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Official Ski Pressing/Shaping/Building/Constructing Thread

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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
All of us have thought about building your own shit at one time or another, but how many of you actually have? This thread will be dedicated to those who actually build your own gear from scratch, surely there are some of you on NS. Now I can't contribute to this thread much because I've never built anything and I only have a small amount of time working with fiberglass, but would sure love to see some info from you dudes who actually do, whether you build in your basement, or for a living. So if you can legitimately contribute please do.
Oct 24 2011 8:22PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
I'm not totally sure about the specifics as to why heat is better but this article sheds some light on the topic, and on the heated ski press. http://skibuilders.com/articles/epoxy.shtml Sorry if that links broken im on mobile. For epoxy I think you want a longer cure time for sure. Deffinatley helps for the new guy doing his first layups would be nothing worse then having the epoxy gel in the press. Hope that helps!
Feb 18 2012 12:47AM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24730 - Karma: 30,003
This really should be in geartalk for sure.
Feb 18 2012 12:53AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Yeah idk why the mods haven't moved it. I even asked nicely.
Feb 18 2012 1:02AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Yeah as I understand it a slower curing epoxy turns out more flexible and stronger, it also bonds better. The heat some way some how boosts these properties. I'm not a chemist so I couldn't tell you why. The camber profile tutorial will be up in a few minutes! So this is basically a good old baaaamp.
Feb 23 2012 5:03PM
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Shenanigans
Posts: 868 - Karma: 455
Threads because I really want to try this some day
Feb 23 2012 5:11PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Here is the tutorial on how to make a camber/base/rocker profile whatever you want to call it. This is used to make our mold ribs when we are physically building the ski. It's pretty basic, I left out like super step by step detail because if you've made it this far then you should now how to use all of the necessary tools and commands. Good luck.

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Feb 23 2012 6:50PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Alrighty guys, this is going to sound nuts, but in the little time I had to wander through home depot, and I can't find any poplar at all. For boards of wood all home depot really has is some laminated craft boards (doesn't say species of wood) and framing lumber. I cannot find poplar boards or maple boards or any suitable species. So how can I get my hands on some poplar boards....?
Apr 28 2012 6:23PM
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AlexFromTarget
Posts: 533 - Karma: 59
threads really considering this
Apr 29 2012 1:01PM
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Bmo.
Posts: 4908 - Karma: 2,669
back in my threads
May 7 2012 10:58AM
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AEROPLAEHN
Posts: 1353 - Karma: 192
Go to a lumber yard / lumber supplier.
May 7 2012 1:07PM
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.cam.
Posts: 1852 - Karma: 48
Ask an employee. All of the homedepots I have been to have oak maple and poplar
May 7 2012 4:20PM
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Toaster-Tony
Posts: 3531 - Karma: 5,850
Built one from the specs of line anthems in shop class senior year. Have yet to get around to actually building the skis haha.
May 7 2012 8:06PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Was in there the other day, and asked if they stocked specialty lumber. The first employee said no, but asked around to a few others, and we even looked..... Lol they don't have any, for what reason I don't know why. Anyways the smaller specialty lumber and woodworking stores do carry it, but a good family friend has a sawmill and some access to some good, clear grain, local poplar, so I'm all in for that, just makes the skis so much more badass.

So tonight I just started on building a jig to hold down my tip and tail templates onto my MDF. I'm going to make a mold like NS member hot.pocket's. It's pretty gnar since the camber profiles are all adjustable as opposed to the traditional full rib camber molds you would see on skibuilders. That took up most of my night, but here is a picture of the jig and the tail template:

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So if you're wondering how the variable camber mold works basically that tip curve looking piece, there will be a bunch of those lined up and held together with threaded rod. Then you have a sheet of MDF the width of the press spanning between two of those tip and tail molds, and then you just shim underneath the MDF to get your desired camber. You can also make longer skis by swapping out the MDF sheet for a longer one.

One last thing before I wrap this post up; I want to make an I beam press because of its un-restricted side loading access. Right now it looks like I have access to some 24 Inch I beam, but to buy four sections of it may get crazy for price. That would also be a fucking huge press, I just don't have room for something that big and heavy. However I was thinking if I bought 2 lengths, and used a plasma cutter and cut them down the middle lengthwise, essentially making them t-beams then I would have a decent size press. Thoughts on this?

Thanks to everyone for the help and contributions so far, keep it up!
May 7 2012 11:08PM
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.cam.
Posts: 1852 - Karma: 48
They shouldn't be much weaker than a 12 inch I beam but they will be harder to attach than a normal I beam
May 7 2012 11:39PM
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Jibbin_Ur_Face
Posts: 2536 - Karma: 751
re-threads
May 8 2012 12:23AM
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richard.
Posts: 873 - Karma: 55
threads.
May 8 2012 12:34AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Yeah it would be a bitch to cut that to, but if it's cheaper, its probably worth it.

Tonight I got half of the tail mold ribs made. I was slowed down so much because my router bearing was right fucked, had to pull it apart, clean it, and grease it. Got it working again. Then the other problem I encountered was that my MDF was sliding around in the jig. I adjusted my clamps so that they pressed harder on the rib template, but the MDF still shifted when it was getting routed. So I tried double sided tape on one side of the template to grab the MDF and that worked temporarily but after 4 or so ribs, it wasn't effective anymore. So what I did was I pounded some finish nails through the bottom of my jig so the sharp tips were bareley protruding through my jig so they would grab the MDF, then I cut the rest of the nail off and filled the gaps in the hole with wood glue. This worked perfectly but it was getting late so I cleaned up and left it for tomorrow. THERES NEVER ENOUGH HOURS IN THE DAY! Will maybe post pics tomorrow so that if anyone builds a similar jig they can incorporate the nails so they won't encounter the same problem I did.
May 8 2012 11:20PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5676 - Karma: 4,299
My threads, wanna see this progress. Skis are still on my list of things to build, along with a surfboard.

Also, I've seen people on post on the silverfish (longbord forum) board building section that hydraulic bottle jacks can be had for somewhat cheap. Somebody made an entirely wood press that didn't explode when pressing with the jacks.
May 8 2012 11:49PM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,087
The reason that this hasn't been moved to GT is that it's a lively thread with real discussion and an interesting topic; many late model NSers haven't ever seen such an example.

Stoked to follow your progress. Skiing pow is one thing; skiing pow on boards you designed/helped design and build is totally another.
May 9 2012 1:41AM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4236 - Karma: 10,722
Re-threadsies.

Also, a pic of my latest pair and my little brother's first pair (he just started skiing!)

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May 9 2012 5:19AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Thats so gnar man. How many people on the lift are like, "Hey, what brand are those skis man?" and you reply:

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Aha anyways, so after a few days of work, I got the tail rib molds made and put together, here is a few pictures:

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Also little concerned about the tip and tail profiles when compared to my other skis I own. They seem to be some more curvier, but then you have to consider the amount the skis will relax. No matter what, they will have enough curve, but do you guys think they have TOO much curve? You can see the curve profile in the last picture.


May 9 2012 10:26PM
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tcgoldman
Posts: 704 - Karma: 723
i appreciate it thanks man
May 9 2012 11:13PM
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KyleA
Posts: 865 - Karma: 510
The best feeling.
May 9 2012 11:26PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4236 - Karma: 10,722
They seem like they'll work just fine in terms of the curvature. If you've ever seen coreUPT skis they have some pretty intense curvature in their tips/tails and they ride just fine. The only thing, whats like the overall size of them? We use ones that are pretty hefty big, also lots of flat on the top to keep the hose from bending down over the other side.

The only reason to do that would be if the hose goes down on the other side an incredible amount it has a tendency to not go completely into the curve of the tip and tail, creating less pressure there and less of a seal. Just a thought.

Pic to show the size of my dad's tip / tail blocks:

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May 10 2012 1:22AM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4236 - Karma: 10,722
And glad to see your making progress!

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May 10 2012 1:24AM
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KrazyistKarl
Posts: 1725 - Karma: 599
still havent built a press. has anyone built a press with fire hose as many do but rather then using just air used water and presurized that with lower (safer) air presures?
May 10 2012 1:42AM
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jaredmdub
Posts: 2229 - Karma: 564
Threads
May 10 2012 3:50AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Ahhh shite, I see what you mean. If there isnt enough flat after the blocks the hose will just bend down over the edge. The overall size? Lol its pretty tiny, here is some dimensions in millimeters:

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Luckily this is only the shape for my tail mold and its about 4 dollars of MDF. I could make this tail mold work by having my clamp that goes in behind to secure it in the press have a nice long flat top but...... I think I'll just redraw the tip mold entirely (haven't made the template yet in case something like this happened) and just make enough of those to do the front and rear of the mold. I'll toss up some dimensions of the new tip drawing once it's done and I'll get someone to compare it to their molds.

Also that is a 3/4" MDF sheet running between your tip and tail molds? Do you nail it down after you have shimmed it for camber or does it just sit lose and the press holds it down once it's under pressure?
May 10 2012 1:59PM
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.cam.
Posts: 1852 - Karma: 48
It has been done but the only reason to do it is if you heat the water and use it as a heat source instead of heating blankets. There is no reason to use water other than air other than that. 40 psi of water is the same as 40 psi of air and if the tube ruptures and you only use air you get a lot less wet...
May 10 2012 4:37PM
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KrazyistKarl
Posts: 1725 - Karma: 599
all i know is that pipe fitters when pressure testing use over a hundred lbs of air and for a hydro test only 30
May 10 2012 5:13PM
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.cam.
Posts: 1852 - Karma: 48
Psi is pounds per square inch so it doesn't matter the liquid if its the same pressure...
May 10 2012 7:11PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Yeah I'd have to agree with this. It's probably used to test pipe because air wouldn't make a big freaking mess if the pipe burst.

Anyways, can someone post their tip lengths and heights. I'd like to use a 55mm tip height but I cant really get a good idea of a tip length, my park skis are rockered, and my all mountains have weird tips....
The reason my molds are so retarded is because I based them around such a small tip radius. Looks like if I make a longer tip length it mellows out the curve and looks way better.

Thanks!
May 10 2012 11:15PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Alright, so been busy over the past few days, and here is my new tip mold design. The orange lines are my construction lines that define the shape of the tip and you can see their respective dimensions of 140mm and 55mm. Would like opinions on this new revised size, and opinions as to whether or not I should extend the running length behind the mold.

Here's the pic, sorry that I annotated that in like 10 seconds:

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May 13 2012 12:00AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Postwhoring hard..... In my own thread. Ahwell, here is a little Monday night update. Tonight, the OCD kicked in unbelievably hard, and I hated my original jig to duplicated my rigs. It was tough to make perfectly square, and I don't believe it is. This lead to inconsistency in the heights in my ribs. Another thing that caused inconsistency with the last set of ribs was where I drilled the hole for the threaded rod after they were cut out. Now the curvature in the ribs needs to be identical in relation to the hole for the threaded rod as that's what holds them together and aligns them.

So after I sat for like a half hour and thought on how to build a new and improved jig, It finally came to me that I needed to have a bolt, a base plate, and my template to sandwhich my rib blanks in between. My dad came down into the workshop, and luckily has a clamping set up for his router table that was a bolt with a flanged end on the bottom, and was the same diameter of the rod I'm using to hold my ribs together. I also drilled three holes into the template and put cut off nails so that the pointy ends were just sticking out, so they can grip the rib blank and not turn around while in the router.

Here is the new jig!

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Also here is a comparison between the old rib that I really dicked up on..... And the new one with the sexy curves. Thoughts before I do a huge production run?

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May 14 2012 10:54PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4236 - Karma: 10,722
Mad swagger jamz happenin in the new mold, looks good I say go for it!
May 14 2012 11:08PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
So after a few nights of work after work and school, I've come up with these two beasts, and I'm super stoked...... Mainly because the bulk of cutting, routing, and sanding MDF is over with. Super tired, and been a long day travelling back and forth between work for supper and some errands, and to build the molds since it was raining outside and working in the yard wasn't an option.

Here is a pic of the blanks all sized up and drilled and ready for their turn in the router:

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I drilled the holes all in the same spot by clamping some straight cuts of wood to the top the drill press' table, and keeping them there, never moving them. This really paid off because there aren't any height differences mold (had this problem with the original set of ribs that I decided to not use)

So from there the ribs get clamped in my latest jig and passed them through the router. After making 48 passes, a shitload of sawdust, and a few hand cramps, I ended up with these puppies:

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So from here I think I'm going to make the top mold, cut the camber profile sheet that spans these two molds, cut the sheet that goes below the molds and the camber profile sheet. After all that I will hopefully have some I-beam and fire hoses to work with!
May 19 2012 12:31AM
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MRoden
Posts: 753 - Karma: 211
finished this up after 3 months. built it all in my woodshop class.
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May 19 2012 12:53AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Nice man. That's alot of rocker in the tip and tails. Is that your only mold or do you have others? Pics of any boards to come out of the press?
May 19 2012 9:19PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Hey guys, haven't updated in a while. Been busy with school and the press, and I'm taking a night off of both tonight. I've made great progress and have pretty much finished up the mold, and honestly, I'm stoked with how good it all looks! Here's some pics:

Bottom mold assembly (missing the bottom sheet used to rocker skis, messed up the length, so it became the top mold)
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Half of the top mold, chose to space the ribs, keep things light, use less material. Still weighs like 30 pounds.
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Scientifically engineered spacers for the top molds. Recognize them? :D Waste nothing!
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The whole jazz assembled.
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Showing how the top mold, tip mold, and mold sheet all come together.
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One more view showing the whole thing lengthwise. Missing the sheet on the bottom of course.
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Now some of you more perceptive ones may look at the whole assembly and wonder why it's missing a middle. Basically I snaked this idea from a picture of an ON3P press on the internet:

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You can see in the middle of their top mold, they have it spaced out with lumber, so basically the top mold is universal, and can be made to fit a longer or shorter mold by adding or removing spacers. Thanks for the idea guys ;p I probably owe them all a box of donuts or 30 000K if they have that magic patented, hopefully the former.

Where do I go from here? Well, I'm still in the hunt for 32 feet of 8x8 or 10x10 steel I-Beam, but I haven' really been looking at all. Luckily through word of mouth of my dad, I was able to score 24 feet of 6 Inch channel for a nights worth of work for a guy's airplane! Sweet deal to me. That will be enough to make some really nice, heavy duty ends for the press. Still looking for fire hoses and a deal on some bulk square aluminium tubing (but paying full price isn't the end of the world) and some material to hold the cattrack together (any suggestions)

Once again, thanks to everybody who has assisted me, I really appreciate it! And yeah yeah, TL;DR, I know....

May 29 2012 8:18PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4236 - Karma: 10,722
Drill holes in the sides of all the pieces (one on each end) and string metal cable through all of them.

Also, drill holes on a few on the other sides and put trampoline springs through the holes and the other end of the spring up onto the iBeam.
May 29 2012 8:23PM
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Bmo.
Posts: 4908 - Karma: 2,669
back in my threads. looking for some time to get started on my press!
May 29 2012 8:37PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,845
I have some 9oz Uni fiberglass cut to length if anyone wants to buy some. Cheap, below material cost. We also have a bunch of VDS strips and 16cmx16cm squares if anyones interested in them too.
May 30 2012 12:21AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
How many strips of fiberglass do you guys have? And the squares, are they squares of VDS rubber? I may but some of this up, because if the first layups sucks, not much is lost.
May 30 2012 12:50AM
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Nate.Dog
Posts: 1672 - Karma: 2,098
I finished my own pair of skis about 2 months ago, here are some pics, I just started my second pair!Click for larger image
there they are in the vacuum press in my woodshop class
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That's what they looked like when we pulled the vacuum bag off
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thats a closeup of the bindings I mounted on them plus a closeup of the graphic
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heres a pic of the completed ski profile!

These skis were amazingly fun, it was probably the most rewarding experience of my life to make them, so stoke I had the opportunity to do it! fully symmetrical super buttery jib ski, poplar+ash core, abs sidewall, tip and tail spacers made out of some kind of plastic I can't quite name, tri-axial fiberglass, super sick clear base so you can see the wood core from the bottom, the whole shebang :)
May 30 2012 1:43AM
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Nate.Dog
Posts: 1672 - Karma: 2,098
best part of the vacuum press, fully customizable, you can change it however you want to to get the profile you want for your skis/board, plus it cleans SUPER easy for repeat use.
May 30 2012 1:45AM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,845
I have at least 100 lbs, I think we even have two rolls that are uncut, bought em and never used them. Squares and strips for VDS.
May 30 2012 8:25AM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5676 - Karma: 4,299
Another vac bag build! How did those hold up? Would you say the vac bag produced a good bond of the materials? And it doesn't look like you used heat to cure it either? Cause I'm highly interested in making a fatter, soft park ski.

With a vac bag you only have to make a one sided mold, which is why I like them. Also here's an idea; I've heard of people taking an air compressor, modifying it to have a door and putting the vac bagged project in it. Then you have more then 1 atmosphere of pressure, assuming your door is good and you dont blow up...
May 30 2012 10:16AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,410
Sick setup up there beachball! Was sealing your vacuum bag tough after a stressful layup? Was an alternative to the ski press, but I decide to go the press route because of sealing the bag. Looks great. And Ginko, specifications of the roll (width, length) and how much do you want for it? PM me if you'd like.
May 30 2012 10:26AM
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Nate.Dog
Posts: 1672 - Karma: 2,098
They held up great! the vacuum bag works like a charm, no delam problems with 3 days of park skiing, and I did in fact use heat to cure it, we put a huge heating blanket over it after this pic was taken!
May 30 2012 2:20PM
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Nate.Dog
Posts: 1672 - Karma: 2,098
sealing the bag wasn't stressful at all, what we did was have the roll pre-cut and taped down at the tip so we just had to roll it out over the ski once it was layed up!
May 30 2012 2:23PM
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