suck at park, probably a 60/40 type of skier favoured towards the groomers. My friends I go with dont like the park.

Regardless of where or how I ski on them, It shouldn't be a reason to not care about it should it? Cosmetic or not.

Can't see them replacing them, but in all honesty in-store credit aint gonna cut it. I struggled to spend the $50. I have all the gear I need.

The error seems like a schoolboy mistake for any employee of any shop in country. Errors happen, I get it, but what else could the employee have been concentrating on when doing this. I am by no means saying tuning is easy, but just requires time, technique and repetition to be good at right? All of which the shop technician should of had enough of if this tune was to cost actual money.
Nov 29 2011 3:51AM
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tbayskier
Posts: 1138 - Karma: 1,642
the rivet probably grazed the belt for about 2 seconds.  The belt takes off a decent amount of base pretty quick.  I understand where you're coming from, I just think it will be difficult to convince the shop you need new skis. 
Nov 29 2011 3:57AM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
You're not going to get new skis, accept it now. Accept an apology and a free tune and move on.
Nov 29 2011 3:58AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
O super easy mistake then, but.....again. Shouldn't of happened.

If i knew that the tune-up was a base grind. I wouldn't of had it done yet, I just had to use the coupon all at the same time.

We'll see how it goes tomorrow. Unsure in all honesty.
Nov 29 2011 4:03AM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
Your ski is still going to go downhill, better then when it would when it went into the shop, just go ski
Nov 29 2011 4:04AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Accept a FREE tune up from a shop that tuned my ski's enough to warrant a thread about them??

Thanks for the advice.

Again. We'll see how it goes.
Nov 29 2011 4:07AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Accept a FREE tune up from a shop that tuned my ski's enough to warrant a thread about them??

Thanks for the advice.

Again. We'll see how it goes.
Nov 29 2011 4:07AM
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Static
Posts: 8560 - Karma: 4,138
you don't want any new gear, a free tune isn't enough... what do you really expect them to do?

They will probably won't mind losing a penny-pinching customer who only brings in his internet bought skis for a loss-leader tune. If you really want to get results, like I said, take them to court.
Nov 29 2011 4:21AM
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Static
Posts: 8560 - Karma: 4,138
editttttttttttttttt, since u bought boots too you might have a little more pull, but don't expect anything of vaule
Nov 29 2011 4:23AM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
I don't think this warranted a thread at all...
Nov 29 2011 4:24AM
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E__
Posts: 5751 - Karma: 4,635
Just go in and question them about it, they'll give you something to make up for the mistake but it won't be anything spectacular and like everyone else said it's just a little mistake that won't warm anyone.
Nov 29 2011 4:48AM
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shibby
Posts: 7088 - Karma: -19
This.

Your original concern was legit but all your worries have been answered. Next time take some responsibility by either tuning yourself or knowing exactly what you're getting yourself into before handing the skis over.

I'm sure you could get a free K2 rivet brought in though if you still think it's a big deal.
Nov 29 2011 4:56AM
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Boooshank
Posts: 1650 - Karma: 160
Thanks for advice and questions answered.

I never said anything about NOT wanting new skis just the fact I knew I wouldn't. I didn't buy my skis over the internet. How would I of known what I was getting my self into before handing over my skis? Check the shop assistants qualifications? The shop has been pretty faultless up until then, why would of thought anything negative?

Apologies for not actually thinking I should of just gone in, accepted a free tune, an apology or not bothered at all.

My bad for using a forum for something I didn't have knowledge about. I'll happily PM a mod to delete the thread after I see what they say.

Thanks again to all answered queries.
Nov 29 2011 5:21AM
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BlakeG
Posts: 1450 - Karma: 1,030
Just get them to grind down your other rivets... Like stated before no other brand that has park skis have rivets
Nov 29 2011 9:07AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
That screw up will have no impact whatsoever on your skis. It's fine. Don't worry about it.
Nov 29 2011 9:23AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,411
The only thing the rivets might be there for is mass dampening. Since it's steel they add mass to the tail and when you add mass the tail is less likely to vibrate and buffet. But yeah not a huge deal though.
Nov 29 2011 9:30AM
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shorty_T
Posts: 2725 - Karma: 761
They can order replacement rivets. They're removable now.
Nov 29 2011 11:54AM
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TheWakes.
Posts: 685 - Karma: 235
the grooves looks like a grindstone for sure. dude probably didn't realize you had rivets. it would have fucked up his stone a bit too tho so he got punished as well.
Nov 29 2011 12:02PM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
atomic and salomon both made park skis with rivets
Nov 29 2011 12:31PM
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SickStickz
Posts: 396 - Karma: 137
I didn't read the entire thread, but I saw the picture of your rivets. It's really not a big deal. Your rivets will be fine. When you grind a ski this happens. The only way to avoid it is to lift the weight up right when you come to the tip so that you can pull the ski out. You could go to the shop, but I doubt they will replace your skis lol. Your skis are functioning just fine.
Nov 29 2011 12:51PM
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Boggs
Posts: 1039 - Karma: 208
This, I accidentally did that to some obsetheds and I just ordered the guy some new rivets. Easy fix.
Nov 29 2011 1:01PM
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Gmart
Posts: 1634 - Karma: 273
i didnt read all of the posts in this thread cause im feelin lazy but they probably left the ski on the machine too long. I work at a shop and watch the tech tune skis all the time and i can see it happening already, he's never done it but like the guy above said the tech forgot to lift the ski up and the base tuner grabbed the metal and shredded it down. Now i also know that k2 makes rivets in there skis for skins, skins are strips of material that go on the bottom of the skis and attach through the holes after you take out the rivets, there for hiking and what not so your ski doesnt slide, there basically grip for the base of the skis. Take the ski back and say i think you left the ski on the machine to long, now there gonna tell you its 100% cosmetic because that part of the ski hardly touches snow and in a way there right but then again they fucked up so i dunno whats gonna happen from there, if i were you i'd bring it back and just explain everything that happened, don't go in all guns blazing and shit cause then there gonna be like fuck this douche bag. In reality, you'd have to tail press the shit out of a big ass rock at the right angle multiple times for those rivets to end up in the condition that yours are in. But if you did that your bases would be fucked up too which they aren't so just go in there and explain. sorry for writing an essay but that's what most likely happened. hope this helped
Nov 29 2011 1:21PM
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Boggs
Posts: 1039 - Karma: 208
Why are we using skins on a park ski again?
Nov 29 2011 1:26PM
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Che~
Posts: 2108 - Karma: 296
the rivets in the revivals arent for skins lol
Nov 29 2011 1:35PM
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Capurnicus
Posts: 9947 - Karma: 1,886
Should def have them replace your skis, that could be dangerous.
Nov 29 2011 1:42PM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
This is a joke right?
Nov 29 2011 1:43PM
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Banane.
Posts: 3102 - Karma: 414
Yea , at least i think.
Nov 29 2011 1:45PM
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Capurnicus
Posts: 9947 - Karma: 1,886
Not at all. Those metal rivets look awfully sharp. He could cut himself while handling the skis and get Staphylococcus and die.
Nov 29 2011 1:46PM
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eheath
Posts: 61645 - Karma: 123,452
hahaha word
Nov 29 2011 1:53PM
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That_One_Dude
Posts: 1050 - Karma: 760
i lold
Nov 29 2011 1:57PM
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Session
Posts: 5389 - Karma: 22,281
It's not a case of if it makes a difference to the ski in the long run or not. Or if they are parks ski's, etc. It's a case of you paid for a service. You don't deserve to get your shit back looking beat.

I would expect some sort of compensation. Whats sad is the shop should have known that it happened, and let you know.
Nov 29 2011 2:04PM
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STAUSS
Posts: 8232 - Karma: 3,311
rivets are for looks.
Nov 29 2011 2:10PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Click for larger image
Nov 29 2011 2:21PM
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CrotchKiller
Posts: 9037 - Karma: 6,943
Holes in the tip and tail are not only the attachments points for K2 skins, but they also fit the functional needs of a backcountry skier including the ability to build a rescue sled or construct various ski anchors. The holes are equipped with removable plugs.

straight off k2's website, although they are not available on the OP's skis
Nov 29 2011 2:26PM
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Session
Posts: 5389 - Karma: 22,281
So is the paint on my car, but if a shop scratches the fuck out of my paint I would expect compensation.

I don't see how you goons can justify trivializing someones gear getting beat.
Nov 29 2011 2:29PM
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nickmcnutt
Posts: 4396 - Karma: 2,966
The rivets on 2 separate pairs of k2 skis I've owned were 100% responsible for keeping my ski rideable for weeks/months past major delam issues. I don't have any pics but i took a grinder to cut off the delamed portion of the edge/base and the rivets are where the delam stopped. Definitely helped. In this case, yeah they probably are still going to do the intended job, but if you're feeling bitchy you might get a hook-up of some kind from the shop. Maybe just some more shitty tunes though.
Nov 29 2011 2:52PM
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