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protesting the protestors

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freeze_pooter
Posts: 3296 - Karma: 16
i was watching fox and they had a clip of this group that goes in to liberal agenda protests and has their own signs. man it so awsome because they were pushing them and swearing at them and acting like a ton of hippy douches. those lib idiots r not for free speech.
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Jul 17 2004 6:53PM
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freeze_pooter
Posts: 3296 - Karma: 16
heres the link
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Jul 17 2004 6:56PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
theres some crazy ass people in those clips people need to relax a bit


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 7:07PM
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freeze_pooter
Posts: 3296 - Karma: 16
most deff
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Jul 17 2004 7:08PM
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beer.
Posts: 3096 - Karma: 44
everyone's for free speech, as long as people don't disagree with them. you might recall a little group called move america forward and fahrenheit 9/11.


smokin weed flippin keys makin crazy gs
Jul 17 2004 8:44PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Wow... that's really weak... have all the counter protests you want, but for God's sake, hold them somewhere else (see: abortion rally a little while ago). Going into a rally and picking a fight...that's just being inflammatory. You're not serving your cause, you're just trying to make people mad, and giving a mob a target. Who the hell are they convincing? Not the protesters. if anything, the protesters are only more firmly set in their beliefs. So what's the point? To attack them? Why would you do that, they have the right to say and think whatever they like. This sort of thing isn't 'awesome', it's antagonistic for the sake of it, and exceedingly juvenile.

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Jul 17 2004 8:54PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
Some good points and it also depends on how the protestors on either side are handeling the situation. But I think the protestors need to realize that their point of veiw isnt the only one shared. Having a protest is trying to get a message across that 'the people' are unhappy about something. I think its perfectly fair for both sides to be presented at a rally.


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 9:06PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
More that a group of people is unhappy about something. 'Protesting the protesters' is like saying you're unhappy that these people are protesting; in other words, you're unhappy that people are exercising their right to free speech. It's fine to express your point of view, whatever it is. It's not so fine to attack someone else for expressing theirs. The basic idea here goes against core American principles, I'm surprised Fox is supporting it. Oh, wait, no I'm not... these guys only target liberal rallies. What was that about both sides being represented, Ice?

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Jul 17 2004 9:10PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
Well as far as Fox targeting liberals I wouldnt know I dont watch T.v. Your arguement is kind of like letting someone make a thread on here about a topic and only letting people supporting that veiw respond to it. The opposing opinion has another thread where only people supporting that opinion can respond to the thread. I think its alot more exciting when the two clash, also it allows for people to be swayed by the other 'teams' ideas and informing the opposite party is possible.


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 9:15PM
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agingeri
Posts: 199 - Karma: 10
Wow... I must be living in a REALLY sheltered community, because where I live (a university town in a staunchly Republican state--quite a diversity of opinion here) people respect each other's opinions. We have a major street corner around here and every Saturday morning for about a year and a half now, there has been a group that's gone out to stand and hold signs protesting the war. And there's a pro-war group that gathers on the other side of the street. Sometimes insults are flung, yes, but everyone understands that the other side values their opinions just as much as we do.

THAT is what this country is supposed to be about, and I'm a little disappointed that it doesn't seem to be happening everywhere.


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Jul 17 2004 9:16PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
^You're straw-manning me. That analogy isn't accurate at all, this is an open forum for people of whatever view. My argument is closer to people who have one view making a cult on this site for people with that view, and having others hack or use mod-powers to invade it. No offense to capurnicus, just an example.

------------
In a haze
A stormy haze
I’ll be around
I’ll be loving you
Always
Always

Here I am
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Here I am
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Always
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Jul 17 2004 9:18PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
I dont know what straw-manning means but I think America is quite an open forum thanks to that trusty 'freedom of speech' I think either side has just as much of a right to voice their opinions any given place, any given time.


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 9:19PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Then why are there people going into an area where a group is expressing themselves, and protesting their ability to do so? As I said, the point clearly isn't to express their own views. If they wanted to do that, the most effective way would be to organize a rally elsewhere. It'd also be easier. Why, then, do they do this? The only reason I can come up with is to, as the thread says, protest the protesters. Attack a group for expressing a view they don't agree with.

------------
In a haze
A stormy haze
I’ll be around
I’ll be loving you
Always
Always

Here I am
And I’ll take my time
Here I am
And I’ll wait in line
Always
Always...
Jul 17 2004 9:23PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
O.k I agree with you. But I also believe that they have a right to 'protest the protesters' I also believe people have a right to 'protest the protesting, protesters' (as you are doing on here) So what kind of distance or time constraints do you suggest for differing opinions on a given issue?


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 9:25PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
I thought that the counter-protest to that pro-choice rally in Washington was well done in theory (though I'm not sure I agree with some of the unplanned things that happened), so I'll use that as an example. it was a little ways away, but just as accessible to the public. Now, I don't agree with the views put forward at that counter-rally, but they were well within their rights to be there holding it.

So you say you believe these people have the right to 'protest the protesters', then? Because that's really interesting... protesting the fact that people are protesting is equivalent to protesting the people's ability to put to good use their right to free expression. Equivalent to protesting the existence of that right, by its definition. Now to me, that seems downright unAmerican, considering how American values are classically defined.

If that is, in fact, your position, then you're entitled to it, but in that case, you might be interested to know that you're ethically wrong. If that isn't what you're saying, then you might want to reexamine what you're saying.

------------
In a haze
A stormy haze
I’ll be around
I’ll be loving you
Always
Always

Here I am
And I’ll take my time
Here I am
And I’ll wait in line
Always
Always...
Jul 17 2004 9:33PM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
I totally dont think that people should be able to protest the fact that people are protesting I think thats wrong aswell. However I do think its fair for both sides or multiple sides to be represented at a given place given they dont go walking 'through' each others crowd, but having each other in veiw is fine by me.


God is an American.
Jul 17 2004 9:37PM
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Itsbackfliptime
Posts: 18901 - Karma: 75
What I got from the video was that they were marching along with the anti-war with a pro-war agenda. They didn't have signs that said 'Protests are bad'. It was the anti-war protestors that were causing the problems. The Protest Warriors were the ones being civil.

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Jul 17 2004 11:07PM
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wilkesyachtingco
Posts: 4425 - Karma: 41
i thought it was entertaining that they would always preface their videos by saying 'well, we are probably going to meet some really peacfull people here today... ' i just thought it was great that their vids show the robotic dogmatic clones of the left.... i loved it when they would just start cussing at the people, calling them facists and whatnot... it was great. obviously there is probably predominatly one sort of leftie that shows up at ANSWER rallys... the out of control ones. yes, we know that not all libs are like the nutjobs in the videos, but aparently alot of em are... theyre no better than the republican clones that so many of you love to tear down for repeating right wing rhetoric straight from the gop web page... you must understand, however that these are the people that many picture when someone says the word 'democrat' either that, or a shreiking howard dean... oh dear.... some people... clones i tell you... swineheards... the whole lot of em...















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Jul 18 2004 1:22AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
''You should be ashamed, you fascist,'' - it is funny. it is aloways situations like protestors protesting protestore where you get that kiind of ignorance from a conservative. fascisim, has a rather warlike history. being anti war is basicallt anti fascism too!
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Jul 18 2004 1:22AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
you can like the war but protesting protestors is more anti american then protesting a war. basic freedome of speech.
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'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


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Jul 18 2004 1:23AM
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wilkesyachtingco
Posts: 4425 - Karma: 41
i dont understand what you just said.















Mercy's eyes are blue
When she places them in front of you
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Jul 18 2004 1:23AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Same thing I said, only shorter and he spelled freedom wrong.

------------
In a haze
A stormy haze
I’ll be around
I’ll be loving you
Always
Always

Here I am
And I’ll take my time
Here I am
And I’ll wait in line
Always
Always...
Jul 18 2004 1:25AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
ok, protesting a war is more patriotic then the people who are protesting the protestore (the conservatives mostlikley anyway). becuase of freedome of speech.
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

'who makes that?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

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Jul 18 2004 1:25AM
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wilkesyachtingco
Posts: 4425 - Karma: 41
no, i was refering to his post about conservatives, facists, something something.... i was really turned around...















Mercy's eyes are blue
When she places them in front of you
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The solemn warmth you feel inside
Jul 18 2004 1:27AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
fascism has a warlike past. If you look at my quoat by one of the poeople protesting the protesters, this shows that he is a dumbass.
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

'who makes that?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

www.johnkerryisadouchebagbutimvotingforhimanyway.com


Jul 18 2004 1:30AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
''You should be ashamed, you fascist,'' - that quoat ...
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

'who makes that?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

www.johnkerryisadouchebagbutimvotingforhimanyway.com


Jul 18 2004 1:31AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,143
Uh.. that would be one of the protesters who said that, I think. Not the protester-protesters. This is bloody confusing, these guys need a new title.

------------
In a haze
A stormy haze
I’ll be around
I’ll be loving you
Always
Always

Here I am
And I’ll take my time
Here I am
And I’ll wait in line
Always
Always...
Jul 18 2004 1:34AM
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wilkesyachtingco
Posts: 4425 - Karma: 41
now, i beleive that you are confused... the anti war protesters, while being superlativly out of control, were calling the conservative rally crashers facists... becuase, i dont know... its a really cool catch phrase i guess... they maybe learned it at the answer rally, or perhaps from moveon.org... anyhow, you see, jaross, you have condemned your own with the lable of ignorance that they so deserve... good on ya son.















Mercy's eyes are blue
When she places them in front of you
Nothing holds a roman candle to
The solemn warmth you feel inside
Jul 18 2004 1:34AM
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Ice-Is-Scary
Posts: 0 - Karma: 87
newmourning your a pretty funny guy, jarros your horrid at spelling to the point where a lot of the times your points are lost


God is an American.
Jul 18 2004 2:03AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
well your right, it was a war protestor that said that. ya this shit is confusing. although it is kind of a fascist thing to do, trying to silence people who are speaking out against what a cirtan country is doing.
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

'who makes that?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

www.johnkerryisadouchebagbutimvotingforhimanyway.com


Jul 18 2004 2:26AM
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jarossamdb7
Posts: 6322 - Karma: -10
***what their country is doing
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

'What Kind of skis are those?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

'who makes that?' -this stupid poser kid


'Line' -me

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Jul 18 2004 2:26AM
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hendrik.
Posts: 6715 - Karma: 267
hi, i am the angel, would you like to touch the peanut butter?
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Jul 18 2004 6:13AM
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beer.
Posts: 3096 - Karma: 44
I don't know if any of you realize this, but to protest usually means to gather or take action against certain actions or policies of someone else. When liberals gather to protest the war, gun control, etc, they are protesting against established government policies. Conservatives protesting these issues is more like rallying in support, because our current government policies are very conservative. So basically, conservatives aren't really protesting anything, especially when they show up at a liberal protest. Since they aren't against the war, what is all their angst for? Seems to me like they're just protesting the protestors.

By the way, there are rabid and fervent liberals AND conservatives. That doesn't mean anything.


smokin weed flippin keys makin crazy gs
Jul 18 2004 10:52AM
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freeze_pooter
Posts: 3296 - Karma: 16
^agreed
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Jul 18 2004 11:02AM
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asac
Posts: 12485 - Karma: 17
j.d.'s first post should have just ended this all.





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Jul 18 2004 11:13AM
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wilkesyachtingco
Posts: 4425 - Karma: 41
no.















Mercy's eyes are blue
When she places them in front of you
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Jul 18 2004 1:02PM
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mackinnon
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hilarious


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Jul 18 2004 1:14PM
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