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Convince me to buy organic

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Commonwealth
Posts: 3729 - Karma: 11
So, I have a slight grasp on the whole buy organic/local thing. I understand a few of the benefits (fair trade, support the local economy, healthier, less energy) but I'd like a greater overview (without doing any research).

However, as a broke college student I can't justify it all the time. Are there any items I should definitely go organic or? Similarly, are there any things I don't necessarily need to buy organic?
Jul 21 2010 2:31PM
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tyberesk
Posts: 446 - Karma: 41
Living on a broke ass college budget can make it hard to always buy organic....but I always try to make it a point to buy locally. It can be expensive to buy organic/nonGM/local, but I feel like you should try to do your part to support local agriculture and eat at restaurants that support local agriculture. Keep the money in your town!
Jul 21 2010 7:31PM
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pomme-de-terre
Posts: 3915 - Karma: 703
it might not make ANY difference in your own apartment, but when they design huge buldings, like an entire apartment building or a wall-mart or some shit and they spec out stuff like low-flow toilets and sinks and LED lighting, it can legitimately save companies hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. my dad helped design this giant battery bank for some factory or big box store or some shit, where they would charge up the batteries at night, when electricity was cheaper, and then use the batteries to run shit in the store during the day, it wasn't necessarily good for the environment or anything, but it paid for itself in under a year


that was off topic. im sorry.
Jul 21 2010 7:39PM
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Shpadoinkle
Posts: 10437 - Karma: 84
Cage free organic eggs are THE best. They have a fuller taste. The yolk is darker. Just pain yummier.

Grass fed organic beef is not fed hormones. Non-organic beef is actually fed beef. GROSS!

Fruit tastes better.

My home in FL we actually have organic orange and grape fruit trees. Sometimes be have bananas if they don't freeze first.

Buying organic doesn't have to be expensive. Farmers market FTW.
Jul 21 2010 7:42PM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
go to farmers markets. everything is usually very cheap, it tastes much better, and it is much healthier for you. that which you cannot buy at a farmers market, try to buy at a natural foods co-op, but it will most likely not be cheap. and then from there, try to find organic things at your local grocery store. the main difference between organic and non-organic foods is that they taste better, and are better for you.
Jul 21 2010 8:07PM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
my town has winter farmer's markets inside the local theater. one vendor sells organic rabbit meat. my grandfather bought three rabbits one time when i was there with him...
Jul 21 2010 8:13PM
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-dva-
Posts: 1530 - Karma: 23
No hate intended, but I'm going to play fact police and assert that this is, in fact, not true. This practice used to be commonplace but resulted in all sorts of crazy diseases in cattle and is now illegal. Animals ARE fed other animals though, which is still gross.

It's important to note, however, that a cow fed an "all vegetarian diet" is probably still fed mostly corn, which is responsible for all sorts of other fucked up issues. SO, when buying beef, look specifically for grass-fed first!
Jul 21 2010 8:32PM
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Avifarer
Posts: 5926 - Karma: 598
make your own grown op
Jul 21 2010 8:40PM
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Delphi
Posts: 3748 - Karma: 36
organic food, nutritionally speaking, has no extra healthy benefits. An organic tomato and a non-organic tomato have the exact same nutritional qualities...organic is not healthier for you in that sense.
Jul 21 2010 9:00PM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
it is healthier in the sense that there aren't chemicals sprayed all over it, and it hasnt been genetically modified.
Jul 21 2010 9:02PM
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-dva-
Posts: 1530 - Karma: 23
If you were super hardcore about it, you can buy the things you like in bulk over the course of the year and freeze/can enough to get you through the winter. As long as you freeze it while it's fresh, vegetables still maintain most of their nutritional value. That would take some serious dedication though.
Jul 21 2010 9:03PM
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Delphi
Posts: 3748 - Karma: 36
pesticides has nothing to do with the nutritional value of the food. Organic may be "cleaner" (although several studies have shown this to be vastly untrue) in the sense that it isn't sprayed, but you are not getting any more nutritional value from organic...it is exactly the same. Not to mention, it is way too expensive and pretty much impossible to supply the entire country with organic food...there is just no way to make that work.
Jul 21 2010 9:06PM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
organic, local food would actually be much cheaper if grocery-store food wasn't so cheap (sounds dumb, but let me explain). larger companies can sell things for much cheaper, because they sell much more, and will make much more than small companies, even though they make less per piece. a local, small town, organic farmer has to sell his/her goods for a higher price because they cannot make as much food, and if they tried to sell it at the same price or lower as the larger companies, they would lose money. dairy farms in my area are losing tens of thousands of dollars a year because they have to compete with the prices of larger companies. and i am not saying that the nutritional facts for organic foods are better, i am saying that not having pesticides sprayed on your food is better. if you could chose to eat two tomatoes, one with pesticides, and one without, which would you choose?
Jul 21 2010 9:20PM
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Commonwealth
Posts: 3729 - Karma: 11
Proof?
Jul 21 2010 9:45PM
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ShredBetty
Posts: 478 - Karma: 23
local>organic

much fre$her and tastier, and better for the environment too!

and don't forget your reusable shopping bags.
Jul 21 2010 9:57PM
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jeR.
Posts: 1325 - Karma: 58
watch food inc, or read fast food nation. buying local is more expensive, i always thought itd be sweet to be able to grow my own food and hunt
Jul 21 2010 10:00PM
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84891jnf92048
Posts: 11552 - Karma: 2,550
were those sentences connected to each other in any way, because that seems like a pretty disjointed post...
Jul 21 2010 10:05PM
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ShredBetty
Posts: 478 - Karma: 23
yeah...a little nonsensical.

more expensive? not always.
out of your pocket maybe.

overall there is less monetary cost for transport and handling (not just gas, but also you have to pay the stock person at the supermarket, and the drivers of however many vehicles it takes to transport the food, plus the maintenance of the vehicles, plus the person to maintain the vehicles, and however much it cost to buy the vehicle in the first place) but it is less costly in the long run.

Jul 21 2010 10:11PM
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drumbumocdp
Posts: 3229 - Karma: 1,098
Also, with organic meats, the animal is usually free range, and has been treated well over its life. A lot of cheaper products have the animal caged up all its life while it eats shit and gets pumped full of chemicals and hormones so it still plumps up.
Jul 21 2010 10:27PM
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Shpadoinkle
Posts: 10437 - Karma: 84
Yeah, sorry. I should have gone deeper into that subject. Yes, it is now illegal because of Mad Cow.
Jul 21 2010 10:49PM
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Shpadoinkle
Posts: 10437 - Karma: 84
Do what they did in the old days... pickle, dehydrate.

OR

Freeze it. I freeze milk (in the carton), meat, sprouted bread, regular bread and veggies.
Jul 21 2010 11:03PM
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juanborlando
Posts: 3598 - Karma: 2,539
Ian Compton eats organic dont you want to be just like him?
Jul 21 2010 11:16PM
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Fish_Sandwich.
Posts: 9108 - Karma: 16
Try organic grass fed free range beef when you make hamburgers, if that doesn't convert you then don't bother.
Jul 21 2010 11:19PM
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Commonwealth
Posts: 3729 - Karma: 11
Ladies and gents, it's settled - I'm going organic.




Thanks for the well-thought responses, everyone
Jul 21 2010 11:25PM
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tyberesk
Posts: 446 - Karma: 41
Another good book is The Omnivore's Dilemma by Michael Pollan. Definite must-read for someone looking into sustainable agriculture or just wondering why to buy organic.
Jul 28 2010 2:41PM
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yellav
Posts: 10056 - Karma: 1,217
this. cutting down on meat and eating local is the best you can do for the environment. while i am a sucker for organic foods and purchase 95% organically the only real argument behind it is that it doesn't fuck up the soil as bad for the next years crops and the sustaining the ecosystem of the region. healthwise organics really dont mean shit, you should buy organics if youre concerned about the ecology of the area, which everyone really should be but i think more often then not people are under the illusion of organics are healthier for me, when in most cases that isn't necessarily true
Jul 28 2010 2:59PM
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Piste.Off
Posts: 11586 - Karma: 1,860
go ahead and give this guy the Golden Wheelchair Award. he deserves it.
Jul 28 2010 3:09PM
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yellav
Posts: 10056 - Karma: 1,217
also this
Jul 28 2010 3:13PM
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ski2sky.
Posts: 1800 - Karma: 897
.
Jul 28 2010 3:16PM
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ElbridgeGerry
Posts: 5902 - Karma: -27
I don't bash vegetarians or vegans, I just bash those with a cause. If you choose to exclude meat from your diet, good for you. There's probably some health benefits in it. If you try and shove down my throat that eating meat is bad, I'm gonna fuck you up.
Jul 28 2010 3:22PM
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Corwack10
Posts: 323 - Karma: 37
.
Jul 28 2010 3:26PM
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GratefulDead
Posts: 3554 - Karma: 84
pics or it didnt happen
Jul 28 2010 3:29PM
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EastCoast315
Posts: 3136 - Karma: 137
Don't just buy organic, grow your own food, organic style!

And if you live in a dairy area of the US, talk to a local small family farm and ask to buy raw milk. its better for you. Yes, there is a small chance you can get sick from it, but its not a deadly illness and as long as the cows are clean and the farmer is honest about their sicknesses, its way more legit than homogenized shit. And around here in CNY, farmers only make $0.60 per gallon, but the consumer pays $3.00 for a gallon. So if you offer the farmer $2.00 for raw milk, you're both getting the deal of a lifetime.

Its just the little things like that that do ya good (and occaisionally save you cash!)
Read about foraging, hunting, and fishing as well, thats one of the best ways to eat organic.
Jul 28 2010 3:31PM
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snwbrdmilf
Posts: 22441 - Karma: 2,805
Exactly. We need our communities to be more self sustainable.
Jul 28 2010 3:33PM
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ElbridgeGerry
Posts: 5902 - Karma: -27



There is no disputing the fact that Raw milk remains quite a health risk. Really dangerous pathogens like TB and Brucellosis (which carries a fairly high mortality rate) are commonly found in raw milk, in fact these are the two main reasons why pasteurization was made mandatory for raw milk. Also Raw milk is very much prone to contamination by other pathogens (e coli, listeria, etc).

The jury is still out on purported benefits of raw milk consumption, but most of the literature I've read disputes some of the health claims out there.

I refer you to a good statement on this topic by Univ. of Cornell Food Science Dept and let you make your own decisions.:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...Op8_dmoJ3v83Jw
Jul 28 2010 3:38PM
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EastCoast315
Posts: 3136 - Karma: 137
Thanks for that worddoc man, interesting
I agree, it is a two sided battle. I think that when the FDA says that it is dangerous for consumption, I think they are right to say that. It'd be infeasible to market raw milk on an industrial scale, because the more industrialized farming becomes, quantity supersedes quality and cleanliness. However on a small, localized scale, with farms of only a couple dozen cows that you know and see every day, it seems like a good way to do business. The farmer I get my milk from I know personally, I've been in his barn and its very clean. None of his cows are sick, because they are allowed to graze openly, and are a pretty pure line of well kept animals. I feel safe drinking their milk. And think, until 1886, no one had even thought of adulterating milk in any way shape or form! There was only raw milk. And most people did just fine, with a good many of exceptions. When you eat anything though, you take a risk. I think its time to step out of the nuclear bunker of suburbia and out to the country for a little bit of real, unprocessed, fresh food.
BUT, we do live in different times, and not everyone has a herd of cows directly across the road from them (like me). So yeah, raw milk isn't for everyone.

Ideologies and scientific opinions aside, raw milk is DELICIOUS. Oh my god, it is so rich and creamy, you really can't beat it. And its much easier to make butter and yogurt with raw milk! (and in making yogurt, you heat the milk up quite a bit, so its sort of pasteurized! haha). Raw makes what you know as whole milk seem as thin and watery as skim.

I hate skim milk with a passion.
Jul 28 2010 4:03PM
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Cow_Jibber
Posts: 382 - Karma: 103

far too many people get a hard on when they hear the word organic becasue it's a buzzowrd and they think buying the product will somehow help the environment and make them seem more earth conscious in the eyes of their peers.  That being said I have no problem with those who buy organic for the RIGHT reasons.  But in reality, growing certified organic plants is actually less sustainable for the land upon which the crops are grown than simply growing without pesticides or herbicides. Far too much is required from the soil in order for the plant to be certified organic.  Therefore eating food that is "Beyond Organic" meaning grown naturally without excessive intervention in the most sustainable form of agriculture.

CLIFF NOTES:

Organic is overrated, just avoid herbicides, pesticides and force-fed hormones, this is called "Beyond Organic"

or if you're like me, eat whatever the hell pleases you

Jul 28 2010 4:13PM
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horner
Posts: 2439 - Karma: 1,578
Jul 28 2010 4:19PM
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Slinger1x1
Posts: 8853 - Karma: 66
i think its a waste of money....
everything is just more expensive and usually taste the same.

on a few occasion, i've liked something that was "organic" more than some just regular store stuff.
like i once had strawberries that were like picked from a local farm or something, not treated or anything, and they were noticeably different and better. but thats about it
Jul 28 2010 4:21PM
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BerGNARdo
Posts: 406 - Karma: 44
This.

But also with pasteurizing, milk can either be heated up a little and kept at that temperature for a large amount of time, or heated up a little bit more and kept at that temp for only a few seconds. The first one will taste alot more like raw milk, will be just as safe as the flash pasteurized milk, but is obviously much more expensive to produce.

In 4th grade I stayed a couple days at this farm with my school and drank warm, raw milk from the cow straight to the glass every morning. If I have room on my property and funds to afford it when im older im getting a cow.
Jul 28 2010 4:40PM
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.Ben
Posts: 454 - Karma: 14
that is a great idea
you sir have just outlined my meal plan for the remainder of college
Jul 28 2010 4:53PM
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EastCoast315
Posts: 3136 - Karma: 137
I didn't realize you could basically simmer it to pasteurize it. Thats really neat to know.

And yeah I've sprayed the milk from the cow straight into my mouth before, so delicious
Jul 28 2010 4:53PM
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.Ben
Posts: 454 - Karma: 14
I also heard that because we have depleted so much of the nutrients from our soils and use so many chemical fertilizers, our produce is far less nutritious than it used to be. Buy organic, fertilize your veggies with cow shit and be healthier.
Jul 28 2010 5:02PM
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XtRemE11
Posts: 5680 - Karma: 246
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M4MiobwycE&feature=related

can somebody embed?

anyway, heres the rest of that penn and teller show, all you organic fans should really watch this before you go repeating what some hippy at whole foods told you... not that penn and teller is the most reliable source, but id trust them and their sources in the show alot more than some random tree hugging college kid on NS.
Jul 28 2010 5:56PM
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EastCoast315
Posts: 3136 - Karma: 137
Very true! and when your out fishing and don't feel like eating your bullheads, throw em on the garden! They'll rot right into the soil and add TONS of nutrients. Squanto was no joke
Just make sure you chicken wire the fuck out of it, or you'll get tons of animals you don't want. Coy dogs, bears, etc. I'd keep my garden a quarter mile from my home if I had the land
Jul 28 2010 6:46PM
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ElbridgeGerry
Posts: 5902 - Karma: -27
I consider raw milk something very close to dessert. It's so rich and creamy. I like it a lot, I just don't have that many farmers in my area(live in the Canadian shield) so I can't really drink it very often..because I'd have to drive 2 hours to get it, changing it from a nice thing to have..into a pain in the ass to get. You obviously can't store large quantities of it, so it's not like I can stock up or anything.
Jul 29 2010 1:25AM
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Barefootin_Fiend
Posts: 7618 - Karma: 4,727
i buy my produce from local farmers markets. I don't know how "organic" it all is, but at least it's supporting a local farmer and the produce is always top notch, too. Hasn't been transported and packaged, etc. for several days.

I buy all of my meat from either a local butcher, or a local farmer depending on the situation. There are a few farmers who will sell you half of a cow (or a whole one), half/whole pig, and/or a shit ton of freshly slaughtered chickens, so you can really stock up on shit. It's so much cheaper to buy in bulk like that.

My main goal is to stay away from a lot of processed foods. That shit's terrible for you.

And to the guy that only eats meat once or twice a week? Are you serious? Holy shit. I have meat with at least 2 out of the 3 "main" meals that I eat each day. Meat meaning beef, pork, chicken, and fish - not just killing my colon and heart with red meat three times a day.
Jul 29 2010 3:07AM
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d.spong
Posts: 909 - Karma: 8

have to be careful with eggs. cage free doesnt necessarily mean they're better.  if the chickens are cage free they can still be in very tight and nasty living quarters. those mass food producers will try to find any loophole they can to sell their stuff. you kind of have to do your research on where the eggs come from. organic chickens/eggs must follow certain guidlines where the chickens are actually free to roam.

also if youre on a budget and dont want to buy all organic fruits and vegetables

http://blog.timesunion.com/healthylife/files/2010/06/pesticides-271x350-custom.jpg

Jul 29 2010 11:10AM
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XtRemE11
Posts: 5680 - Karma: 246
your buying pesticides with organic foods too, more harmful ones :)
Jul 29 2010 12:30PM
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sack
Posts: 4881 - Karma: 147
it's pretty easy to cut down your meat intake, especially at breakfast and lunch... vegetarian meals are quicker/easier to prepare, and there are lots of protein sources that aren't even soy. I stopped eating all meat 15 months ago. anyhow, I guess it isn't for everyone.
Jul 31 2010 1:34PM
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ClauseFour
Posts: 67 - Karma: 10
I've not eaten meat for several weeks now, simply to cut down on costs. But if made right, vegetarian foos can be perfectly pleasant
Jul 31 2010 4:47PM
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