Member of the Month

hi_vis360
November, 2024

Online

Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post. Register to become a member today!

Freelance Work Shooting Weddings... what camera?

profile picture
Irotate360
Posts: 6836 - Karma: 22
Hey Guys,

So I have been shooting weddings on and off for a few years but have always used borrowed equipment. Since I have a big boy job now, I've been able to save up some cash to invest in my little side business. I haven't done a great deal of research just yet as my purchases will probably come closer to the end of '11 but I would love some input from you guys to get me started.

1) What is your budget? How much money can you spend right away, and do you think you can get more money to invest in the future? $3,500 for the camera not including accessories

2) What experience do you already have with cameras? Have you ever even used one before? Have you helped your friend out with his camera? Have you owned your own? I have been shooting for years but mainly with SD consumer and prosumer level camcorders. I am new to HD and haven't shot much with it. I've done my research with HDSLR's though and while I like their capabilities, I'm looking for a more versatile camcorder. I look to invest alot of time to learn the ins and outs of the camera before I start shooting weddings with it.

2) What gear, if any, do you currently have? (tripod, old camera lenses, mics, etc) - Everything I own is low end and thus I will need to invest $ in almost every piece of gear(unfortunately)

4) What are you planning to shoot and how do you want to use your camera? Are you going to use this with the sole purpose of shooting skiing? or do you think you might try other stuff as well (movies, documentaries, short films, etc) - Solely for weddings and other contract work I can find. I would like alot of manual control, solid state, and be able to shoot well in low light. HD 3CCD is a must. I would sacrifice features for picture quality.

7) What computer do you currently have/use to edit (if not currently editing, what would you most likely use)? If you can provide specifics, such as hard drive space, RAM, processor size, that would be great. -Looking to invest in a powerful computer as well...


Sep 1 2011 3:55PM
0 0
profile picture
gordie.
Posts: 2014 - Karma: 84
I shoot weddings as well. It depends what your clients are after... most of mine really enjoy the short film style videos I've created, most always shot with solely DSLR. However, I also always have a stationary camera running at the back capturing all the footage, so they can watch their entire ceremony and all the speeches, etc.

I'd recommend a two camera kit if that's what you're looking to do- if you're just looking to take videos from stationary camera, I'd look at something that shoots onto p2 that fits in your budget.
Sep 1 2011 4:41PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
HPX170 or HMC150 are probably your best two options, not sure which one handles low light better though.
Sep 1 2011 5:14PM
0 0
profile picture
MANDER
Posts: 4017 - Karma: 2,038
I know 5d mkIIs are used in a lot of weddings and they do everything that you want, except the 12 minute run time could be a problem if its an unmanned camera though
Sep 1 2011 5:21PM
0 0
profile picture
blatt
Posts: 5584 - Karma: 3,097
the problem with buying a 5dII is that it leaves not much for accessories.

I honestly would say join the DSLR revolution. Get a 60d body and a a few lenses. I would stress getting the sigma 30mm f/1.4 for those low light moments and a tokina 11-16 for those wide moments.

If you wanna stay traditional camcorder, I'd say HMC150, HPX170, or the XF100.
Sep 1 2011 5:57PM
0 0
profile picture
TWoods
Posts: 10014 - Karma: 8,386
I have an 27 inch imac i7 with 8gb of RAM. I know there's lots of PC people in here, but this computer chews through 4gb photoshop files like they're web-ready jpegs. It's phenomenal and the screen size is a huge plus.

I don't know how much a comparable PC would be, but this was worth every penny. I am a firm believer that apple holds down the creative market for a reason.

I don't want to start a mac vs. PC debate, it's just a recommendation as you mentioned you were looking for a computer upgrade too.
Sep 1 2011 6:09PM
0 0
profile picture
miroz
Posts: 10333 - Karma: 3,945
Skip the DSLR if you're going to be have a one-camera setup. In terms of events, like weddings, your primary obligation to your customers is to capture the important parts. A camcorder will make it much easier and much less frustrating to do this.

That being said, a DSLR will be an awesome investment if you go with 2 cameras, for obvious reasons.

Like Jamie said, HPX170/HMC150 would work well. I prefer the HPX just because I like P2, but that's not always practical or ideal for everybody.
Sep 1 2011 10:47PM
0 0
profile picture
Galin
Posts: 2342 - Karma: 3,940
2 cameras would be ideal, they pay you so you capture their special moments and there's no do-overs during the ceremony. Don't forget about audio and support too. You're going to want a good audio kit with at least 1 lav, and if you go DSLR that means you need something like a Zoom H4n as well. A good shotgun mic on the stationary cam is also a good idea. As far as support I can't stress a good tripod enough for any situation, especially if it's something you're planning on doing for a while. When I started I got a 501/190xdb setup and I'm regretting it as they're starting to fall apart already. Glidecam work is also pretty big for weddings so you may want to think about that as well. Overall you're looking at an extra ~ $2000 in gear that you shouldn't forget about when budgetting. Seems like a lot but one wedding and that's paid off so it's worth the investment to get a good product for your clients right off the bat.
Sep 2 2011 10:55AM
0 0
profile picture
Laurent.
Posts: 10056 - Karma: 25,313
From a friend who also occasionally shoots weddings:

1. DSLR, for pictures and some video, preferably full frame. 5D Mark II seems like an excellent option.

2. HDV Camcorder. For the continuous video of the ceremony. If you can get one which has interchangeable lenses, some people want to have the entire room in view, others just want to see themselves in front of the altar.

3. SOLID tripod for the HDV camcorder, he actually has the same tripod I have: the Manfrotto 144B with 141 RC Ballhead. It's quite heavy but very solid and stands pretty tall at like 190cm or so.

4.Wireless microphone attached to the HDV camcorder. He sets this up near the altar of course.

5.Extras: BIG ass battery for the HDV camcorder, and a sort of hard disk that it can write too (forgot how it's called.) you don't want that thing to stop recording.


Sep 3 2011 1:32PM
0 0
profile picture
Irotate360
Posts: 6836 - Karma: 22
Great information guys thank you. I was planning on investing in a second camera when I got more of a cash flow and was leaning toward a DSLR. My goal with the second cam would be to shoot sit down interviews and shots without a ton of movement.

Not to turn the conversation in another direction but are the HDSLRs still unable to record over that 12 minute threshold? I've also heard they overheat pretty easily... I know Sony has come out with a cam that has the functionality of a HDSLR but in a camcorder casing(NEX VG10 I believe it is). I feel as though this is the direction that Canon, Nikon, and Panasonic will be going as well. Should I hold off until these companies start releasing these types of cameras?

Lastly, how do shots from HD cams and DSLRS flow together? I've thought about this alot lately and can't seem to picture taking short depth of field shots and then cutting them together with HD cam footage... Anyone maybe have an example? (I could be seeing this every day and just not know it...)
Sep 7 2011 2:08PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61648 - Karma: 123,472
Your friend is living in the past. Who the fuck still uses HDV on a professional level?



Like said before, hpx would probably be your best bet, buy some extra p2 cards and get yourself a nice tripod and some nice wireless mics.
Sep 7 2011 2:14PM
0 0
profile picture
Blandct
Posts: 1858 - Karma: 37
Something to think about as far as audio goes. For indoor weddings You can plug your h4n directly into the soundboard in the church to record the audio. This is the best way to get good audio at the church. Also with the h4n you can plug that into the DJs soundboard or the venues soundboard which ever will be used for the toasts and speeches and such.
Sep 7 2011 4:54PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
no you can not. Those devices (soundboards) produce a strong "line" signal in their outputs, and the Zoom only has "mic" level inputs. The signal will be way too strong unless he gets dampening cables or another recorder with mic/line switchable input
Sep 7 2011 5:15PM
0 0
profile picture
Blandct
Posts: 1858 - Karma: 37
Skip to 4 minutes.

introduction to audio with DSLRs from stillmotion on Vimeo.

Sep 7 2011 6:19PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
just because they do it doesn't mean its correct. you still have to listen to me and do the right workaround for the best quality. or they just failed to mention it
Sep 7 2011 6:35PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61648 - Karma: 123,472
Wrong. Jamie is right.
Sep 7 2011 6:54PM
0 0
profile picture
Blandct
Posts: 1858 - Karma: 37
Fair enough. MIght have been some premature/ill advised advice on my part.

With that being said may not be the best advice. Just did some reading up on DVX User. If someone was to use this method doing the proper research would go a long way on what to expect with the device.
Sep 7 2011 6:55PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
they shouldn't expect too much, the zooms fall short in a LOT of areas. The pre-amps are weak and noisy mainly
Sep 7 2011 7:26PM
0 0
profile picture
Irotate360
Posts: 6836 - Karma: 22
So cleary newschoolers is very pro Panasonic for HDV. What's your thoughts on Sony and more specifically the ax2000?
Sep 7 2011 8:29PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
it's alright, nothing phenomenal though. Only sony camera I like under 10k is the fs100. Both are AVCHD though, not my favorite codec. If you have the choice, definitely go p2 over avchd. you'll get much better results
Sep 7 2011 8:42PM
0 0
profile picture
klayer_9
Posts: 2037 - Karma: 188
Click for larger image
Sep 8 2011 9:34PM
0 0
profile picture
miroz
Posts: 10333 - Karma: 3,945
Don't say HDV. We hate tapes.

But yes...for full size camcorders Panasonic is fairly well received.

Jamie: for the record, I work with a Sony Z5U for school, and it's actually fairly powerful. Would I choose it over a HVX/HPX? No. But that being said...it's fairly decent. Just giving Sony a little credit. They've gotten better. I used to hate Sony, and while I still won't favor them, I don't dislike them anymore.
Sep 13 2011 5:43PM
0 0
profile picture
Irotate360
Posts: 6836 - Karma: 22
So is it the DVCPRO HD codec that everyone prefers or the 4:2:2 sampling or both? I'm really leaning toward sonys AVCHD line at this point. Side by side comparison may show the Panasonic with a slightly better quality picture but A. I really don't want to invest in p2 cards B. The avx2000 shoots better in low light C. The codec seems like an easier format for my workflow ( I edit on Vegas). Am I making a mistake?
Sep 13 2011 9:14PM
0 0
profile picture
eheath
Posts: 61648 - Karma: 123,472
overall, the dvcproHD codec is the best out right now and has been out for what, 8 years? it works great with computers, doesn't take alot of processing power, 422 is very nice, but not exactly needed. You can achieve a great image with 420 and some careful color grading but 422 you can do anything you want, its fucking crazy. But, i think in your case, 420 avchd will be fine.
Sep 14 2011 2:32AM
0 0
profile picture
andstuff
Posts: 1118 - Karma: 61
Another reason why Zoom H4N sucks...


Here's the thing: you will profit greatly by having two cameras. Sure you can get a 60D kit and shoot random shots and make an edit put to music, but such a product won't be enough to turn a substantial profit. If you can swing a videocamera and a DSLR with audio and full continuity, you can bring in the big bucks. This is what sets apart the boys from men, so to speak.

My method is this: HPX170 sitting stationary in the corner on a tripod filming EVERYTHING. 7D shooting random A-camera angles. Tascam DR100 recording line-in to PA system during ceremony and reception, and using it for random soundbites during everything else.

With this setup, you literally have a full record of the entire day. All you need to do is lay down the B-camera angle, throw in A-camera to mix things up, and sound sync. Clients will pay lots of money for this, not so much for "ski-edits" of people getting married.

Now you don't have to buy an HPX170 and 60D to get great results. Honestly you can replace the hpx170 with any HD camcorder that shoots 24p, and last I checked they were pretty cheap (under $1k). If you drop, say, $2500 on an HD camcorder, 60D, lenses, and portable audio recorder, you can easily pay that off in one wedding if you know what you're doing.
Sep 14 2011 4:14AM
0 0
profile picture
Irotate360
Posts: 6836 - Karma: 22
You shoot everything in 24p?^
Sep 14 2011 2:09PM
0 0
profile picture
andstuff
Posts: 1118 - Karma: 61
Yerp.
Sep 14 2011 2:17PM
0 0
profile picture
1337
Posts: 31059 - Karma: 29,329
Tascam's XLR's can't take line in either, unfortunately :(
Sep 14 2011 2:56PM
0 0
profile picture
andstuff
Posts: 1118 - Karma: 61
Works great for me, albeit unconventional.
Sep 14 2011 3:14PM
0 0
All times are Eastern (-5)