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Skiing and "black" culture

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Big-Punisher
Posts: 814 - Karma: 10
I'm hoping we can open up a discussion here about the attachment that some skiers have to black, inner city culture. At the surface, the appropriation of clothing style and manners of speech is fun and harmless. That being said, I am wondering what you guys consider to be some of the underlying motives behind this? Does this portrayal add some sense of legitimacy to the sport? Is it just a reflection of a wider interest in inner city, urban culture on the part of white males?

I'm also interested in what people think about All Star Haynes. I enjoyed his stuff in last year's final episode of freeskitv. His lyrics are fun and whatnot, but is his talent being used by the ski industry to create a closer link to urban culture? That is, do we feel cooler now that an actual black person is rapping about the sport we know and the characters who permeate it?

My interest isn't in taking a moral higher ground here, or to come across as an intellectual snob. I'm just hoping an interesting discussion might develop from some of these talking points.
Oct 28 2009 1:05PM
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Big-Punisher
Posts: 814 - Karma: 10
and yes, I recognize the irony of this post given that my screen name is Big-Punisher!
Oct 28 2009 1:07PM
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McLeod
Posts: 1762 - Karma: 1,582
NS threads have been making me think too much lately, i dont like it.
Oct 28 2009 1:16PM
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Klick_2_klaim
Posts: 3396 - Karma: 25
just think of it like this.

white rich kids have everything except what black poor kids have. Which is nothing.

ergo, rich white kids wish they had nothing. Nothing = apparent street cred. and who doesn't want that?

Salomon, just wants to exploit the kids, so they pay someone to help them do it, so they can put more money into their racing programs and win gold medals at the Olympics.

The circle of life moves us all.
Oct 28 2009 1:22PM
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Capurnicus
Posts: 9947 - Karma: 1,886
I think it's a much broader cultural aspect of today's youth, far beyond the scope and influence of skiing. I also think it's a super complicated issue that you could write a book about. But basically, I think it's a result of a number of factors. First you have the emergence of hip hop as a major part of today's culture. Additionally, in the past 20 years or so, reggae music has reached new heights in popularity in the United States, UK, etc. Music is really important in the creation of a cultural identity, and appreciation of Hip Hop and Reggae has given many of us an interest in black culture.

But in another respect, I think it has to do a lot with the properties of Black culture and Black political thought. Throughout the past 300 years, the Black race has been subjected to a number of oppressive institutions both in North America and in Africa. As a result, there is a major emergence of a "Black mode of resistance" which rejects preconceived Western notions and stresses the concepts of resistance and Black identity. I think that this rebellious nature is often quite appealing to the youth, and so many white youths have been drawn to this aspect of black culture.

Finally, I think that the increased use of marijuana amongst the youths in the US during the past 15-20 years has only deepened this appreciation of Black society. I'm not trying to say that Marijuana has inherently black conotations, I'm just trying to say that use of marijuana can often lead one to an appreciation of the Rastafari way of life. And obviously, the Rastafari way of life involves a deep respect and belief in the black race.

So yeah, I think that's why we love Black culture soo much.
Oct 28 2009 2:10PM
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Atypical
Posts: 1339 - Karma: 45
"black culture" has been more eminent in every aspect of youth society, and heavily seen in action sports.

I think the whole thing started with the "skater" look. The baggy, rugged, torn look became more popular. Because most of the easily accessible sports took place in urban environment (skateboarding, inline, bmx, etc) the popularity of hiphop moved into the action sports world.

In skiing, I honestly have no idea how and why it started. Currently I like its an iconic idea. "Steeze" has played a major part in skiing in the last 10 years, developing the sport and changing how it looks. The "thug" look adds another level of style.

Trends will change. Skateboarding and Snowboarding went a different way in some areas, with the gypsy look. Inline has mushroom blading.


Oct 28 2009 2:18PM
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JRullo
Posts: 1794 - Karma: 265
this is like the 10th thread on this, and you dont need to do that if you dont want to but dressing like it makes your tricks look better for sure, idk about acting like it. its just fun a quess. and i mean who doesnt want to be black?
Oct 28 2009 2:20PM
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Atypical
Posts: 1339 - Karma: 45
Another point I wanted to add.

I do wear large clothing, tall tees, etc. I don't do it because I want to be black, or thug, I do it because it identifies me (in my opinion) with the skiing culture.
Oct 28 2009 2:22PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 913
hahaha  There is a simple explanation in my eyes.  Antiestablishmentarianism  (not dis) The  genre the OP writes about just happens to be  this teenage generations' choice of rebellion towards the preceding generations.   Quickly, it has gone, flapper, big band, bobbie sox, hippy, punk, gansta? Its just another fad.

Question is: Where will it go next? Gauging the trend, politician? naaaa.. death row would be a better fit.

shoot holes in that!
Oct 28 2009 2:30PM
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BroBomb
Posts: 500 - Karma: 1,726

Good topic, and if you read BroBomb you're pretty likely to see an article that touches on it in the near future.

BUT to step outside of the skiing bubble real quick, we've gotta realize that mainstream (white) culture copying black culture is no new thing. Nearly every form of American music in the last century has come from black culture: gospel, blues, rock n' roll, jazz, R&B, Soul, Funk, and of course hip hop.

There's a quote from Mick Jagger that goes something like this: "The Stones and the Beatles were just white kids from England who wanted to make Black-American music."

Oct 28 2009 2:34PM
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Aaaron.
Posts: 11817 - Karma: 903
it's all about the fried chicken.
Oct 28 2009 2:37PM
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Blandct
Posts: 1858 - Karma: 37
seems about right to me.
Oct 28 2009 2:39PM
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short_and_steezy
Posts: 760 - Karma: 18
Thats the biggest word I've ever seen on ns
Oct 28 2009 2:46PM
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doGelyst
Posts: 2492 - Karma: 509
in times of recession, I have decided to hold it down for the business trend.

suit & tie is where its at.

Click for larger image

mens warehouse sponsorship
Oct 28 2009 2:55PM
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Baskin.
Posts: 1387 - Karma: 13
i agree.skiing is actually an extremely expensive sport vs.playing baketball,or soccer so id say there is most likely more poor black people than white so less black skiers
Oct 28 2009 2:59PM
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49566738265
Posts: 0 - Karma: 7,704
This is just another one of the hundreds of "Why do skiers dress gangster" threads in an intellectual disguise.
Oct 28 2009 3:01PM
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DrStrangelove
Posts: 1948 - Karma: 3
threads like this are soooooooooooooo stupid and there have been waaaaaaaaaaay too many of them lately
Oct 28 2009 3:01PM
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nonexistant
Posts: 428 - Karma: 27
.
Oct 28 2009 3:18PM
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jamesnunya
Posts: 84 - Karma: -90
nothing hood about pussies in flamboyant colored coats,  neon and tie dye tall tees? you look like confused homosexuals, pink and purple shit and most other bright colors are gay as fuck, unless your a prepubescent girl.
Oct 28 2009 3:49PM
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jamesnunya
Posts: 84 - Karma: -90
look in the mirror with that garbage on and tell yourself your a man
Oct 28 2009 3:52PM
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antwone
Posts: 1352 - Karma: 157
this
Oct 28 2009 3:58PM
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304NordMan
Posts: 2983 - Karma: 525

this has gone from asking a very formal question to giving jokes on yellow kids.

jesus, i love newschoolers!

Oct 28 2009 4:04PM
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gfanuckaa
Posts: 538 - Karma: 292
hahahah
Oct 28 2009 4:11PM
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Big-Punisher
Posts: 814 - Karma: 10
As much as I like All Star's raps, it makes me wonder whether he'd be just as well served rapping about tennis or croquet. here is absolutely nothing similar between skiing and the inner city lifestyle which inspired hip hop in the first place.

White people have been appropriating black culture, especially black music for decades. To pay a guy to write rap songs about team Salomon is just another means of doing so. Personally, I find it embarrassing for both the sport and Jarred Haynes, who obviously has the talent to do more than this (and maybe he does do more, I don't know).
Oct 28 2009 5:33PM
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Aaaron.
Posts: 11817 - Karma: 903
so you are very eloquent.  you may even have a point.
but explain to me why it matters.
Oct 28 2009 5:46PM
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jamodeo
Posts: 3040 - Karma: 663
Pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis... not any more 
Oct 28 2009 5:57PM
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Big-Punisher
Posts: 814 - Karma: 10
it's more just an observation about social interaction. I'm not for or against hip hop culture in skiing, i'm more interested in developing a dialogue about the fascination that some skiers have towards it, and what it means on a broader scale.
Oct 28 2009 6:07PM
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Aaaron.
Posts: 11817 - Karma: 903
i don't quite understand..
Oct 28 2009 6:11PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
threads like these make me want to quit skiing. or at least NS.
Oct 28 2009 6:12PM
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skiierman
Posts: 28699 - Karma: -5,563
kids are fucking retarded.

im leaving it at that.
Oct 28 2009 6:20PM
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onearmwanderer
Posts: 1153 - Karma: 31
^ i think its exactly what nomen said, to me kids just do it because they want to fit in simple as that.
Oct 28 2009 6:46PM
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Thenowhereman42
Posts: 5682 - Karma: 65
Wait, you guys aren't black? 
Oct 28 2009 6:52PM
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yellav
Posts: 10056 - Karma: 1,217
"If you can't see the correlation between hip-hop and skiing, something is WRONG WITH YOU." - All Star

had a conversation with a friend over this quote yesterday. i personally could not stop laughing about the irony of it, whereas my friend had some personal tirade about the validity of it. i really don't have much of an opinion on it besides the downright hilarity so i suppose i'll just leave it here for analysis.
Oct 28 2009 6:54PM
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patrickcowan
Posts: 3713 - Karma: 218
its not just skiing.  this entire generation listens to rap music.  black people make most of rap music and rap about what they deal with.  then white kids listn to it and act black. 
Oct 28 2009 6:56PM
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Big-Punisher
Posts: 814 - Karma: 10
"this is great. i solve pretty much every problem i have in life with a rap song. can he also make one about season passes being too expensive? and only having enough $ for just park skis and not park and powder skis?"

Malczyk posted this in another thread. I thought it was hilarious
Oct 28 2009 7:48PM
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BodaginRep
Posts: 56 - Karma: 13
I actually think this is a good point.  If you are a skier between the ages 12-16 then chances are you are white and are fairly affluent, or upper middle class.   Pretty much everything has been handed to you, and so far you're life has been pretty cush.  (not hatin', talking from experience until I moved out)  You've probably realized this yourself, and have a lot of respect/admiration/awe for inner city youths who start with nothing and work their way up.  So as a result you imitate them because some part of you wishes you had been an inner city youth who had to start with nothing, as said, it gives you street cred and respect from others. 
Oct 28 2009 7:55PM
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518
Posts: 187 - Karma: 10
and if you wore spandex and poc helmets, you'd be a racer
Oct 28 2009 8:02PM
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Boggs
Posts: 1039 - Karma: 208
Maybe all-star just likes skiing...

I mean, we all post here for the same reason. Why cant he just use his talents to promote other interests of him and his friends, and leave it at that?
Oct 28 2009 8:13PM
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hue.
Posts: 1518 - Karma: 220
wooow too many words. its cause skiing is gangster, and black people are gangster, so its just combining two gangster things
Oct 28 2009 8:18PM
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SKIU4EA
Posts: 2387 - Karma: 2,072

yeah, there's been a million threads on this, but when you sit back and think about it,  this is probably 1 of the most important questions we are confronted with everyday that we're on snow or hikin the boot pack.  Where are our roots and why the fuck do we do what we do.

there are so many different angles to this issue that are directly influence by our changing culture.

Oct 28 2009 8:22PM
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Roy
Posts: 1982 - Karma: 1,240

If I had to guess I think he's not trying to get across a point but trying to make white, skinny, upper middle/upper class kids question why they hide behind this "inner city black" facade in an attempt to make them realize that they're not black.

That's if I had to guess.

And if you ask me that's not necessarily a bad thing because people should be who they are, not pretend to be something they're not.

Oct 28 2009 8:26PM
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Rogge
Posts: 5773 - Karma: 3,930
I'd like to weigh in on this.

Jarred (All Star) and I are friends from freshman year of college. Like all people that share a living space, we shared our cultures, likes, dislikes, and hobbies with one another because lets face it, that's what you do. We lived with all types of people (Irish Catholics, Conservatives, Liberals, Italians, Cubans, Dominicans, Haitians - St Rose was a melting pot of cultures and ideologies). Some we liked and others we disliked. While Jarred and I didn't have much in common aside from living in the same hall way, we got along really well.

Jarred came into my room one day and I was watching the trailer for WSKI 106. He couldn't believe they were using "Dip Set" in a ski movie. I don't think he was offended or impressed - he was surprised to see a song he knew being used in a different way. Maybe he didn't understand it at the time but he respected it because that's what decent human beings and friends do when exposed to something new and different.

On the same hand, Jarred had an immense talent for freestyle rapping. I've always felt you didn't need to be good or even participate in an art, sport, or activity to be impressed with someone that has mastered their craft. I was impressed at how intense his passion for music was and continues to be and how he used his talent.

Jarred's new mixtape is no different than any edit in the video section or photo in Freeskier. It's someone's interpretation of a broad sport. I encourage all of you to listen to "My Story" for Jarred's full recap of how he found his way into the ski industry.

Anyone in here that believes this is an issue of "black vs white" or "have vs have not" clearly has no sense of how great our sport is. There's no antiestablishment garbage here. I'm not rebelling against anything by listening to hip hop. I respect the message and the story and don't need to empathize with any of the lyrics; I simply enjoy them.
Oct 28 2009 8:32PM
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Gyslaine
Posts: 103 - Karma: 27

Lets clarify this thing

-yes indeed Ski is the whitest sport on earth

-It is not called gangsterism but STEEZE

-and I think that everything is made to differ from racing... Racers put googles on their helmet.. we put ours under and so on

you know.. so have fun, sex, beers and ghost ride

Oct 28 2009 8:40PM
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Rogge
Posts: 5773 - Karma: 3,930
and I'd like to ask Mr. Malcyzk, a person that does Marketing for a ski company (LINE) that tries to promote the broadening of our sport by making it more affordable and accessible to all people, why he feels the need to to call out someone that's from another demographic and has a general interest in skiing?

I believe people made fun of your boss, Mr. Levinthal, when he decided to make twin tip skis and I'd say that worked out really well for all of us and you.

Have an open mind people. It's not just our sport, it's everyones and the only way its going to survive is if it grows. These are the exact issues we discussed at Carte Blanche at IF3. There's half as many skiers today as there were 10 years ago. Why? Let's broaden the spectrum and invite everyone to enjoy our sport.
Oct 28 2009 8:41PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
No Rogge, let's hope the trend continues and make mogul skiing cool again so I can get freshies all day.

I honestly think it's because you have a bunch of upper-middle-class teenagers, many of them in suburbia. What does that lead to? Wanting to fit in, and searching for an identity. Being a teenager is basically all about insecurity and social awkwardness, and suburbs are completely monotonous, so you need a way to be different but not be an outcast. TA DA! Act like you're an inner city thug!

It probably doesn't hurt that rap is excellent to ride to.
Oct 28 2009 8:50PM
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yellav
Posts: 10056 - Karma: 1,217
skiing is a white upper class sport. if you havent noticed theres this whole recession thing going on right now.
Oct 28 2009 8:50PM
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Rogge
Posts: 5773 - Karma: 3,930
10 years big cat. The recession has been happening for 2-3 years now depending on what political channel you subscriber to. Please fill in those 7 years.
Oct 28 2009 8:52PM
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Rogge
Posts: 5773 - Karma: 3,930
and JD, if you've seen Wild Stallions this year, you'd know mogul skiing is cool.

:-)
Oct 28 2009 8:54PM
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