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Official Ski Pressing/Shaping/Building/Constructing Thread

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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
All of us have thought about building your own shit at one time or another, but how many of you actually have? This thread will be dedicated to those who actually build your own gear from scratch, surely there are some of you on NS. Now I can't contribute to this thread much because I've never built anything and I only have a small amount of time working with fiberglass, but would sure love to see some info from you dudes who actually do, whether you build in your basement, or for a living. So if you can legitimately contribute please do.
Oct 24 2011 8:22PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Oh and I'd like to remind all of you guys that stuff mentioned in this thread could be potentially dangerous to you and your health. From experience I know for a fact that epoxy is a known carcinogen (so don't get that shit all over your skin) and most resins, when mixed with to much catalyst, are VERY flammable. If you are going to do some of this work, rubber gloves and safety glasses are recommended.
Oct 24 2011 8:28PM
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Blake.P
Posts: 9894 - Karma: 3,585
inb4 on3p
Oct 24 2011 8:28PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
This should maybe be moved to the gear talk section. My bad.
Oct 24 2011 8:33PM
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HeathR
Posts: 4359 - Karma: 1,382
I have a built several pairs. Check out skibuilders.com for all the info you need. There was a ski builders cults on ns but its dead.
Oct 24 2011 8:45PM
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ChuckTesta
Posts: 960 - Karma: 258
inb4 gear talk
Oct 24 2011 8:48PM
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Blake.P
Posts: 9894 - Karma: 3,585
LOL.Manitoba
Karma : 256
100 Posts
Pro

Oct 24 2011
8:33:52
Quote Reply This should maybe be moved to the gear talk section. My bad.
Oct 24 2011 10:32PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
http://skibuilders.com/howto/

A lot of what you need to know can be found there. You'll also need a lot of time and a good chunk of spare cash to get started.
Oct 24 2011 10:37PM
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Bmo.
Posts: 4907 - Karma: 2,667
threads for a great idea

people who build their own please post links or whatever to where you get ur stuff (edges, topsheets, etc)
Oct 24 2011 10:38PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
clothing company =/= ski company
Oct 24 2011 10:50PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
ummm.....you're sure you went to the right link right.... ( http://skibuilders.com/howto/ ) cause there's nothing about clothes there...
Oct 24 2011 10:52PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
This was supposed to go in the "jiberish/saga sponsor snowboarders" thread...don't know what the fuck happened.

But go to http://www.skibuilders.com (as mentioned a few posts up) and go through there.

I'm currently doing a research project for the manager of the site and he's a really cool guy (really knows his stuff) and would love to help any of you who are looking to build your own.

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^^ one pair of about 10+ pairs of my dad's homemade skis
Oct 24 2011 10:55PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
I posted this in another thread and then came here and tried to reply and it put that one up for some reason, something about the spam buster or some bullshit.
Oct 24 2011 10:56PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
no worries, I was just confused, haha.
Oct 24 2011 11:00PM
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Flacko
Posts: 1495 - Karma: 788
i made my own ski blades, they had no edges because i didnt know where to buy them and they warped, i have made about 5 pairs, all shit

Oct 24 2011 11:34PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Thanks for the link guys. The difficult part seems to be pressing these babies. I'd have to build a press likely and that's killer. Making the mulled would be easy as I build plugs for aircraft parts.
Oct 25 2011 12:32AM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
some people end up "pressing" them by simply putting a shit ton of sand bags on top of the skis, you dont need a full on "press" to make your own
Oct 25 2011 12:47AM
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hokkanee
Posts: 1800 - Karma: 435
Those look sick
Oct 25 2011 2:24AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Lol i thought about just adding a bunch of weight. You wouldnt run the risk of having a pneumatic press explode the shit out of your face if you built it poorley. You wouldnt need to build the top section of the mold if you used weights for pressing then, would you?

Also, whats up with the bindings on your dads skis, and most of the skis on that website. They look very oldschool.
Oct 25 2011 9:12PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
Telemark bindings, basically lets your heel separate from the ski

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^^found this in the pic section, props to whoever it is^^
Oct 25 2011 9:29PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409

I Inboxed you hotpocket, if you get the time write me up a reply.

And do you ride telemark bidings on everything you make hotpocket? It seems like everyone who builds skis only rides with telemark bindings!?!?!

So yeah just starting into the process now, and hopefully things will all work out in the end. Sorry for bumping this thread but if anyone knows any good canadian sellers for base, topsheet material, and edges, please hit this thread up with links, would be appreciated!

Jan 12 2012 1:50PM
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KyleA
Posts: 865 - Karma: 510
My latest pair of skis.  Half of them any way, modeled by Miley. 

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Jan 12 2012 2:04PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Aha lookin good, diggin the kittens. (they are cats right?)
Jan 12 2012 5:08PM
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the.nile
Posts: 580 - Karma: 153
if you use a pneumatic press you need to build the press. but if you use weight only you don't need it. when i made mine i did a hand lay up with a vacuum bag over the mold and put lead weights on top of it. ill post pictures of the skis later
Jan 12 2012 8:17PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Thanks, that would be great, but I might make a press, depending on what scrap stock my dad has. We may have the material, minus the fire hose. But weight or vacuum bagging are my alternatives if not. Still looking for some reliable material sellers WITHIN Canada.

And I'm not at the point of building the physical skis yet, but has anyone ever experience delams. When on Ski Builders, I was alarmed by the amount of delams those guys have experienced...

With the few people I've networked with on here, the one thing I haven't talked about is the ski design itself, just been discussing mold making technique, materials, and core shaping.

I'm not really sure what I want. I'm not a huge park skier (would love to be but my hill's is ghetto) and am maybe just gonna start sessioning in town rails and whatnot. What I do love is just freeriding around the mountain, and tearing up the occasional "powder day" we get. For the most part, I just rip around on the icy slopes, and do butters and fly off rollers. No matter what the skis will forsure be a twin tip. Right now I'm riding salomon twenty twelves, and the width of them (91 mill underfoot) was a huge step up from my K2 all mountain skis (74 mill underfoot) the first thing I noticed is how much more speed these puppies carry, If I carve aggresivly on the K2's I'm left with no speed after 10 turns, and this is not how it is with the 2012's, they carry soooo much speed, no matter how hard I thrash on them, so the ski will definatley be wider. Now how wide is to wide for the corduroy and the ice? I'd really like to build this thing 100 mill underfoot, which seems ridiculous, so looking for an opinion there. I'd also like to build it with some rocker, will definatley have traditional camber underfoot, and then have it transfer into rocker, for this, I'll just keep the rocker profiles close to that of my 2012's. Now what about tip shape, its not huge if your just skiing ice, but for the occasional powder day, what keeps the drag low? Personally, I'd like to shape the tip so its somewhat bullet like, as opposed to just a half circle. Thoughts?

Sorry that's so much shit to read, but there is really alot to consider when designing a pair of these puppies. Sorry for typos and whatnot, I tried to edit that to make as much sense as possible.

Thanks for your time, contribute if you can!
Jan 13 2012 6:21PM
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.cam.
Posts: 1852 - Karma: 48
Look up cloth ski press on ski builders. Might be your best bet
Jan 13 2012 7:49PM
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AndrewZ
Posts: 759 - Karma: 36
I posted this a couple years back. Unfortunately now that I'm living in a tiny apartment in Boston and working all the time I haven't had a chance to build in a long time. Feel free to reach out with any specific questions (although I don't check NS nearly as often as I would like anymore...)

https://www.newschoolers.com/ns/forums/readthread/thread_id/473769/
Jan 13 2012 8:05PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
I'll actually be acquiring a vacuum bag quite soon. Is just the bag alone appropriate to press skis? It's 70 inches long, and I ride around 166cm skis so maybe some ski building is in my future...
Jan 13 2012 8:24PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
I'll talk design, granted I'm not a ski designer but I've looked into it, since I like building shit.. Skis are my my list of stuff to build for myself.

Look a line elizabeths. A quite fat ski with a decent bit of sidecut. I've only ridden fat skis a few times, but I didn't find them hard to roll onto edge. So 100mm waist shouldn't be a problem. I'm also from NJ, so I'm decent at skiing on ice... I was on icelantic nomads at some point in colorado, in real, non man made snow. They felt like they turned much better then my chronics in fake snow/ice. Might have been the conditions/sharper edges but I didn't find fat skis much more difficult to roll onto edge.

Tip shape... I've never really skied powder, but obviously a gradual transition to the tip curvature will create lift, instead of a tall, crazy bend tip that will push it. Not sure if this comes into play, but the half circle tip would have more surface area then a "bullet"/pointy tip so the half circle might have a better chance at making lift. Like I said, I've never really been in deep pow so I'm not sure how the tips go through the snow. It might be better for them to cut through and let the noses/bases do the lifting.


Jan 13 2012 8:39PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
Materials for skis are rare in North America, and for the quantity you need, most suppliers will probably ignore your requests.

If you are worried about delams, go with a pneumatic press. Higher pressure (and vacuum bags are usually pretty low pressure) is generally better for adhesion and helps press as much epoxy out of the ski as possible, and this helps to decrease the final weight as well. Adding a ton of weight to the top of it will be slow, which is bad news if your epoxy pot life is almost up (on your first pair, you will run out of time and your epoxy will start to set, happens to everyone). Adding weight like that will also distribute the pressure out unevenly as you add the weight, which is bad for the ski as well.

Your first few skis are not going to be perfect. Play it safe and bet on giving yourself at least 4 layups to make an acceptable pair worth mounting.

For design, go wild. I ski a 120mm underfoot ski most days. Fact is, no matter what you end up building, you often as not will ski it one run and by the bottom you'll have 5 ideas of how to improve the ski. Build whatever seems fun, after you press a pair you'll probably want to another. Even if the ski has huge flaws, you'll still love riding on it - nothing beats the feeling of zooming past people on your pair of sticks you build yourself.

Jan 13 2012 9:08PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Aha thanks alot, and I'm not too worried about working time. Me and my father build fiberglass wheel pants for airplanes, and on the parts I do, the poly resin I work with has a 10 minute gel time, so I'm not too worried about that. I think I will build a press, as I'm sure we have the scrap material, however the guys on ski builders used a ski press on most if not all of their skis that had delams. I think I will stay away from the weight method of pressing forsure. Do you think for starters, it would be safer when doing layups, to do one ski at a time (I'm not even close to that stage yet though) so I won't have to be as worried about letting the epoxy set? Also, if I did a single ski, and pulled it out of the press in 24 hours, and I had say a core shift, or an edge popping off, I wouldn't be wasting as much material because I'm only throwing out one ski?

For core materials, what do you guys prefer? I'd like something on the softer side of a medium stiffness?

Jan 13 2012 9:18PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Woops, totally missed your post before I replied. So DOUBLE POST WOOO!

I love building shit to, I'd love to get into the industry, and I doubt building skis would do it, but you never know. If not, it's just a damn good hobby.

Anyways, I'm from Manitoba X_X so were pretty much east coast ice shredding all the time, but a few times a month, we do get some legendary snowings (Wow a foot!!!! I know right!?) and I wouldn't mind cruising that stuff hard. I'd also like to get into some of the local valleys, where no one has skied before. My 2012's would likely get the job done, but who cares! Glad to hear that 100 MM wouldn't be the worst to roll on edge. And yeah the line Elizabeth at a whopping 110 mill under foot, is pretty big for the park, so yeah, 100 should be find. That's the first thing I noticed between switching between my carve skis and my wider 2012's is how they carry speed, and how the 2012's pickup speed much quicker.

I don't think I'll get stuck on the tip design then, if I'm not skiing pow all the time, does it really matter that much? And the tip curvature when viewed from the side will be just standard, not santa's sleigh style,and likely with abit of rocker, maybe 15-20 centimeters.
Jan 13 2012 9:30PM
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jibjunkie
Posts: 3807 - Karma: 191
treads
Jan 13 2012 9:43PM
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Bmo.
Posts: 4907 - Karma: 2,667
Thanks for all the info guys, gonna start building building as soon as this spring semester ends. Can't wait!
Jan 13 2012 10:01PM
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KrazyistKarl
Posts: 1725 - Karma: 599
threads for when i have time to build a press
Jan 13 2012 10:19PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
Single ski will be way easier. Its not as consistent as doing a pair at a time, but way easier.

Just to give you an idea, fastest Scotts been able to throw a pair into the press is around 20 minutes for layup. Good luck with 10 minutes.
Jan 13 2012 11:08PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Yeah I was worried about consistencies between the skis, but I'd rather have 2 slightly different skis as opposed to two in the trash. So now this brings up the question, should I make a single or double ski press?
Jan 14 2012 11:35AM
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AEROPLAEHN
Posts: 1353 - Karma: 192
Been considering building a press for a couple years, talked with a friend last night and might start a project.
Jan 14 2012 11:39AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
http://www.store.skilab.com/

Has anyone had experience dealing with these guys. They have a very nicley laid out site, and just about everything. It says they are located in Reno, (so shipping wouldn't be insane compared to Europe) and their prices per meter seem awfully cheap.
Jan 14 2012 12:01PM
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the.nile
Posts: 580 - Karma: 153
defiantly go with a longer gel time. i used 30 minute epoxy and barely had enough time to lay up one. Also i would highly suggest doing both skis at once, i did mine separately and they are terribly inconsistent, or at least build the mold and plug big enough to make both skis for when you get better at it. i think it would be smart to do a couple timed runs using paint, cardboard, and scrap wood just so you get the motions down and figure out what works best for you, i did this first and it helped out 100%. i can try to find the slideshow that my friend made when he made a snowboard, its basically the same idea as a ski and it could help a lot.
Jan 14 2012 6:26PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
Alright, so i'm gonna build a dedicated park ski, something simple and cheaper, (less material, i can split the topsheet from ski lab and save some cash there instead of a 100MM underfoot beast, where I would have to buy two 8.99 topsheets for one pair of skis, and there would be alot of waste material there. For a guy learning, probably not the smartest decision.)

This guy is going to be 110 tail, 85 waist, 116 tip... and this is in a 167 length (I ride a 171 right now, and it seems pretty heavy to swing around, the 171 is identical to my height) and with 110,85,116 @ 167 that gives me a 20 meter sidecut radius. Your thoughts on this design please?

Now where I'm lost in this whole design, is core material, thickness (and how long of a boot mounting space I will need to build into the core) and the height of the camber. Now my thoughts on this are 6MM camber, 10MM thick core, run that for 300MM directly under where the center point of my boot will be on the ski (which is 1 cm back from true center) and build this core solely out of poplar. Your thoughts?

Anyways, once these things are finalized, I can go buy my MDF (anyone have any idea how much this is priced at nowadays, and how big of a sheet do you get for that?) to build my mold. And also we need an upper and lower half for our mold, can I just save the top portions I've routed away when making my lower mold, put them together with threaded rod, and use that as my upper mold portion?
Jan 16 2012 10:12PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
Home depot for prices.

If you think about the MDF that the router carves out, you are going to get different curves for the top and bottom pieces if you do it that way. It may not matter depending on how extreme your curves are.
Jan 16 2012 10:18PM
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hot.pocket
Posts: 4225 - Karma: 10,615
I work for the guy who started the site, definitely legit or good to their word if that's what you're wondering.

Shouldn't be a problem at all dealing with them.
Jan 17 2012 12:21AM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
This is really gonna make this thread excessively large. This post almost deserves its own thread. Had a member on here who wanted a hand with drawing a pair of boards in AutoCAD. I'm using the student version which you can get at: http://students.autodesk.com/?nd=download_center
The only bad thing about this cad is that it watermarks your drawings so you can't use it for commercial use..... herp derp if you couldn't figure that one out.

so yeah here is my huge tutorial to drawing a basic ski profile. I'll make the ski camber profile one in a while. Hopefully its clear, and if you're having troubles, inbox me for help. I do not recommend building this ski in real life. It was a toss together ski, with no though put into it.



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Feb 17 2012 10:11PM
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careisch
Posts: 68 - Karma: 13
threads for when i decide to actually do something
Feb 17 2012 10:54PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
So does just a vac bag work? Somebody said they did it with the bag and lead weights? I've got a 70" long bag, and I'm short so the skis would be no longer than 170cm. Assuming your resin doesn't need heat or anything.
Feb 17 2012 10:57PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
I've seen some videos of vacuum bagging skis and it looks like it works alright, but it seems inconvenient to have to build the bag around the ski and then suck it tight because of time constraints. And according to most of the specific forums for building, heat is suggested for curing the skis, makes them way stronger and they will be more consistent. When I do my pair I'm gonna start ghetto and go with the sandbag pressing method and put a few space heaters pointed towards the skis to bring the temperatures up. If all goes well and I enjoy this then I will certainly be making a press.

Anyone have any insight on wood. Surprisingly home depot does have poplar (I know wtf) just framing lumber and a few other species for crafting lumber....... Although they have pre laminated poplar boards that are like 1 inch thick. Anyone have some experience with these? I'm just worried about the monkeys they had laminated the boards, and what they laminated them with.
Feb 17 2012 11:04PM
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NinetyFour
Posts: 8650 - Karma: 13,409
oh yeah and after my in depth herp derp talk, they do work. Not sure how well, but they do work.
Feb 17 2012 11:05PM
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Jibbin_Ur_Face
Posts: 2536 - Karma: 763
Threads. Me and my buddy wanna make a pair.
Feb 17 2012 11:18PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
I was under the impression that the heat just accelerates the reaction of the epoxy and hardener, since most companies are not interested in long cure times. So if you got a slower curing epoxy then you'd be good?
Feb 18 2012 12:30AM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
I was under the impression that the heat just accelerates the reaction of the epoxy and hardener, since most companies are not interested in long cure times. So if you got a slower curing epoxy then you'd be good?
Feb 18 2012 12:30AM
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