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First pair of powder skis

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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i am moving to whistler next year and it seems appropriate to invest in some pow skis. i am park rat and have never researched pow skis so you will have to bear with me. i just started skiing this year so i doubt i will be dropping massive cliffs or skiing steep lines. i am looking for a ski that will be fun on powder days and can still handle a bit of park. i guess i am looking for a playful pow ski. i am 6'2'' 180lbs. i am also not trying the break the bank so please keep that in mind.

thanks in advance NS!
Apr 3 2011 6:50PM
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PeteySkeety
Posts: 996 - Karma: 209
The armada JJ is my favorite powder ski, but I would never hit rails with it, it is really good in powder but also holds its own on groomers and hardpack. If your looking for a cheaper ski, bluehouse maestros are awesome, that is what I currently ski when I go out west.
Apr 3 2011 7:55PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
yeah i doubt i would hit many rails with them mostly jumps. thanks for the suggestions!
Apr 3 2011 8:11PM
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JayDope
Posts: 6842 - Karma: 408
sir francis bacons, they made them a little more narrow for next year, so ull have some fun in the park with them as well, soft playful, def a solid option
Apr 3 2011 8:17PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i have been doing some research and the bacons look like they would suit me. thanks man

does anyone know of any other skis similar to the sfbs?
Apr 3 2011 8:42PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i cannot find 182 sfbs anywhere. does anyone know a store that has them in stock? if not what are some similar skis because the sfbs sound awesome
Apr 4 2011 2:06AM
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.nasty
Posts: 10581 - Karma: 11,150
try to line blends
Apr 4 2011 2:34AM
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RobertBB
Posts: 623 - Karma: 16
Line EricPollard Opus
The ski that replaces the EP pro!
Apr 4 2011 3:20AM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
its your first year skiing, learn how to ski on what you have first and avoid buying a dozen sets of skis before you find one you like
Apr 4 2011 4:16AM
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tall_t
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 15

its not his first year.

try  to get the volkl bridge. its a good all mountain ski and pow ski. but it kinda sucks in the park

Apr 4 2011 9:24AM
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JayDope
Posts: 6842 - Karma: 408
he wants to ride it in the park too, i wouldnt suggest the opus for park
Apr 4 2011 12:35PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i am not going to take it in the park very much. i am already have a park ski. but on a pow day if i feel like doing a park lap or two i want the ski to be able to handle it.
Apr 4 2011 1:14PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
and I quote, from the OP thread description:

"...I just started skiing this year..."
Apr 4 2011 1:30PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i started skiing in december. i know how to ski now. are you suggesting i stick with my current park skis for my duration in whistler? i am confused
Apr 4 2011 2:30PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
unless you have something that is less than 90mm at the waist, you should be fine. If you try and get a 110 rockered pair of skis with that little skiing under your belt, you will be doing yourself a disservice. If you stick with what you have till you can ski pow pow competently with the thin skis, you will be able to get more out of the rockered ski.

If you really want to get a pow ski. I would suggest something you can use as an everyday ski. Something about 100-105mm at the waist, and with just a tad of tip and tail rocker. Something like an on3p jeronimo, line blend, k2 kung fujas or volkl gotama.


but, I still suggest getting more skiing time under your belt.
Apr 4 2011 4:43PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
well i have antics right now (83mm) but i will be buying new park skis over the summer (domains or anthems). will the domains or anthems be able to handle whistler powder? i will be skiing park most of the time but after a big dump i would like to enjoy some powder. I was thinking of getting something with 115-125mm waist but i have no knowledge of skiing powder or what skis would be best for me. i just do not know if i can justify spending money on a new pair of skis that are only 95-105mm (blends, jmos, etc). i am unable to get more time under my belt because my season is pretty much over and i am moving to whistler at the start of november. i have ~55 days on skis currently
Apr 4 2011 4:59PM
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Ghini
Posts: 2261 - Karma: 3,002
Next years Moment PB&J!
Great review here;
http://www.skijosh.com/20112012-moment-pbj-review---182.html
Apr 4 2011 5:32PM
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californiagrown
Posts: 9794 - Karma: 2,014
like its been said before, you should really learn how to ski well before getting a quiver. judging by the fact that you ski in ontario, you probly didnt spend much time outta the park working on skiing different types of terrain, and carving different length turns.

as well, once you learn how to ski powder on skinnier skis, you have the basics down, and you are able to ski pow at a much higher level with pow skis.

I would honestly say, get a one ski quiver that is around 105 underfoot, that has camber...maybe some rocker in the tip, that can also be used as a pow ski. trust me you will have a ton of fun in pow no matter what ski you are on.

if you go straight to a pow ski, you will forever be a backseat nancy, and have real trouble skiing steep lines aggressively.
Apr 4 2011 5:38PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
If you have never skied much outside park, don't bother getting a pow ski, you will be like the kids I see at Big Sky skiing like shit on nice skis. Learn how to ski pow/steeps on what you have. then get something nice

And for Fuck Sake don't center mount your skis!!!
Apr 4 2011 6:56PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
well i am going to be riding domains or anthems and they are both symmetrical. why would i not center mount them?
Apr 4 2011 7:50PM
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JayDope
Posts: 6842 - Karma: 408
u realize they dont make anthems anymore right?
Apr 4 2011 8:38PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
because... your weight should be over the ball of your foot, unless you are mid rail slide. So mounting them center, if skied correctly, puts your weight past the center of the sidecut, and the center of the ski.

So unless you are buying a park ski, and another ski, you should not mount center.

But my opinion is apparently in the minority on here, so mount whatever you want wherever you want.
Apr 4 2011 8:43PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
http://www.untracked.com/p3161-10_line_anthem_freestyle_twin_tip_symmetrical_skis.html
Apr 4 2011 8:44PM
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-JME-
Posts: 679 - Karma: 33
JJs all the way.. mad versatile
Apr 4 2011 8:46PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,686
Learning how to ski correctly will do you much more service then a pair of fat skis. The last thing whistler needs right now is another retard. If you don't know how to ski, admit it most of you can't, it is best to spend some time learning good technique then buying some fat idiot proof ski and heading straight for the powder.
Apr 5 2011 1:30AM
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Wookum
Posts: 242 - Karma: -59
lol'd

also i thought i was confident in my skiing abilities but this thread is just making me self conscious, haha

you guys can have my like 4 pairs of pow skis
Apr 5 2011 1:45AM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,686
Let me know what you got. 542 can suck it, I have first dibs.
Apr 5 2011 2:29AM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
i have never heard of someone mounting a symmetrical park ski anywhere but dead center. i am fairly new to skiing though so maybe there is an advantage to mounting it elsewhere. i am just going to use my park skis (domains/anthems) in the pow.
Apr 5 2011 2:32AM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
no one suggested center mounting powder skis. i am not sure why mounting points of skis is even being discussed. you are stupid and have contributed nothing to this thread. maybe you should stop worrying about spoiled park rats and actually read the thread and if you have something knowledgeable to contribute, then contribute. if not, do not post. IMO
Apr 5 2011 2:41AM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
Mounting any ski at dead center and trying to ski it in an all mountain/pow  situation sucks balls. It places your center of balance (with correct form) in front of the sidecut, and center of the ski. essentially  giving you much more tail than tip. Skiing a ski dead center in an all mountain/pow situation usually leads to catching a bad case of "backseat." Symptoms include: burning thighs, frustration, and lazy arms.

Mounting a symmetrical ski so that the ball of your foot is over dead center (like 3cm back usually?) will make a huge difference in the all mountain/pow situation (a good difference). I have a pair of Line Elizabeths at the recommended -2, and the dead center pair I borrowed frequently were noticeably more difficult in pow.

Think about it this way. Mathematically speaking, -3cm gives you 6cm more tip than tail. That is about 3-5% of your ski. This usually correlates to about...  50 grams per foot more weight in front of you. But, you must also consider the bindings, since the heel piece is always heavier than the toe piece. So by weight your ski halves are off by about 1-3%

Also, consider what axis your ski actually rotates around while you are spinning. It actually depends on what you are doing, and how your skis are positioned. Depending on what grab, cork, etc you are performing, your rotational axis is greatly different. So honestly, you are not going to notice...

the affects a -3 mount has on skiing switch, are also pretty much negligible, due to again, you weight should still be over the ball of your foot.
Apr 5 2011 3:24AM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
haha i have definitely felt the burning thighs symptom before on my very rare trip outside of the park. you seem to be a very knowledgeable fellow. if i mount my domains/anthems -3cm, will it decrease my performance on rails? i will probably ski park ~90% and powder ~10% of my time in whistler so would you recommend mounting -3cm? my main focus is park skiing but i figured since i am coming from east coast i might as well ski some powder while i can. i will not be doing any crazy pow runs because as mentioned before i just started skiing and i am aware of my lack of skiing ability.

basically what i am saying is i only care about maximizing my skis performance in the park. if centre mounting will help me in the park i will mount them dead centre, if it does not matter, i will mount them -3cm fto assist me on the occasional pow day.

sorry if that was long and rambled i have been slaving away all day on a game theory project. thanks mt.baker mans for bearing with me haha!
Apr 5 2011 3:51AM
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jscarpino
Posts: 647 - Karma: 70
bacons, def a good all around ski, i love my bacons. but i do have a fatter ski for the real deep days
Apr 5 2011 5:46AM
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Wookum
Posts: 242 - Karma: -59
if you learn to ski powder this will change for sure

and mt baker man where are your ep's mounted?
Apr 5 2011 9:18AM
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S.C
Posts: 3068 - Karma: 2,285
for pow and park jumps

CRJ
S7
JJ
SFB
obsetheds
YLE

more pow but could still handle park jumps alright

hellbents
EP Pro


of those choices its all personal preference: stiff vs. light, wide vs. skinnier, amount of rocker
Apr 5 2011 10:09AM
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factory81
Posts: 3967 - Karma: 63
holy fuck

You are a ski doctor.


Mt_Baker_Man;

I have One Life's center mounted, and I suffer from riding lazy at times, burning thighs, and as always with rockered skis I have to remain pretty damn conscious of my edges while ripping down on hardpack so nothing catches.


But of course these hardpack surfaces are not stressing my tips.

You go on to say that it doesn't put enough emphasis on the tip and I have had "limited tip control" at times and had to put more emphasis on ripping with my tails.

I literally went to the gym 5x/wk for 2.5 months leading up to skiing in Utah for my 2nd out west trip. So we're talking 2k vert max kinda stuff. But anyways even with all the working out I was finally able to not gripe about my legs burning "as much" (realllllllly did help though) and I feel as though I have learned over time (especially toward the end of my like 30th-40th days on OneLife's how to just pretty much rip down anything I can handle "effortlessly".


BUT YOU MAKE ME WONDER. Next time I am out west I am going to demo OneLife's from Causwell and ask for them to mount them -2 back so I can test out just what you are talking about.

I have asked for my OneLife's to be mounted "dead center" wherever the line is or whatever right? But I am not a ski measuring guru and I haven't measured my shit ever. They ride like some center mounted skis that I have learned to slay pow/choppy pow/crud in.
Apr 5 2011 11:17AM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
Honestly, I don't ski park that often, but I have never felt held back by a non center mount when popping onto rails, sliding, or doing switch ups.

If you are really concerned though, you could spring for a pair of Marker Schizo bindings, mount them -3 back, and then you could ski them anywhere between dead center and -6.

just curios... How messed up are your current park skis? And what are they?
Apr 5 2011 2:12PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37379 - Karma: 119,900
Yeah the bacons sound good for you if you want to ride the park aswell. If you want to charge hard instead, the EP's might not hold up very well. Soft skis generally get squirrely at high speeds.
Apr 5 2011 2:28PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
I didn't want to quote that whole thing...

Anyway. I have not ridden a pair of the Surface 3SR skis on hard snow enough to really think about this... but I would bet your difficulties on hardpack might be at least amplified by their abrupt rocker design. Without a smooth edge curve, I cannot see a way for them to carve smoothly, and initiate properly. But again, I have not tried them much. I would humbly suggest trying a non-3 stage rocker ski, at least something with smooth rocker profile, if not something with traditional camber underfoot.

You should try this in your house:

If you have carpeted stairs, or anything like that, with your ski boots on, put just the front of your boots on the edge of a stair, so just your toes and the ball of your foot are touching the stairs. Hold your arms in a relaxed position with your elbows just slightly in front of your body (proper pole position for freeskiing). Then try to squat. You will probably notice how far your shoulders have to move forward to keep you from falling backwards.

A man's center of mass is carried higher than a woman, so the shoulders are pretty important for proper balance. Keeping your shoulders squared and level down the hill, while also consciously keeping them forward, will probably cause a noticeable improvement in your skiing.


Hope that helps!
Apr 5 2011 2:33PM
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freeballer
Posts: 726 - Karma: 960
Get something pretty fat, but not so fat you can't take it out everyday.  Also, get something with rocker in the tip.  I'd say something around 105-115 underfoot.  I personally don't like rockered tails, unless it's super deep.  They don't ski as well in hardpack, chop, and crunchy snow.  Maybe the Liberty Helix with Stealth Rocker, Shogun, Sidestash (or whatever version is a little wider,  Nordica Girish.  The rockered tip will float better, and have easier turn initiation, but the flatter tail will make you ski it better and provide a solid platform to get out of the backseat by throwing your hands forward.  I don't care what people say, you don't move to Whistler with only park skis.  Buy something wider, but not crazy wide and then if you find yourself loving steep pow, which you should if you are doing it right, buy something really fat on closeout somewhere.

And when you get there, don't be another retard that moves to Whistler.  HaHa. Have fun and learn from all the ripping skiers out in BC.
Apr 5 2011 2:44PM
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Dr.Dickless
Posts: 2620 - Karma: 1,392
you get a pair of salomon foils, theyre old, but they ride pow pretty good, as long as its <2ft and they can slide rails and do jumps really well, its a good all around ski
Apr 5 2011 2:53PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
182 bluehouse antics, i have a picture of some of the damage in my profile. they are pretty destroyed and likely have water damage.
Apr 5 2011 3:08PM
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Mt_Baker_Man
Posts: 2012 - Karma: 105
If park is your priority, I would not worry about getting a pow ski till you know what you want. and why, whether that be soft, super rockered, small sidecut, etc.

Try waiting till you can demo some skis next season, and find something on sale or used?

Best of luck. Hope they have a good "post-la nina" season.
Apr 5 2011 3:15PM
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bgould
Posts: 1306 - Karma: 23
thank you sir. yes, hopefully this years snowfall can be repeated next year!
Apr 5 2011 4:14PM
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EricaMN.
Posts: 2704 - Karma: 347
this years obsethed, also try next years line opus, sounds like there an amazing ski
Apr 5 2011 10:30PM
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