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Lenders foreclose on Intrawest...

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schmuck
Posts: 1974 - Karma: 53,161

Banks seize Whistler and other resort properties after parent company Fortress Investment misses big debt payment. Financiers are expected to put Intrawest's Whistler Blackcomb resort on auction next month while the facility is hosting 2010 Winter Olympic Games...

Click here and here for full stories from the Globe & Mail and CTV.

We'll keep you updated as more info becomes available.



Jan 20 2010 4:22PM
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Maximumsushi
Posts: 7837 - Karma: 3,351
Holy shit this is awesome!
Jan 20 2010 4:28PM
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Luc.
Posts: 7540 - Karma: 59
so intrawest went bankrupt? holy SHIT?
Jan 20 2010 4:49PM
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treebeard
Posts: 3663 - Karma: 1,955
hmm...interesting.
i wonder what this will mean for whistler? and the other intrawest-owned resorts
Jan 20 2010 4:54PM
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hewy
Posts: 1355 - Karma: 205
holy fuck
Jan 20 2010 4:55PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
I LOVE IT!
Jan 20 2010 4:56PM
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rYb
Posts: 944 - Karma: -12
oh fuck, there goes my job at blue.
Jan 20 2010 5:01PM
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Deletedtoday
Posts: 4060 - Karma: 398
ns should buy!!!!!
Jan 20 2010 5:02PM
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@skiinmitch
Posts: 2781 - Karma: 78
good thing panorama got bought before this happened.
Jan 20 2010 5:27PM
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Blurst
Posts: 13577 - Karma: 10,169
oh my gosh this is insane!
Jan 20 2010 5:39PM
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Drail
Posts: 14012 - Karma: 10,010
did it? I was wondering... 'cause I mean - someone will buy Whistler, someone will buy Blue, someone will buy Tremblant... but Pano? I wasn't sure if they're worth it enough to get a buyer quick enough to keep the lifts running. who owns Pano now?
Jan 20 2010 5:45PM
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Topher19
Posts: 100 - Karma: 15

VANCOUVER, BC. – January 20, 2010 – There have been inaccurate and misleading media reports surrounding Intrawest today. Fortress Investment Group continues to own and control Intrawest and all of its properties. Serious discussions with Intrawest’s lenders are ongoing regarding refinancing and the Company continues to operate “business as usual” at all of its resort properties. Intrawest is looking forward to the success of the 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games.

Jan 20 2010 6:00PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
Trying to cover their own shares in the company. They haven't unloaded their stock just yet...
Jan 20 2010 6:12PM
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Hubsta
Posts: 1279 - Karma: 156
I wonder how long until someone comes up with the idea of NS buying whistler ;p
Jan 20 2010 6:19PM
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@skiinmitch
Posts: 2781 - Karma: 78
yea it got baught before this even happend. it was baught by a bunch like 30 people all chipped into buy it
Jan 20 2010 6:34PM
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sm
Posts: 325 - Karma: 10

pretty sure that panorama hasn't been sold. there have been several potential buyers over the last 5 years but none of those deals have made it to completion.

If they had been sold you would think that they would remove all the intrawest branding from the website.

Jan 20 2010 6:56PM
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Sklar
Posts: 8864 - Karma: 31,612
you fail someone already did

They already sold Copper away right?
Jan 20 2010 7:36PM
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Download-My-Apps
Posts: 5069 - Karma: 1,017
wow. I dont feel bad, intrawest is a giant douche. Will this have any impact on current passholders at whistler?
Jan 20 2010 7:45PM
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selkirks
Posts: 1978 - Karma: 59
I actually think this might be good news for the ski industry. The dismantling of Intrawest will mean one more giant corporate interest will be tossed out. It will mean revitalization of the resorts that Intrawest owns now--Whistler and the other resorts are too big and valuable to close. Now if only Vail could fail, we will have essentially destroyed the original Big Three (Vail Resorts/Associates, American Skiing Co., and Intrawest), giving rise to smaller companies (i.e. Powdr Corp., Aspen Skiing Company, etc.) that will foster innovation and growth in a troubled industry. I sincerely doubt that any resort would close or have significant layoffs.
Jan 20 2010 8:12PM
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schmuck
Posts: 1974 - Karma: 53,161
As mentioned above, Intrawest has just released a statement in response to various news reports...

---

INTRAWEST COMMENTS ON INACCURATE MEDIA REPORTS

VANCOUVER, BC. – January 20, 2010 – There have been inaccurate and misleading media reports surrounding Intrawest today. Fortress Investment Group continues to own and control Intrawest and all of its properties. Serious discussions with Intrawest’s lenders are ongoing regarding refinancing and the Company continues to operate “business as usual” at all of its resort properties. Intrawest is looking forward to the success of the 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games.
---

We'll do our best to keep you updated on any future developments as they happen.




Jan 20 2010 8:13PM
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@skiinmitch
Posts: 2781 - Karma: 78
its just recently been sold. thats what alot of people have been saying up there.
Jan 20 2010 8:16PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
if they are having problems with paying debt, they would liquidate some of their assets.  this would likely be under performing hills that are in the red.  i seriously doubt they would sell off whistler.  it is probably fortresses honey pot.
Jan 20 2010 9:09PM
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Jimmy.
Posts: 2888 - Karma: 27
NEWSCHOOLERS MOUNTAIN.
Jan 20 2010 9:22PM
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nepnw11
Posts: 105 - Karma: 163
chyeeeeaaaaaaaaaa booooiiiiiiiiii has such a good ring to it!
Jan 20 2010 11:57PM
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1337
Posts: 31054 - Karma: 29,231
If every active member contributed we could consider this. I'm in.
Jan 21 2010 12:54AM
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Obsessedwski
Posts: 2261 - Karma: 71
Sorry to be the douche Schmuck, but I really don't see the importance of this.
A thread maybe, but sticky? Really?

I believe that it is not in fact Intrawest that's going through troubles, although they might be having financial troubles of their own, it's Fortress Investments; Intrawest's parent company that's in a bit of a pickle right now. They missed a big loan payment recently, and that's the reason for the seizure of their properties by the respective financial institutions.

Also, I don't think the recent developments will have any affect on the 2010 Olympics. Partly because its way too advanced now that you can't really "cancel" or change the location of an event of such magnitude; and because there really is no way anyone in their right minds would just refuse to host the olympics at this point, especially whistler in their current situation (if indeed Whistler is in the hands of new owners now). The supposedly "new" owners of Whistler would want to recoup anything they can from their losses, and the Olympics is a great opportunity to sell off land that will skyrocket in prices post-Olympics.

As for the regular operation of the resort, I also have a hard time believing there will be a massive change in the current operations; there might be a few cuts here and there but it probably won't be huge.

Seriously, I'm sorry if I'm wrong though, I haven't been having the best few days and I may just be talking out of my ass.

And in the case that Whistler is indeed up for grabs I pray that the 130,000+ members of NS can pool enough money together to outbid the bidders from around the world...


Jan 21 2010 1:53AM
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schmuck
Posts: 1974 - Karma: 53,161
It's news.



Jan 21 2010 2:11AM
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Obsessedwski
Posts: 2261 - Karma: 71
Fair enough.
New stickies make me all jiggly inside so not complaining!
Jan 21 2010 2:31AM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
Just to touch on some points you made.

1. The parent company is still responsible for Intrawest's properties. So them having trouble is indicative of Whistler and in turn Intrawest having trouble.

2. Any prospective purchasers of Intrawest's assets (namely Whistler in this case) will not see a return on investment from the Olympic games. Any outstanding contracts will have to be renegotiated. Depending on the actual date of sale, this may or may not be an issue. But either way, this is what could happen. a) The auction occurs before the games. Someone buys the resort for an extremely cheap price, and wants to renegotiate the terms of the IOC contract. They will ask for money, and probably get it since there isnt time to move the games. b) the auction is held after the games and no body wants to move in to take over the resort for what they will be asking.

The point of all these loans was to take a resort that had been purchased for 1.8 billion dollars, and then turn it into something wrth alot more

They invested in the p2p gogo, tons of infrastructure for the games, and moreeeee condos. In spite of these improvements, there have been numerous safety issues...most notably the ice jack incident last winter. When does the average skier look at a resort and say "Yea, they have good snow, but what the fuck are they doing business wise?"
Jan 21 2010 10:04AM
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Obsessedwski
Posts: 2261 - Karma: 71
Thanks for clearing that up.

1) I understand that the parent company having troubles means bad news for everything they own, but this would be the case even if Intrawest was actually turning profits no?

2) The actual auction date is Feb. 19th 2010; 7 days after the opening ceremonies. How would that affect the outcome?
Jan 21 2010 11:35AM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
Yes...when a company goes out of business, the whole company does. Not just one portion. Think of it this way. Say I own a business and I owe a ton of money for something related to he business. And that business owns a shit ton of tractor equipment. When they foreclose on me as a person, they would take the tractor equipment to sell and repay the debt. They have authority to take any possessions of the parent company that they feel would recoup the costs for the least amount of effort. AKA take the most expensive things and sell those off first. When you owe 1.4 billion, and you have a resort worth 1.8 billion, that will probably be the first thing to go.

The auction date being during the games will drop the price a little...at that point, all the buyer would be getting at that point is a ski resort with tons of debt and bad press associated with it.
Jan 21 2010 12:03PM
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grambo
Posts: 1125 - Karma: 93

Umm Whistler mountain ops by themselves are cash flow positive, as an asset it is fine. Intrawest has some junk properties that are dragging it down (e.g. golf courses in shithole Florida which was horribly overvalued during the boom and is worth shit all). Fortress was/is over leveraged which is another problem. Whistler will be fine regardless of who buys it. 

Jan 21 2010 2:48PM
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japollner
Posts: 1699 - Karma: 459
Cash flow positive means nothing in relation to debt. Whistler owes soooo much money on the peak to peak gondola. Hence why you need to pay extra to use it.
Jan 21 2010 3:02PM
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special_k10101
Posts: 1498 - Karma: 72
well i would say dubai.






buuutttt...
Jan 21 2010 4:37PM
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cool.
Posts: 3457 - Karma: 1,724
hmm, not sure if this is a good or bad thing. could be reallyyy sick.
Jan 21 2010 5:07PM
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Brenone
Posts: 4944 - Karma: 296
buuuut they just got their own bailout form the UAE govt. im sure it will be another private equity group that takes over. there are a lot of scavengers out there looking to buy distressed properties at auctions. at the right discount Intrawest could still have some value.
Jan 21 2010 5:25PM
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T_orageskiier
Posts: 580 - Karma: 13
will this effect vacations planned through intrawest and club intrawest?
Jan 21 2010 5:42PM
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Blurst
Posts: 13577 - Karma: 10,169
What would be sick about it? I really know nothing about whistler other than it is a huge skiing centre with a ridiculously commercialized village, so how would new buyers make it better?
Jan 21 2010 7:15PM
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Craigskis
Posts: 6650 - Karma: 1,645
12 Million wasted dollars on the piccolo chair & god knows how much they spend on the world record setting yet pointless peak 2 peak gondola

Bigger doesn't always mean better. Think of the David and Goliath parable....
Jan 21 2010 8:07PM
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geteducated
Posts: 6410 - Karma: 86
yea less is more.  they just whored whistler out.  now its got an std and scaring away the customers.

no one is gonna buy whistler until they see how the olympics turn out.  remember what happened in montreal.
Jan 21 2010 8:27PM
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THE_WKND
Posts: 136 - Karma: 69
Party Mountain!
Jan 21 2010 9:58PM
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Blurst
Posts: 13577 - Karma: 10,169
for like 20 years after montreal nobody wanted to host the olympics. We can only pray that that does not happen to Vancouver 2010
Jan 21 2010 10:20PM
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Scott29~
Posts: 1448 - Karma: 62
Its not like there havent been signs of shit like this for a long time. Not a fan of the real estate driven mega-resort crap~
Jan 22 2010 12:46AM
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Elijah.
Posts: 9322 - Karma: 76
But I thought we were buying a condo from Megacorp together!
Jan 22 2010 3:57AM
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popNfresh44
Posts: 3757 - Karma: 44
Its just going to be another mega-corporation that buys it, who else could afford something like Whistler?
Jan 22 2010 8:58PM
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Greg_o
Posts: 316 - Karma: 82
Unless you're in middle management I doubt you have anything to worry about.
Jan 22 2010 9:04PM
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DrZoidberg
Posts: 5675 - Karma: 4,268
Let's go all the way right (literally, not politically) to New Jersey. That's east of whistler anyway. They own mountain creek too. Now I only glanced over this thread and haven't seen a cohesive, clear answer (I skipped all the long stuff) about their financial status but I'm wondering if creek will feel the effects? Hopefully they won't present themselves as price increases.

Jan 22 2010 9:44PM
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Solipsism
Posts: 67 - Karma: 15
you don't have to pay more for using the p2p, not on a day ticket, nor season ticket.

furthermore the debt owed as a result of capital investment (like a gondola of p2p's magnitude) would be analysed as a whole, not just as a huge financial defecit without any return.

 any prospective purchaser would look at how lucrative Whis is likely to be in the medium /long term, not just the status quo of the accounts books!  And cash flow positive does mean a lot to the market value of a property -  the price is almost certain to increase if the property is turning up $$ consistently (even though cash flow positive and debt aren't mutually exclusive, cash flow pos. indicates the business has the capacity to repay its loans and remain in the green!)

i think everyone needs to chill, lets face it the likelihood of Whistler being sold for a ridiculous undervalued amount, mid olympics, is pretty slim, and as is the prospect of any new investor reshaking F&B and operations staff anytime in the immediate future....

 - Just my 2 cents worth!
Jan 23 2010 2:23AM
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Download-My-Apps
Posts: 5069 - Karma: 1,017
before they put in the peak to peak lift tickets were 10 dollars cheaper. And they bumped up the student pass 50 bucks after the p2p
Jan 23 2010 10:17AM
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Solipsism
Posts: 67 - Karma: 15
yeah but season passes this year are the lowest they've been in ages!
Jan 23 2010 12:22PM
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