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Official Canadian Federal Election Thread - May, 2011

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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
So, after the government unveiled the 2011 federal budget today (the most nothing budget in at least a decade), it seems certain, if not official, that there will be an election as a result of the vote on friday. It'll take place on May 2 or May 9. Although I am guessing no one will have much to say yet, things always heat up as the campaign goes along so I thought I would make a thread.

Will there be a conservative majority? Who will you vote for (or who would you vote for if you could)? Will the current issues surrounding the budget form a jumping-off platform for election issues? I'm thinking not - there is simply nothing really in there to campaign on or against, aside from the elimination of the federal deficit by 2015. From where I sit, the issues at stake will develop over the next couple of weeks and we'll be talking about completely different things than now. Aside from contempt of Parliament which is a good election buzzword.
Mar 22 2011 6:24PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
not to stir any pot, but for what reason are you voting conservative? If you were to try to convince me to vote conservative, what key points would you use?
Apr 7 2011 8:56PM
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freestyler540
Posts: 13150 - Karma: 19,459
Maybe if Harper would stop having scandal after scandal. They have had more scandals in 6 years than the liberals in 15.

3 MP have been secretly fired for withholding documents obtaineble by the freedom of information act.
They moved money around illegally in a scheme to overspent on last campaign.
Jaffer affair
Julie Couillard affair
On MP mislead Parliament in her report. She ordered people to falsify numbers.
They constantly preach about coalition when there is none
Even worse, they did it openly when the libs were in power
They covered up torture reports from Afghanistan
The RCMP is a mess (the commissioner is appointed by the prime minister)
He is pushing on harsher weed laws with minimum sentences for first offenders.

COME ON, dont put greedy people in power.
Apr 7 2011 9:04PM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16
Dude I think your the one who doesn't watch CBC. It definately has a liberal bias. Search Frank Graves or ekos bias if you don't believe me. Or watch George Strombawhatever's show or Rick Mercer. Both on the station, both, although comedy shows, have huge left wing political agendas. I just don't want tax money going to a tv station no one watches, I'm uncomfortable with the idea. Its more of an ideological thing. IMO the government is there to protect rights, and do certain necessary things, not to make tv shows and radio programs. And it doesn't matter who runs news, government or coporations, its still filled with propaganda and they have the same agenda. In the end, there are way bigger issues on the table. I don't really care about the CBC, it doesn't effect me. As long as they keep playing NHL games I don't really care.
Apr 7 2011 9:15PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
Canadian nationalism over its ownership over the airwaves is good for Canadian business and an absolute fucking nightmare for consumers who get charged out the ass for what is essentially a cabal. The CBC is merely an incidence of this outdated cultural theory. It's a really warm and fuzzy principle when the Supreme Court opines on it in the context of this or that reference of the Broadcast Communications Act or whatever but in practice Telus is really screwin' me on these TV bills.
Apr 7 2011 9:42PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
I don't watch CBC, I listen to CBC Radio. I don't care much for television. It's TV, of course they're going to have shows that swing both side of the spectrum. CBC Radio, on the other hand, is unparalleled as an intellectual media source.

You are also quite ignorant of the statistics of how many people watch/listen to CBC and how many people rely on it for their news and entertainment. It's incredibly important to have national media. If everything was privatized, do you honestly think any company would give a shit about putting up broadcasters in remote parts of the country where they would only lose money? No, they wouldn't. The CBC, being federally funded has done that. They 'unite' Canadians right across the country. Don't forget about RCI too.
Apr 7 2011 9:43PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
not only airwaves, but airlines too!
Apr 7 2011 9:49PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
wait wait wait. are you saying public ownership of companies hurts the pocket of consumers? I sure hope I read that wrong, and won't say anything on the assumption I did.
Apr 7 2011 9:59PM
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HKizzle
Posts: 401 - Karma: 19
Here's my opinion:
-Harper's doing alright, if he has a majority the country will probably stay on the same course, which isn't too bad
-I can't take the Liberal Party seriously after Stephan Dion was it's leader. Seriously they're a joke.
-Jack Layton is an eccentric man with a cool moustache. I wonder where I've seen that before... Also I don't know much about NDPs but I think they're almost the same as Liberals.
-Bloc Quebecois: Even people in Quebec think they're a joke.
-Green Party: LOL!
Apr 7 2011 9:59PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
of course. protection of public companies to private newcomers, is detrimental to the consumer because it prevents competition in the market. therefore, the public company doesn't have to offer better service or lower prices because the consumer is stuck with paying for it.

see bell canada,

see rogers teaming up with bell for the internet caps to prevent netflix from competing with their ondemand cable/satellite system.

air emirates not being allowed a nominal increase in landing privileges to protect air canada. air canada can't compete with the service quality and prices the air emirates offers.
Apr 7 2011 10:27PM
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Proletariat.
Posts: 1797 - Karma: 45
Its not just Canada. France, Germany and the UK have all kindly told Air Emirates to fuck off. They try and push their way into other countries
Apr 7 2011 10:30PM
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Anathema
Posts: 21048 - Karma: 5,062
conservative. go.
Apr 7 2011 10:30PM
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Sutton_skier
Posts: 8 - Karma: 10
Here's my opinion:
-Harper's doing alright, if he has a majority the country will probably stay on the same course, which isn't too bad
-I can't take the Liberal Party seriously after Stephan Dion was it's leader. Seriously they're a joke.
-Jack Layton is an eccentric man with a cool moustache. I wonder where I've seen that before... Also I don't know much about NDPs but I think they're almost the same as Liberals.
-Bloc Quebecois: Even people in Quebec think they're a joke.
-Green Party: LOL!

^ Bloc Quebecois =a joke? What are taking about? They are doing a good job and that's why many people believe in them.

For me Harper is just try to make another USA. Did you Harper had work for the oil company before he did politic?
Apr 7 2011 10:46PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
you really should 'geteducated' on this matter. (get it, your name. har har har)

but seriously, government regulation is keeping us from being completely gouged by private companies.
Take insurance companies. That's what happens when you have a lack of mandates regulating the private sector. Rates become ridiculously high. Petro Canada was a government attempt to try to regulate gas prices. It worked, until Mulroney's government sold it off. Again, cell phone companies in Canada is a perfect example of lack of government regulation protecting consumers from overpriced services.
Apr 7 2011 10:47PM
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shibby
Posts: 7088 - Karma: -19
Please don't post here if you aren't eligible to vote, clearly you aren't over 18...

And LOL@ people who are so scared of minority and coalition governments.
Apr 7 2011 10:48PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
okay, I have a challenge. Someone here convince me why to vote Conservative. Tell me a few main points of why they are the best political party and deserve to lead the country.

and do it without "they are better then the Liberals because.." or, "because the Liberals..."
Apr 7 2011 10:50PM
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Ace3+4
Posts: 1493 - Karma: 50
People from sutton are obviously retarded
Apr 7 2011 10:53PM
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Sutton_skier
Posts: 8 - Karma: 10
lol thanks Nic
Apr 7 2011 10:56PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
Um, I wasn't making a generalized statement one way or the other. The Canadian view of airwaves in Canada has resulted in a small cabal of companies controlling media in this country and has prevented competition from service providers from, say, the USA, which leads to exorbitantly higher prices. It's basically the reason we pay so damned much for telephone and tv.
Apr 7 2011 11:09PM
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Lord.Quasimoto
Posts: 958 - Karma: 33

Yes they are a complete joke, just because your French doesn't mean you should try and ruin our great country. If you are for the destruction of Canada, yes the BLOC are doing a great job.

HARPER worked for OIL company!! OHHH MAN im so scared of oil. grow up.

Apr 8 2011 2:22PM
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Lord.Quasimoto
Posts: 958 - Karma: 33

im not voting conservative but this is a no brainer.

HARPER = an economist. right now the the global economy is falling apart... having a PM who at least understands basic economic principles is a REALLY good thing at this point.

Apr 8 2011 2:25PM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16
Not to mention academics like Ignatieff generally fail in leadership roles. Look at the US. Obama is the first intelect to be President since Nixon. both failed miserably.
Apr 8 2011 7:37PM
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Proletariat.
Posts: 1797 - Karma: 45
They fail because they cant associate themselves with the average citizen who isn't an elitist
Apr 8 2011 7:46PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
I have yet to find someone able to explain exactly how Obama has failed miserably, other than expressing policy decisions they disagree with on an ideological basis; ie, "health care reform is socialism lols". If the issue is that he hasn't done much, the answer would have to be that if so, he hasn't done much wrong, either.
Apr 8 2011 7:57PM
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Obi-Wan-Jenobi
Posts: 951 - Karma: 119
I do not agree with abortions, ever. I think the gun registry is retarded and fixs nothing. As well as i think the Torries did a tremendous job with the recssion, and because of that our dollar is now worth more than the american one. As well i dont like Michael Ignatieff he has said some things that rather upset me. But i do think that the way we vote here is kinda dumb. We in the west dont really have as much say, and the people who vote for say the green party have no say at all.
Apr 8 2011 8:38PM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16
http://www.usdebtclock.org/

btw. Not trying to be some tea bagger. I think Bush dug a fucking crater for obama. But he's failed to rally the left with his campaign lies, and can't seem to rally any independents. Polling has him even with a GENERIC 2012 challenger and approval ratings of less than 45%. Thats ridiculous compared to other presidents.

Apr 8 2011 9:58PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
lets stay on topic!!
Apr 8 2011 10:01PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
I am not denying that the US's economic situation is pretty grim. I am not clear on how this is Obama's fault. I am also not denying that a lot of people down there seem to dislike him. I am not clear on why this is. Seriously, every time I bring this up I get a reply sort of like what you just gave me and it does not answer the question. Why can't anyone answer this? Like I hear people going "worst president ever" and you'd think if you're saying that you'd have a laundry list of massive fuck-ups but people never actually do.

Anyway this is off topic, it's the Canadian election thread not "do you like Obama thread #12,754,995".
Apr 8 2011 10:06PM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16

haha fair enough. I guess we should stay on the topic of the Conservative win. There's no laundry list of fuck ups. It's just there were such high expectations and unfortunatley it wasn't time for on the job training which they got stuck with.

Anyway, new projection today has tory's at 153 seats. +10 from currently. Ontario will be a battle ground. I don't know why the NWT is voting liberal again either :s

Apr 8 2011 10:26PM
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CAPITA-DEVOURS
Posts: 1968 - Karma: 4
harper will ruin canada if he gets a majority, but the liberals and ndp aren't doing that well in the polls right now..but I heard that jack layton was the most popular politician, without linking him to the ndp
Apr 8 2011 10:36PM
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St.Steezy
Posts: 4228 - Karma: 20
I am voting Green.

Elizabeth May is one of the Candidates in my riding and she is by far the most active MLA in my riding. I'm not the biggest fan of Elizabeth May, but my vote is atleast a way of saying No to the other parties.
Apr 9 2011 12:01AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
wow, if you call Nixon an intellectual I'd hate to see who you call dumb. god, the guy was an idiot.
plus he had a bachelor of law. A bachelor. not even a masters let alone a PhD. I do not consider, nor do most people consider, someone with a simple bachelors degree to be an intellectual by any means. Sure he's more educated than probably 90% of the United States, but that's not an intellectual by any means.

Now to shatter your little statement about academics failing as leaders, you seems to forget Trudeau. Greatest leader Canada ever had. He was a professor and academic by all means of the word. or Mackenzie King. or Laurier
Apr 9 2011 1:41AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
you can tell I'm tired when I start using "mean" for everything
Apr 9 2011 1:44AM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16

Trudeau and his liberal policies fucking BURRIED our country in debt man. I know dumb people who don't vote don't care or pay attnetion to debt. But inflation is the sneakiest, most evil tax of all. Wake up. I'll agree he did a lot of good things and was probably a good leader but he destroyed this country economically and we paid for it for decades.

Also, since all you probably know about nixon is impeachment and whatever else it says on wikipedia, the arguement is irrelevant. He was an academic, not that it matters. In the end, conservatives are going to wreck the tax and spend hug-a-thug liberals and if anyone thinks otherwise please PM me.

Apr 9 2011 1:59AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
It's your opinion to not agree with abortions. The Elizabeth May is very much against them too.

but the gun registry, oh gosh. what a money drain. I mean, either abolish it or keep it. don't just get elected on the promise of getting rid of it then in like 5 years of power do absolutely nothing about it at all. Seriously, they shoulda got their act together on that.

this is why the long gun registry is a good thing though:
-imagine yourself a police officer. you get a call saying there is a raging drunk guy with a history of violence beating his wife. the guy happens to also have 3 rifles and 2 shotguns in the house. with the gun registry fully implemented, as a cop you'd be able to look up in a matter of seconds and see 'okay, this guy has 5 guns'. now you know to prepare yourself for that possibility and approach the situation differently.

that's just one example of why it is indeed a good thing. And if you own a gun, why do you care if it needs to be registered? it takes almost no time at all. unless of course you're planning on shooting someone with it. but it has been a huge waste of money.


as for the dollar, it goes a lot deeper than just 'the government did well in recession', and you really can't praise any individual or group of individuals for it being stronger than the us dollar.


and using "iggy is shit" is a bad reason to vote conservative.
Apr 9 2011 2:00AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
were you reading this page?

http://www.freealberta.com/trudeau.html


and sorry if I'm not quite reading properly, but you're saying getting rid of tax is a good thing?





Apr 9 2011 2:07AM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
trudeau was a coke headed communist and he alienated the west.
Apr 9 2011 4:03AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
You keep saying unbelievably stupid things. Like painfully dumb. A bachelor's of law is a graduate degree. It takes 7 years to get one. It is the equivalent of a Master's in philosophy. Getting a PhD or LLM is viewed by most lawyers as pretty much a waste of time unless you want to TEACH law, rather than practice it. Of all practicing lawyers in Canada maybe 2% have an LLM or PhD. I know a lot of great lawyers and Q.C.'s and none of them have more than a bachelor's in law.
Apr 9 2011 10:36AM
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kris.....
Posts: 759 - Karma: 43



Apr 9 2011 11:13AM
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k-rob
Posts: 14217 - Karma: 2,892
LOL WUT?
Apr 9 2011 11:31AM
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Trollolo
Posts: 793 - Karma: 16
hahaa the first ad was so jokes. I love when political commercials are made like a movie trailer.
Apr 9 2011 11:47AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
well that I was not aware of. What's the undergraduate degree of law called if it's not a bachelors?
I would have assumed it's the same 4 years as a bach of science or arts or what have you.
Apr 9 2011 11:47AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
not to be harsh then, but you just made the exact same mistake I did. I'm not going to call you "unbelievably stupid things. Like painfully dumb"

but apparently a Bachelors of Philosophy is that same delio as a Bachelors of Law, it too is a post-graduate degree equivalent of a Masters.
Apr 9 2011 11:50AM
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Mike-O
Posts: 14593 - Karma: 1,089
I kind of agree. At least here, you get Bachelor's of Law in three years, Master's in five years. Never heard that a Canadian Bachelor's of Law would for some reason be seven years, sounds stupid and you, J.D., shouldn't call people stupid because of not knowing a difference in an otherwise derivative system.
Apr 9 2011 11:51AM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
 Dude, I just looked it up. And don't give me the "It's wikipedia crap"

In some exceptional cases, it may also be the name of a postgraduate degree, such as a Bachelor of Civil Law, the Bachelor of Music, or the Bachelor of Philosophy.

then read this article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LL.B.

a normal bachelors of Law is 3-4 years and is an undergraduate degree, the same as any other.



and I'm completely sticking by the fact that if you hold an undergraduate degree in anything it does not make you an academic.

an academic is someone who does research to further the knowledge of a field of study. someone practising law at a firm is not doing that. they are not an academic.



so, what i take from this:
-a bachelors of law is 3-4 years and an undergraduate degree, but may in some exceptional cases be a postgraduate degree

-the same is true for Philosophy.

-Nixon was not an academic




Apr 9 2011 12:05PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
oh, sorry, now that post looks dumb since you deleted the ones you just posted.


well anyway, that was a pointless side argument that got nowhere
Apr 9 2011 12:06PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
No it's not. It's an undergraduate degree. I did a minor in it. My cousin got his BA in Phil, which took 4 years, then did a master's, which took a further three. 7 year program.

Mike-O, your country may mirror the UK and Australia, where law is an undergraduate program. I could understand you or an aussie making that mistake, but this guy lives in this country. It's even fine to be ignorant about this stuff, but when you talk out your ass about something you clearly don't know anything about you look dumb and make K-rob go "LOL WUT?" and no one needs that.

In the US, a law degree used to be called a "bachelor of laws", or LLB. Until recently it was still called that in Canada. The US now gives out a "Juris Doctor" or JD which sounds more impressive because it has "doctor" in it, but it's the same exact degree. In Canada you can now get either depending on your university - at UBC you actually got to choose which letters you wanted your diploma to say. Same thing. Both take a total of 7 years of university - 4 years of undergrad then a further 3 year program, and in Canada you then have to basically apprentice to a lawyer as a "student at law" for a further year while you pass your bar course. So it's really more like 8 years.

Again this doesn't have much to do with the election.
Apr 9 2011 12:10PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
Dude I HAVE a law degee. Are you actually going to argue about this? Let me explain in the simplest way possible. In order to practice law in this country you must:
-Go to school for 7 years and graduate with 2 degrees, one of which will be either a Bachelor of Laws or a Juris Doctor, which makes no difference, just depends on your school;
-Apprentice for a further year
-Pass a bar course
-Be called to the bar in a court ceremony.

A friend of mine did it in 6 years plus the apprenticeship period, but that is the exception. If you tried to practice law in this country with an undergrad degree (including an undergrad degree in Law from a UK or Australian or Finnish etc school), you could go to jail.

 You were wrong, just try to think about things or look them up (preferably as they apply to Canada, not other countries) before you make a strongly-worded post about them.t
Apr 9 2011 12:15PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
In English-speaking Canada it is sometimes referred to as a post-graduate degree because previous university education is usually required for admission.

but ok. I believe you. I was for the most part wrong about law degrees in Canada

but just throwing it out there that even in Canada it can be an undergraduate degree. I know for a fact my university, University of Ottawa offers an undergraduate law degree.

but as you're saying, the case is specific for Canada. so looking at Nixon and applying Canadian law practices doesn't work either.

If I'm getting facts right, he had a simple undergraduate degree. And as I said much earlier does not make him an academic. The whole point was the he is NOT an academic, and the academics do NOT ALWAYS make terrible leaders like the dude was saying.
Apr 9 2011 12:27PM
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corona
Posts: 12818 - Karma: 32,995
oh, that's why. Quebec is different than the rest of Canada and has undergraduate law degrees. U of O, being in Ottawa and near Quebec and being a bilingual university offers similar courses to what one would get in quebec. so they have an undergraduate degree in law, the same as any other bachelors
Apr 9 2011 12:30PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,145
No it doesn't. In order to get into the university of ottawa's law school you will either need to have completed an undergraduate degree or get special dispensation. If you tried to apply to that program out of high school you would be rejected exactly 100% of the time. You absolutely cannot get a law degree in this country at the undergraduate level. Some schools have pre-law, lots have criminology which has legal aspects, phil dept's teach philosophy of law courses, but all law schools in this country are post-graduate. You can get in after 3 years of undergrad if you have really solid grades and a good LSAT score, that's as close as it gets:

http://www.commonlaw.uottawa.ca/en/admissions/full-page-content-admissions/admissions-criteria.html

No idea how civil law works but McGill law is the same as U of O, U of T and every western law school. The bottom line is, it takes 7-8 years as a student to be a lawyer in Canada, and 7 in the US.
Apr 9 2011 12:35PM
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