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Color Correcting in FCP X

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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
Is there a better way to color correct other then the built in color corrector because I don't find that very useful also techniques on color correcting so I can get better.
+k to all who help
Aug 1 2011 9:10PM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
thoughts?
Aug 1 2011 11:24PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
FCP X is just overall crap. I gave that program soo many chances and my last straw was its color correcting, although I am told you can do some sweet compositing in Motion. I would recommend downloading motion and trying that out. FCP X doesnt support XML, so thats your only option.
Aug 2 2011 1:44PM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
so overall just keeping fcp 7 and learning the application color would be better?
Aug 2 2011 2:11PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Color is sketchy. It just is not that stable of a program and I have found lots of problems with it, but when it works, I like it. Its confusing, but really good to know.

I would recommend that route or maybe even trying to snag Davinci Resolve Light... although, I have heard that light doesnt have a 3 way color pallet, but non light is $1000. Maybe try out colourista and if you have FCP 7, then MB Looks is great.

I do not know how well Motion works, but I have heard it is pretty good for compositing and about the only good thing with FCP X.

There are lots of routes you can go with color grading/correcting. Its all personal preference. I am digging just the in program color correcting tool in Avid MC 5.5 right now.
Aug 2 2011 2:36PM
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Official_Recap
Posts: 1075 - Karma: 525
What specifically are the issues you've run into in Color? I've been using the program for about a year, but haven't had any major problems at all.
Aug 2 2011 3:08PM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
How is color correcting in Avid is it good?

Cuz I am having the hardest time deciding which route I want to take?

I can't decide wether or not to try and get Avid Media Composer 6 when it comes out, go back to FCP 7 and use that because I have more options, or stay with FCP X and try Motion?
Aug 2 2011 3:36PM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
.
Aug 3 2011 12:45AM
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eheath
Posts: 61652 - Karma: 123,518
I enjoy color correcting in FCP alot, i dunno about anyone else...
Aug 3 2011 12:48AM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
Yah I really enjoyed it too I just haven't liked the color correction in FCP X. Ever since I made the switch I have been disappointed. I always debate making the switch back but it speeds up my workflow by so much.
Aug 3 2011 12:51AM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Its just never been a stable program for me. It crashes sometimes and more than half of the time, I will xml import my timeline back into FCP and there will randomly be a couple of black frames in the timeline that were not there when I exported to Color. That drives me INSANE!
Other than that though, I just love Color.



Aug 3 2011 3:35PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
I just really like how it likes. It has curves, color pallets, ect. I just really like how it works and how it works inside the editing program (without having to export XML to something else).

If I were you, I would begin learning Avid. Avid is a completely different program then FCP and does things a lot differently. It will take a good amount of time to learn, but it will be worth it. FCP will become obsolete if serious changes arent made. Sure a lot of people will still be using FCP 7, but it will slowly die off and most people will be going back to Avid. Avid is making a big push to get all of their old customers back from when they switched to FCP several years ago, and also taking in the new generation that learned on FCP.

Most people in the industry know FCP and Avid, but more people will begin to mainly only know Avid.

Avid 64 bit will be much better than FCP X (obviously) and will be significantly faster then FCP 7.

You can also create some extremely sweet set ups with editing boards and mixers.

Oh and how can I forget the best part... $295 for students. That includes 4 years of upgrades! Why spend $300 on FCP X, when you can get a much better program for less!
If I read the student deal right, that means that you can get Avid now and learn it and upgrade to MC 6 for free (it comes with the student deal) when it comes out this fall.

Here is an example of my color correction window set up and the options in the basic color correction in MC5.5. Im still learning the program, but I have played with this the most. It will probably help to click to full screen these screen shots...

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Click for larger image

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Aug 3 2011 3:55PM
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kootenayklaus
Posts: 3914 - Karma: 2,179
I'm thinking of making the switch... I was a PC user, then I obtained a Mac. I've been working with FCPX and such, and the fact that I can't make something as simple was really pissing me off. I love Motion, and the abilities in Motion, but the no color correcting and such is a big downfall. Some of the work flow, i.e. I CAN'T DO A FADE TO BLACK ON A CLIP THAT ISN'T IN THE MAIN TIMELINE!!!! is horrid. I love the ability to conform my footage though, and if there is a way to do that in Avid then I am for sure leaving. Overall though, anything is better than vegas.
Aug 3 2011 4:08PM
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Official_Recap
Posts: 1075 - Karma: 525
Hmm. That has never happened to me, but I could see that being beyond frustrating.

How advanced is the color corrector in Avid in comparison with the capabilities of Color. I know you can do a LOT more in Color than, for example, within the Final Cut 3-way corrector, so I'm wondering where Avid falls into play here.

Also, the actual aesthetics of Avid look horrendous. Do you know if they are going to be updating the actual look at all with the upgrade in the fall? I know it's the performance and workflow that matter in software, but looking at those screen shots is almost painful going from the looks of FCS.
Aug 3 2011 4:16PM
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S.C
Posts: 3068 - Karma: 2,285
Not trying to hate or anything, but ive never seen an edit from you that you've color corrected, so FCP X should be awesome as a beginning tool...
Aug 3 2011 4:22PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
I gave FCP X a chance soo many times. I took tutorials and I tried as hard as I could to deal with certain things and learn it and then I just gave up. I mean fuck, you cant even make a subclip... thats such horseshit. Theres a million things wrong with it. The timeline is just crap. The last time I opened it, is when I tried to mess with some color correcting. I promptly was excited that they didnt change the cmd+Q shortcut. Havent opened it since, and have had absolutely no urge to.
I dont even get why you cant add an effect to the second layer of video. That blew my mind... well its not even technically a second layer. I could go on, but will obviously stop.

Avid is much harder to learn than FCP X, but its not stupid to learn like FCP X. Well I mean learn from FCP.
Avid does things quite differently than FCP (not talking bout FCP X), but it does actually make sense.
The effects options and customization are almost like After Effects options. For instance, the stabilizer in Avid has tons and tons of options, just like the one in AE.
I still do not know a lot of Avid, but I am enjoying learning it right now and it actually makes sense how it all works.

As for conforming, Im pretty sure there is a way to do it, but im not positive. If I ever conform anything, I still just use cinetools, which you can still use. Im pretty sure Cine Tools will even conform Avid DNxHD footage. Ill give it a shot.... although there is not 1080p60 Avid DNxHD yet, but it is coming in the new Avid. You could just conform the files from the camera to 24p, then convert to Avid DNxHD though, so not a big deal.
Aug 3 2011 4:34PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Yes it is, but there were ways around it. It just took extra time.

Well I would say it is fairly close. Take a look at the screen shots I posted. There are also color effects in Avid, so its more than what I posted. It is not quite as good, but its good enough for me. You can just add another layer of color correction for secondaries. It is personal preference though. Im sure something like Davinci Resolve is much better though, but Im pretty sure Avid works well with Davinci.


Avid was originally made to be run on Avid systems. Avid used to not really care about their customers and did things their way. They basically said, here is our program, and here is what it is made to run on. If you dont buy the Avid editing machine with it, it will not run properly. That was their mentality and that is why most people jumped to FCP. Things are changing for Avid though. Those people in the company are gone and they have began to develop their software around the professionals that use it.
Yes the UI is a little messy on a mac, but after a couple of days of figuring out how you want to set up each window set (color correcting, trim mode, effect mode, motion editor, timeline, ect) then you will enjoy it. Not only that, but MC 6 is supposed to be much more Mac friendly and one of their big emphasis seems to be creating a better User Interface that doesnt scare people away (mainly to make those old FCP users feel comfortable and not frustrated... sounds crazy that Avid wants to make a new UI that is welcoming to FCP users, but Apple makes a new UI in FCP X that doesnt have its FCP customers in mind at all).

If you look at my screen shot, that is my color correcting window set. It looks a little sloppy but I have everything I need and it really is not a pain like it seems. Here ill post a screen shot of how it looks with my normal editing window set...

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^^ That may seem like a lot is going on right above the timeline and below the viewer (composer window), but thats just where I have my keyboard shorcuts window so i can learn them, and then a couple of other bins so I can quickly find shots in other bins. You can also set it up without that little gap like this...

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It all seems messy when you first open it but once you adjust everything it works find and I almost like it more than FCP because you can have more floating windows and switch to different layouts very quickly.
Aug 3 2011 5:00PM
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NJurkiewicz
Posts: 1597 - Karma: 697
Yah I know my stuff at the beginning of the year didn't have color correcting but towards the end of the year I have started doing a lot of it I just haven't uploaded anything.
Aug 3 2011 5:09PM
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kootenayklaus
Posts: 3914 - Karma: 2,179
Obviously 10/10, but I am very confused. Coming from someone with almost no Mac backround as of a month ago, what is Cine Tools?

Avid does look like a step in the right direction for me though, thank you very much.
Aug 3 2011 5:32PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
Cine Tools is a program that was apart of the Final Cut Studio package.

You could use it to conform footage. So you could take something thats 60p or 30p and turn it into 24p very quickly. It obviously slowed down the footage to preserve the frames, but thats how I conform the footage.
If you dont want to slow something down, but want to conform, you can just convert a 30p clip to 24p (or 60) pretty easily. I did that in Avid. I think it just takes away frames. Your original frames are not preserved though. Thats why im not entirely sure on if Avid can conform 60p to 24p the same way Cine Tools does.
Aug 3 2011 5:36PM
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kootenayklaus
Posts: 3914 - Karma: 2,179
Yes, basically to just slow it down. I plan just to shoot in 24-30-60 in accordance to whenever I need each one, and just cut down the quality of the 1080p clips to 720p, considering I shoot with a 60D. Thank you very much. I think I'll send you a PM if I have any troubles or questions about this stuff, you know what you're talking about. I cannot thank you enough.
Aug 3 2011 5:46PM
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kootenayklaus
Posts: 3914 - Karma: 2,179
Oh, one last thing. Does Avid have a sister special effects program, like FCP and Motion, Premiere and AE, etc? Could I use Motion 5 with Avid?
Aug 3 2011 5:48PM
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Bentley@DOSMedia
Posts: 1410 - Karma: 1,827
No problem man.

This is kind of personal preference, but I like to take the 720 clips and up res them. If you shoot 720p60 and conform to slow down to 24p, I would up res that to 1080p, so that way you preserve the resolution of the 1080 shots.
Avid actually makes this insanely easy to do.
Just conform your .h264 shots to 24p. Then set your Avid settings to be 1080p24, and then when you import them (not AMA link), Avid will automatically convert them all to 1080p24 Avid DNxHD 115, or whatever setting you are using. That is just the setting I would recommend.

Hit me up on FB or something if you ever need help... Most people get scared/confused by Avid at first.



They have a 30 day trial that I recommend. They also have tutorials on their site.
Aug 3 2011 5:52PM
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