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I guess it's my turn to ask for some help, haha.

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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883

So here's the deal, after this season I will most likely not be with Line anymore (long story short, I want other options and I'm probably giving up my spot for another kid at Sundown who slays). Now, here's where the "other options" come in, I want to check off some skis on my "hit list" - basically what you see below are the skis I've never skied before but really want too (no, these are NOT the ONLY skis I've never skied before, there are plenty out there, these are just the ones I've been wanting to try). I'm looking for TWO pairs of new skis (pretty much positive both will be 2011 models), ONE pair that is rockered, and ONE pair that is regular cambered.

Rockered (will be paired with P14s):
ON3P Jeronimo (I'd probably just get the 2010 model cause I don't really want to wait)
Rossignol S3 (like the idea of the "rocking chair" rocker on these)
Armada Alpha (1)/Halo (Alpha 2) (they're Armada…not much more needs to be said)

Cambered (will be paired with either STH 14s or FKS 140s):
Liberty LTE (light, poppy, bamboo core)
Rossignol S4 (heard excellent things)
Armada THall/AR7 (these are the only skis on the list I've owned before, I owned the 07 Scarface THalls and the 09 AR6…but they're both new next year so they're back on my "hit list")

The regular camber ski will be a 95% park ski, the rockered will be an 85% park ski - it is the east coast, we don't get much pow and the trails around aren't the most exciting things in the world. My park ratio is 75% rails 25% jumps. I deal with TONS of ice so they need to be able to hold an edge. They need to be able to take a beating and be very well rounded. I'm 5' 8" and around 160 lbs, I ski pretty aggressively (level 3+ skier).

So here's the deal:
1) Give me all the info you've got on the skis above, I'm really only looking for first hand experience (I know plenty about the specs and whatnot of them - I just want to know how they are in real life), I know a lot of you haven't had experience with the 2011s yet, but if you've owned previous years tell me what you think.
2) Tell me, if money was not and issue, which rockered ski would you pick AND which regular cambered ski would you pick.
3) If you have other options, go for it, but I'm looking for something new that I haven't ridden before so I'll be taking that into consideration.

The reason I'm trying to make my choice now is so that I can budget out my summer so I can afford all the things I need for the winter and still have a kick ass summer. So, help me out guys, what do you think?

Sparknotes: just read everything before posting…it's pretty detailed, if you don't want to read it all, don't bother posting.

Mar 26 2010 12:01AM
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minibus4
Posts: 517 - Karma: 13
The Surface One Life rocks my socks for a powda ski. Its stiff enough to charge through AK lines and soft enough to use in the park. Durabilty isnt the best in the world but it will definately hold up. The flat spot allows you to ski groomers with ezz. Went over 73 mph on these. Fucking love them.Click for larger image
Mar 26 2010 12:53AM
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minibus4
Posts: 517 - Karma: 13
Got them in 21 of blower and still could not even sink the tips even when I was leaning all the way foward. Hard to break. Did some 25 foot drops with them. Land switch 7's in the park with them. I can go on and on about how much I love this ski.
Mar 26 2010 12:57AM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
^was that meant for the "one life" thread... I really don't have much need for that much a ski here on the east
Mar 26 2010 1:02AM
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minibus4
Posts: 517 - Karma: 13
Oh haha my bad.
Mar 26 2010 1:04AM
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Scrambles
Posts: 2270 - Karma: 63
maybe look at lib tech jib nas(rockered). i have the pow ones and the magne-traction holds realy good on ice and carves, and has edge hold of a normal sharpened even when detuned, and dont catch anymore than a  normal ski there also crazy stiff(at least used to be, i heard 2011 are softer). i have no first hand expirience with this particular ski, but my pow nas rip
Mar 26 2010 1:22AM
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minibus4
Posts: 517 - Karma: 13
check out tramdock right now, they a\have the S4 http://www.tramdock.com
Mar 26 2010 1:22AM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,404
j-mos for sure, check the on3p shipping thread, there have been a few reviews(one by me) in there, and i posted some detailed pics of them fresh out of the box
Mar 26 2010 1:29AM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
yeah, that was another ski I've considered in the past...they're just kinda hard to get a hold of, but I'll keep it in consideration, thanks.

also, I'm not looking for them now...I don't have the money right now and all they'd do is sit in my closet until november so I'd rather just save up the money and get the 2011s .
Mar 26 2010 1:32AM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
yeah, as of right now they are my top pick for my rockered ski, they seem SO sick and I've heard nothing but good things about them, and they are perfect for an east coast slayer. In fact, the only reason I'm debating them right now is cause the rocking chair camber of the S3 is pretty interesting, I know someone who has them and he can just swivel around on them which just looks like so much fun...but I'm not sure if they be fun all the time. And the Alpha/Halo is on there cause I'm really comfortable with Armada as a company and I'm pretty sure I can a sweet deal on the 2011s (but that doesn't matter too much to me right now).
Mar 26 2010 1:39AM
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T.O.
Posts: 740 - Karma: 97
i would recommend this years rockers from moment for a rockered ski and next years reno jib for a cambered ski. the jibs are light but extremely poppy at the same time
Mar 26 2010 1:52AM
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abc8tr8we98g
Posts: 498 - Karma: 25
LTE's kill it everywhere.  I have mine mounted 2.5 back from true center as i dont do too many rails but they still are solid on rails.  Fantastic for jumps.  The bamboo core is crazy poppy and they are easy to spin because they are so light.  Land like a dream.  Also we've had plenty of ice in the mornings this year and they carve it up really well...would handle the ice coast extremely well.

as for rockered skis...Im 99% sure i will be purchasing next years jmo's for my all mountain slayer.  Also as mentioned before you cant go wrong with the moment rockers...ive done a few runs on a friends (no park just cruising the mountain) and they were a blast, i couldnt keep them on the ground.
Mar 26 2010 3:16AM
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Mr_pretzel
Posts: 4616 - Karma: 1,289
my threads
your in the exact same position as me.
Mar 26 2010 3:16AM
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abc8tr8we98g
Posts: 498 - Karma: 25
forgot to mention how durable the LTE's are...ive got about 30 days on them and they only have a few tiny top sheet chips and the bases look brand new despite hitting several rocks at high speeds.
Mar 26 2010 3:18AM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
nice, good to hear that the LTEs ride as good as they sound. They're also on the top of the list for my cambered ski. So as of right now, I'm looking at getting J-Mos and LTEs. Anyone have any experience with S4s?
Mar 26 2010 9:20AM
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ike.
Posts: 2292 - Karma: 93
i would definitely go with LTE's for park. super solid construction, great flex and crazy light!!

for rockered I would go wit alpha 1 if you are really concerned about weight, as they are the lightest ski i have ever held, and have such a low swing weight it is rediculous!
Mar 26 2010 11:03AM
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pigglywiggly
Posts: 4482 - Karma: 305
i got to demo the s3 and s4 at a demo. hated the s3, just didnt like it at all. felt boring, just did "okay" at everything. s4 was nice from as far as i could tell. stiff for sure and pretty light was all i can remember from it. im only like 5 foot 6 and 115 pounds and the only size was a 181 so i didnt really get a fair shot at skiing/reviewing it.

so right now for next year for PA park skiing, im looking in to...
salomon 2012. (got to demo it, i LOVED it. so fun)
on3p blue steele. (so much hype on on3ps recently, so i think im buying in to it)
armada halos/alpha 1. (always wanted a pair, and have now really wanted some since my friend picked some up)
on3p jmos (may just be a little too wide for my everyday ski)

Mar 26 2010 11:44AM
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mmckechnie
Posts: 1483 - Karma: 29
I used to have the rossignol scratch fs wrs (same ski as the s4).  Definitely go longer if you end up getting this ski.  Rossignol measures kind of short.  I got the 174 and wish I had gotten the 181.  Aside from the length issues it was a great ski.  Stiff when you first ski it, but it breaks in and becomes super playful with a ton of pop.  You can really load up on your tails and get a lot of air off of nothing.  Really durable too.  The tip and tail have rubber in them to prevent over flexing and the sidewall has minicap just at the top which almost eliminates sidewall chipping.  They were also very very light weight skis.  Edges are a bit on the thin side at only 1.7mm thick whereas AR6s for example have 2.5mm edges.

Also take a look at Armada Pipe Cleaners.  They have been my favorite park ski ever.
Mar 26 2010 11:55AM
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freeballer
Posts: 726 - Karma: 960
Another vote for the LTE.  They are very durable and versatile.  The edges are great for rails.  They use a softer edge which prevents cracking.  When you slide a rail, you heat up the edge super hot in a very short amount of time.  Then you land on snow, which is very hard on edges in general.  It tempers the edge.  Some companies use a really hard edge, which is more durable for normal skiing and it can take more tunes.  But the downside is edge cracks on rails, because of the tempering of the metal when you land on the cold snow. 

But what I like about mine the most is the flex pattern and bamboo.  They are great on jump lines because they are so responsive due to the bamboo.  They rip groomers and terrain outside of the park which is very nice. It's a whole different story than a pure park ski, such as the afterbang.  It's a true performance downhill ski that absolutely rips in the park.  IMO, you can't go wrong with the LTE.  Awesome for nollying onto rails.  Great customer service as well.  Great company all around
Mar 26 2010 12:30PM
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freeballer
Posts: 726 - Karma: 960
^
Oh yea, I forgot to mention that it is a super fast ski as well. Unlike alot of park skis, they use a PTex 2000 sintered base versus an extruded base.  I hate slow skis, and these are far from it.
Mar 26 2010 12:32PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
awesome, good to hear, I spent the past season on ABangs, they're fun, but speed is not their strong suit, haha.

So right now I'm leaning towards J-Mos and LTEs (not sure on size yet, I usually ski the mid 70s sizes, and neither have one - probably end up going with 178 LTEs, but the idea of 181 J-Mos kinda worries me, I'm not that big so I'll probably just end up getting 171s). Bamboo all the way next year I guess, haha.

I demoed the Salomon 2012 too, they were ok, they just didn't do anything outstanding for me, which is why they're not on the list.
Mar 26 2010 1:29PM
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pigglywiggly
Posts: 4482 - Karma: 305
oh okay. well they were my first ever early rise/ camber combo that ive ever tried at the time (i think?) so maybe i just got all hyped up when i rode them haha
Mar 26 2010 1:31PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
yeah, don't get me wrong, they were fun, but they just weren't the most fun ski I've ever been on. They felt stable and controlled, but they just didn't have that lively feel like other skis I've been on. It was however fun bashing through spring crud that was all over the mountain, haha.


Any other thoughts would be appreciated...and to the guys who own J-Mos, what do you think, 171 or 181?
Mar 26 2010 1:59PM
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onenerdykid
Posts: 6656 - Karma: 10,862
I personally don't ski a lot of park, but thought the Alpha1 was a blast to ski.  I was already a huge fan of the JJ and loved how it skied everything, so the Alpha/Halo design felt like it's little brother.  Lots of pop, retardedly easy to butter, and it railed turns on hard pack.

The S3 felt like a small S7, it has a ridiculously huge tip and I don't see how it would be good in the park, but maybe that's just me.  As an all-mountain ski, I thought it was really powerful and a good choice for the woods.

If you ever get a chance to ski the new AR7, you won't be disappointed- that ski is going to be the jam next year.  Everything the AR6 is but lighter and slightly wider.  Very playful, super stable, lots of pop, and looks sick, which let's face it, on a ski does kinda matter haha
Mar 26 2010 2:29PM
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pigglywiggly
Posts: 4482 - Karma: 305
this may not be a fair question to ask, but would you take the ar7 or halo/alpha for hardpack/ park (i know you dont ski it, but i still have to put park in there)


Mar 26 2010 2:44PM
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Phormat
Posts: 774 - Karma: 20
I've heard good things about the Moment Rockers, have you looked into these? Seems like an alternative choice to the Jeronimo if you are looking for more options. K2's lineup is fully rockered next year, and I have also heard good things about the Salomon 2012's. Wish I had riding experience on these to help more, just putting some ideas on the table.
Mar 26 2010 2:53PM
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onenerdykid
Posts: 6656 - Karma: 10,862
If I were to only have one ski, I would pick the AR7 over the Alpha/Halo because it would slay everything pretty well except pow.  My actual everyday ski is the Prophet 100 and because of that, I would go Alpha/Halo. This would then be my quiver: park/slope = Alpha/Halo, All-mtn = Prophet 100, Pow = Pontoon, and I'd pretty much have all of my bases covered.
Mar 26 2010 3:04PM
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Lemuel
Posts: 14486 - Karma: 10,635
The only one that I have skied is the S4 ( I skied the ghetto, same exact ski, been unchanged for years).  I would describe them as a lightweight version of the chronic.  I have chronics and they rule on trail and in the park.  The S4 is a little lighter, but I woudl say it skis very similarly to the chronic.  It is also very lightweight.  I think this will definitely be my next ski when my chronics die.  My friend has them and he likes them.  I skied them a couple times and they were a ton of fun mounted at center.  The other time I demoed them and I believe they were mounted at recommended.  For a fairly medium/ stiff (for a park ski) ski, it is a ton of fun.  I hope this little bit of info helps haha.
Mar 26 2010 7:42PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
yeah, that's what I've heard, I love the Chronic, they're super fun - but I'm think I want something slightly softer, but stiffer than the Afterbangs, cause I personally like stiffer skis in the park.

To however said Pipe Cleaners, I've thought about them, but I would absolutely destroy them in no time, remember I ski mostly rails and those bases would get wrecked, I'm also looking for more of a lower maintenance ski, I plan on waxing the rockered ski (most likely gonna be the J-Mos) on a very regular basis since they'll be more all-mountain, so I want a ski that I can just beat on, wipe down and leave it alone until I ski it again and then every now and then (probably twice a month) wax and tune/detune the edges.
Mar 26 2010 7:58PM
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lakers2010
Posts: 74 - Karma: 10
my buddy has this years AR6 and they seem to be quite durable. hes really hard on everything he own and these skis lasted to entire season with only minor top sheet knicks. for edges and his bases, he never wipes um down or touches um and everything seems to be in good shape from what ive seen. only problem is wen u pick them up with no gloves on it gets little fiberglass shards in ur hands once the top sheet starts chipping up.
Mar 28 2010 2:49AM
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jorb.co
Posts: 2581 - Karma: 468
fail
Mar 28 2010 2:57AM
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Goku
Posts: 8119 - Karma: 4,223
try pipe cleaners, they are by far the most fun ski ive ever skiied, they ski like a race ski speed wise, they are awesome to rip with. they have a race base so they need to be waxed a lot. but man they are the greatest twin tip ski ive used
Mar 29 2010 12:08PM
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Twig
Posts: 6407 - Karma: 60,031
Another hater of the S3 here. Dull and lifeless on the piste, mediocre in the pow, fairly heavy for park and recommended is like -7cm from true centre, not the best shape for park despite what rossi claim.

In your position i'd take:
ON3P JMO / Blue Steel (Rockered)
Moment Jib/Volkl Wall/Blue Steel (Cambered)

Never skied the ON3Ps.. Jibs are similar to Walls (owned both) but Jibs are lighter/ a bit stiffer. I imagine blue steels (Cambered) are also similar but I don't know. For the amount of park you are skiing I can't see why you wouldn't buy symmetrical skis.
Mar 29 2010 1:21PM
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steezeball478
Posts: 437 - Karma: 68
props for giving up your sponsorship to another kid, thats really cool of you dude. I wish I could give you some insight but sadly i havent really skid any of these, I've only heard good things about the j-mos
Mar 29 2010 2:01PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
word, kids got tons of talent and deserves it more than me, I'll be dropping an edit of him soon - we want one more day of filming at mount snow so he can throw down on some bigger jumps, so keep you eyes peeled.

So I've pretty much decided on J-mos - I just gotta decide on size now

As for the regular cambered ski, I'm still pretty undecided...LTEs are on the top of the list right now, and I was lucky enough for a shop to throw me some Phil Larose's they've had lying around for a while so hopefully that'll help me make up my mind, but I'm still interested in the new construction of the AR7/THall, out of those two I'm leaning more towards the THall just cause they've changed the flex pattern so its a bit stiffer and I like that. And the S4, I might be throwing that one out, just cause I feel it might be too stiff, and I don't ride much pipe at all so don't need a ski that's that stiff.

Thanks to everyone, and I've given everyone +k unless I've already had you at 10.
Mar 29 2010 2:31PM
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yeahitsdave
Posts: 1315 - Karma: 10
Another vote for LTEs as your chambered ski, I absolutely loved them as an all mountain ski and a higher end park ski. Very light weight, tons of pop thanks to the bamboo, and a solid, fast base. Durability is top shelf, and the warranty is the best in the business, I love what Liberty is doing.

On the rockered side of things... I'd say go ON3P. I'm all for supporting a upstart company, especially one that has such a strong NS background and an awesome group of guys running it. There's been killer feedback to their stuff, so I'd say jump in headlong. Bamboo rules, and any company using it has their head in the right place. As for which ski, J-mos would be a killer all mountain park ski, something a lot different from the LTEs. If you wanted something else for your park-centric ways, rockered Blue Steeles would be baller.

And like the guy above me said, props on giving up your sponsorship. I'd kill to see more people with that respect out there.
Mar 29 2010 2:32PM
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Mr_pretzel
Posts: 4616 - Karma: 1,289
from what i have heard the thall/ar7 will have the hybrid sidewall, witch reduces the swing weight so if you liked your old ar6's then the new thall will be a safe pick.

And another propes to giving up your sponsorship, but will you still be sponsored by full tilt and colorado ski shop?

Another question how old are you?
Mar 29 2010 2:47PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
Yeah, that's the major reason they're on the list, I'm curious about the new construction.

I'll be keeping CSS for sure, such a great shop and they've always been cool and helpful, as far as Full Tilt, I don't know, they kinda came with Line, so I'm not sure what will happen there, but I do know that I'll for sure still be rocking Full Tilts next year, even if I have to buy my own

I'm 22.
Mar 29 2010 2:51PM
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iFail
Posts: 2066 - Karma: 65

If you're getting two skis for mostely park, I think you should have one directional jump ski and one soft(er) rockered ski, so sort of what you said.  I'd think the AR7s would be a great choice for the jump ski based on the fact that all current Armadas are sick, and the capwall constrution of the JJ/Alpha/ARG seems to have worked real well.

For the rockered ski, if you really want something different then maby Reno Rockers would be a great choice.  Skis with any camber still have that camber fighting against you buttering them a bit, so flat camber underfoot and rockered tips/tails is noticably more fun.
 If you wanted the rockered ski for more all mountain use too them Jmos would be what I'd get(if I had money to get new skis).

Mar 29 2010 7:17PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
The only reason Rockers aren't on the list is cause of the price, I'd rather spend less money and get J-Mos.

Also, The rockered ski is going to be more of my all-mountain ski, but I can't say it wont go in the park...cause well it will be in there a bunch cause there's not much else to do at my home mountain.
Mar 29 2010 9:57PM
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Hoover
Posts: 1432 - Karma: 52
sorry but this is a minor thread jack but still the same subject,anyway i ski the midwest and already have a pair of t-halls and getting some moment rockers,i only need a park ski and was wondering if moment rockers would be my best choice,please help
Mar 29 2010 10:23PM
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jorb.co
Posts: 2581 - Karma: 468
id go with the jjs and libertys. i never liked armada but a guy i know raves about his jjs non stop, and has demod almost all rockered skis (works at a shop) and say the armadas are by far the best all around skis.
Mar 29 2010 10:50PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
JJs are way to wide for what I'll be using them for - I've seen them in person and they just really don't belong on the east coast unless there's a ton of pow at like Jay or something, but I never make it up there.
Mar 29 2010 11:22PM
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SweatyBallShack
Posts: 2857 - Karma: 58
I like meh TNKs and I liked my friends dumonts while they lasted (so if the pro pipes are more durable then ya...)
Mar 29 2010 11:39PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
I'm not a big fan of the TNKs, they just weren't that fun to me when I was riding my friends. The Dumonts and Pipe Pros are EXTREMELY different, the Pipe Pro is not a park ski, it's a pipe ski only, it's extremely stiff (much stiffer than Chronics), the Dumonts were on the softer side (they were more of a mid-stiff ski). The Pro Pipe will make a sick pipe ski, it'll hold an edge in the icy pipe walls with ease and spin pretty fast, but it has pretty much zero forgiveness.
Mar 29 2010 11:45PM
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SweatyBallShack
Posts: 2857 - Karma: 58
My bad. I just kinda figured they were similar because it's replaceing the dumonts. I actually like stiff skis though because you get the energy you put into it back. Tnks aren't that poppy. I will admit that. Plus I always catch edges with them for some reason
Mar 29 2010 11:49PM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
yeah, when I say stiff, I mean STIFF, I've never felt a "park" ski that was that stiff, it was like a race ski stiffness.
Mar 29 2010 11:53PM
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SweatyBallShack
Posts: 2857 - Karma: 58
Wait I could have sworn I saw one of the salomon guys on pro piped in slopestyle. But ya the dumonts are really fun to screw around on. It's a shame the edges blow out so easily
Mar 29 2010 11:55PM
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Twinjibber77
Posts: 6239 - Karma: 2,354
Fact.




And in regards to Armada, they are Armada so it's always gonna be good. I too would like to try the Alpha series, insanely impressed with the Halo ski which i am considering for next year.
Mar 30 2010 12:08AM
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BWalmer
Posts: 9141 - Karma: 12,883
Definitely, thats's what makes this such a hard decision, I've loved my Armada's and I'd love to get a new pair, but I really want to try out some other skis and broaden my horizon

And, there could be someone who used the pipe pro in a slope comp, they would just like to have a stiff ski - it's not like it can't hit rails or jumps, you just have to stomp landings cause they'll be very stiff and hard to hold onto if you don't land properly.
Mar 30 2010 12:28AM
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jorb.co
Posts: 2581 - Karma: 468
well why do you want rockered skis  then? because rocker is cool? there arent too many skinny rockered skis. like i said, they slay all over and yes, it is possible for a fat ski to be something other than a park ski.
Mar 31 2010 6:46PM
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