Brady vs manning debate over?

Brady has 3 rings.

Brady has the most touchdown passes in a season.

He blows manning away.

yeah, manning pretty much blew it last night. although, he doesn't quite have the supporting cast that brady has... on a different note though, how about drew brees? i think he has a chance to surpass both brady and manning in achievements during his career...

to be honest, and i know its a long shot, but from active QBs right now (brady/manning not counted), i only see philip rivers going into the "best QB of all time"-debate.

Of all time? As much as I hate the guy right now, then why isn't anybody bringing up Favre? Even with him in the mix, I don't think any of the three will be definitively called the greatest of all time before they retire.

Elway.

i agree 100%. elway and marino

No i think Manning is a better QB.
Watch his composure. He can read a defense exactly and audible a play and then go on to perfectly execute it.

Brady on the other hand as we learned is not so perfect. He also lets his emotions get the best of him and he can go into a slump.
Brady also broke those records, I beleive, purely on the fact that he had one of the best supporting offenses possible. Moss, welker, stallswerth, graham? those are all top names when it comes to there positions.

joe montana.

true about moss, might be true about stallworth or graham. but welker was anything but a star player before brady & belichick fitted him in their system

you cant say that wayne/clark/harrison arent top guys on their positions. and when you look, just as an example, at their new wideouts this year, collie and garcon, you could see that they didnt drop easy balls, fight for every yard and so. they surely arent bad (although manning makes them better).

bout to drop some knowledge on all you bumbling idiots

drew brees last night, by winning a superbowl, joined the "elite" club of quarterbacks, which previously only had 2 members, brady and manning. brees is one of the most accurate QB's in the nfl. its one thing to hit your target between the numbers, its another thing to pinpoint the ball to tell the receiver which direction to turn or run. he has incredible leadership and energy, captain of the saints, pumping them up before every game. i dont think he has a chance to be the best of all time, because its just his first superbowl and he has no mvp's

tom brady will no doubt go down as one of the best qb's off all time. not many quarterbacks know how to win 3 out of 4 superbowls. hes a natural leader and a face of a franchise. his best skill is probably the ability to sit in the pocket so calmly and avoid rushes. he's not a mobile quarterback like a big ben or a vince young, but every time the opposing team brings extra guys he seems to take one step and evade them all. he has the best awareness of any qb in the league. he put up consistent mid to high 20's in terms of touchdowns per year over the first few years of his career. then, in 2007, when he finally got some skilled players, its pretty clear what he could do. 50 touchdowns, 8 int, an nfl record, and an mvp. if he completed the undefeated season i dont think there would be any doubt who the best of all time is.

that said, tom brady is a complete product of bill belichick. belichick has the ability to turn anyone into a good player--tom just had more potential than the rest. belichick can turn bad players like matt cassel into good players, he can turn average players like wes welker into superstars, and he can turn stars like randy moss into record setters. without bill belichick, tom brady would not even be starting in the league right now. his scouting report in 2000 indicated he had terrible awareness, a weak arm, and was incredibly skinny--traits which are now completely turned around.

peyton manning is no doubt the best quarterback in the nfl. he built his career by himself, making himself a star in college and being drafted in the first round. his accuracy is matched by none other--so many times ive see a covered dallas clark catch a ball that had to be thrown into a 1 foot window. he works harder than any other qb in the nfl, and quite frankly, he deserves more championships. normal offensive coordinators call in a play to the quarterback to run. tom moore, the coordinator for the colts, calls in 3 plays: 2 pass, 1 run. peyton then picks whichever play he wants to run, and half the time he even audibles into a whole new play. he is so good he has the ability to turn receivers like pierre garcon and austin collie into superstars, who elsewhere would be nothing but a bunch of scrubs. reggie wayne does not have outstanding skills; he doesnt have the speed of desean jackson, he doesnt have the hands of larry fitzgerald, he doesnt have the strength of andre johnson, yet year in and year out, he continues to put up some of the best numbers in the league. why? peyton manning. manning's personal accolades include a record 4 mvps, a superbowl, and the highest passer rating out of any single season (121.1, brady's in 07 was 117.something) no matter how much you hate the colts or manning, he deserves more respect than any other nfl player. i esteem him with the most respect, and even though im one of the biggest pats fan you guys will ever meet, i love the guy. not to mention hes hilarious

peyton manning is a better quarterback than tom brady, who is a better quarterback than drew brees. those 3 guys are greatly separated from the rest of the pack, even the up and coming phil rivers who could be a superstar in the near future (right now, hes just really good)

nonetheless, despite who is a better quarterback, tom brady has the most accomplished in his career. 3 superbowls, 1 mvp, and a bunch of records. this may be because of superior coaching, it may be because a great defense in the first few years of the century.

bottom line, peyton is better, tom has accomplished more

if i were to start a team, id take peyton any day

and im a die hard pats fan

i agree, though the chargers need to fire norv turner. fast. he fucking sucks balls at coaching. as much as i hate phil rivers, i gotta hand it to him, hes really really good

who the fuck is stallswerth? you mean stallworth? he had 600ish yds and 3 td's in 07.... he sucked balls. daniel graham wasnt even on the team in 07, it was ben watson and kyle brady. get educated

i know tom brady has 3 rings and manning has 1. and that means a lot.i honestly cant stand either of them but if i was making my own team and i could pick one qb id pick manning. the super bowl champion patriots teams had much better defense than the colts have. and i would just say that he patriots as a team were better than the colts.

Marino, Montana, Manning, Brady, Elway

payton manning is possibly the best quarterback to ever play the game

yeah, but stallworth was the main part in that play against the jags, where they lateraled the ball 3 times and carney missed the XPT

*cheating

1. I realized you like being an e-thug and pointing out typing errors..but you clearly understood what i ment, and if youd like to take a little looksie, Stallsworth is taller and faster then about 95% of Dbs. Stallsworht can beat just about anyone deep
2. Im not solely talking about the 07 season, Graham or Watson either one, hes always had a great TE option. and one point 2 or 3.

dominated.

Thank you, as I completely agreeing with you on every point, this is also coming from a pats fan (although not die hard)

The skills that Peyton has is just unreal, just watching him play amazes me. Besides that one interception last night (stupid mistake) he outplayed brees, and looked better.

Peyton Manning is clearly better.  Watch him play, he reads the defenses and knows what they're doing most of the time.  Also look at the people around manning, he doesn't have near the defense that pats do/did.  Also Tom Brady is a bitch and complains about shit all the time and asks for roughing the passer flags when an arm taps his helmet.  brady just pisses me off.

EVERY player "calls" for flags. whether it is a WR that signals PI or a running back that gets up and grabs its facemask, you see it all the time. THE RULE is that you cant touch the QBs helmet or hit him below the knees. end of story

Yeah but Brady still bitches about every little thing. Something doesnt go his way hell throw a fit and cry.

While you watch Farve, Manning, Warner or just about any other good QB, they handle themselves and go right back to work.

Look at last nights game, Manning threw the pick, knowing he probably just lost the game, what did you see him do? Did he stamp his feet and whine? Or did he show great composure and continue to play his style?

yeah, I've never seen Brady stamp his feet and whine when he throws an interception. It's hard to say that Tom Brady lacks composure, but I don't know if you have seen him in the playoffs before, especially in his first few years. I'd argue that he was, and to a certain extent, still is the most clutch performer in NFL history.

I am not in any way trying to take away from the Skillset that Brady has.

Hes a good QB and better then most. But to call him the best, and the title Mr. Perfect?

Watch him in games, after an error. Watch him outside of the game, I have seen him literally cry over an interception twice.  Hes not as flawless as people hype him up to be. Look at his combine..hes clearly a product of his environment. Yes he did have good stats and  superbowls before Moss but did you notice that his record breaking season was when Moss just happened to be there? Did Moss not also break a ton of records that season..was 9/10 deep balls thrown to Moss?

You have to credit Moss as a main reason Brady was able to dominate the league that year.

you can also argue that Brady had such a sick season because he was able to display his true talents with a receiver like Moss. He never had that kind of weapon before both Moss and Welker. The fact that he exploded that year was because he finally had the tools to explode with. It wasn't like he was completely incapable of those numbers in past years, he just didn't have to caliber of receiver necessary to accomplish that with.

Good point.

But then is it fair to say he is better then Manning, Brees and Warner if these three guys don't have the same option as a Moss to go to. Even if they have good recievers. It can easily be stated that over the past decade Patriots have had the best and most consistent revieving core.

Im assuming your next arguement would be that they are a good recieving core because they have a good QB. Which may be true, but im talking raw talent and ability, height, speed, jumping. and stats from previous teams and college games.

Dude, no one cares.  All that matters is the Lombardi Trophy and they both have at least one.  And that pick Peyton threw was the fault of a shitty route by Reggie Wayne, as was the perfectly thrown pass to the chest that Wayne dropped to end the game...

youre the biggest slackjawed retard ive ever seen. MOST CONSISTENT RECEIVING CORPS? ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?

tom brady never had a 1000 yd reciever until 2007 buddy. the pats started the century with players like troy brown, deion branch, and david givens. deion branch was the best, and his best season was 989 yds (from memory!). in 2006 we had reche caldwell and jabar gaffney as our top 2 receivers. TOP 2. JABAR GAFFNEY IS NOW THE 3rd RECEIVER ON THE BRONCOS. dont open your mouth when you have no idea what the fuck youre talking about

the colts over the past decade had marvin harrison, marcus pollard, reggie wayne, dallas clark, brandon stokely, etc etc

the rams had tory holt and isaac bruce

the cardinals in the second half had anquan and larry

the jets had jericho cotchery and lavreneus coles

the bengals had TJ and chad ochocinco

the steelers had antwaan randel el, hines ward, santonio holmes, plaxico burress, etc etc

the packers had donald driver, javon walker, greg jennings, etc

the list goes on

hell, the pats were near worsts in receivers up until 2007

hes retired now though :(

the fact that you think being tall and fast makes a good wide receiver makes you the biggest dumbling bumbling fumbling idiot ever

wes welker is 5'9 and pretty damn slow

darrius heyward-bey had the fastest 40 time in the combine last year, howd he do?

is larry fitz fast? hell no

is anquan boldin fast? hes slow as shit!

any WR is taller than a DB

receiving takes hands, route running, timing, and intelligence (something which you clearly do not have)

i fucking hate football

You need not throw a hissy fit because you have to be right on this topic.

umm hello terry bradshaw fo life.

andy jew pwning noobs in this thread

wes welker is not fast. he is quick. there is a difference

you know exactly what i mean.... the vast majority of WRs is taller than the vast majority of DB's, who are generally under 6 feet tall

MY POINT BY SAYING WES WELKER IS SHORT IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAID: BEING TALL DOES NOT MAKE YOU A GOOD RECEIVER

not only do you know jack shit about football, you dont know how to read either

welker is QUICK, he is not FAST. any person with half a sense of knowledge of sports knows the difference

he is in fact pretty slow when compared to the average receiver

getting open deep does not take pure speed. with a 10 yard cushion, a DB can easily cover a 9 route (a deep route.) the receiver needs to know how to make good breaks off the line, fake the db out, throw a move, etc

stallworth does not know how to get open, otherwise brady wouldve passed to him much more

well you can take that how you want to but a guy that is showing NO sign of emotion in the moment he lost the biggest game since 4 years is also a little weird.

Im going to say Brett Farve is one of the best, and without looking just at stats, but at the way he plays and How much he loves to play football.

I dont think there is another player in football that loves to play as much as Farve does. And he makes for a good football game. I could really care less if someone has excellent stats. I HATE watching peyton manning play football. He looks so nervous in the pocket, and once the rush gets to him he falls to the ground. I like players that make the most out of each play , even if it means they accidently through an interception.


I think you guys forget that this is a game, and these players are paid to entertain thousands of people in TV. So i think that the best player should be the one that loves to play and makes stuff happen.

Thats just my opinion, you guys dont have to agree.

nah brett farve is a cool dude. an iron man. but he is not in the top 5 qbs ever. he has made too many mistakes in big games. plus hes not the most accurate dude. he doesnt have the football smarts that a dude like peyton manning has. i agree that peyton is a bitch in the pocket and dives to avoid sacks and i hate that but you have to be real, peyton is on a different level than any other qb in the league presently.

Im coming from the Fact that this is a game to entertain people, so why not have the QB that is one of the most entertaining be one of the top players.

Plus, i absolutely hate Peyton Manning. He is good, but i get tired of every sports announcer sucking his dick. Im mean he is good but i dont really care because i cant stand watching him therefore i dont watch games in which he plays.

I enjoy watching and think that any player that tries his hardest to make a play even if its dangerous is a better player. They got to take risks and make the most out of every play, and dont care if it ends in a pic, it was exciting and makes for a better football game, Then fundamental football that is.

ahem.....

Adam Vinateri won 2 of those 3 superbowls....

adam vinatieri could not make a 100 yd field goal, tom brady had to drive down the field with the rest of the offense in a little over a minute. adam vinatieri can not win a superbowl with 3 points. for the other 59:56, tom brady had to do work

still though, i see your point, and thats why i think peyton manning is a BETTER QUARTERBACK, despite having less achievements

ummm Steve Young anyone?

ummm what? seriously ns, you guys are really disappointing me. maybe you should read all of it, because

THIS ARTICLE PROVES HOW TOM BRADY IS BETTER THAN STEVE YOUNG

As much as I agree with everything you've said in this thread, heyward-bey plays for the raiders.. which makes this particular "argument" kinda invalid :P

hahah tru dat, but still, the raiders idiotically took heyward bey as the first WR in the draft last year,

michael crabtree was no doubt the best, wayyy better than heyward bey, but was crabtree faster? helllllll nawww!!!



is desean jackson a better receiver than larry fitzgerald? NO!

is ted ginn a good receiver at all? NO!

is percy harvin a good receiver? he will be, but he needs to work on his other skills besides speed!

in XXXVI vs the Rams, Brady had a below-average game. Vinatieri banged 4 field goals in and won the game...
one of which was set up by an INT, another was set up by a monster 14 yard drive!!! to Brady's credit he did drive down in yam-overtime to set up the game winner... but one might argue that the coin-toss going into overtime decided that Superbowl outcome. I HEREBY CLAIM THAT THIS WIN SHOULD NOT BE CREDITED TO THE GREAT TOM BRADY! ASTERISK I SAY!

Super Bowl XXXVIII against Carolina is a different story. Brady lit it up. that cannot be denied. but Vinatieri did exactly what you said he did not ("adam vinatieri can not win a superbowl with 3 points"). His hitting the 41-yard field goal in the closing seconds won the game. If he had missed, they would have lost. Therefore, he won the game. (See Super Bowl XXV aka WIDE RIGHT to see proof of what would have happened had Vinatieri missed) ASTERISK!

Super Bowl XXXIX vs the Eagles.... you could just as well claim that McNabb handed the Patriots this game.... man did he stink. ASTERISK!

Tom Brady's Superbowl wins: 3***

(heh. I'm just messing with you, as much as it pains me to admit it being a Bills fan and all... TB is an amazing QB)

Agreed!