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War in the National Anthem

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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
How as a country can we move away from war when war is glorified in our national anthem so much?


Aug 8 2011 11:45PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
shit like what
Aug 11 2011 12:18AM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
Nowadays you're no longer fighting for your country. You're fighting for some white rich guy who wants more money.
Aug 11 2011 1:54AM
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Funnel
Posts: 7816 - Karma: 1,534
Unfortunately, I'd have to agree with that. I'd be willing to bet that we went into the Middle East for oil. It's sad, but that's probably part of the reason. We have no reason to be over there.
Aug 11 2011 1:56AM
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120494435941
Posts: 0 - Karma: 37
its funny the ignorance of the op, if we never fought against the british we would still probably be under a kings rule, people need to realize freedom isnt free, and that for the US to have the liberties it does there will always be war. i have learned to accept it.

if you dont want violence go to a socialistic country like norway, oh shit......too early?
Aug 11 2011 1:59AM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
1. Yes, we fought for our freedom, originally. The freedom is the good part. The fighting is an unfortunate vehicle to get said freedom. I'm not saying it never happened or it wasn't important, i'm saying it shouldn't be glorified.

2. Violence in Norway was caused by CHRISTIAN fundamentalists
Aug 11 2011 2:03AM
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Poikenz
Posts: 1484 - Karma: 3,808
You are aware that you didn't fight the british to be free but because you wanted more land right?
Aug 11 2011 2:42AM
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b-ladd
Posts: 2300 - Karma: 48
I don't think that dude has ever fought any Brit ever. And that land was rightfully ours, manifest destiny and Native Americans not being real people and all that.
Aug 11 2011 2:46AM
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malonius_funk
Posts: 2249 - Karma: 1,500
like "It spoke of duty, honor and self sacrifice. Three things you'll never have." if someone said that to you then you wouldn't take it lightly, so don't expect others to. simple as that.
Aug 11 2011 10:17AM
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Ski_the_east01
Posts: 5203 - Karma: 2,306
Damn OP I can't believe how narrow your view is on such a pertinent subject...please show me where the national anthem glorifies war, you must have a pretty twisted ass interpretation. I am by no means pro-war, but I believe that the men who made the ultimate sacrifice in defending this country during it's infantile stage should be commemorated and paid respect. They are the reason you have such liberties today and the reason why you are able to speak freely about your opposition to war - please keep that in mind

The poem was written after an intense night bombardment during the war of 1812 in which the flag still stood the next day which meant the fort had not surrendered and had survived - it does not glorify war, it merely attempts to capture the intense amount of pride and triumph felt when the flag was still flying the morning after the assault on the fort - I dont believe you have a true appreciation for the hell our soldiers who have fought for this country have gone through

I urge you do some research on the revolutionary war and the war of 1812 and find out what these men were fighting for, or visit a VA hospital and see for yourself the sacrifices they have given in the name of the United States - a national anthem is the least this country can do for such brave men
Aug 11 2011 10:38AM
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burntahoegreen
Posts: 191 - Karma: 24
nice! why is it,in my exp. that the kids in my high school who enlisted were 1.dumb as fuck or 2.white trash 3. or both and wanted to get married at like 20 and have like 2-4 kids. why does that always seem to be the case? I guess college isnt for everyone. do what makes you happy, i wish u the best!
Aug 11 2011 10:55AM
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Snowgoner
Posts: 5047 - Karma: 965
show some respect. kind of ironic that you are calling others dumb when you believe that 9/11 was a conspiracy LOL
Aug 11 2011 8:03PM
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PacificRimJob
Posts: 24725 - Karma: 29,948
The Russian/Soviet anthem, and the French anthem make me want to grab a gun...
Aug 11 2011 8:31PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
Well im finishing college first, im gonna do at least four years because i love my country. They will then pay for law school for me. So 1. im not dumb as fuck 2. Im from an upper middle class family 3. I dont plan on getting married for quite some time.
Aug 12 2011 4:24PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
At this point, you aren't fighting for your country. You're fighting for some rich white guy.
Aug 12 2011 4:27PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
No ill be fighting people who kidnap reports and behead them, or people who brainwash kids to blow themselves up and people who wouldnt think twice about killing you and your entire family simply because your american.
Aug 12 2011 4:51PM
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ohmythugaim
Posts: 1376 - Karma: 130
wololo
Aug 12 2011 5:03PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
o jesus here comes the US brainwashing bullshit, whens the last time you heard of a 9 year old kid throwing a grenade into a truck of people?
Aug 12 2011 5:05PM
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BMB
Posts: 3138 - Karma: 232
it doesn't glorify war, only acknowledges it. get ur shit straight OP
Aug 12 2011 5:09PM
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ohmythugaim
Posts: 1376 - Karma: 130
>implying you can only brainwash people to have them commit suicide etc.
Aug 12 2011 5:10PM
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49566738265
Posts: 0 - Karma: 7,704
I'm sorry, but you are basically trying to compare the War of 1812 to Iraq and Afghanistan.

Not. The. Same.

Separation of church and state? Probably not guided by what's on our money....however, if I was against believing in a divine power and the pledge my kids said at school had "under God" in it I might be annoyed at best. It's really a bit outdated, and by no means universal.

All in all, this stuff is tiny potatoes considering we have a useless Congress and weak President who can't even find a way to get them to compromise and move on from what is supposed to be day to day business. Our government is becoming even more inefficient and expensive. A much bigger concern than the national anthem.
Aug 12 2011 5:26PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
i like you.
Aug 12 2011 5:28PM
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123ski
Posts: 7374 - Karma: 1,415
Where does the US constitution say "separation of church and state?"

If you are referring to the 1st amendment is specifically says: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;"

Establishment of Religion as a government and recognizing "God" are two separate things.

The constitution itself grants "inalienable rights" under the theory that they were given to man by "their creator"  The founding fathers (the same ones that drafted the amendments to the constitution) believed in god.  The addition of this amendment means that the government has to be "neutral" when it comes to religion and not establish a religion, but to turn that around to mean that the government cannot affirm a god or a creator would undermine the entire constitution and would ultimately mean that everyone's religious liberty and inalienable rights would need to be stripped.


------

As far as the answer for the OP.   The song recognizes the great victory over England.  It is not an endorsement for the type of war that you hate, but recognizes that where a state is taking away your liberty, you have the right to fight for your rights. 
Aug 12 2011 5:30PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
Who gives a shit what a 200+ year old document says. Just because there's nothing against acknowledging "god" in the constitution doesn't mean it's okay to promote it in your pledges/songs! People just seem to take the constitution as this godly document that knows all. It's outdated and should recognize the rights of people to be unreligious. I wouldn't want my kids reciting "under god" every morning.
Aug 13 2011 11:04AM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
why not? its not hurting anyone. maybe worry about yourself?

i thought liberals are supposed to be open minded to things. don't you all subscribe to the 'if it doesn't affect me, it doesn't bother me' mantra?

your kids i assume will be intelligent and won't request you to take them to church because something they recite maybe less than 10 times in their life says god in it. soon they will realize that it has always been like that and is just a formality of tradition.
Aug 13 2011 7:18PM
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Lax_Bro40
Posts: 5166 - Karma: 18
Where i come from we are proud of our past, and proud to be American, unlike you, you stupid fuckin commie
Aug 13 2011 7:49PM
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deleted5
Posts: 14507 - Karma: 13,507
yeah i thought when it says bombs bursting in mid air it talking about something else, not about how we fought a war to be a free country seem like you don't know what it's about either.
Aug 13 2011 8:08PM
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TOAST.
Posts: 7506 - Karma: 36,368
FIREWORKS
Aug 13 2011 10:10PM
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malonius_funk
Posts: 2249 - Karma: 1,500
OH YOU FUCKING SHOWED HIM BRO HOLY SHIT GUYS LOOK AT THIS HE FUCKING SHOWED HIM
Aug 13 2011 10:21PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
Click for larger image
Aug 14 2011 3:15AM
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Scott29~
Posts: 1448 - Karma: 62
If there werent any wars id run out of masturbation material~
Aug 14 2011 4:15AM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
Yeah dude, I'm proud of racism, violence, discrimination, the death of many young men and women and civilians too. The US has a fuckin awesome past.
Aug 14 2011 9:32AM
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XtRemE11
Posts: 5680 - Karma: 246
so does every other country, and mankind in general.
Aug 14 2011 8:57PM
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PurpleDino
Posts: 1513 - Karma: 483
Yeah I am so proud of my home country, 'MERICA!, killing Native Americans to gain land.  I am proud as fuck to say that we killed a shit ton of mother fuckers to get to the point that we are at right now.  FUCK YEAH 'MERICA
Aug 14 2011 8:58PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
tell your parents to contact their closest native reserve and offer up your house you live in. then i will take your post seriously.
Aug 14 2011 10:08PM
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PurpleDino
Posts: 1513 - Karma: 483
That is quite a bit different man.  I have no control over whether or not we would have taken over natives land in the first place.
Aug 14 2011 10:16PM
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ohmythugaim
Posts: 1376 - Karma: 130
This post is silly.
Aug 14 2011 10:21PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
well if your convictions are like that about how the land that you live on was procured is like that, well. you should shut the fuck up.
Aug 14 2011 10:34PM
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Funnel
Posts: 7816 - Karma: 1,534
Yeah I know! It was only Americans. The French and Spanish were great examples. They NEVER stole any land. Not other country in history has done what those damn hicks did.
Aug 14 2011 10:40PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
does that make it okay?
Aug 14 2011 10:54PM
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Funnel
Posts: 7816 - Karma: 1,534
No. It was fucked up. There's no debating that.

However, it just bugs me when people single out America like "holy shit, can't believe they did that!" Slavery was happening everywhere at the time and it was not just British colonists/Americans who fucked the natives. At least the government tried to make it up to the natives. Honestly though, it was fucked up. Jefferson's trail of tears is not exactly something to be stoked on, it was one of the darker times in American history.
Aug 14 2011 11:05PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
agreed

Aug 14 2011 11:20PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Ok so two things.

1. After reading this thread all I can say is, holy fuck, what kind of garbage do they teach kids in American high schools about the war of 1812? Christ, you might as well read wikipedia.

2. The US national anthem does not glorify war anywhere NEAR as much as some. Google a translation of La Marseillaise, it essentially talks about watering French fields with the blood of impure foreigners.
Aug 14 2011 11:37PM
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sherwood4099
Posts: 1173 - Karma: 22
Jesus fucking christ... Your such a simpleton
Aug 14 2011 11:51PM
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schism
Posts: 1705 - Karma: 389
I don't even know what to say anymore in this thread but wow. I can see why the world is losing faith in america.
Aug 14 2011 11:52PM
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XtRemE11
Posts: 5680 - Karma: 246
yeah its not like the native americans were doing the same thing to each other or anything, and its not like basically every civilization in history did similar things. oh wait....
not saying its good, but we took their land from them. they fought us and we won. its ours now. yeah its fucked up, but thats how its been done basically since beginning of mankind. and im still extremely proud to be an american.
Aug 15 2011 12:53PM
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Snowgoner
Posts: 5047 - Karma: 965
quality post.
Aug 15 2011 4:31PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
doesn't make it okay
Aug 16 2011 3:47PM
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Brantford.W
Posts: 148 - Karma: 10
Yes it does, because its foreign boots on our soil.
Aug 16 2011 3:52PM
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Zimmerman
Posts: 6992 - Karma: 1,021
i think you're confused. i'm not against 1812 or the revolution, i'm against glorifying the wars
Aug 16 2011 3:53PM
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Brantford.W
Posts: 148 - Karma: 10
We cant be proud we kicked some ass when we were invaded? Or show respect to those who died?
Aug 16 2011 3:57PM
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