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Sean Penn's Comment at the Oscars

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ThaLorax
Posts: 21083 - Karma: 8,455
I think this it was a good summarization of the current situation and takes a lot of balls to say in a situation like that.  I'm glad to have met the man on multiple occasions.

Excerpt from his acceptance speach: “For those who saw the signs of hatred as our cars drove in tonight, I think that it is a good time for those who voted for the ban against gay marriage to sit and reflect and anticipate their great shame and the shame in their grandchildren’s eyes if they continue that way of support. We’ve got to have equal rights for everyone.”

How can you say that a group of people shouldn't have the same rights as you just because they are different? It's just as bad as not letting blacks eat at the same restaurants as whites and it's only a problem because of an outdated book (the bible).
Feb 24 2009 2:01AM
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EnemySki
Posts: 471 - Karma: 10
No Mucho it doesn't take a lot of balls to say something like that. Most of hollywood agrees with him anyways so saying something like that at the oscars doesn't take any balls.

The Oscars is not a place for that and celebrities that voice their opinions there are stupid. It is an event to give acting awards its not supposed to be turned political. They are ruining it for the people watching at home.
Feb 24 2009 4:31PM
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emopoppins
Posts: 3996 - Karma: 269
because the church says its wrong. haha i dont see what the big deal is. civil marriage is the same thing and straight people do it all the time.

The Church and Government are NOT the same, i dont see why gay people expect to get equal treatment from both sources. Everyone needs equal rights, but i really want gay people to quit expecting the church is going to accept them.
Feb 24 2009 4:40PM
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Bright_Nation
Posts: 400 - Karma: 12
First off, religious freedom is important, and so is freedom of speech, but spamming people with your beliefs is just annoying.

It's not die-hard Christians that piss me off in particular, its anyone who tries to force their way of life on me or anybody else.  That just happens to be Christians almost all of the time.

Just because you think Jesus is your savior does not make him/it mine, so fuck off and leave us alone.



...PRAISE SKISUS, SON OF POW INSTEAD!
Feb 24 2009 4:41PM
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rhcp
Posts: 2598 - Karma: 18
I do think its a little funny that so many people want a complete separation between church and state yet when this issue rolls around its like they're being denied a civil right when they can't get married in a church.
Feb 24 2009 5:31PM
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Wapile
Posts: 425 - Karma: 11
Marriage:  The social institution under which a man and woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc.

I really could care less if your gay, go ahead and be gay.  No reason you need to be married though.  Marriage isn't meant to be between the same-sex, and should never be.  No I'm not being close-minded. I think it's obviously wrong, you make the choice to be gay, and its going to be detrimental to any children you might have.
Feb 24 2009 6:33PM
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SMH[-__-]
Posts: 545 - Karma: 13
I'm pretty sure that's not a fact, or at least not known...
Feb 24 2009 6:40PM
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Bright_Nation
Posts: 400 - Karma: 12
1 + 0 = baby
1 + 1 = fail
0 + 0 = fail

can't have a child when the math isn't right!


...just out of intrest, is it only humans who for some reason can be gay, or do other creatures do it as well?  Seems like a trait that would become extinct due to evolution.  No gay people can reproduce, therefore no children to continue their genetic lineage.
Feb 24 2009 6:45PM
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JamesR
Posts: 3396 - Karma: -12

homosexuality/bisexuality has been documented in animals from apes to elephants.

But this is all a fucking conspiracy. The government is using it to destract us from what is really going down!!! AGAIN!!!

Feb 24 2009 6:49PM
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skiminnesota
Posts: 9093 - Karma: 429
i would say it doesnt take balls to say it in that setting.... he was preaching to the choir. 

Feb 24 2009 6:51PM
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N-John360
Posts: 835 - Karma: 8
Props to Sean Penn for saying that. I have always supported gay marriage, and I'm glad he stood up for something we both believe in at a place where political stances don't come into play too often. I'm not going to get into reasons why not allowing gay marriage is absolutely rediculous because I have Calc class in seven minutes, but I am certain our government needs to change its stance on gay marriage.
Feb 24 2009 6:53PM
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Tinga
Posts: 11349 - Karma: 2,333
i've been trying to come up with a smart comment to this severely flawed question but i can't. just thought i'd bring that up. 
Feb 24 2009 7:13PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142

Or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnHyy8gkNEE

Don't have to like Keith, but this was a pretty good one.
Feb 24 2009 7:41PM
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onearmwanderer
Posts: 1153 - Karma: 31
Mehh there are plenty beneficial effects of being married, i dont know the exact details but stuff like taxes and economical stuff like that changes when you are married together. 
And also, there is another reason to get married.  Its the best symbol of love and commitment, you cant just deny that to a group of people just because it doesnt appeal to you.
Feb 24 2009 8:03PM
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lloyd_christmas
Posts: 1775 - Karma: 16
i'm going to keep this as brief as possible because i really don't care about this and and really do still see it as a non-issue compared to a whole mess of things.

1. if you don't see the fraud problems and new laws that would have to be passed and enforced...then whatever. i shouldn't even be bothering.

2. you don't think churches, organizations, whatever, would see a huge, sharp decline in funding from the people who are totally opposed to it? yeah, people would be getting married and spending money, but who's to say people who give to the church and spend money for religious purposes won't abandon it for what they deem an attempt at gaining more funding and going against their beliefs?  and since when do these radical right wingers (not me) use factual information and reason to support their beliefs? are you kidding me?  whatever, though

3. sean penn.....i mean you just answered your own question man.

4.  this is a non issue....look what we have going on not only in our country but around the world. and we're going to argue about whether or not gay people can get married?  ok, it's AN issue, but not one that commands anywhere in the ballpark of the attention of, say, the economy or the war, to be broad.

....like i said, i don't really care about this much.  i could have it either way, but don't be naive and think there's an end-all universal objective truth to the matter. 
Feb 24 2009 8:05PM
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ski_ENDUB
Posts: 2535 - Karma: 86
ha true, hollywood is the worst place to get a political statement from. the only thing that Sean Penn every said thats worth quoting is "Hey bud, let's party"
kind of reminds me of Team America:
-"Way to go FAG, you really made a difference, didn't ya, FAG"
Feb 24 2009 8:49PM
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hey_dude_its_me
Posts: 1403 - Karma: 32
who cares what some dumb actor thinks politics? wow you've met him, good for you
Feb 24 2009 9:02PM
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Arabian.
Posts: 9632 - Karma: 55

1. How come this is suddenly a problem now with fraud? It happns with straight couples as well. That's not really an issue - why should you deny a right to us just because a few people will abuse it? Here, you're not allowed to vote because some of you didn't. It doesn't make sense. As for new laws, there wouldn't be any new ones. They would be extended, but not new.

2. That is their problem. Don't you think some People stopped supporting schools churches, and restaurants because they weren't segregated in the south? Why should you deny civil rights to a poeple because some churches would lose money? Doesn't make sense. And anyway, why should they deserve funding if they are trying to disparage a people?

3. Sean Penn was awesome in MILK. that is all. He's no MLK, but he's spot on.

4. Yes, it is AN issue. Hell, even I think we should deal with War before we deal with marriage. I can married later.

Feb 24 2009 9:22PM
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whattheshit
Posts: 6562 - Karma: 107
just dropping in to say mickey rourke should have won instead.


Feb 24 2009 9:38PM
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Wapile
Posts: 425 - Karma: 11
Give me straight evidence that you can be born gay.  As far as I'm concerned your born a straight clean slate, and based on either other's influences, or your own choices, you become gay.  Yes, that and religion are the basis behind my whole belief towards it, but until you can solidly prove me wrong, my opinion stands.  If you can't make babies, it's just not natural.  I hate these controversial-topic threads so Im done after this post.
Feb 24 2009 10:53PM
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ThaLorax
Posts: 21083 - Karma: 8,455
Thanks for the deep intellectual input. I can tell you put a lot of thought into that post.


A lot of actors are political activists in their off-time and spend their money for good causes.  Don't let E or MTV fool you.  For those of you saying it doesn't take balls to say something like that and that he's preching to the choir, believe it or not, not all actors aren are left wing liberal hippies who smoke weed and adopt third world babies just for the funsies. Plus, didn't just say it in front of the "choir", he said it on a nationally broadcasted show that millions of people were watching.  I'd like to see you stand in front of a an audience of 1,000's and potentially millions more watching from the camera shoved in your face and still be able to say something like he did.

Anyways, this thread isn't about him, it's about the subject he brought up by saying what he did.
Feb 24 2009 11:05PM
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rhcp
Posts: 2598 - Karma: 18
Yeah, I actually agreed with a lot of what he said, which is very rare.

I'm fine with them having all the rights of a married couple, but to me it won't be marriage.

I think it's sorta a moot point anyways.  I bet within 15 years every state will have legal gay marriage.


Feb 24 2009 11:17PM
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Static
Posts: 8553 - Karma: 4,089
lol, you're basing your opinions on religion and you want straight, solid facts.
"If you can't make babies, it's not natural" should infertile couples also be denied?
o wait yoar done. nm.
Feb 25 2009 1:48AM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
We're going to look back on this 40 years later and do the same double take we do when we hear arguments supporting slavery.
Feb 25 2009 3:15AM
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CCskin
Posts: 54 - Karma: 10
The amount of ignorance in this thread is shocking, try not to post if you don't have a basic understanding of the American Judicial System, Constitution, and marriage.
Feb 25 2009 4:21AM
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Wapile
Posts: 425 - Karma: 11
You completely disregarded the "and" I used.  I was referring to somebody saying that you don't choose to be gay, and as far as im concerned, you do.  So I base it on that, and yes also on my religion.
Feb 25 2009 7:02AM
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Static
Posts: 8553 - Karma: 4,089
No, I just think it's ridiculous someone who's opinion is tied to religion is asking for empirical evidence.
Feb 25 2009 7:24AM
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rhcp
Posts: 2598 - Karma: 18
I cannot believe you are comparing this to slavery.
Feb 25 2009 8:45AM
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notomatoplz
Posts: 1377 - Karma: 29
yea fine, i really dont care if gays are allowed to be "married" or whatever you wanna call it. homosexuality still isn't right to me at all. but aslong as it would stop society from trying to cram homosexuality down every highschoolers throat (no pun?) then im fine with it. let them do their own thing and keep it to themselves. basically, i think there is way to much publicity these days for "gay lifestyles", and i think it is really screwing with peoples heads. some kids that dont "know if they're gay" are supposed to just try it and see if they like it.? I dunno, the only problem i have with it is the fact that i dont find it right for members of the same sex to have sex and no matter how many hollywood movies tell me that it is right, wont change my mind. so let them be married and have equal rights because afterall, they are human beings and they just need to keep their relationships in the bedroom.
Feb 25 2009 9:48AM
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PagesHouse
Posts: 6024 - Karma: 104
If marriage was a religious or even important ceremony anymore..... why our divorce rates so high? It's not so much religious anymore as required for tax breaks and other shit I don't know much about. You're expected to get married and that's about it.

Gays deserve marriage just as much as any of you writing in this thread... and to be honest if gay marriage was legalized give me one reason how it would affect your lives in a negative way? Maybe it would make you a more open-minded and accepting person... how terrible.
Feb 25 2009 10:04AM
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ski@jaypeak2
Posts: 2802 - Karma: 429

Actually it does affect me because what if me and my best friend own a business together work there everyday untill we are 40 and then decide, "shit im 40 im not gonna marry some woman now"  So in order to recieve the tax benefits my business partner and i get married.  That puts a strain on the already corupt tax mess.  You dont think people will abuse this "right" to marriage.

And to anyone that says polygamy has nothing to do with the gay marriage issue how could you be so igrnorant to believe that if a man truly loves two women and they both have given birth to his kids that he should not marry them both?  Its the same exact thing!!  polygamy has been around just as long as gay sex and marriage but guess what only one of them is legal.  (and its not gay marriage)

Gay marriage is not a "right"  any of this, "It makes me truly happy" is the stupidest thing.  Wow great you are truly in love with a guy, well im truly in love with two women but im considered a weirdo? go figure

Feb 25 2009 10:19AM
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ski@jaypeak2
Posts: 2802 - Karma: 429

sorry for the double post i didnt read all the way through the first time.

Damn this is not a gay issue you are talking about nature vs nurture can we please get back to why gays can not be offered benefits from the government to live together.  Because that is what marriage is. 

OHH did anybody else hear that the first lesbian couple to be married in Mass just filed for a divorce!!  Way to make such a big deal and then live together for 2.5 years!!  Ive lived with my GF for 3 years and dont even want to think about marriage

Feb 25 2009 10:27AM
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PagesHouse
Posts: 6024 - Karma: 104
Like someone said and you just blatantly ignored.... it is unknown if you can be born gay or not because scientists have yet to be able to study the DNA responsible for sexuality. Therefore, there is no evidence supporting that you are not born gay.

There IS evidence however that hormonal and chemical imbalances in a human's body (which they are born with) can lead to transexual or homosexual tendencies... in which case it would not be choice.

Another interesting fact is that in a study, 10% of sheep had homosexual tendencies.... so for those who try to argue in nature there is no homosexuality.... you are far from right.
Feb 25 2009 10:27AM
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notomatoplz
Posts: 1377 - Karma: 29
natural selection my friend... those sheep made mistakes and will not reproduce.
Feb 25 2009 10:40AM
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ski@jaypeak2
Posts: 2802 - Karma: 429
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals

really? because it has been going on for years and somehow heterosexual sheep will produce homosexual babaies!!  how is that natural selection? 

Please people the argument is not about animals fucking or whether you are born that way.  The issue is rights.  And if two men have those rights based on "love"  why cant one man and two women who are all in "love"

Feb 25 2009 10:46AM
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cfox
Posts: 2286 - Karma: 38
hes a faggot straight up
Feb 25 2009 10:53AM
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Casey
Posts: 7849 - Karma: 24,323
betterment of the sheep pack? keeping the population in check so the rest stay healthy? I dunno, with pack animals it seems like there is some possibly benefitial characteristics to having some animals that don't reproduce.
Feb 25 2009 10:57AM
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ontwosticks
Posts: 915 - Karma: 95

Homosexual behavior in animals refers to the documented evidence of homosexual or transgender behavior in non-human animals. Such behaviors include sex, courtship, affection, pair bonding, and parenting. Homosexual and bisexual behavior are widespread in the animal kingdom: a 1999 review by researcher Bruce Bagemihl shows that homosexual behavior, has been observed in close to 1500 species, ranging from primates to gut worms, and is well documented for 500 of them.[2][3] Animal sexual behavior takes many different forms, even within the same species. The motivations for and implications of these behaviors have yet to be fully understood, since most species have yet to be fully studied.[4]

The natural existence of homosexuality in non-human animals is considered controversial by conservative religious groups who oppose LGBT social movements because these findings seem to point to the natural occurrence of homosexuality in humans.[1] Whether this has logical or ethical implications is also a source of debate, with some arguing that it is illogical to use animal behavior to justify what is or is not moral (see appeal to nature).[1][5][6]



There is the first paragraph for everyone that says "homosexuality is unnatural" and it's amazing how many play the religion card here after the skiers for jesus thread went completely ape shit with people hating religion. I mean really you can't just have religion whenever it benefits you.

Feb 25 2009 11:16AM
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ontwosticks
Posts: 915 - Karma: 95
yea sorry for the double post but everyone should read that article, surprisingly well written for wiki and will give some serious facts about homosexuality rates in animals, especially mammals.
Feb 25 2009 11:24AM
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Static
Posts: 8553 - Karma: 4,089
If you and your buddy decide to get married chances are you probably are gay. What's to stop a man and woman who are friends from scamming the system the same way? You bitch and moan about tax fraud screwing you over, well guess what polygamists milk the system harder than anyone. One dude knocks up 3 or 4 women. He can only marry one, while the others collect benefits from being single mothers. Why not save us all some money and let them all marry right? (Wait a minute you did claim polygamy was legal.....) That's basically what you're saying with your first argument. Whatever it takes to reduce fraud right?

You can't deny someone rights because someone else might do something illegal. If that's really your position and reasoning behind it then we should ban guns because some people use them for illegal activities.

If you think it's wrong and you just want to deny them the right fine, just admit that you're an asshole. I for one don't even give a fuck if 3% of the population is getting screwed, but I'm not gona try to justify it as right with whatever bullshit reasons my loosened asshole can spew. "If it's legal, next people will want to marry inanimate objects!"

Go back to church you retarded little pieces of shit.
Feb 25 2009 11:52AM
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OhMyBosh
Posts: 5056 - Karma: 171
wasnt there a movie about this entire argument with adam sandler recently? where he pretended to be gay to get tax benefits?
Feb 25 2009 11:54AM
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ski@jaypeak2
Posts: 2802 - Karma: 429

First let me begin by saying i do not attend church regularly and never once referenced "god" in my post.  great generalization though.

i may not have been clear enough but i do not agree with polygamy either.  however gay marriage and polygamy are very similar!!  Just because polygamist mostly live in isolated communities and do not parade down main st more then half naked waving flags (gay pride parade) doesnt mean their love isnt real. 

Feb 25 2009 12:28PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,142
I think you meant to say interracial marriage bans, and I agree.
Feb 25 2009 1:08PM
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icecreamsandwich
Posts: 3207 - Karma: 25
People do not choose to be gay. 16 year old girls choose to kiss other girls at parties to get boys attention - they are not gay - oh wait, girl on girl - that's acceptable in society right?

My best friend is gay. I've known him since we were in grade one. He did not choose to be gay. I saw how much he struggled with it throughout elementary school and high school. I know he did not choose it.  In elementary school, he "dated" tons of girls, "dated" in the OMG I'm holding your hand sense. In high school, he tried dating numerous girls, it wasn't right for him. He experimented with dating a few guys, that to him, felt right, the attraction was really there. He went for three years, dating both girls and guys, each time, the girl was never enough, he wasn't attracted. He was attracted to the guys. He didn't want to be gay, his father was married but flirted with anything in a skirt. His father made all sort of negative comments about gay people in front of him. He tried and tried to be straight. It doesn't work. You don't choose to be straight or gay. He is well aware that if he were straight life would be much much easier for him.

Religion is all well and good if you need to believe in something, but don't use your religion as an excuse to put others down because they are different from you.

It isn't necessary for every couple to have a baby. There are plenty of children out there to adopt.
Feb 25 2009 1:41PM
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Arabian.
Posts: 9632 - Karma: 55

Thank you. Same deal here minus the dating part. We are all aware that being gay is fucking awesome, but it would be much easier to be straight and not go through all the bullshit. All you kids that are against gay marriage either:

A. Aren't over 16.

B. Are spouting your Parents views.

C. Deeply religiious

Feb 25 2009 2:32PM
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Arabian.
Posts: 9632 - Karma: 55

? It keeps cutting off ma post?

C. Deeply religiious [Which is fine]

D. Don't Know any Gay people.

E. All of the above.

Feb 25 2009 2:33PM
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ski@jaypeak2
Posts: 2802 - Karma: 429

This is gonna be my last post on the subject but you are gravly mistaken.

a. Im 26

b. my parents are very liberal

c. not religious

d.  i interact with at least 4 gay people  EVERYDAY.(my 2 bosses are gay, co-worker lesbian, asst mgr, gay)

e.  All of these people i am friends with and even go to the bars with.  This topic comes up frequently and they respect my opinion.  i guess i havnt typed it yet but i do agree with giving same sex couples that have lived together for a certain time, certain rights regarding hospital visits and other such concerns but no marriage.  MARRIAGE WAS CREATED BY THE CHURCH!!  church and state are very different.

Feb 25 2009 2:43PM
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Arabian.
Posts: 9632 - Karma: 55

So can actually look your "friends" in the eye, and tell them "I don't want you to marry"? Not even civil marriage?

that's cold.

Feb 25 2009 3:22PM
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Wapile
Posts: 425 - Karma: 11
A. no..
B. I disagree w/ most everything /w my parents when it comes to politics
C.I wouldn't say Im deeply religious, but yes, I am.
D.I work w/ 2, and they're some of the coolest guys I know. I don't hate them as people, I just hate the concept of gay marriage.
E.I really hate these threads, b/c there's no chance Im going to change your views or your going to change mine.  We all have different opinions and in the end, mine is the only one I really care that much about.  Once again, im done posting.
Feb 25 2009 7:17PM
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PagesHouse
Posts: 6024 - Karma: 104
Honestly you're right.... you can argue about gay marriage and abortion until the cows come home but rarely will you ever change anyones mind. These are issues that people feel very strongly about and very stubbornly about.
Feb 25 2009 8:59PM
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