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Is Global Warming real?

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BravoWhiskey5280
Posts: 4020 - Karma: 520
Now I know its glenn beck, but watch..Its really interesting.
PS-Its mainly a scientist Lord Christopher Mocknoton talking..





Nov 15 2009 3:56PM
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~~JEFF~~
Posts: 1045 - Karma: 301
win
Nov 15 2009 8:45PM
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sk1er
Posts: 614 - Karma: 10
Even though climate change occures in a cycle, in the past volcanic eruptions and the like were the culprets for raising CO2 levels. Since the industrial revolution it has maily been humans. So when we do get a big volcanic eruption, or some natural outgassing were fucked.
Nov 15 2009 8:47PM
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Armanzoid
Posts: 2453 - Karma: 26
Wait, "there's no point in slowing it down?" Seriously? Do you really believe that allowing the Earth to heat to the point where the existence of humanity is threatened is stupid? Why not just pick up a gun now and take down government and modern society, there is no reason to keep it going being that it will all collapse regardless of what we do. I personally want to do anything possible to cut CO2, and if everyone else did, it would happen. The CO2 in the atmosphere would be converted into oxygen by plants and we would be back at equilibrium.
Nov 15 2009 8:48PM
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BravoWhiskey5280
Posts: 4020 - Karma: 520
So your saying that since the begging of the industrail revolution or earth hasnt had any natural admission of co2??? Come on really?
Plus there is no way in hell that Ill believe that some volcanic eruption has caused a slight rise in global tempature, thats stupid
Nov 15 2009 8:51PM
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BravoWhiskey5280
Posts: 4020 - Karma: 520
Except for the fact that you cutting down on your carbon admissions would only help your self-esteem and thats about it
Nov 15 2009 9:00PM
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AMD_5
Posts: 745 - Karma: 15
i told myself that I would never read another global warming thread, but fuck it.

As previously stated, global warming is made up bullshit. climate change is the real one. However, climate change is blown wayyyyy out of proportion, IMO. like obviously cars and shit are bad for the environment, but we're not all going to die in 25 years because of all the pollution. shit like this happens over long periods of time. its good to take measures to curb things like this, but i think they are getting a bit out of hand.

thats my opinion, take it or leave it.

BTW, i think people should start explaining how this shit really works to all those "pro-environment" extremists with their "save the planet" signs. Honestly, how fucking ignorant do you have to be to think that you'll be able to save the planet.fact is,  the earth is going to be here until the sun blows up. FUCK! these assclowns need a smack in the fucking face for being so stupid.

And for future reference, never ever ever ever ever cite something glenn beck said or did as evidence or proof.
Nov 15 2009 9:05PM
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OhMyBosh
Posts: 5056 - Karma: 171
Yeah its best to only believe stuff that agrees with your current viewpoint.
Nov 15 2009 9:06PM
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kylecross
Posts: 251 - Karma: 12
http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/23465/

Everybody, please watch this video. It gives the comic relief that is much needed during a glenn beck induced shit show.
Nov 15 2009 9:11PM
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gordie.
Posts: 2014 - Karma: 84
THANK YOU!

finally something from skiierman that i LIKE

i was parking at a lot near the ACC (toronto sports arena) and besides the handicap spaces there was HYBRID SPACES. i honestly wanted to kick the shit out of the prius's sitting in there.
Nov 15 2009 9:13PM
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AMD_5
Posts: 745 - Karma: 15
ahh shit, im in canada. doesnt work
Nov 15 2009 9:13PM
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sk1er
Posts: 614 - Karma: 10
I didnt say there hasnt been any natural emmsions, the largest contributiing force in recent times IS humans. Maybe you should do some real research then and stop listening to glenn beck. You can start with the carbon cycle, then look up super volcanos, after that you can research methane bogs/thawing permafrost and finally read about frozen underwater methane, then come back and share what you learned.
Nov 15 2009 9:17PM
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Armanzoid
Posts: 2453 - Karma: 26
So you believe that a rise in the temperature of the Earth would have no effect on humanity?
Nov 15 2009 9:37PM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
The Copenhagen conference CAN do this, BUT if everyone relies on the United Nations International Panel on Climate Change we will get out of this situation. It does not bring on drastic changes. To some it may seem drastic but it will leave our world economy resilient to this climate change bitching over emissions in 50 years. This is the plan:

-The country's that create the most emissions currently have to cut the most before 2020. (China the highest, then the US, etc. etc.)
-While we have to cut by 20% or something like that (Not at all that bad, we have the technology for a sustainable industry and should use it anyway)

-Then all countries balance out emissions over the next years

-Next stage the entire world decreases their emissions together until in 2050 emissions are no longer a point of discussion and industry is no longer reliant upon oil, coal, and other non-sustainable resources.

I believe that it is completely fair and will leave our world with a sustainable future for our grandchildren.
Nov 15 2009 9:44PM
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AMD_5
Posts: 745 - Karma: 15
^^ How long were you working on that doozy?
Nov 15 2009 9:51PM
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andreweckels
Posts: 594 - Karma: -4
CO2 raises tempature. higher tempature melts glaciers. melted glaciers raise sea level. rising sea level means lots of problem where people live. is this a problem worth attempting to fix? naw fuck it lets all just do whatever the fuck we want because one person can't make a difference anyway
Nov 15 2009 10:03PM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
I'm not gonna quote that beast, but good post woozy. We can understand that climate change is happening. It is still not certain whether humans are creating it but whether we are or are not, society needs to change the perception that we can go on doing what we are.

"Business as usual." This just cannot continue, climate change goes much further than emissions, it goes into every single act we make. I read on the greenpeace web site that de-forestation causes more emissions than all of our suv's, trains, trucks etc.. Many experts think that peak oil has already passed and this will alter how society acts. Our skiing industry is seeing snowpack decrease. All of this should force people to understand that whether we understand all of it, we know that it is not a good thing to be destroying our earth at a non-sustainable rate. Society must change, as a whole, world.
Nov 15 2009 10:35PM
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OhMyBosh
Posts: 5056 - Karma: 171
Its a shame that you wrote such a well thought out essay on this yet turn it into this little bullshit conclusion.
Climate change data goes back thousands of years, with various ways of obtaining data etc. The theory that climate change is caused by increasing CO2 levels is backed up by immense amounts of data, and is widely accepted to be true by a vast majority of scientists. It is not just a bunch of BS based of computer models.
Nov 15 2009 10:52PM
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BravoWhiskey5280
Posts: 4020 - Karma: 520
see the reason why i dont believe you and believe woozy is because his arugument is supported with facts and isnt full of non-backed acquisations. Not to mention this is probably your third time saying this in the thread,
Nov 15 2009 11:57PM
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prophet
Posts: 4734 - Karma: 1,007
??
Nov 16 2009 12:21AM
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NW_Rider
Posts: 2580 - Karma: 314
accusations
Nov 16 2009 12:26AM
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prophet
Posts: 4734 - Karma: 1,007
or is it acquisitions!? ohhh
Nov 16 2009 12:27AM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
Where are your facts?
woozy made a great post, but he never said that climate change is proven not real, he in fact said that what they've found could be completely true. The models are models, and they could very well be correct models, we are already seeing that some models made in the 90's fell short on predictions and climate change is actually changing quicker than thought. Also their are plenty of scientists and reports that have clear evidence of climate change and human effect upon it.
Nov 16 2009 12:27AM
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NW_Rider
Posts: 2580 - Karma: 314
given the context I think it's pretty obvious, but I'll bite.





OOOOOOOHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Nov 16 2009 12:30AM
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Mt_P0wDerJuNkIe
Posts: 1506 - Karma: 58
wow im never reading a global warming thread again.
Nov 16 2009 12:34AM
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GreekAR6
Posts: 527 - Karma: 11
Does anyone else find it funny that NS's idea of scientific evidence/proof is nine times out of ten a youtube video?
Nov 16 2009 12:37AM
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OhMyBosh
Posts: 5056 - Karma: 171
not gnna lie, that was tl;dr...

i'll probably put together a more legit response tomorrow.
Nov 16 2009 1:10AM
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NW_Rider
Posts: 2580 - Karma: 314
You still got your point across, and I couldn't agree with you more. Very well put and probably the most comprehensive dismantling/ownage I have ever witnessed on NS.
Nov 16 2009 1:20AM
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Cincher
Posts: 3403 - Karma: 535
Man oh man woozy, +k for having a well thought out, interesting, insightful and well backed up rebuttle. That is by far THE most intelligent thing any NSer has ever said that I have heard of. You have definitely changed my perspective on this climate change debate. I myself admit to being somewhat stubborn towards this whole thing, but I'll definitely try to keep an open mind towards opposing opinions from now on.
Nov 16 2009 1:44AM
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Gorilla.Steeze
Posts: 2215 - Karma: 43
agreed with the above post. nice insight woosey.
Nov 16 2009 2:17AM
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Admiral
Posts: 118 - Karma: 10

I WOULD JUST LIKE EVERYONE TO CONSIDER THIS:

When the EXPERTS/SCIENTISTS (aka people that actually know what they're talking about) are not in agreement on a scientific issue, how can WE (non-experts) claim that our opinions on the issue are correct, how can we regard any opinion as certain?

There are many qualified experts on both sides of the argument.

Nov 16 2009 2:29AM
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skinorthwest
Posts: 11 - Karma: 10
Some of you need to get a clue. Climate change is occurring. Those of you who think otherwise clearly don't live in a climatologically variable area. One examples that might hit close to home: PALMER SNOWFIELD, Mt. Hood, OR: The summer skiing capital of the United States. Most of you on here are too young to realize it (so am I, but I've seen the data), but the glacier is getting smaller year after year. Sure, some years are still better than others, but if you look at the 100-year average, the snowfield is getting smaller and smaller the point that Windells has contingency plans in place should the glacier become too small to sustain operation in the future. We're altering our climate at a rate higher than any previous time in our history. Palmer may be gone within 10-25 years. Either way, don't you think that it would make more sense for us to be responsible with our planet? We only have literally one shot at this, and in order to ensure the continuity of our species, we need to take care of the Earth. In short, I want to be able to ski Palmer in 25 years. I want to be able to ski. The National Ski Areas Association recognizes climate change, and reports that by 2050, skiing will be limited to elevations above 4,000 feet in the contiguous United States. Thus, goodbye to skiing on the East Coast, goodbye to Snoqualmie, goodbye to Stevens, goodbye possibly even to Mt. Baker Ski Area. We'll miss you. If only the US and China could have listened, we'd stilll be able to ski waist-deep powder on your sacred mountain.
Nov 16 2009 2:51AM
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Kevski
Posts: 7056 - Karma: 2,785
I like this subject but I'm too baked to think about it now so this is a mythreads for later. Sorry.
Nov 16 2009 2:54AM
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Shreddysaurus
Posts: 2120 - Karma: 59
hes super cereal guys
Nov 16 2009 2:57AM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
I completely agree with you.

Climate change is occurring, there is no longer any doubt at all.

No one knows for certain if it is caused by humans or natural causes, yet we continue to sit here an argue about it.

I have been stating throughout this thread that whether humanity is the cause or not, we should be acting now. A ticking time bomb is counting down if we are the cause, if we are not the cause we are still blowing through all of our resources.



This video makes complete sense to me, hope you care about it enough, especially as a skier.
He is no scientist, but he does not take a stand on the scientific data, he simply breaks down our future and how to live the best in it.

Just think about it, how old is our earth? Now it took us 200 years of industry to strip the earth of much of its resources. We are destroying forests, burning oil, coal, natural gas, wrecking agricultural land etc. We are not living in a sustainable world.

Whether or not humans are causing change, our lifestyle is not SUSTAINABLE. We must begin to change our lifestyle is we want to enjoy tomorrows world.

This change will have to start in the US and Europe, I accept that, because we are the most progressed areas in the world we must lead the earth on this issue. If we can cut our energy resource use and/or emissions and begin the start.

It's like gambling on this issue, we can not act and possibly come off scot free, or have our shit wrecked... OR

We can ACT on this issue and a) save the world from this environmental disaster
b) make an economy that is not reliant upon non-sustainable resources but did spend a lot of money on the issue that turned out to be false

THE ONLY RESPONSIBLE CHOICE IS TO ACT ON THE ISSUE we risk spending money we didn't have to, but in the end we would still have a sustainable industry and that is worth paying for anyways, it's going to have to happen at some point.

Please argue with me on these points. Thanks

p.s. I hate Al Gore (and I'm an environmentalist)
Nov 16 2009 9:22AM
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notomatoplz
Posts: 1377 - Karma: 29

atmospheric co2 lags behind global temp increases by up to 800 years. so how is it co2 causing all of the warming?

Nov 16 2009 9:39AM
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OhMyBosh
Posts: 5056 - Karma: 171
Takes time for the changes to occur... If the temperature was changing the CO2 levels, then surely the CO2 peaks would be after the temperature peaks, not the other way around.
Nov 16 2009 11:50AM
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BrewskiJunior
Posts: 35 - Karma: 10
I completely agree. I bet at 325,000 years ago they thought the climate was changing cause they were killing too many dinosaurs and the methane  from the decomposing carcases were polluting the sky (im joking).

Thank you for realizing that, as you said, "undergoing climate change naturally for millions of years without the help of humans." and "you cant do anything about it." Its the natural cycle of the earth. Not from running your car at 9mpg. Ever heard of ice ages? yeah. Wasnt' humans' fault either.
Nov 16 2009 1:09PM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
Please educate yourself. Temperature and Co2 is changing at rates never seen before, I'm not saying that it is caused by humans, there is a lot of science both ways, but we are finding more and more that we are the ones to blame.
Nov 16 2009 1:28PM
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dbstar
Posts: 2038 - Karma: 20
www.edf.org/documents/4418_MythsvFacts_05.pdf

/thread
Nov 16 2009 1:28PM
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BrewskiJunior
Posts: 35 - Karma: 10
Way to contradict yourself. "Im not saying that it is caused by humans...but we are finding more and more that we are the ones to blame." Nicee.
Nov 16 2009 1:34PM
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T-Holt
Posts: 5020 - Karma: 639
Honestly, I think that global warming is blown out of proportion.
I think global climate change is the more accurate term. Guys, remember, the ice caps have been melting since the last ice age. One of the reasons they're melting fast right now is because ice reflects much more sunlight than rock / earth. The more ice that melts the faster the ice melts.

I think that the biggest problem on our hands is not global warming, but instead the depletion of natural resources. Renewable energy is great, it conserves resources and is more economical in the long run. Another big issue imo is deforestation. This is a very real thing that cannot be denied. I have class in a few minutes so I can't really say anymore, but I will say, just think about the more important issue on hand.
Nov 16 2009 1:54PM
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steezc-ross
Posts: 822 - Karma: 1,156

are you retarded

Nov 16 2009 2:11PM
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Armanzoid
Posts: 2453 - Karma: 26
Hahaha, best post here.
Nov 16 2009 2:12PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
You posted Glenn Beck, your argument is invalid.
Nov 16 2009 2:26PM
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shredables
Posts: 647 - Karma: 19
thank you
Nov 16 2009 2:53PM
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Kevski
Posts: 7056 - Karma: 2,785
I'm Canadian and I've never heard of Glenn Beck before, so don't lump me in with democrats or republicans because I don't even know which ones are which. But holy shit. That video was probably the worst, least convincing, most childish and utterly retarded video trying to disprove GW/CC I've ever seen...

Woozy, that was really well written. Good on you. You didn't, however, change my opinion on the matter. I'll look into the other side some more later, but I have class in a couple minutes so I'm gonna keep this short and basic.

I am only a first year uni student so I don't know all there is to know right now, but I'm getting a grasp I think at some of the science behind it and my prof (Dr. Phil Dearden) is a pretty big figure in Canada. He is on numerous panels on these types of issues and wrote the most accepted Climate Change and sustainability textbook in Canada. First off, it is undeniable that the whole earth's climate is radically changing at rates we've never seen before. This isn't to say that it hasn't happened before, but we don't know the effects of the natural processes before either.

As for the CO2 levels rising after temperature does, that's because of a couple positive feedback loops in the earth. Oceans store HUGE amounts of CO2, and as they warm they lose the capacity to hold it and end up releasing it into the atmosphere. This warms the temperature more and then more CO2 is released.
Another feedback loop, although much less significant (probably not really a big deal at all actually), is with forests. Pine Beetle anyone? With milder winters pests like that can thrive, killing more trees. They stop photosynthesis and release CO2 into the atmosphere, contributing to more temperature increase and more mild winters, allowing bigger devastation later and so forth
All humans need is to be the catalyst.

And are they seriously denying that an increase of CO2 in the atmosphere will lead to increased temperatures? That's high school chemistry/geography. CO2 absorbs long wave radiation released by the earth, and if there is more of it then more will be kept within the atmosphere. Is this actually about questioning basic principles of science?

Another feedback loop. Glaciers are melting, polar ice is melting. They reflect short waves (which aren't absorbed by the atmosphere in much significance) and regulate the temperature. If it disappears then more will be absorbed by the earth and released as long waves, which are trapped by the CO2. Gnarly process.

Shit gotta go to class, I didn't get to look it over to see if this has any coherence but I hope it's at least somewhat useful. Or maybe I'm just on another track completely.
Nov 16 2009 3:25PM
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Tasche
Posts: 5422 - Karma: 99
If you base your argument on Glen Beck you already loose.  Who saw South Park last week.  Spot on Glen Beck. 

The sad thing about global warming is that it has become a political issue.  Here is the bottom line, CO2 is linked to global warming, global temperatures are rising, ice melt is retreating further and further every year, glaciers are vanishing.

Why argue these facts unless you have a political motive?  Anyone who has taken a geology class can relate the CO2 to global temperature.  You are a fucking Reh-tard if you think otherwise and you are delaying the actual work of solving this problem you no talent morons.

Fucking politics, would rather try to discredit someone than have them do anything worth while.  I am seriously considering doing some jail time for killing Glen Beck.  Or maybe those guys at the Westbourough Baptist church.
Nov 16 2009 3:36PM
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Mr.Panda
Posts: 17711 - Karma: 564
Could we not call it global warming? Cause I know for a fact that in the winter the ice pack comes farther and farther south and fucks up the crab fishing grounds and for a layman that makes global warming seem like such a fucking joke when in fact it is a climate change thing that makes the higher months MUCH higher in temp and the colder months MUCH colder in temp.
Nov 16 2009 3:39PM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
That is not a contradiction.
I said "that I am not saying it is caused by humans" so I am keeping my mind open on the topic, then I said, "we are finding more and more data that says we are to blame." Which is a true statement, there is a lot of arguments and datasets piling up against the opposition.
Summary: I said I'm not 100% sure, but mounting evidence is swaying me towards human caused climate change.
Nov 16 2009 3:52PM
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Pinguu
Posts: 1581 - Karma: 49
Good post,
Nov 16 2009 3:56PM
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