I am ashamed to be an American

To bad you are a retard and dont know anything about earth let alone america. Hybrids can be trucks they can be cars they can be suvs. all while saving on gas and being just as powerful and actually since its electric it is instant power you dont have to wait for the fuel. and you can get all this shit in 4wd and save a shit load instead of wasting money on something that is ruining our atmosphere.

this keeps getting better and better

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt."

lol lol lol lol lol lol

I am so ashamed to live in America, especially out here in Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming. I can't believe all the horrible things we do to our environment. I can't even walk outside without being reminded of how bad we are fucking things up.

what a whiny bitch..your not helping your case with dumbass responses like this

find me a 400 hp fullsize 4x4 truck that is affordable, easy to maintain and durable.

i dare you.
double dog.

You do know that hybrids cost way fucking more than a regular car and that in the process of being made they hurt the environment more than they can possibly save it right?


Whose the retard now fuckhead?

just got back from putting a euro s3.2l engine in my m3, and it doesnt pass nys emmissions. I love it, now i get to drive my 87 f150 4x4 because that apparently is better on emissions

how small is your dick you rich fuck

There are no words left to describe how much I hate these threads. When everyone runs out of opinionated logic, they always boil down to degrading remarks about the size of a man's penis.

worddd +k for you sir

why dont you go live in another country for more than a week and see how much better it is ?





rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrretard

Don't hate! Go work for it, like I do. Idiot.

I know that the nickel batteries they use to make a hybrid is not good for the Earth. I know that the nickel batteries that they use that sits in a junk yard hurts the Earth more then a gas motor. I know it takes more energy to produce a hybrid then it does to produce a HUMMER. Oh and I also know that you only get on average 75% of the gas MPH that the sticker says for a hybrid. I also know that the HP does not even come close to the HP in a gas motor. Did you know that a hybrid also has a gas motor? So it's not instant power. On most hybrids the gas motor kicks on at 10-20 MPH. So the electric start with "instant power" is not really power..lol. I will not trade my truck in for a hybrid, it just does not make sense when your towing. LOL thanks for caring though.

it's called a hybric specifically because it was marketed to be both gas and electric. the whole concept of the car is that it's gas efficient and 'pollutes less'.

lol did you even read his post?

How does it "pollute less" when the damn batteries used to run it don't break down at all and the pollution created while making the thing is more than the car can save in what it's lifespan is?

yeah, i'm just saying anyone who didn't know why it's called a hybrid is pretty much stupid.

HOLY SHIT GUYS, ALERT THE MEDIA.

i don't know much about it, and i'm reading now for the sake of it, but apparently nickle is less toxic than lead for the environment, and the car has a lower carbon emissions. the whole idea of this car is marketed on lowering the level of pollutants in the atmosphere.

I don't think you did. The guy obviously knows what a hybrid is.

hybrids still arent

a- powerful

or

b- affordable

smart cars aren't worth a shit if you need to do any kind of work.

it's spelled nickel

Nickel may be LESS toxic but it is still a toxic metal. And the POINT is yes, to lower carbon emissions. Yeah, it may have lower carbon emissions but the amount of carbon emissions from the creation of the car in the factory is actually more than what the car can save in it's life time.

I know what it is marketed as but it's kinda false. For now, hybrids aren't doing much other than making Hollywood stars and starlets think they are saving the squirrels.

The Prius is powered by not one, but two engines: a standard 76 horsepower, 1.5-liter gas engine found in most cars today and a battery- powered engine that deals out 67 horsepower and a whooping 295ft/lbs of torque, below 2000 revolutions per minute. Essentially, the Toyota Synergy Drive system, as it is so called, propels the car from a dead stop to up to 30mph. This is where the largest percent of gas is consumed. As any physics major can tell you, it takes more energy to get an object moving than to keep it moving. The battery is recharged through the braking system, as well as when the gasoline engine takes over anywhere north of 30mph. It seems like a great energy efficient and environmentally sound car, right?

You would be right if you went by the old government EPA estimates, which netted the Prius an incredible 60 miles per gallon in the city and 51 miles per gallon on the highway. Unfortunately for Toyota, the government realized how unrealistic their EPA tests were, which consisted of highway speeds limited to 55mph and acceleration of only 3.3 mph per second. The new tests which affect all 2008 models give a much more realistic rating with highway speeds of 80mph and acceleration of 8mph per second. This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo, which costs less then half what the Prius costs.

However, if that was the only issue with the Prius, I wouldn’t be writing this article. It gets much worse.

Building a Toyota Prius causes more environmental damage than a Hummer that is on the road for three times longer than a Prius. As already noted, the Prius is partly driven by a battery which contains nickel. The nickel is mined and smelted at a plant in Sudbury, Ontario. This plant has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the ‘dead zone’ around the plant to test moon rovers. The area around the plant is devoid of any life for miles.

The plant is the source of all the nickel found in a Prius’ battery and Toyota purchases 1,000 tons annually. Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist’s nightmare.

“The acid rain around Sudbury was so bad it destroyed all the plants and the soil slid down off the hillside,” said Canadian Greenpeace energy-coordinator David Martin during an interview with Mail, a British-based newspaper.

All of this would be bad enough in and of itself; however, the journey to make a hybrid doesn’t end there. The nickel produced by this disastrous plant is shipped via massive container ship to the largest nickel refinery in Europe. From there, the nickel hops over to China to produce ‘nickel foam.’ From there, it goes to Japan. Finally, the completed batteries are shipped to the United States, finalizing the around-the-world trip required to produce a single Prius battery. Are these not sounding less and less like environmentally sound cars and more like a farce?

Wait, I haven’t even got to the best part yet.

When you pool together all the combined energy it takes to drive and build a Toyota Prius, the flagship car of energy fanatics, it takes almost 50 percent more energy than a Hummer - the Prius’s arch nemesis.

The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles - the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.

The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles. That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.

One last fun fact for you: it takes five years to offset the premium price of a Prius. Meaning, you have to wait 60 months to save any money over a non-hybrid car because of lower gas expenses.

well, i mean for one thing, they save on gas consumption. and the only reason the car's production would be outsourced as many times is because it's better cost efficiency. i don't know. there's a lot of factors in this, and i'm not willing to buy or justify either argument. as far as i see it, you're willing to pick up a rumor you heard to slap anything you don't agree with in the face, ignore the facts, and argue your point until it's flat.

if you're really concerned with things like that, you should probably look into how much damage a simple pair of blue jeans causes to the environment. i would probably bet, that clothing production is probably high ranking in environmental destruction. most of the time, things are half made in one country, shipped to the next, and another, and then back to the start to save money. and that's only adding to dyes and waste and etc. but anyways.

Read the post above yours... it makes my 14 miles to the gallon Bronco seem like a bicycle.

can you source your article?

Do a simple "prius VS HUMMER" search. Tons of links and pros and cons. I choose to side with the HUMMER because the Prius does hurt the Earth just a much.

yeah

i find this post interesting
mrvadeboncoeur
# 26 Aug 2010 Thursday 12:28 am
There’s a lot of myth, urban legend, and misinformation out there on hybrid vehicle batteries and vehicle production, thanks to a flawed marketing paper by CNW and a poorly researched student newspaper article that keep getting quoted…
Anyhow, I suggest reading:
Prius Versus Hummer: A Nickel for Your Thoughts:
http://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/200711/mrgreen_mailbag.asp#headaches
Battery Toxicity: http://www.hybridcars.com/battery-toxicity.html
Hummer versus Prius: “Dust to Dust” Report Misleads the Media and Public with Bad Science:
http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of_science/case_studies/hummer_versus_prius.html
Prius Versus HUMMER: Exploding the Myth:
http://www.thecarconnection.com/Auto_News/Green_Car_News/Prius_Versus_HUMMER_Exploding_the_Myth.S196.A12220.html
Giving Directions: No, the Hummer Actually Isn’t More Energy Efficient Than A Prius, Let’s Put This “Debate” To Rest:
http://www.betterworldclub.com/articles/hummer-not-more-efficient.htm
Heard the One About the Hummer?:
http://www.toyota.com/html/dyncon/2007/september/hummervprius.html
Usually the mythic “article” from The Mail on the nickel in the hybrid cars’ NiMH batteries is quoted from a now retracted article. The retraction that clears up this bit of misinformation is at: http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=417227&in_page_id=1770
(They were using data from the early 1970′s about the INCO-Sudbury nickel mine, which was more than 20 years before the first hybrids needed NiMH batteries, and the plant has greatly cleaned themselves up and reforested the area. If you were to add up the amount of nickel in the million+ hybrids sold since 1997, the total is less than 1% of the world’s annual nickel production (far more nickel is used for stainless steel, for example).)
All of the hybrids on the market so far have a full warranty on the hybrid battery out to at least 8 years/80,000 miles, sometimes longer depending on manufacturer or if an AT-PZEV vehicle in a CA-emissions state (longest of 10 years/150,000 miles). The hybrid batteries are supposed to last the lifetime of the vehicle, and depending on model replacements are often quite rare. Toyota does offer a $200 bounty (with labeling on the battery stating who to contact) on each hybrid battery to be sure that it gets properly recycled. With nickel prices as high as they currently are, recycling is very cost effective.
And no, Toyota did not have to lower the fuel economy ratings of the Prius because they were too high. The EPA changed their testing procedures for the 2008 model year to be more realistic, by increasing speeds and acceleration, by testing for colder temperatures, and by testing for AC use. The fuel economy numbers for ALL cars dropped, not just for the Toyota Prius.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ratings2008.shtml
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml

from
http://www.dotneter.org/2010/08/is-it-true-a-hybrid-vehicles-battery-production-causes-more-pollution-than-conventional-vehicles.html

Ya i saw that one also. I enjoyed my post a little more though.

bias is as bias does :P

Yes ma'am.

I don't know what planet your own, but why don't you try unfuckulating your brain and pikological shit.

Didn't Michael Crichton write a book about how Hybrids basically trash the environment.

Sudbury, Ontario is called the mining capital of the world for good reason.

The Sudbury plant has been in continuous operation since the rock was blasted to make way for the Canadian Pacific Railway in 1883.

That means that nickel has been mined there for the last 124 years. The Prius has been on the road since 1999. What about all the environmental damage done for the 116 years before the Prius ever came along?

There used to be a great deal of pollution at the Sudbury plant, just like there was at a lot of factory facilities. However, new pollution controls are in place and Sudbury residents themselves will talk about how things are improving dramatically in the area around the plant. Young trees are growing there, even now.

Another thing noted about the area around the plant is the Apollo astronauts trained there. It has been said that the area around the plant was as lifeless a wasteland as the moon. Actually, the astronauts trained there because the rock formations were similar to those on the moon. This area of Ontario was hit by a meteorite which created a basin and caused much of the look of the area. The moonscape feeling is also from the slag heaps from smelter output. Anyone who has ever seen any factory facility knows there is always a large amount of material left over from the original raw materials, be that a nickel plant, a steel smelter, or a dog food producer.

Also the environmental damage is not all due to the nickel plant - there is other industry, and a lot of the trees disappeared due to extensive logging.

Take a look for yourself. Here's a breakdown:

The Sudbury nickel plant produces around 60,000 tons of nickel per year. If Toyota buys 1000 tons/year, that's around 6% of the total output.

I have personally presented a Prius battery to local safety responders and fire department personnel. The entire pack weighs 117.47 pounds, which is the components as well as the actual nickel itself. The nickel weighs about 50 pounds. So that's 50lb per Prius, with 2000 pounds per ton, that's 40 Prius per ton of nickel.

Considering the plant puts out 120,000,000 pounds of nickel each year, each Prius uses about 0.000024 of the annual production of the Sudbury plant. Please double check my math and contact me if I need to make any corrections.

So, let's use common sense when looking at a vehicle like a Prius and what it uses for fuel, space, and amount of material to build. And then let's consider what a vehicle like a Hummer would require in those three areas. Obviously, a vehicle like the Hummer consumes much more resources, and the same basic types of resources, as the Prius.


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070612100132AAvXAcC

here's some more bullshit.

http://www.sudburysoilsstudy.com/EN/overview/background.asp


cool.

my threads for when im not half dead from being tired

Point is that they still support the mine that is terrible for the Earth. Weather it's one pound or 1,000,000 tons.

yeah, but it's whether or not the truth is being bent here. your food pollutes the planet, your clothing pollutes the planet, your bus, cars, exhaling, shitting, farting, whatever pollutes the planet. if you're going to argue that omg, well 1% is still worse than zero, then you're going to have to accept reality. 99% of your life is pollution. 99% of the things you own is pollution, is and will be. the pressing issue is how to reduce wants, and destructive products, destructive habits, and destructive creation. it's completely impossible to make everything completely environment friendly. it is completely impossible, to alter the rate at which we function and run our daily lives to alter the amount we pollute. the whole idea, is to lessen the blow as much as possible. sudbury flat out has been a shit hole since they started mining, just like most mine towns, and like stanky ass hamilton.

the world is in the state it's in because people don't apply ethics to their decisions and simply because we've been uneducated about thousands of things for milleniums. everything is so cheap because you want cheap shit, and they want to save money so they can have more money. everybody wants more money. so. ask yourself, how can i make money, because bartering is dead, and save the fucking planet because, i want to live here, i want my kids to live here, and their kids, and their kids, to see the fucking polar bears. and i want to drive a chevy nova, and go shopping, ski, and eat a wendy's spicy chicken when i'm not drinking a black velvet.

life will never go back to the basics, but you can fix shit. and if you want to protest a prius, go for it, but don't buy a hummer because it helps you sleep at night, because you're just being a hypocrite.

this looks like a big, important thread, so now i'm in it

I have no intention of buying a HUMMER, I have a truck that I love. I am just saying a Prius is no better then my truck except maybe for MPG. That's what I am saying.

As far as your other statements. I think that world will be warming up even if we were not here. It's a cycle that has happen for millions of years. history will always repeat itself. I am just saying I am not going to buy a hybrid because some hippie wants me to. I love my truck way to much.

and i get it. i love consumerism. it's fucking addicting. but i use everything til it's bare or give it away otherwise. it's kind of just like the more you learn the deeper you find the hole, and i don't know if some people just don't care or if it's really like an unmotivating situation. anyways. thank you for having a decent conversation with me.

Still, hummers dont have 117.47 pound nickel batteries. its still a shit ton of nickel that a hummer does not have. thats the whole point, that hybrids are hiding their pollution in the form of a battery.

this is a pretty ignorant post.

thats nice, i can say the same thing about pretty much every one of your posts.

whatever helps you sleep at night.

yea cool huh? fantastic!!

canadian is the way eh!

this...